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Waterford GAA Thread - Mod note post #1
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Mastermcgrath wrote: »Brilliant, all heart and honesty, never expected anything less from Ken. A phenomenal competitor on the field of play. I beleive Waterford’s greatest ever player, of the recent era anyway (having not seen the teams of the 40s or 50s).
Thought Flynn was the most natural hurler Waterford has produced in the modern times. He had it all. Skill, touch, pace. To truly understand how good he was, look at the U21 replay final against Offaly in 1992. He was only 17 years old, playing against a great Offaly U21 team.0 -
Thought Flynn was the most natural hurler Waterford has produced in the modern times. He had it all. Skill, touch, pace. To truly understand how good he was, look at the U21 replay final against Offaly in 1992. He was only 17 years old, playing against a great Offaly U21 team.
he remains the best stickman ive ever seen,you'd pay just to see him play,he was always liable to do something magical at àny moment
Stephen bennett againest kk,was all sprts of shades of paul flynn.......if he was born on other side of river suir,he would be regarded as one of the all time greats
(This is not to take from ken mcgrath,a completly different type of player,flynn wouldnt fill the role ken used to)0 -
Jesus I hope the season starts up pretty soon
Having GAA withdrawal symptoms, last years All Ireland finals seemed like an age ago0 -
Hey kids, did you know there used to be this thing called a 'crowd' at matches? No, I'm being serious!Thought Flynn was the most natural hurler Waterford has produced in the modern times. He had it all. Skill, touch, pace. To truly understand how good he was, look at the U21 replay final against Offaly in 1992. He was only 17 years old, playing against a great Offaly U21 team.
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Waterford GAA has introduced a revolutionary new approach to the management and preparation of under-age development squads. The new system is explained in some detail in this week’s Dungarvan Leader. The following is my own summary of what is being implemented.
The new structure has been devised by a committee led by Jason Ryan with Darragh Duggan, Dave Robinson and Dara Mac Donncha also on board. They began work last April and got a terrific response from those approached for advice or for getting actively involved in the new scheme. The committee consulted widely with experts in various fields before drawing up their development plan. The pandemic was actually a big help as various people who would normally have been up to their eyes in coaching, administration, etc. were instead able to devote time to Zoom meetings and other interactions with the organising committee.
The key feature of the new system is the provision of organized support for development squads in three key areas – athletic development, coaching and logistics (transport, organizing matches and venues, equipment, etc.). Each of these spheres will come under the control of an overall supervisor – Gerry Fitzpatrick (athletic development), Benji Whelan (football coaching), Jonathan Moore (hurling coaching) and Eoin Breathnach (logistics).
A team of interns has been recruited via social media from a large group of initial applicants who are being trained by the respective supervisors and will then work with the individual development squads. In the first year the scheme will be rolled out to ten development squads – four at Under 14 (two football and two hurling) and three each at Under 15 and Under 16 (two hurling and one football). It is planned to further extend this down to Under 13 and up to Under 20 in future years.
Each development squad will have a formal management team with different people assigned to perform specific roles – manager, selectors, coaches, secretary, first aid, gear and equipment and transport. Each squad manager has been allocated a dedicated and experienced mentor whom he or she can sound out for advice. The list of mentors is very impressive, including Peter Queally, Joxer O’Connor, Fergal Hartley and Derek McGrath. Everyone who was approached to act as a mentor responded positively.
The scheme began with four nights of Microsoft Teams sessions for development squad managers and coaches which were well attended and at which presentations were made by the county supervisors and other experts. There will be an annual end-of-year evaluation to see how the system is working and how it can be improved. The ultimate aim of the scheme is to bring players to adult playing level with the appropriate technical, physical and tactical preparation required to allow them to make the step up successfully.
If it works, this well-thought-out plan should move the preparation of under-age development squads in the county onto a new level. For me, the key elements of the plan are the involvement of top-level expertise in supervisory and advisory capacities, the creation of a common template for all development squads to work from, the provision of back-up assistance and, perhaps above all, the prospect of managed progress as players move up through the age grades.
Up to now, in my view, the appointment of development squad managers was rather ad hoc and, once appointed, they were essentially on their own. A major weakness has been the absence of structures for coordinating the work of the different squads and linking squads from successive years together. This contrasts, in particular, with the developmental system in place in Limerick in recent years.
Ultimately, the crucial role in making the system work will be played by Jason Ryan’s organising committee who have devised the system and now have the challenging task of implementing it. They, and the County Board, are to be congratulated on this initiative and we wish them all the best in putting it into effect.
If I have left out any other key features of the scheme, or made any errors in my reading of the scheme from the Dungarvan Leader article, I would welcome clarifications and further inputs from other readers.0 -
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Giveitfong wrote: »Waterford GAA has introduced a revolutionary new approach to the management and preparation of under-age development squads. The new system is explained in some detail in this week’s Dungarvan Leader. The following is my own summary of what is being implemented.
The new structure has been devised by a committee led by Jason Ryan with Darragh Duggan, Dave Robinson and Dara Mac Donncha also on board. They began work last April and got a terrific response from those approached for advice or for getting actively involved in the new scheme. The committee consulted widely with experts in various fields before drawing up their development plan. The pandemic was actually a big help as various people who would normally have been up to their eyes in coaching, administration, etc. were instead able to devote time to Zoom meetings and other interactions with the organising committee.
The key feature of the new system is the provision of organized support for development squads in three key areas – athletic development, coaching and logistics (transport, organizing matches and venues, equipment, etc.). Each of these spheres will come under the control of an overall supervisor – Gerry Fitzpatrick (athletic development), Benji Whelan (football coaching), Jonathan Moore (hurling coaching) and Eoin Breathnach (logistics).
A team of interns has been recruited via social media from a large group of initial applicants who are being trained by the respective supervisors and will then work with the individual development squads. In the first year the scheme will be rolled out to ten development squads – four at Under 14 (two football and two hurling) and three each at Under 15 and Under 16 (two hurling and one football). It is planned to further extend this down to Under 13 and up to Under 20 in future years.
Each development squad will have a formal management team with different people assigned to perform specific roles – manager, selectors, coaches, secretary, first aid, gear and equipment and transport. Each squad manager has been allocated a dedicated and experienced mentor whom he or she can sound out for advice. The list of mentors is very impressive, including Peter Queally, Joxer O’Connor, Fergal Hartley and Derek McGrath. Everyone who was approached to act as a mentor responded positively.
The scheme began with four nights of Microsoft Teams sessions for development squad managers and coaches which were well attended and at which presentations were made by the county supervisors and other experts. There will be an annual end-of-year evaluation to see how the system is working and how it can be improved. The ultimate aim of the scheme is to bring players to adult playing level with the appropriate technical, physical and tactical preparation required to allow them to make the step up successfully.
If it works, this well-thought-out plan should move the preparation of under-age development squads in the county onto a new level. For me, the key elements of the plan are the involvement of top-level expertise in supervisory and advisory capacities, the creation of a common template for all development squads to work from, the provision of back-up assistance and, perhaps above all, the prospect of managed progress as players move up through the age grades.
Up to now, in my view, the appointment of development squad managers was rather ad hoc and, once appointed, they were essentially on their own. A major weakness has been the absence of structures for coordinating the work of the different squads and linking squads from successive years together. This contrasts, in particular, with the developmental system in place in Limerick in recent years.
Ultimately, the crucial role in making the system work will be played by Jason Ryan’s organising committee who have devised the system and now have the challenging task of implementing it. They, and the County Board, are to be congratulated on this initiative and we wish them all the best in putting it into effect.
If I have left out any other key features of the scheme, or made any errors in my reading of the scheme from the Dungarvan Leader article, I would welcome clarifications and further inputs from other readers.
It’s a very well thought out plan and something that a lot of clubs and individuals have highlighted and asked for over the last 10yrs or so. I know a lot of fellas that have been involved in both hurling and football development squads have looked for a more professional approach from the board and of coaching and games in particular. It wasn’t forthcoming. The whole regionalised and mentor system is totally what’s needed. It will only benefit us in the long run in hurling, not so sure it’ll benefit football. But we aren’t a big enough county to accommodate both at intercounty level so I think a decision has to be made there. If you’ve 8 regionalised squads of 25 u-13s in hurling, that’s 200 lads concentrating solely on trying to get on the final county squad. There’s not another 30 lads in the county who are going to be good enough to be anyway competitive at intercounty level in football. And unfortunately for the footballers that’s just the way it is.
The mentor system is an excellent idea and will help us to develop a very specific styles of play as limerick, wexford and Galway have done over the last 10yrs or so. Cork,Clare and Offaly are in year 3 of their new development squad structures ( cork and Clare both by passed 2019 Tony forristal,if not the 18 also, in favour of regional squads rather then a county squad at that age). Kilkenny launched their redevelopment of their underage structure, with Dj Carey as head of redevelopment, this year and Tipperary are at the same stage we are. I’m not sure who is over the Tipperary restructuring but heard Liam sheedy had some involvement ( could be trouble for us if he is and steps down as their manager at the end of this year. Liam Cahill will be favoured for that job unless Tommy or Declan fanning step up to the job as what previously happened with Michael ryan and the other fella when sheedy stepped away). There’s also 6/7, predominately football counties,restructuring their underage systems to catch up with the kerrys, Dublins, Mayos and Tyrones of the football world. Croke park have given a lot of money towards coaching and games to each county over the last 12/13 years, and we’ve received substantially more then counties with more clubs then us, but about 4 years ago questions were asked about what exactly was the money being spent on. Every county had to put proper structures and accountability in place. So whilst the board deserves credit for implementing the new system, brilliant, we are a year or 2 behind other counties.
I’m fully supportive of the ideas, principals of the whole thing. It’s exactly what’s needed. And best of luck to the managers, mentors and players. But here is my issues with it. Some of the people who’ve been involved with the coaching and games are now over seeing the whole system. This wasn’t a brain wave by any of them. The change came from the top down. Whilst I do like the structures they’ve put in place and am very impressed by some of the personnel that are getting involved I’m not sure, going on past performances, they can deliver on the potential of the group assembled. Eoin Breathnach has been over coaching and games in the county for the last 10/12 years and has failed us miserably in that time. A very nice fella but I feel the job itself is too big for him and isn’t strong enough to stand up to our “ brilliant” county secretary. We’ve a very good club coaching and games officer in Eoin Morrissey from Erins Own club who was involved in both Westmeath and wexford GAA over the last few years. He has done some great work since being appointed in November. This is the man I’d have over the whole restructuring and would appoint county coaching and games officer with immediate affect. This brings me to the previous coaching and games officers. This position was viewed as a stepping stone to other positions on the boards for certain individuals none more so then the author of the piece in the leader newspaper. As for the man who was the minor hurling manager for 2 years. A very good hurling coach but as a manager left himself down very badly and should’ve done better with a decent minor team in 19, too negative. Could do a good job but doesn’t like taking direction and has openly displayed his dislike towards football. Jason Ryan will be brilliant and have every confidence in him. Not all own for experience but is vice principal of the technical school in dungarvan and everyone has great praise for the job he does in the school. Dave Robinson also a massive plus and through his work, as a GDO, understands and has seen the problems and will find the solutions.
Look it has the potential to be very good but there needed to be new leaders there and they weren’t put in place. A couple of fellas that failed us in the past are still hanging around it like bad pennies. There’s still time to make these improvements so hopefully our chairman does the right think.0 -
Anyone get a chance to look at the “wexford way player pathway”? Brilliant document. Well laid out and expertly put together. Our restructuring doesn’t include GDOs. Wexford have 11 full time staff in coaching and games, 8 full time GDOs. By 2025 they are hoping to increase this to 15. We’ve 3 GDOs.0
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Happy theres now a start date for the new season. Looking forward to what league and championship structure is put in place0
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Reckon we're playing Limerick first in the league. Going by last year's games it's Limerick, Westmeath and Tipp at home with Cork and Galway away
Not that it matters and more than likely we will be watching at home but can't wait for the season to begin0 -
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Reckon we're playing Limerick first in the league. Going by last year's games it's Limerick, Westmeath and Tipp at home with Cork and Galway away
Not that it matters and more than likely we will be watching at home but can't wait for the season to begin
Be good to see Waterford play Limerick again. It might get the All Ireland out of the system if they have a proper cut off them and get a goal or two. A win would be fantastic for confidence.Support 🇮🇱 Israel
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With the resumption of intercounty hurling now not far away, it is time to start thinking about Waterford’s championship prospects for 2021. The key question here, of course, is will Waterford be capable of reproducing, or even improving on, the team’s 2020 heroics. Supplementary questions include how will we respond to the huge loss of Tadhg de Búrca and how will the new additions to the panel contribute to the 2021 campaign?
Last year we had ten players who played senior championship hurling in Croke Park for the first time. That, in itself, was an extraordinary achievement. Hopefully, many of these will build on this experience and improve even further this year, although it would be unrealistic to expect all of them to do so. There may be some who were on last year’s panel and who didn’t feature during the year but who may put up their hands this year. Then there are the new additions to the panel, with the further fascinating possibility that the unnamed group of promising young prospects whom Liam Cahill has brought into the training panel could throw up one or two “bolters”.
In 2020, 24 players in all got at least some game time in the championship. Of these, Stephen O’Keeffe and Tadhg de Búrca will not be available this year. There were a further eleven players who saw some game time in last year’s league, although I expect that some of these will not feature this year, and may not even be on the panel. Three who definitely will be are the recovered Pauric Mahony and the two goalkeepers, Billy Nolan and Shaun O’Brien. It is also possible that Darragh Fives might also return to action, but you cannot plan with him in mind.
One young player who got a fair amount of league action last year but failed to feature in the championship is Tom Barron. It will be interesting to see how he fares this year. At least two players were added to the panel before the pandemic brought the league to a premature halt last March – Ian Kenny and Conor Sheahan. Kenny, of course, ended up starting the All-Ireland final. I don’t know what Sheahan’s current position is.
Of the five players added to the panel, two – Michael Kiely and DJ Foran – were named in the initial training panel last year but were subsequently ruled out for the year due to injury. This fate also befell Colm Roche, but apparently he has not been named in this year’s panel, despite performing strongly in the 2020 club championship. The other three new panel members are Shane Bennett, Seamus Keating and Tonto Douglas. Bennett we know all about. All I can say about Douglas is that I know he has size and skill. Keating, to my knowledge, has played just once in the championship for Waterford, when he came on as a first-half substitute in the dead rubber game against Cork in 2018. Playing at centre back, he made a very positive impression that day, but strangely was never seen in the colours again. A big, strong, athletic and forceful player, he obviously was brought into the panel in response to the loss of de Búrca.
Given last year’s success, one would not expect substantial change in this year’s team. I am not too concerned about Stephen O’Keeffe’s departure. Billy Nolan is a good shot stopper, is probably a better hurler than O’Keeffe as he plays his club hurling outfield, and I have seen him when at DCU hitting pinpoint long balls to team mates far out the field. His backup, Shaun O’Brien, made a good impression in his one outing last year, against Limerick in the league.
The full back line was outstanding last year. Ian Kenny was thrown in at the deep end when Shane Fives got injured but coped okay and will be better for the experience. At the same time, I remain concerned at the depth of backup for this line.
It is a tall order trying to fill in for Tadhg de Búrca. I’m not sure that Iarlaith Daly has the experience or presence to dominate in this position, and would rather see him at wing back in place of Kevin Moran who, in my view, is not good enough in this position and should be restored to midfield, where he has played his best hurling for Waterford. Callum Lyons would certainly have the power and ball-winning ability for centre back, but that might deprive us of the powerful running forward which is a feature of his game on the wing. It will be interesting to see how Seamus Keating gets on if tried in this position in the league.
Up front, everyone will be eagerly looking forward to seeing if Michael Kiely will be able to transfer his outstanding under-age form to the senior level. He certainly has the capability of providing an entirely new focus to the forward line at full forward. His ball-winning, skill and ability to lay off ball could be a lethal asset combined with the predatory skills of Dessie Hutchinson and Patrick Curran.
Further out, if Jack Fagan was able to reproduce his devastating display from the second half against Kilkenny he would be a fixture at wing forward with Austin Gleeson on the other. An interesting question is whether and how Pauric Mahony could be accommodated. Mahony is particularly good at taking passes and slotting points from 40-60 metres out, so having two ball-winning wing forwards could provide the perfect platform for this. It could be that Cahill will go with a two-man full forward line with Stephen Bennett free to range around the field, a role he filled to great effect in 2020.
One of Waterford’s great assets last year was their very effective bench (never as obvious as in the game against Kilkenny, whose substitutes had no impact on the night). This is likely to be even more the case this year when, in addition to those already named, Liam Cahill will also have Neil Montgomery, Darragh Lyons, Kieran and Shane Bennett, Jack Prendergast, Conor Gleeson, Patrick Curran, and DJ Foran at his disposal. I don’t think you will find a panel as strong as this in any other county.
Liam Cahill will also have (hopefully) five league games in almost summer conditions to try out his panel and work on his game plan (which he never really was able to do last year). All in all, I do think that Waterford supporters have good reason to be hopeful, if not indeed optimistic, going into the coming season.0 -
Giveitfong wrote: »With the resumption of intercounty hurling now not far away, it is time to start thinking about Waterford’s championship prospects for 2021....
...
...All in all, I do think that Waterford supporters have good reason to be hopeful, if not indeed optimistic, going into the coming season.
I've just put on Journey & stood to attention.0 -
Giveitfong wrote: »With the resumption of intercounty hurling now not far away, it is time to start thinking about Waterford’s championship prospects for 2021. The key question here, of course, is will Waterford be capable of reproducing, or even improving on, the team’s 2020 heroics. Supplementary questions include how will we respond to the huge loss of Tadhg de Búrca and how will the new additions to the panel contribute to the 2021 campaign?
Last year we had ten players who played senior championship hurling in Croke Park for the first time. That, in itself, was an extraordinary achievement. Hopefully, many of these will build on this experience and improve even further this year, although it would be unrealistic to expect all of them to do so. There may be some who were on last year’s panel and who didn’t feature during the year but who may put up their hands this year. Then there are the new additions to the panel, with the further fascinating possibility that the unnamed group of promising young prospects whom Liam Cahill has brought into the training panel could throw up one or two “bolters”.
In 2020, 24 players in all got at least some game time in the championship. Of these, Stephen O’Keeffe and Tadhg de Búrca will not be available this year. There were a further eleven players who saw some game time in last year’s league, although I expect that some of these will not feature this year, and may not even be on the panel. Three who definitely will be are the recovered Pauric Mahony and the two goalkeepers, Billy Nolan and Shaun O’Brien. It is also possible that Darragh Fives might also return to action, but you cannot plan with him in mind.
One young player who got a fair amount of league action last year but failed to feature in the championship is Tom Barron. It will be interesting to see how he fares this year. At least two players were added to the panel before the pandemic brought the league to a premature halt last March – Ian Kenny and Conor Sheahan. Kenny, of course, ended up starting the All-Ireland final. I don’t know what Sheahan’s current position is.
Of the five players added to the panel, two – Michael Kiely and DJ Foran – were named in the initial training panel last year but were subsequently ruled out for the year due to injury. This fate also befell Colm Roche, but apparently he has not been named in this year’s panel, despite performing strongly in the 2020 club championship. The other three new panel members are Shane Bennett, Seamus Keating and Tonto Douglas. Bennett we know all about. All I can say about Douglas is that I know he has size and skill. Keating, to my knowledge, has played just once in the championship for Waterford, when he came on as a first-half substitute in the dead rubber game against Cork in 2018. Playing at centre back, he made a very positive impression that day, but strangely was never seen in the colours again. A big, strong, athletic and forceful player, he obviously was brought into the panel in response to the loss of de Búrca.
Given last year’s success, one would not expect substantial change in this year’s team. I am not too concerned about Stephen O’Keeffe’s departure. Billy Nolan is a good shot stopper, is probably a better hurler than O’Keeffe as he plays his club hurling outfield, and I have seen him when at DCU hitting pinpoint long balls to team mates far out the field. His backup, Shaun O’Brien, made a good impression in his one outing last year, against Limerick in the league.
The full back line was outstanding last year. Ian Kenny was thrown in at the deep end when Shane Fives got injured but coped okay and will be better for the experience. At the same time, I remain concerned at the depth of backup for this line.
It is a tall order trying to fill in for Tadhg de Búrca. I’m not sure that Iarlaith Daly has the experience or presence to dominate in this position, and would rather see him at wing back in place of Kevin Moran who, in my view, is not good enough in this position and should be restored to midfield, where he has played his best hurling for Waterford. Callum Lyons would certainly have the power and ball-winning ability for centre back, but that might deprive us of the powerful running forward which is a feature of his game on the wing. It will be interesting to see how Seamus Keating gets on if tried in this position in the league.
Up front, everyone will be eagerly looking forward to seeing if Michael Kiely will be able to transfer his outstanding under-age form to the senior level. He certainly has the capability of providing an entirely new focus to the forward line at full forward. His ball-winning, skill and ability to lay off ball could be a lethal asset combined with the predatory skills of Dessie Hutchinson and Patrick Curran.
Further out, if Jack Fagan was able to reproduce his devastating display from the second half against Kilkenny he would be a fixture at wing forward with Austin Gleeson on the other. An interesting question is whether and how Pauric Mahony could be accommodated. Mahony is particularly good at taking passes and slotting points from 40-60 metres out, so having two ball-winning wing forwards could provide the perfect platform for this. It could be that Cahill will go with a two-man full forward line with Stephen Bennett free to range around the field, a role he filled to great effect in 2020.
One of Waterford’s great assets last year was their very effective bench (never as obvious as in the game against Kilkenny, whose substitutes had no impact on the night). This is likely to be even more the case this year when, in addition to those already named, Liam Cahill will also have Neil Montgomery, Darragh Lyons, Kieran and Shane Bennett, Jack Prendergast, Conor Gleeson, Patrick Curran, and DJ Foran at his disposal. I don’t think you will find a panel as strong as this in any other county.
Liam Cahill will also have (hopefully) five league games in almost summer conditions to try out his panel and work on his game plan (which he never really was able to do last year). All in all, I do think that Waterford supporters have good reason to be hopeful, if not indeed optimistic, going into the coming season.
Very good write up and its hard not to excited about the season starting (tbh it should of been started earlier in the year but GAA put up no fight to get that Elite status back). Clare or Cork in a Munster semi final would be an ideal draw but then again Munster is still a minefield with no easy draws.
This is possibly Cahills last year as Waterford boss although he has the option of a 3rd year his head could be turned by his native county esp if Liam Sheedy leaves the role as Tipp boss. Lets hope he leaves no stone unturned and he knows the areas in which we need to improve.0 -
Didn't pauric Mahony do his cruciate? that was last October, hard to see him being back for us this summer unfortunately0
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https://twitter.com/Stephen_Long/status/1332803425961205761I've just put on Journey & stood to attention.0 -
Cork away will be our first game in the league as I saw from local papers Westmeath vs Galway and Limerick vs Tipp are the opening games for them
We're travelling to Galway on Sunday 6th June (Jesus what a BH weekend that could of been)0 -
League fixtures
NHL
Sun 9th May- Cork (A)
Sun 16th May- Westmeath (H)
Sun 23rd May- Limerick (H)
Sun 6th June- Galway (A)
Sun 13th June- Tipperary (H)
NFL
Sat 15th May- Carlow (H)
Sun 23rd May- Wexford (A)
https://waterford-news.ie/2021/04/16/deise-hurlers-to-begin-2021-league-campaign-in-cork/0 -
Deisegodeo wrote: »Didn't pauric Mahony do his cruciate? that was last October, hard to see him being back for us this summer unfortunately
Pretty sure it was ankle ligament damage. Not cruciate.
Is De Burca definitely gone for the year can anyone comfirm? I mean he was named on the panel0 -
Mastermcgrath wrote: »Pretty sure it was ankle ligament damage. Not cruciate.
Is De Burca definitely gone for the year can anyone comfirm? I mean he was named on the panel
Mahony certainly did his cruciate, gave interviews discussing it prior to the All Ireland Final.
Tadhg did his cruciate in December, optimistic timescales on recovery are usually 8-9 months. So he won’t be playing any part. I’d imagine he is named as part of the panel so he will have access to all medical / gym facilities & personnel.0 -
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Clare or Cork in a semi final would be our best draw, would need to stay away from Limerick and Tipp. Eitherway a bye into a semi final would be ideal0
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Waterford v Clare in the quarter, winner plays Tipp in the semi.0
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No point in complaining, no easy draws in Munster. Clare are a good side if they have their players back available to them and the issues between county board and management are resolved.0
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The main thing is that we have avoided Limerick until the Munster final (assuming we - and they - get there). Clare are eminently beatable, and very reliant on Tony Kelly. Apart from Conlon (who is getting on) and Duggan, who were they missing last year?
My view of Tipperary is that all of their top players are now on the wrong side of 30 with a lot of mileage clocked up, while there don't seem to be any gems among their younger players. Despite two recent under 20/21 All-Irelands, they haven't produced anyone of the calibre of Calum Lyons, while they don't have players in their mid-20s comparable to Austin Gleeson, Stephen Bennett and Jamie Barron. I certainly would not fear them (especially with Liam Cahill driving us on).0 -
Giveitfong wrote: »The main thing is that we have avoided Limerick until the Munster final (assuming we - and they - get there). Clare are eminently beatable, and very reliant on Tony Kelly. Apart from Conlon (who is getting on) and Duggan, who were they missing last year?
My view of Tipperary is that all of their top players are now on the wrong side of 30 with a lot of mileage clocked up, while there don't seem to be any gems among their younger players. Despite two recent under 20/21 All-Irelands, they haven't produced anyone of the calibre of Calum Lyons, while they don't have players in their mid-20s comparable to Austin Gleeson, Stephen Bennett and Jamie Barron. I certainly would not fear them (especially with Liam Cahill driving us on).
In my view, this is the best possible draw for Waterford but not in terms of disrespecting Clare and Tipp as soft touches but for other factors.
I always feel playing a 1/4 final is the best draw, no matter who you draw. It focuses the mind for the year and you know exactly what you need to do in terms of who you are playing and may play after than. Win and you have some momentum and confidence and you are set up for a one-off shot to reach an All-Ireland 1/4 final minimum. You've learned a bit about yourself from the opening game, you are out of league mode and you can really go at a semi-final. Lose and you have that extra time to recover before the qualifiers to sort the mistakes, personnel, tactics etc as well as sorting the minds after a defeat. Sometimes, losing a provincial semi-final doesn't afford you that time but losing a semi having won a 1/4 makes recovery easier.
Although slightly contradicting myself, I'd agree that avoiding Limerick was the key. Not that Waterford should fear Limerick but as they're the best team in Ireland and avoiding them certainly makes it more likely that Waterford will reach a Munster final and have a path to the 1/4 finals.
In terms of the other 4 teams, despite Waterford making last year's final, I would put them all in a category that depending on personnel available, form, attitude etc, any of them could beat any of them on any given day.
Clare are in a position that Waterford have found themselves in in recent years: having to recover from a poor previous year. Their county board are taking a lot of flack for their behaviour in recent years, players have decided against committing to travel, a clot of injuries and murmuring of discontent amongst the panel. It could go either way under Lohan. They could get the players back to full fitness and once again, deliver on their huge potential and promise or they could flatter to deceive and be one of the also rans. Time will tell on this but either way, Waterford will not have it easy against Clare and can't be taken for granted.
In reality, Tipp are probably regarded as best of the rest of in Munster having won the All-Ireland less than 2 years ago and having won an under 21 and an under 20 All-Ireland in recent years. Most of the 2006/07 minor winning team that have backboned the senior team since 2009 (3 of the Mahers, N McGrath, Callanan etc) are the wrong side of 30 but they definitely have a kick in them yet and the break they've had over the last 6 months will do them no harm at all. I feel they will be the happiest with the draw.
On the other side of the draw, it will be interesting to see how Cork fare this year and after the mini clearout by Kingston. God only knows what would have happened if Nickie Quaid hadn't blocked the Harnedy shot in 2018. There's no denying Cork left that semi-final behind them and if I was a Cork supporter, that would be up there with the regrets I feel towards the 98 defeat to Kilkenny, Clare in 02 & Limerick in 07. The trajectories of both counties could have been very different. And looking at the opening game of 2019, Cork were much superior to Limerick with their pace & movement but again, both counties have moved in opposite directions since.
If Kingston is to get things right, there is talent in Cork and again, they could flourish, or they could be a year or 2 getting to the required level. In some ways they are in a no lose situation. Lose to Limerick as expected and they go the expected route of the qualifiers and they could get a favourable draw and build from there and gain momentum. Beat Limerick and they get that Cork swagger and confidence back and they are the most dangerous of animal. No team can win All-Irelands from nowhere like Cork did in 90 & 99. However, having said this, I genuinely don't think they at the top table yet. I have said there is talent, but I'm not sure their key positions are strong enough and it takes time for players to bed into these. I'd expect Limerick to overcome Cork, and as with Clare, Cork are unpredictable at the minute & it could go either way from there.
I won't go into detail on ourselves or Limerick but this is the start of it now, lads back training tonight, weather to get milder, matches in sight, roll on the league & we will learn a lot more.0 -
Giveitfong wrote: »The main thing is that we have avoided Limerick until the Munster final (assuming we - and they - get there). Clare are eminently beatable, and very reliant on Tony Kelly. Apart from Conlon (who is getting on) and Duggan, who were they missing last year?
My view of Tipperary is that all of their top players are now on the wrong side of 30 with a lot of mileage clocked up, while there don't seem to be any gems among their younger players. Despite two recent under 20/21 All-Irelands, they haven't produced anyone of the calibre of Calum Lyons, while they don't have players in their mid-20s comparable to Austin Gleeson, Stephen Bennett and Jamie Barron. I certainly would not fear them (especially with Liam Cahill driving us on).
Weren’t they missing Colm Galvin and Podge Collins aswell. That’s 4 massive players
All things being said it would be a disappointment if we lost to them in the first round. Tipp is a team I’d love to see us have a right crack at. We haven’t beaten them in the championship since 08 semi final and I reckon Cahill would love to mastermind a victory against them.0 -
Is what it is, no easy draw in Munster.
Take it one game at a time, Clare are an impressive team.
Can't wait for the new season
Footballers once again face Limerick in the QF0 -
Mastermcgrath wrote: »Weren’t they missing Colm Galvin and Podge Collins aswell. That’s 4 massive players
All things being said it would be a disappointment if we lost to them in the first round. Tipp is a team I’d love to see us have a right crack at. We haven’t beaten them in the championship since 08 semi final and I reckon Cahill would love to mastermind a victory against them.
Podge Collins hasn’t been a massive player for Clare since 2013 IMO. Galvin will be a big addition undoubtedly, along with Duggan & Conlan.
Tadhg is going to be a colossal loss to us this year. He was a HOTY candidate going into the All Ireland final.0 -
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Think the Clare match will be the weekend of 26th/27th June and the semi final the weekend of 3rd/4th July. Munster final is set for the 18th July
Qualifiers starting with 3 rounds (one been a Preliminary round with the 2 teams beaten in the Leinster QFS) the weekend of the 10th/11th July with the next 2 rounds the weekends after leading up to the All Ireland Quarter Finals on the 31st July0
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