All Covid-19 measures are permanent, don't be a boiling frog!

sabat

sabat wrote: »

Don't waste your time poster; note how every single genuine person like yourself gets subjected to the same sh1t from the same 2 or 3 people and just abandons the thread in frustration. It's against the forum charter and against the spirit of the site in general-I even complained to a c-mod about it but nothing happened.



This a good site covering topics I think you're interested in:

https://www.technocracy.news/

What I don't get is the continued insistence that there's no evidence. I would argue that there's plenty of evidence, but no proof. And then when you quote Priti Patel saying that social distancing is 'here to stay' you're accused of taking her out of context. And when Professor Edmunds, an influential member of SAGE, says masks will probably be required by law for ever it's the 'probably' that's focused on. When has 'probably' ever been 'probably not'?

Patrick Wood is great. James Delingpole interviewed him a couple of times.

PintOfView

Deleted User wrote: »

What I don't get is the continued insistence that there's no evidence. I would argue that there's plenty of evidence, but no proof. And then when you quote Priti Patel saying that social distancing is 'here to stay' you're accused of taking her out of context. And when Professor Edmunds, an influential member of SAGE, says masks will probably be required by law for ever it's the 'probably' that's focused on. When has 'probably' ever been 'probably not'?

Patrick Wood is great. James Delingpole interviewed him a couple of times.

But there is more evidence for the opposite view, so how you selectively choose the evidence to believe?

robinph

[Deleted User] wrote: »

What I don't get is the continued insistence that there's no evidence. I would argue that there's plenty of evidence, but no proof. And then when you quote Priti Patel saying that social distancing is 'here to stay' you're accused of taking her out of context. And when Professor Edmunds, an influential member of SAGE, says masks will probably be required by law for ever it's the 'probably' that's focused on. When has 'probably' ever been 'probably not'?

Patrick Wood is great. James Delingpole interviewed him a couple of times.

So just to humour you for a second, if Priti Patel did actually mean what you think she meant...

Why? What is in it for the government? What is in it for all world governments? Why have they all somehow decided to follow the same plan to force their populations to wear masks? Who is behind this plan?

PintOfView

PintOfView wrote: »

But his hypothesis is nothing but gaping holes!!

The biggest gaping hole is that it is written from the point of view of someone who didn't know there was a nasty virus in circulation, or didn't believe it, and who then tries to come up with alternative explanations for the measures put in place to reduce Covid transmission, and ignores the blindingly obvious.

Because schools and other places have spent some money in facilitating hand sanitisation and social distancing means we can't revert to normal!
This is nonsense!

His refers to "the hype about TB " and how the TB eradication scheme is used by the government to control agriculture.
Again nonsense, TB is a contagious disease in cattle, and it's only thanks to a well organised scheme down the years that it's been kept under control, though not yet fully eradicated.

Extra security restrictions introduced after 9/11 are not necessary now that the scare has died down!
So he thinks that the types of people who did Locherbie, and downed other planes, and flew planes into the world trade centre, and those who were less successful and were caught, these have all gone away!
Clearly nonsense.

Re covid he says "These measures are being rolled out precisely because they have huge social and population control advantages for the state, hence they are only piggy backing on the virus to do what they have all along planned to do, and hence have no intention of ever releasing you in the future from their newly introduced grip."
Sorry, but that is delusional (or designed to manipulate the gullible)!

When the virus becomes less of a problem, for eg., when most people have been vaccinated, why would all these measures not stop?

And who are 'they'? Ireland it governed by our own government, who we elect. If we don't like what the government does we can put in a new government, and you can even run for the dail yourself!

You possibly sincerely believe the nonsense that the op wrote, and if you do I can only say that you're worrying yourself unnecessarily.
There are other more mundane real things to be concerned about, but not what the op was saying.

I don't he said that there was no virus in circulation, did he? He wrote that he believes it is being weaponised to control people. The Government has spend a lot of money to change the face of society. It does point to measures being permanent.

Would you agree with other posters that this is nonsense: https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/lc1kp1/flatten_the_curve_part_82_peter_theil_klaus/

robinph

robinph wrote: »

So just to humour you for a second, if Priti Patel did actually mean what you think she meant...

Why? What is in it for the government? What is in it for all world governments? Why have they all somehow decided to follow the same plan to force their populations to wear masks? Who is behind this plan?

What does 'here to stay' mean? It's not what I think she meant. It's what she meant. Here to stay means permanent.

It would mean that less movement, less pollution, clear skies, clean water. WEF tweeted the other day that lockdowns were improving life in cities.

robinph

[Deleted User] wrote: »

What does 'here to stay' mean? It's not what I think she meant. It's what she meant. Here to stay means permanent.

It would mean that less movement, less pollution, clear skies, clean water. WEF tweeted the other day that lockdowns were improving life in cities.

So we are being made to wear masks because all world governments have suddenly decided to coordinate a plan to tackle climate change?

What made them suddenly decide to take such drastic action of closing down international travel and majorly reducing their economy's? If they had finally acknowledged that climate change was an emergency, what made the sudden change in opinion? Could they not have all agreed to some updated version of the Paris agreement without shutting down the world economy so much?

PintOfView

Deleted User wrote: »

I don't he said that there was no virus in circulation, did he? He wrote that he believes it is being weaponised to control people. The Government has spend a lot of money to change the face of society. It does point to measures being permanent.

Would you agree with other posters that this is nonsense: https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/lc1kp1/flatten_the_curve_part_82_peter_theil_klaus/

But he's ignoring the obvious explanations for the measures that were put in place, almost like he doesn't believe there was a virus, or that it wasn't serious!

What should the government have done in the face of the virus? Do nothing and let people die?

When you say the government have spent a lot of money to change the face of society, what changes in particular are you referring to?

Dohnjoe

sabat wrote: »

Don't waste your time poster; note how every single genuine person like yourself gets subjected to the same sh1t from the same 2 or 3 people and just abandons the thread in frustration. It's against the forum charter and against the spirit of the site in general-I even complained to a c-mod about it but nothing happened.

You believe this is all a conspiracy by the "elites", but the poster you are referring to believes this is a Communist conspiracy. Those are completely different and contradictory conspiracies. Which begs the question, why would you agree with someone who contradicts you?

The answer is because both conspiracies are bull**** so you feel you have to defend both to defend your own view.

PintOfView

sabat wrote: »

This a good site covering topics I think you're interested in:

https://www.technocracy.news/

Can I ask if you believe all you read on that web site?

Do you double check anything you read on that and similar sites?

Dohnjoe

Deleted User wrote: »

What does 'here to stay' mean? It's not what I think she meant. It's what she meant. Here to stay means permanent.

You are misinterpreting what she said. This has already been explained and given context to you.

She said some changes, e.g. workplace changes, public transport, might become permanent (in her opinion). And they might, I don't think most office based companies will go back to normal working practice again. There's nothing sinister or "evil" or nefarious about that, it's just a side-effect of all that having to be sped up due to a pandemic.

Dohnjoe

Again the repeating pattern if it wasn't obvious

• Posters who make extreme claims, no matter how contradictory, try to validate each other.
• Evading common sense questions
• Vague conspiracies
• Paranoia of authority
• Inability to question source information
• Inability to understand basic scientific reasoning
• Belief in multiple conspiracies and across multiple subjects
• Impervious to reason/logic

PintOfView

PintOfView wrote: »

But he's ignoring the obvious explanations for the measures that were put in place, almost like he doesn't believe there was a virus, or that it wasn't serious!

What should the government have done in the face of the virus? Do nothing and let people die?

When you say the government have spent a lot of money to change the face of society, what changes in particular are you referring to?

I imagine the OP is referring to the signs you see everywhere saying "masks required", the perspex screens, the social distancing markings on shop floors.

I would go down the road Lord Sumption suggests in this interview: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJPF5j129QQ

That is to leave it up to people to decide what risks they wish to take.

Dohnjoe

Dohnjoe wrote: »

Again the repeating pattern if it wasn't obvious

• Posters who make extreme claims, no matter how contradictory, try to validate each other.
• Evading common sense questions
• Vague conspiracies
• Paranoia of authority
• Inability to question source information
• Inability to understand basic scientific reasoning
• Belief in multiple conspiracies and across multiple subjects
• Impervious to reason/logic

Neil Clark has said numerous times in the past that an inside source he has in the Conservative Party told him months ago that there would be no significant easing of restrictions until June and that there would be another lockdown in autumn. He first said that months ago. And he was spot on. Nothing vague about that.

Dohnjoe

Deleted User wrote: »

I would go down the road Lord Sumption suggests in this interview: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJPF5j129QQ

That is to leave it up to people to decide what risks they wish to take.

That interview is from May 2020, so he has egg on his face. He's also a bit of a loony.

The fact that you keep linking this stuff tells me instantly that you read conspiracy sites regularly, because that's where all this guff comes from.

As for his suggestion, it is of course idiotic. If some ignorant person decides not to wear a mask, they might be fine, but they risk infecting your mother/father/grandparents/etc. Which is why masks have been encouraged or made mandatory in many situations.

Dohnjoe

Deleted User wrote: »

Neil Clark has said numerous times in the past that an inside source he has in the Conservative Party told him months ago that there would be no significant easing of restrictions until June and that there would be another lockdown in autumn. He first said that months ago. And he was spot on. Nothing vague about that.

There is no "inside source". Experts and scientists had been warning since March 2020 that there was likely to be a second wave.

You started off posting here as an "objective" poster, the mask has now fully come off and you are now peddling and entertaining several Covid conspiracies at once. Again, this is not the first time we've seen this. In fact, by my count this is the 4th time you've done this.

Dohnjoe

Dohnjoe wrote: »

That interview is from May 2020, so he has egg on his face. He's also a bit of a loony.

The fact that you keep linking this stuff tells me instantly that you read conspiracy sites regularly, because that's where all this guff comes from.

As for his suggestion, it is of course idiotic. If some ignorant person decides not to wear a mask, they might be fine, but they risk infecting your mother/father/grandparents/etc. Which is why masks have been encouraged or made mandatory in many situations.

Is YouTube a conspiracy website?

He's probably one of the most, if not the most, learned and erudite people in England.

Dohnjoe

Dohnjoe wrote: »

There is no "inside source". Experts and scientists had been warning since March 2020 that there was likely to be a second wave.

You started off posting here as an "objective" poster, the mask has now fully come off and you are now peddling and entertaining several Covid conspiracies at once. Again, this is not the first time we've seen this. In fact, by my count this is the 4th time you've done this.

https://twitter.com/neilclark66/status/1352239276038217729

One of his tweets about his inside source.

I'm not peddling conspiracy theories. I was asked about the OP's post and I examined what he wrote. And I said 'potential variants' means that measures would be de facto permanent. Because a potential variant could appear 10, 20, 30, or 40 years down the road.

Dohnjoe

Deleted User wrote: »

Is YouTube a conspiracy website?

No, but people with extreme views can still appear.

He's probably one of the most, if not the most, learned and erudite people in England.

Yeah no. His views and specifically lockdown views are controversial to say the least

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jonathan_Sumption,_Lord_Sumption
https://www.theguardian.com/law/2021/jan/19/less-valuable-experts-unconvinced-by-lord-sumptions-lockdown-ethics

The only reason he appears on this forum is because he is anti-lockdown (any conspiracy thread on Covid involves Covid denial and anti-lockdown views)

robinph

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Neil Clark has said numerous times in the past that an inside source he has in the Conservative Party told him months ago that there would be no significant easing of restrictions until June and that there would be another lockdown in autumn. He first said that months ago. And he was spot on. Nothing vague about that.

Wonder where they got that idea from? It's not like any other viruses tend to reduce during the summer months and become more common during the winter months.

robinph

[Deleted User] wrote: »

https://twitter.com/neilclark66/status/1352239276038217729

One of his tweets about his inside source.

I'm not peddling conspiracy theories. I was asked about the OP's post and I examined what he wrote. And I said 'potential variants' means that measures would be de facto permanent. Because a potential variant could appear 10, 20, 30, or 40 years down the road.

Hang on a moment, now we're wearing masks for evermore because a new variant might appear in 40 years time.

A few minutes ago we were wearing masks forever because of climate change?

Dohnjoe

Deleted User wrote: »

Neil Clark

Yeah

https://johnwight1.medium.com/meet-neil-clark-a-covid-crank-working-with-russian-state-media-to-undermine-public-health-in-the-88c6d947033a

I'm not peddling conspiracy theories. I was asked about the OP's post and I examined what he wrote. And I said 'potential variants' means that measures would be de facto permanent. Because a potential variant could appear 10, 20, 30, or 40 years down the road.

Seems like a repeat act to me.

You apparently will buy into just about any conspiracy about Covid going, from the Communist one to the batshiat insane one on Reddit. If that's your thing, cool. But the "on the fence" pretense is wearing a bit thin here.

PintOfView

Deleted User wrote: »

I imagine the OP is referring to the signs you see everywhere saying "masks required", the perspex screens, the social distancing markings on shop floors.

But signs and perspex screens and floor markings are not expensive. How can you say that because they spent that money it looks permanent? What would you have done?

Deleted User wrote: »

I would go down the road Lord Sumption suggests in this interview: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJPF5j129QQ
That is to leave it up to people to decide what risks they wish to take.

And what do you think would happen if you left it up to everyone to decide whether to lockdown or socially distance, or wear masks?
All those measures in concert bring the transmission rate down.
If a significant minority of people don't observe the restrictions the virus will travel further and faster.
Wouldn't this make the situation worse?

Dohnjoe

Interesting how choosing a conspiracy is like window-shopping for some of these people.

"I reject your boring reality and substitute in this exciting fantasy instead.."

PintOfView

Deleted User wrote: »

He's probably one of the most, if not the most, learned and erudite people in England.

For each Lord Sumption we could likely find multiple other erudite people in England who disagree with him.
If we could find many more erudite people who say the opposite, would you go with their vews?
That is the test, otherwise is it the case you seek out those that confirm your bias?

Dohnjoe

sabat wrote: »

Don't waste your time poster; note how every single genuine person like yourself gets subjected to the same sh1t from the same 2 or 3 people and just abandons the thread in frustration. It's against the forum charter and against the spirit of the site in general-I even complained to a c-mod about it but nothing happened.

Have to reply to this again..

To address this directly: You come here to spread disinformation that comforts you. When other posters point out the obvious flaws, you are unable to address or explain those flaws, you are unable to answer straight-forward questions, but instead of drawing the conclusion that your beliefs must be faulty, you go the opposite direction and double-down on them. That makes no sense.

Not only that but you try find solidarity with other posters who are posting completely different disinformation, stuff that directly contradicts you. That again makes no sense.

I've heard over 20 different conspiracies on Covid, if there was actually a conspiracy happening, only one of them would be correct, which would mean 19 of those conspiracies are completely untrue.

I haven't come across a credible conspiracy here in years, which means this forum is, sorry to say, chock full of liesdisinformation. Every one else is just pointing out the obvious, but sure, villainize them but not the serial liars fantasists

Dohnjoe

Dohnjoe wrote: »

Have to reply to this again..

To address this directly: You come here to spread disinformation that comforts you. When other posters point out the obvious flaws, you are unable to address or explain those flaws, you are unable to answer straight-forward questions, but instead of drawing the conclusion that your beliefs must be faulty, you go the opposite direction and double-down on them. That makes no sense.

Not only that but you try find solidarity with other posters who are posting completely different disinformation, stuff that directly contradicts you. That again makes no sense.

I've heard over 20 different conspiracies on Covid, if there was actually a conspiracy happening, only one of them would be correct, which would mean 19 of those conspiracies are completely untrue.

I haven't come across a credible conspiracy here in years, which means this forum is, sorry to say, chock full of liesdisinformation. Every one else is just pointing out the obvious, but sure, villainize them but not the serial liars fantasists

A poster called one world order described in detail what he believes to be happening. brianhere described in detail what he believes is happening.

And you dismissed as nonsense what the research that poster on reddit did. He had quotes, sources, facts etc to back up what he was saying, and you just dismissed it as nonsense. You didn't even explain why you believe it to be nonsense.

Is this article from the Washington Times nonsense: https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2021/jan/9/great-reset-corporate-communism-and-its-coming-ame/

Timberrrrrrrr

[Deleted User] wrote: »

A poster called one world order described in detail what he believes to be happening. brianhere described in detail what he believes is happening.

And you dismissed as nonsense what the research that poster on reddit did. He had quotes, sources, facts etc to back up what he was saying, and you just dismissed it as nonsense. You didn't even explain why you believe it to be nonsense.

Is this article from the Washington Times nonsense: https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2021/jan/9/great-reset-corporate-communism-and-its-coming-ame/

That's not a news article though, that's an opinion piece, literally just someone's opinion.

Timberrrrrrrr

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

That's not a news article though, that's an opinion piece, literally just someone's opinion.

Her arguments are persuasive:

"Mask mandates, anyone?

If government can’t get it done the constitutional route, government can exert pressures on the private market to get the same done by a different route. No mask, no entry has become the normal shop store sign these days. Soon, no vaccine, no entry. Soon, no papers — no buying or selling.

With the coming oligarchy — the coming top-down global “build back better” and “great reset” campaigns — citizens won’t be able to travel, to work, to go to school, to shop or to sell without first meeting the standards set by corporate heads and their WEF partners.

It’s a takeover of free markets and an imposition of behavioral, political and economic standards on entire countries, by unelected, unaccountable, often even unseen and unknown billionaire elites.

And it’s coming to America.

It’s communism dressed as social justice capitalism.

Biden‘s announced nominations of union-friendly Cabinet members plays right into this “great reset” moment in time. Who else better equipped to cripple America’s free market from within than union members?

If seeing the battle is step one to winning the battle, then it’s crucial to acknowledge: Build back better means something. The great reset is real. And Americans must fight the communism these soft-sounding phrases are actually selling.

The WEF, remember, is comprised of private companies, and therefore largely sheltered from accountability. Or ballot box replacement.

If WEF‘s “Great Reset Initiative” reaches fruition, even elections — and with them, all those arguments over problematic election integrity — won’t matter. America, like all the countries of the world, will be run and governed and regulated by a crowd of corporate elitists and their billionaire friends. The Constitution will be just a piece of paper. Freedom will be only what they grant."

robinph

[Deleted User] wrote: »

And it’s coming to America.

So why is the rest of the worlds govements also in on this plan? How come governments who were not even elected a year ago are also following this plan to rule the world by the wearing of masks?

runawaybishop

robinph wrote: »

So why is the rest of the worlds govements also in on this plan? How come governments who were not even elected a year ago are also following this plan to rule the world by the wearing of masks?

Texas and Mississippi just dropped mask requirements. Maybe they weren't CCed on the plan?