Edinburgh vs Ulster, Sat 5th Sept 7:35pm

ScrubsfanChris

Thats still just the one final for Edinburgh in their pro rugby history.....

razorblunt

Slap in the face for Rory Lawson on comms too, he assumed from the restart it was going to extra time, completing ignoring, Ulster making inroads into the Edinburgh half.

Buer

Diabhal Beag wrote: »

I remember there were Ulster fans nonplussed about Dan McFarland coming in. He's done wonders.

He has done a fine job but I really wouldn't hold up the last few weeks (including tonight) as any massive endorsement of him.

Edinburgh sh*t the bed tonight and were shockingly indisciplined. Ulster were very poor for long stretches and deservedly went in to the break without a score on the board. 15 of their points came as a direct result of Edinburgh penalties.

I would imagine McFarland is delighted and relieved but wouldn't be happy with the actual performance this evening.

I'd love to hear Cockerill's thoughts after that. I'd imagine he'll be tearing strips off his players.

thomond2006

David Nucifora

The penalty from Willemse that gave Madigan the chance was horrendous. Flew out of the line into no man's land and gave away an incredibly cheap penalty. It summed up the Edinburgh performance, with better discipline they could have easily run out comfortable winners.

Burkie1203

thomond2006 wrote: »

The penalty from Ritchie that gave Madigan the chance was horrendous. Flew out of the line into no man's land.

Willemse was the player?

Leinstertomas

Burkie1203 wrote: »

We all know what happened the last time Ulster beat Embra in a SF and played Leinster.

Was the same score and all!

razorblunt

thomond2006 wrote: »

The penalty from Ritchie that gave Madigan the chance was horrendous. Flew out of the line into no man's land and gave away an incredibly cheap penalty. It summed up the Edinburgh performance, with better discipline they could have easily run out comfortable winners.

That was Willemse, fine margins and all that. He was an inch away.
Gilchrist for the Herring try was worse, he was making no effort to roll.

Jump_In_Jack

Fantastic finish, delighted for Madigan and hope Ulster bring that fight next week,
Such a better spectacle than yesterday.

awec

Locke_Lamora wrote: »

Leinster could put 60 on us and it still won't wipe the smile off my face. Ulster doing just enough to keep me coming back for more, love it.

Tonight means nothing if we don’t beat leinster next week.

Tired of being the bridesmaids, tired of watching leinster win everything.

I want the opportunity to be insufferable.

Diabhal Beag

Buer wrote: »

He has done a fine job but I really wouldn't hold up the last few weeks, including tonight as any massive endorsement of him.

1 win out of the 3 post-lockdown games isn't really the right window of games for looking at his overall term in fairness Beur.

I've mentioned this in the reply to former former but think of all the ill-will and frustration after the Kiss tenure. He basically left scorched Earth and it took a very shrewd and ruthless man to pick up the pieces.

Now Ulster are in bonus territory in both Europe and domestically after 2 years of solid coaching.

That second half was the best half of rugby since the return from covid.

lawrencesummers

Deleted User wrote: »

That second half was the best half of rugby since the return from covid.

....in the NH.

Buer

awec wrote: »

I want the opportunity to be insufferable.

Well boy do I've something to say that will please you.....

:pac:

KH25

Diabhal Beag wrote: »

1 win out of the 3 post-lockdown games isn't really the right window of games for looking at his overall term in fairness Beur.

I've mentioned this in the reply to former former but think of all the ill-will and frustration after the Kiss tenure. He basically left scorched Earth and it took a very shrewd and ruthless man to pick up the pieces.

Now Ulster are in bonus territory in both Europe and domestically after 2 years of solid coaching.

Agree it would be harsh to take these 3 games as an indication. For me it’s obvious to see the improvement in Ulster. It’s not perfect, but it is absolutely an improvement.

Loafing Oaf

What would have happened if it was level AET? Do they do penalty shootouts in rugby?

Buer

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

What would have happened if it was level AET? Do they do penalty shootouts in rugby?

Yup. Assuming same number of tries have been scored (which they had tonight).

Drop goals from 5 nominated players. Has only ever happened a couple of times.

thomond2006

David Nucifora

Buer wrote: »

Drop goals from 5 nominated players. Has only ever happened a couple of times.

Pity about the Madigan winner at the end, denying Marty Moore's opportunity to step up to take one of those drop goals.

Buer

McFarland's comments there suggests that Cooney's removal was purely tactical when speaking of the team being in the doldrums and having to change something at halftime.

Hard to see him starting next week after that. D'Arcy calling it out that Cooney has been poor now in consecutive matches and shouldn't start.

Squidgy Black

Buer wrote: »

McFarland's comments there suggests that Cooney's removal was purely tactical when speaking of the team being in the doldrums and having to change something at halftime.

Hard to see him starting next week after that. D'Arcy calling it out that Cooney has been poor now in consecutive matches and shouldn't start.

Good to see a coach not afraid to pull a key player if they're not performing all the same. He's been fairly ruthless the past couple of weeks overall when talking about some of the performances

Leinstertomas

Thought Matthewson was quality when he came on and a big reason Ulster won that. Ulster looked much more composed with him and passing was much crisper and more accurate than Cooney's. Those last few box kicks were vital

Paul Smeenus

And that's why we're the good guys. Never in doubt.

We switched on for the first time since the season restarted in the second half of this game. Better than either team played last night.

Delighted. Alby made a huge difference, but whatever McFarland said made a difference across the board. We looked less nervous, braver, and actually just focussed on ourselves and putting in a performance.

And now we're in the final.

bilston

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

And that's why we're the good guys. Never in doubt.

We switched on for the first time since the season restarted in the second half of this game. Better than either team played last night.

Delighted. Alby made a huge difference, but whatever McFarland said made a difference across the board. We looked less nervous, braver, and actually just focussed on ourselves and putting in a performance.

And now we're in the final.

Could be a big mental blockage cracked tonight for some of these guys.

I always rated that Madigan chap!

Buer

It will be interesting to see what changes are made next week by McFarland.

Cooney has to go. He is completely at sea at the moment. He can regain his mojo in the early season games but, for now, AB has to start.

I think Reidy needs to start. He's a robust carrier and Ulster need to share that burden; Coetzee cannot carry the team as well as all the ball. In the same regard, Treadwell deserves a start. I certainly don't see the fuss about Carter and how he earned 16 test caps.

In the back line, I was more impressed with Hume tonight. One great shoot and hit on Mata and it was his vision and pass that created the overlap for Lyttle's try. Stockdale has showed promise at 15 but we saw what he can bring on the wing. It's a curious call for next week.

I imagine the two bigger boned props will return to the starting line up also. They weren't great but got through a lot of nuts and bolts.

AbusesToilets

Little's try was fantastic, his stutter step was a thing of beauty

Buer

AbusesToilets wrote: »

Little's try was fantastic, his stutter step was a thing of beauty

Hamish Watson will wake up screaming about that try. 60 tackles without missing a single tackle and then that.

Paul Smeenus

Watson's face strolling away from that missed tackle was my first tingle of "Edinburgh are a bit mentally fragile".

Paul Smeenus

Buer wrote: »

It will be interesting to see what changes are made next week by McFarland.

Cooney has to go. He is completely at sea at the moment. He can regain his mojo in the early season games but, for now, AB has to start.

I think Reidy needs to start. He's a robust carrier and Ulster need to share that burden; Coetzee cannot carry the team as well as all the ball. In the same regard, Treadwell deserves a start. I certainly don't see the fuss about Carter and how he earned 16 test caps.

In the back line, I was more impressed with Hume tonight. One great shoot and hit on Mata and it was his vision and pass that created the overlap for Lyttle's try. Stockdale has showed promise at 15 but we saw what he can bring on the wing. It's a curious call for next week.

I imagine the two bigger boned props will return to the starting line up also. They weren't great but got through a lot of nuts and bolts.

Treadwell is young and hasn't kicked on the way I hoped he would. He's often a bit soft. But the way he threw himself again and again into hard carries was a testament to whatever buttons McFarland successfully pressed at half time. And absign that maybe he can be a good, tough second row. But Carter hasn't impressed me in a single game. I'd say Hendo and AOC are our best combo at the moment.

Hume is very good - a lot of potential. That's the hardest channel he's being asked to defend, and tonight he seemed to be stepping up. Great footwork, good passer, strong. Just a matter of getting experience, as far as I'm concerned.

beggars_bush

Jacob Stockdale is a complete liability in defence

He literally fell over for one of Edinburgh's tries

ionadnapokot

Holy ****!
Just watched now.
Pashunnnnn from Madigan and McGrath at the end there!
Best way to win.
Exciting game compared to yesterday.

Coetzee was heroic. Impressive game from Hume.

Paul Smeenus

beggars_bush wrote: »

Jacob Stockdale is a complete liability in defence

He literally fell over for one of Edinburgh's tries

He got tripped up by Burns.

And yet, for being such a liability, the All Backs couldn't work out how to exploit that.

tanko

Surely a penalty for a deliberate knock on was very harsh there?
Was he not trying to catch the ball and almost got it.
9/10 times a scrum is given there imo.

awec

tanko wrote: »

Surely a penalty for a deliberate knock on was very harsh there?
Was he not trying to catch the ball and almost got it.
9/10 times a scrum is given there imo.

Ye can't run out of the line with 1 arm outstretched. As soon as he knocked that on he knew it was a penalty.

thomond2006

David Nucifora

tanko wrote: »

Surely a penalty for a deliberate knock on was very harsh there?
Was he not trying to catch the ball and almost got it.
9/10 times a scrum is given there imo.

I would say 9/10 times a penalty is given. A front rower at the end of the game who is trying to keep the opposition out? The ref has only one option.

ionadnapokot

Buer wrote: »

McGrath, Moore, Reidy looks like he's carrying a bit of a wide load, Mathewson, Murphy is looking doughy, Stockdale not looking as trim as he did either. Maybe it's the jerseys.

I must say it is very noticeable how rusty all of those lads look.
Not convinced by Stockdale at FB at all. 11 is his best position but it must be Andy Farrell request.

Ulster in general are clearly suffering in contacts around the park.
However, they showed some balls in the second half to keep throwing everything they had at Edinburgh.

9-15 that finished that game should start next week.
Feel bad for Cooney. He did make a great tackle at the end of 2nd half.

Bazzo

razorblunt wrote: »

That was Willemse, fine margins and all that. He was an inch away.
Gilchrist for the Herring try was worse, he was making no effort to roll.

Ah he wasn't really, he had one arm outstretched and slapped it down, he hadn't a hope catching it. The fact it wasn't immediately blown for a penalty was surprising, not sure if Murphy had his head turned or something

guapos

StevenToast wrote: »

Thank god liam toland isnt on commentary tonight..

Cant ruin my enjoyment

How can I double thank this

arsebiscuits1

tanko wrote: »

Surely a penalty for a deliberate knock on was very harsh there?
Was he not trying to catch the ball and almost got it.
9/10 times a scrum is given there imo.

Not for me. You need to be in a realistic position to catch the ball. Or show you've made a reasonable effort. One hand out stretched does not show enough of that.

To be fair to him his hand makes a backwards motion as he swiped at it. But it was an easy decision really.

The only time you see those things blown for a knock on only nowadays is if the player goes for the ball with both hands

razorblunt

Buer wrote: »

Hamish Watson will wake up screaming about that try. 60 tackles without missing a single tackle and then that.

In fairness it was a lovely little stop-and-go from Lyttle.
Kinghorn really didn’t help Watson either, Watson could have been the man on the shoulder and Kinghorn the tackler

stephen_n

I’m still convinced Madigan threw the pass deliberately, knowing what would happen. On the replay you can see him pause, look at the player coming up and then decide to pass. So either it was very calculated or extremely reckless but he knew he was there.

errlloyd

stephen_n wrote: »

I’m still convinced Madigan threw the pass deliberately, knowing what would happen. On the replay you can see him pause, look at the player coming up and then decide to pass. So either it was very calculated or extremely reckless but he knew he was there.

Wouldn't be the first time that a tied semifinal came down to an Ian Madigan pass that was either going to win the game or the lose the game.

Sadly, we lost last time.

AbusesToilets

errlloyd wrote: »

Wouldn't be the first time that a tied semifinal came down to an Ian Madigan pass that was either going to win the game or the lose the game.

Sadly, we lost last time.

Thats what happens when you let Gopperth try a drop

Digifriendly

I would have Stockdale back on the wing (Defensively he was all over the place last night) where he is best and either Ludik or Lowry starting at FB.

Yeah_Right

Podge_irl wrote: »

Best hooker hair since Szarzewski

That's who he looks like!! I was trying to remember the name.

BoardsMember

stephen_n wrote: »

I’m still convinced Madigan threw the pass deliberately, knowing what would happen. On the replay you can see him pause, look at the player coming up and then decide to pass. So either it was very calculated or extremely reckless but he knew he was there.

I think you're giving him too much credit. He'd already thrown some very risky passes. He seemed to be set on deciding the game, one way or another!

stephen_n

BoardsMember wrote: »

I think you're giving him too much credit. He'd already thrown some very risky passes. He seemed to be set on deciding the game, one way or another!

Well he either weighed it up and decided he could make the pass and threw it or that he reckoned your man would try and fail. He definitely saw him coming though.

Richie_Rich89

Digifriendly wrote: »

I would have Stockdale back on the wing (Defensively he was all over the place last night) where he is best and either Ludik or Lowry starting at FB.

I've seen Stockdale criticised for supposedly missing five tackles. But one of those misses was actually a very good piece of defence, in my opinion. He forced the Edinburgh player to cut back inside and they lost all momentum and teh Ulster defence was able to regroup.

Lyttle's finish was pretty classy. It takes a bit of imagination to know how to go about beating people like that.

Digifriendly

Richie_Rich89 wrote: »

I've seen Stockdale criticised for supposedly missing five tackles. But one of those misses was actually a very good piece of defence, in my opinion. He forced the Edinburgh player to cut back inside and they lost all momentum and teh Ulster defence was able to regroup.

Lyttle's finish was pretty classy. It takes a bit of imagination to know how to go about beating people like that.

Watch the second Edinburgh try again and Stockdale misses the player completely. IMHO he is playing out of position at FB and is struggling to adjust to this. He should be back on the wing where he's at his best.

ionadnapokot

Nice bit by Kinsella on Ulster sklills. Dan Coper getting acknowledgment.

https://www.the42.ie/ulster-edinburgh-collective-speed-5197009-Sep2020/

I thought Hume had a good game & it was interesting to see that clip of him stepping in to get width out to McCloskey, Stockdale and Lyttle.

Buer

Digifriendly wrote: »

Watch the second Edinburgh try again and Stockdale misses the player completely. IMHO he is playing out of position at FB and is struggling to adjust to this. He should be back on the wing where he's at his best.

I wouldn't want to throw the baby out with the bathwater. Position wise, he has looked fairly ok. He has been solid under the high ball and has a monster boot.

His one on one tackling is poor and that is something that really needs to be addressed. The miss before the Burns intercept was pretty embarrassing for a test winger to make.

I think he has the nuts and bolts to be a top level full back but needs to be given time there to develop. Perhaps the next fortnight isn't the right time but I do hope Ulster give him a good few more starts there this season.

bilston

Personally I'd keep Stockdale on the full back. Yes he did miss some tackles, but its worth persevering with IMO.

Lowry did really well when came on, he had really impressive interventions, not sure I'd start him though, I still worry about his size, albeit he looks a bit bulkier now.

The truth is we need Addison back, then Id stick Stockdale back on the wing.

Stockdale has overall been good over the three matches.