Payroll not processing overtime and subsistence due to staff shortages

LegacyUser

Hi all. Work for the HSE, specifically the ambulance service. A small section of NAS thats mainly involved in PTS, covid testing and frontline backup.

Yesterday we got word that due to payroll staff shortages, and no approval for replacing a clerical officer that processes our wages that recently left the job, our timesheets will not be processed and none of our overtime and subsistence pay will be given for the forseeable future.

Basically, the computer is only going to pay us flat wages and none of our OT/Subs which generally amounts to anywhere from €200-400 per paycheck.

We rely on this money big time to top up our below average flat wage.

The only thing we've been told by payroll is "the situation is currently under review and we hope to receive sanction for a replacement clerical officer soon".

In HSE terms, this could mean months or longer.

Morale is already so low, we've been striking and partaking in industrial action last year and there's a lot of very disgruntled staff in the service due to how poorly we're treated by management and the inadequate staffing, equipment and training we receive.

The unions (in bed with management) are beyond useless. We're a very fractured workforce as is and nothing ever seems to get done in terms of improving working conditions.

This is another kick in the teeth.

What do you think we should do? There's lots of talk of dropping tools. We've done this before over the years. One time it worked in rectifying a safety problem, and it was non union action.
Other times unions have been involved and management laughed at us for months and ignored us.

The only other option we have is to take it and go without substantial pay for the next month or longer until a clerical officer is hired.

antix80

Is there an option not to work overtime?

If so, if you're not happy with the terms of overtime don't work it.

This isn't a private sector employer pulling a fast one. The money will be there .. you're making a mountain out of a molehill.

Strumms

You get together and agree that until your employer can facilitate the payment that you work for... ie, basic, shift and OT... that any and ALL OT requests will be refused. If you won’t get paid for doing it in an accurate and on time fashion, you WONT do it.

The managers should NEVER have facilitated a situation where because one member of staff left, people were not getting paid correctly. There needs to be a backup be it because of a long term sickness in the team, a retirement, somebody leaving that all payments can be processed. Might mean outsourcing payroll or god forbid a manager staying back a night or two, like they want you to, sorry EXPECT you to if the shît hits the fan... It’s unacceptable not to pay people the correct amount, on time, every time.

Strumms

Strumms wrote: »

You get together and agree that until your employer can facilitate the payment that you work for... ie, basic, shift and OT... that any and ALL OT requests will be refused. If you won’t get paid for doing it in an accurate and on time fashion, you WONT do it.

The managers should NEVER have facilitated a situation where because one member of staff left, people were not getting paid correctly. There needs to be a backup be it because of a long term sickness in the team, a retirement, somebody leaving that all payments can be processed. Might mean outsourcing payroll or god forbid a manager staying back a night or two, like they want you to, sorry EXPECT you to if the shît hits the fan... It’s unacceptable not to pay people the correct amount, on time, every time.

Managers in the HSE are not in a position to hire replacements when staff leave.

Strumms

Dav010 wrote: »

Managers in the HSE are not in a position to hire replacements when staff leave.

They need to re-evaluate that. People need to be paid accurately and on time, overtime and basic pay, it’s the same, money earned and to be paid as owed. If a staff shortage or expertise shortage is the catalyst for OT not being processed, you have to do something about it.

If a heart surgeon in the Mater went long term sick just after another retired I can assure you they’d be looking for a replacement ASAP. People need to be paid what they are owed, on time, every time.

Strumms

Strumms wrote: »

They need to re-evaluate that. People need to be paid accurately and on time, overtime and basic pay, it’s the same, money earned and to be paid as owed. If a staff shortage or expertise shortage is the catalyst for OT not being processed, you have to do something about it.

If a heart surgeon in the Mater went long term sick just after another retired I can assure you they’d be looking for a replacement ASAP. People need to be paid what they are owed, on time, every time.

Who needs to reevaluate? The hse is public sector. What they can do and not do is decided by ministers and legislation. Most front line departments are short staffed and underfunded to such an extent that it's either staff shortages or planned updates / initiatives get shelved.

It's also not possible for a paramedic to refuse overtime if he's at a scene dealing with an emergency when his shift ends. They have a duty of care to patients.



Op, what's siptu or nasra saying? Surely whoever one you are with is involved? I know community Gardai are in the same boat. Nothing processed since covid roster came in

GarIT

I'd strike. Or stop doing any of the work you are paid allowances for.

Divisadero

antix80 wrote: »

Is there an option not to work overtime?

If so, if you're not happy with the terms of overtime don't work it.

This isn't a private sector employer pulling a fast one. The money will be there .. you're making a mountain out of a molehill.

You're making a molehill out of a mountain.

Strumms

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Who needs to reevaluate? The hse is public sector. What they can do and not do is decided by ministers and legislation. Most front line departments are short staffed and underfunded to such an extent that it's either staff shortages or planned updates / initiatives get shelved.

It's also not possible for a paramedic to refuse overtime if he's at a scene dealing with an emergency when his shift ends. They have a duty of care to patients.



Op, what's siptu or nasra saying? Surely whoever one you are with is involved? I know community Gardai are in the same boat. Nothing processed since covid roster came in

Management, political people, whomever the book stops with and makes decisions that’s brings about a situation where people who work are not getting accurately or efficiently paid.

A paramedic ‘at the scene’ is thinking about the job at hand... but if on the way back a call comes over the radio that the replacement crew are a driver down and can they stay out an extra 30 in order a cover driver gets ready...nope, got a place I need to be.

Strumms

Strumms wrote: »

Management, political people, whomever the book stops with and makes decisions that’s brings about a situation where people who work are not getting accurately or efficiently paid.

A paramedic ‘at the scene’ is thinking about the job at hand... but if on the way back a call comes over the radio that the replacement crew are a driver down and can they stay out an extra 30 in order a cover driver gets ready...nope, got a place I need to be.

Strumms wrote: »

If a heart surgeon in the Mater went long term sick just after another retired I can assure you they’d be looking for a replacement ASAP.

You think the Dept of health don’t know there are staff shortages in Hospitals, including consultants/surgeons? The Mater are currently down 16 consultants.

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40037798.html?type=amp

august12

Dav010 wrote: »

Managers in the HSE are not in a position to hire replacements when staff leave.

But they are in a position to ensure adequate numbers of staff are trained to provide services,

august12

august12 wrote: »

But they are in a position to ensure adequate numbers of staff are trained to provide services,

Having never worked in payroll, I can’t testify to that, having worked in the HSE and it’s predecessor, the Health Boards, I know that managers cannot just pull staff from other departments at will and try as they may, cannot train one staff member to do the job of three members to the same standard.

Managers, Dept heads do their best with what they have, but saying they can get the staff they want at will or train staff to adequately cover the additional duties of those that have left, is naive.

Dempo1

Whilst I sympathise, listening to that Spoofer Paul Reid, Head of the HSE, all is perfectly rosey within the HSE.

But that aside, it's worth point out countless issues reported within the private sector workers who don't have the gaurentee of a weekly pay slip or indeed pensionable jobs, more to the point raised, the Government's TWSS scheme left 10s of thousands of employees short changed throughout its implementation, Staff expected to work full hours for less pay, Over time payments not allowed, rates of actual pay reduced etc. So whilst I sympathise with the OP. in the real world there are also continuing hardships and nothing to do with staff shortages in payroll departments. I commend the OP for the work they do, but a little perspective please on a crisis that has affected most working people.

AndrewJRenko

OTnotpaid wrote: »

Hi all. Work for the HSE, specifically the ambulance service. A small section of NAS thats mainly involved in PTS, covid testing and frontline backup.

Yesterday we got word that due to payroll staff shortages, and no approval for replacing a clerical officer that processes our wages that recently left the job, our timesheets will not be processed and none of our overtime and subsistence pay will be given for the forseeable future.

Basically, the computer is only going to pay us flat wages and none of our OT/Subs which generally amounts to anywhere from €200-400 per paycheck.

We rely on this money big time to top up our below average flat wage.

The only thing we've been told by payroll is "the situation is currently under review and we hope to receive sanction for a replacement clerical officer soon".

In HSE terms, this could mean months or longer.

Morale is already so low, we've been striking and partaking in industrial action last year and there's a lot of very disgruntled staff in the service due to how poorly we're treated by management and the inadequate staffing, equipment and training we receive.

The unions (in bed with management) are beyond useless. We're a very fractured workforce as is and nothing ever seems to get done in terms of improving working conditions.

Really, the union IS your best route to solving issues like this. I know it's fashionable to blame everything on the union, but the union IS literally down to the members. The members get to vote on everything, so you can't blame the union for the mess with the inter-union dispute.

This is a good opportunity to get the union working for you. Make sure this issue gets on the agenda of every union meeting, push the shop stewards and officials to be escalating this issue. It's really an open goal for the union.

Or you could just whinge to Joe Duffy, which will probably get it sorted quicker.

Dempo1

Dempo1 wrote: »

Whilst I sympathise, listening to that Spoofer Paul Reid, Head of the HSE, all is perfectly rosey within the HSE.

But that aside, it's worth point out countless issues reported within the private sector workers who don't have the gaurentee of a weekly pay slip or indeed pensionable jobs, more to the point raised, the Government's TWSS scheme left 10s of thousands of employees short changed throughout its implementation, Staff expected to work full hours for less pay, Over time payments not allowed, rates of actual pay reduced etc. So whilst I sympathise with the OP. in the real world there are also continuing hardships and nothing to do with staff shortages in payroll departments. I commend the OP for the work they do, but a little perspective please on a crisis that has affected most working people.

There's a little vomit in my mouth.

The op does an important job in the very sector thats battling the pandemic, he's not being paid and he does all this in a very real world that's far more real than whatever paper pushing excircise you were doing prior to sitting at home for a few months getting 350 a week to scratch yourself.

Honestly, to use the 'real world' and 'pandemic' cards on someone that's working in the medical sector!

(See how I can turn that around begrudgers?)

Sardonicat

OP I'm utterly disgusted that this is happening to the very people who are putting themselves at risk testing possible COVD infected people. One such individual called out to my house to test me on Thursday, the same day I called the GP with my symptoms. He was efficient, professional, kind and comforting and I couldn't praise him enough. I think ye should go public with this. Create a public outcry. It's disgusting that ye"re being treated this way when the country needs you more than ever and ye have risen so brilliantly to the challenge.

Strumms

august12 wrote: »

But they are in a position to ensure adequate numbers of staff are trained to provide services,

It’s their JOB too basically

Strumms

Strumms wrote: »

It’s their JOB too basically

Just like that, you think a HSE manager can advertise and employ a replacement?

stinkbomb

Dav010 wrote: »

Just like that, you think a HSE manager can advertise and employ a replacement?

of course they can't. But what they can do is take over the work of the disappeared CO and pay the staff their wages, in full.

It's pretty basic. These are the people who save lives, who risk theirs. Pay their ****ing money, and do it as the the topmost priority. Anything less is completely unacceptable.

stinkbomb

stinkbomb wrote: »

of course they can't. But what they can do is take over the work of the disappeared CO and pay the staff their wages, in full.

It's pretty basic. These are the people who save lives, who risk theirs. Pay their ****ing money, and do it as the the topmost priority. Anything less is completely unacceptable.

I am not defending nor excusing the HSE for being understaffed and not paying staff, but blaming the manager for this or saying the manager should do cover the work in the required timeframe is idiotic. Some parts of the HSE are chronically understaffed, that is an issue for the unions and the HSE, not blaming the guy/girl who has to run an understaffed department and can’t get replacements.

stinkbomb

Its not at all idiotic. If the manager in question is doing anything else with their time rather than sort this issue out, that is what is idiotic.

If you're running an understaffed department and can't replace people who leave, do you know what your top priority needs to be? PAY THE STAFF YOU STILL HAVE, so they don't also leave/down tools/refuse overtime etc. It's not rocket science.

stinkbomb

stinkbomb wrote: »

Its not at all idiotic. If the manager in question is doing anything else with their time rather than sort this issue out, that is what is idiotic.

If you're running an understaffed department and can't replace people who leave, do you know what your top priority needs to be? PAY THE STAFF YOU STILL HAVE, so they don't also leave/down tools/refuse overtime etc. It's not rocket science.

Apparently some further simplification is necessary. If the job of the understaffed department is payroll, then the priority every day, staffed or understaffed, is the payment of wages. If they don’t have the staff to do it, the employer, in this case the HSE are to blame.

stinkbomb

"The HSE" isn't some nebulous force. It's the people who work in it. If the staff aren't getting paid, its the job of the management of that staff to sort it out so that they are getting paid. It's not just some other unspecified entities fault.

Which bit of this is confusing you?

stinkbomb

stinkbomb wrote: »

"The HSE" isn't some nebulous force. It's the people who work in it. If the staff aren't getting paid, its the job of the management of that staff to sort it out so that they are getting paid. It's not just some other unspecified entities fault.

Which bit of this is confusing you?

None of it confuses me, I’ve worked on and off in the HSE/HB’s for nearly 25 years. For some reason you think a department manager is autonomous, if they are understaffed they have to go to the HR Dept, who then goes to the Hospital manager, who in turn must communicate with the HSE recruitment section. If the manager is understaffed, they can’t just rub a bottle and a new staff member pops out.

You understand that procedures in Hospitals get cancelled all the time due to chronic understaffing, do you think a manager can tell a surgeon to operate faster or push patients out the door quicker?

Sardonicat

Dav010 wrote: »

You understand that procedures in Hospitals get cancelled all the time due to chronic understaffing, do you think a manager can tell a surgeon to operate faster or push patients out the door quicker?

They can tell someone to stay back and input data into a payroll appilcation, though. It's hardly comparable to surgery.Its data input.

Sardonicat

Sardonicat wrote: »

They can tell someone to stay back and input data into a payroll appilcation, though. It's hardly comparable to surgery.Its data input.

That requires a degree of flexibility, something Strumms does not necessarily agree with, unless it suits him/her.

In relation to surgery, it is an example of how even more crucial tasks get held up due to staff shortages, which are beyond managers control.

Sardonicat

Dav010 wrote: »

That requires a degree of flexibility, something Strumms does not necessarily agree with, unless it suits him/her.

A degree of flexibility from whom? The wages clerks? If your job is to get out frontline workers paid then yeah, you should expect to roll your sleeves up at times when you'd prefer not to. Just like the ambulance service have done but apparently are being expected to do without getting paid for the extra hours cos no one in the payroll office could be arsed.

Strumms

They will get the thumbs out of their arses and get hiring if employees turn around together and say, “if you fail to pay me what I’m owed, on time, every time, basic and overtime and shift pay, I’m going to escalate this as far as is necessary until I do... if I’m not being paid and compensated for my labor as per my contract, on time every time , I reserve the right also to withdraw labor until payment has been made up to date..

As sardoniccat says it’s data entry, that gets the once over from a senior manager, signed off and sent to payroll. If a manager or management team cannot get that right where they have the right people in the business to ensure ontime and accurate payments they have zero business holding the position of manager.

Also there is more to this than meets the eye... do payments stop if the payroll person is away for two weeks annual leave ? Is sick ? Where is the logic in having only ONE person who can process wages ?...HAS to be a backup.... be it a manager (common sense) , outsourcing to a payroll company who have an agreement to step in.

Flexibility in most elements of jobs and employment, for sure. Payment of wages ? Absolutely ZERO flexibility. On time, every time and accurate

Sardonicat

Sardonicat wrote: »

A degree of flexibility from whom? The wages clerks? If your job is to get out frontline workers paid then yeah, you should expect to roll your sleeves up at times when you'd prefer not to. Just like the ambulance service have done but apparently are being expected to do without getting paid for the extra hours cos no one in the payroll office could be arsed.

Do you agree with this Strumms? Should the clerks be made to do extra work even if they don’t want to work beyond their contracted hours?

Sardonicat

Dav010 wrote: »

Do you agree with this Strumms? Should the clerks be made to do extra work even if they don’t want to work beyond their contracted hours?

Shoud the ambulance staff, even if they are not being paid as per their contract?

Sardonicat

Sardonicat wrote: »

Shoud the ambulance staff, even if they are not being paid as per their contract?

That is really between the op, their union and employer, the HSE.

Strumms

Dav010 wrote: »

Do you agree with this Strumms? Should the clerks be made to do extra work even if they don’t want to work beyond their contracted hours?

I think it’s very evident that the only people who need to be ‘made’ do anything are the managers... it’s that much of a clown show on their behalf they should be working in a tent with ‘Fossets’ over the door.

If clerks ‘cant’ complete the work as I said it needs to be outsourced to a payroll company.

Strumms

Strumms wrote: »

I think it’s very evident that the only people who need to be ‘made’ do anything are the managers... it’s that much of a clown show on their behalf they should be working in a tent with ‘Fossets’ over the door.

If clerks ‘cant’ complete the work as I said it needs to be outsourced to a payroll company.

For the boy at the back of the room, the managers cannot hire replacements, that is done through HSE recruitment section in Manorhamilton Co Leitrim, and if they are told by the Dept of Health to hold off recruiting, they cannot get replacement staff. A few months ago Leo Varadkar was forced to deny that they had put a ban on recruitment because they were so slow hiring staff. The only way this is going to be addressed is through Union involvement.

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/oireachtas/new-hse-staff-not-allowed-to-work-due-to-recruitment-ban-tds-claim-1.4073525?mode=amp

For someone so militant against staff being made to work longer hours, you seem to flip flop when it suits you. You have never been a manager nor had to deal with staff shortages have you Strumms?

Strumms

Dav010 wrote: »

For the boy at the back of the room, the managers cannot hire replacements, that is done through HSE recruitment section in Manorhamilton Co Leitrim, and if they are told by the Dept of Health to hold off recruiting, they cannot get replacement staff. A few months ago Leo Varadkar was forced to deny that they had put a ban on recruitment because they were so slow hiring staff. The only way this is going to be addressed is through Union involvement.

For someone so militant against staff being made to work longer hours, you seem to flip flop when it suits you. You have never been a manager nor had to deal with staff shortages have you Strumms?

Boy at the back of the room ? Really classy

No flip flop, the view I have is considered and consistent

Ban on recruiting? All well and good, people not being paid though on time because of a recruiting ban ? You need to be actively seeking a special provision for hiring a new hire, a temp..

Or

Outsourcing... Wagepoint or whatever company ...

What you are not doing is paying employees late.

3DataModem

Whomever your employer is, clerical staff availabilty should never be an excuse for not getting paid (unless a very small business and an emergency situation).

https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/employment/employment_rights_and_conditions/pay_and_employment/when_you_are_regularly_paid_late.html

spaceHopper

If you are in a union then as bad as you feel they are you need to get them involved.

At the same time I'd get on the radio, think Joe Duffy and make a fuss. The last FG government were very reactionary and often found a solution only when forced to. I'd say this FG/FF one are every bit as bad. If all of your colleagues email their Local TD's and make a fuss.

One other thing you could do is email the SF TD who is responsible for Health to ask a leaders question in the Dail/ They'd be all over this kind of thing.

How is the minster going to rectify the HSE's failure to pay key front line staff the over time due to them. Is he ware of the clerical staff shortages and the damage this is doing to moral during the pandemic"

Strumms

Strumms wrote: »

Boy at the back of the room ? Really classy

No flip flop, the view I have is considered and consistent

Ban on recruiting? All well and good, people not being paid though on time because of a recruiting ban ? You need to be actively seeking a special provision for hiring a new hire, a temp..

Or

Outsourcing... Wagepoint or whatever company ...

What you are not doing is paying employees late.

And you think the payroll manager can decide to outsource payroll or take on a temp? Those decisions are made far away from the payroll office.

The ops fight is with the HSE, not the clerks/managers inputting the timesheets.

I really am interested that your considered and consistent view is that managers should dictate that clerks/staff work longer hours to cover staff who have left, irrespective of whether they agree or not. I will gladly remind you of that on future threads.

Strumms

Dav010 wrote: »

And you think the payroll manager can decide to outsource payroll or take on a temp? Those decisions are made far away from the payroll office.

The payroll manager has the authority and responsibility to get payments processed, calculated and paid on time. They do in fact, or certainly any that I’ve known, have the ability to get in a temp. Most managers do, they are directly responsible for the manpower in their department. Hiring a temp just comes out of their budget...

Strumms

Strumms wrote: »

The payroll manager has the authority and responsibility to get payments processed, calculated and paid on time. They do in fact, or certainly any that I’ve known, have the ability to get in a temp. Most managers do, they are directly responsible for the manpower in their department. Hiring a temp just comes out of their budget...

Not in the HSE, all staff recruitment is centralised.

https://www.hse.ie/eng/staff/jobs/recruitment-process/how-to-apply.html

Strumms

Dav010 wrote: »

Not in the HSE, all staff recruitment is centralised.

https://www.hse.ie/eng/staff/jobs/recruitment-process/how-to-apply.html

Getting in a temp isnt recruiting.

They are not an employee. They are not hired... they are agency manpower contracted to them.

No differerent from getting in a contracted cleaning company to clean offices, window cleaner, vending machine contracts. .

Strumms

Strumms wrote: »

The payroll manager has the authority and responsibility to get payments processed, calculated and paid on time. They do in fact, or certainly any that I’ve known, have the ability to get in a temp. Most managers do, they are directly responsible for the manpower in their department. Hiring a temp just comes out of their budget...

This isn't the private sector. It's public. There's entire legislation governing recruitment within the hse and the wider civil service.

It would be great if it did work the same, but it doesn't and there's pretty much shortages in most areas.

Recruitment must be sanctioned. It must be run via competitions and is certainly not done on a job by job basis.

The paramedic should get paid but the staff in charge of payroll (Killarney?) Are also busy and too be fair are usually very helpful when needs be. If the are paid for 40 hours then that's what they also work. It's like any mathematical equation, if there's 300 hours of work but only 7 staff, something can't get completed without overtime and that's not always forthcoming

Strumms

Strumms wrote: »

Getting in a temp isnt recruiting.

They are not an employee. They are not hired... they are agency manpower contracted to them.

No differerent from getting in a contracted cleaning company to clean offices, window cleaner, vending machine contracts. .

It's very different and it's not allowed.

Look strumms, I like your posts generally but your wrong on this one. Your attempting to apply private sector freedoms and norms to the public sector. It doesn't work that way

Strumms

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

It's very different and it's not allowed.

Look strumms, I like your posts generally but your wrong on this one. Your attempting to apply private sector freedoms and norms to the public sector. It doesn't work that way

Well i think the freedoms that enable employees in both public and private sector to be treated fairly should be universal accross both sectors..both public and private.

kathleen37

Dav010 wrote: »

You have never been a manager nor had to deal with staff shortages have you Strumms?

I've been a manager for many years, and my priority is always my team and making sure the work they do, and the impact of that work is managed properly. Yes, I've had to deal with staff shortages, and managing that was my job.

Thinking about this, there must, must be some path of escalation the payroll manager can take. Temporary secondments for example. Asking other teams for volunteers. And I would absolutely be doing extra hours and input the data personally, if that was what it took for front line staff to get their money.

In this case, I would also be considering whistle blowing about this situation. For crying out loud, these are the people putting their lives on the line for us. The least they should expect is to get their bloody wages.

kathleen37

kathleen37 wrote: »

I've been a manager for many years, and my priority is always my team and making sure the work they do, and the impact of that work is managed properly. Yes, I've had to deal with staff shortages, and managing that was my job.

Thinking about this, there must, must be some path of escalation the payroll manager can take. Temporary secondments for example. Asking other teams for volunteers. And I would absolutely be doing extra hours and input the data personally, if that was what it took for front line staff to get their money.

In this case, I would also be considering whistle blowing about this situation. For crying out loud, these are the people putting their lives on the line for us. The least they should expect is to get their bloody wages.

Absolutely agree with everything you posted, but the higher echelons of HSE management and Dept of Health seem immune to much more pressing and media reported staff issues like beds/nursing/consultants/Doctors/oncology services etc, I doubt overtime payments will bother them too much, especially since standard contracted hours are being paid.

Staff shortages are not the fault of local Dept managers, it is a failing throughout the HSE. As a manager yourself, you would do your best, but would you accept blame for this situation if you were in charge of payroll? Apparently Strumms thinks you should.

Strumms

Dav010 wrote: »

Absolutely agree with everything you posted, but the higher echelons of HSE management and Dept of Health seem immune to much more pressing and media reported staff issues like beds/nursing/consultants/Doctors/oncology services etc, I doubt overtime payments will bother them too much, especially since standard contracted hours are being paid.

Staff shortages are not the fault of local Dept managers, it is a failing throughout the HSE. As a manager yourself, you would do your best, but would you accept blame for this situation if you were in charge of payroll? Apparently Strumms thinks you should.

They simply need to ensure that ALL hours are paid... not just contracted. As an employee im not remotly interested in managments failure to staff payroll. All worked hours are paid... whatever lengths.. whatever thinking outside the box to make it happen ... managers need to manage. If you want 10 hours extra from me this month... by the time the pay slip is done and hits my desk...it better be included... i work for money... not an IOU.... if you want me to do extra.. your part of the deal is you pay me on time for doing it.... if you cant and dont... i dont do extra.. im not a charity.. im not a loan shark... want extra... be ready with the payment... on time everytime... keep the sob stories and cover ups for disney time.

bobbyy gee

are you in a union get them to sort it out

Strumms

Strumms wrote: »

They simply need to ensure that ALL hours are paid... not just contracted. As an employee im not remotly interested in managments failure to staff payroll. All worked hours are paid... whatever lengths.. whatever thinking outside the box to make it happen ... managers need to manage. If you want 10 hours extra from me this month... by the time the pay slip is done and hits my desk...it better be included... i work for money... not an IOU.... if you want me to do extra.. your part of the deal is you pay me on time for doing it.... if you cant and dont... i dont do extra.. im not a charity.. im not a loan shark... want extra... be ready with the payment... on time everytime... keep the sob stories and cover ups for disney time.

There you go Kathleen37, imagine being a manager who is short staffed due to historic systematic failures of your employer, and you have this guy blaming you personally for the failure of not inputting overtime for nationwide employees. Nice, based on that, I don’t know how you would avoid the sack for incompetence, and you thank him.

bobbyy gee

bobbyy gee wrote: »

are you in a union get them to sort it out

For the life of me, I can’t understand why the ire isn’t being directed towards the Union and HSE rather than the payroll Dept staff.

kathleen37

Dav010 wrote: »

Absolutely agree with everything you posted, but the higher echelons of HSE management and Dept of Health seem immune to much more pressing and media reported staff issues like beds/nursing/consultants/Doctors/oncology services etc, I doubt overtime payments will bother them too much, especially since standard contracted hours are being paid.

Staff shortages are not the fault of local Dept managers, it is a failing throughout the HSE. As a manager yourself, you would do your best, but would you accept blame for this situation if you were in charge of payroll? Apparently Strumms thinks you should.

I do understand that things are done differently in the public services, I only have private sector experience as a manager. I worked in the NHS (non management, contractor role) for 7 years so do understand some of the challenges.

I also understand that staff shortages are not the fault of local management, but I still think there are things that can be done which don't involve new recruitment to alleviate this situation.

I hear what you say also re the whistle blowing, but this situation honestly give me the rage so much, I'd certainly be doing that.

I sincerely hope this gets sorted for the OP and their colleagues.

Regarding the OP, this is really something that your manager should be speaking to the payroll manager about. It just an intolerable situation.

kathleen37

kathleen37 wrote: »

I do understand that things are done differently in the public services, I only have private sector experience as a manager. I worked in the NHS (non management, contractor role) for 7 years so do understand some of the challenges.

I also understand that staff shortages are not the fault of local management, but I still think there are things that can be done which don't involve new recruitment to alleviate this situation.

I hear what you say also re the whistle blowing, but this situation honestly give me the rage so much, I'd certainly be doing that.

I sincerely hope this gets sorted for the OP and their colleagues.

Regarding the OP, this is really something that your manager should be speaking to the payroll manager about. It just an intolerable situation.

So you would accept the blame as per Strumm’s post that you thanked? then sit down and do all the nationwide over time for the ambulance service , in the allotted timeframe, for the foreseeable future until the HSE finally gives approval for replacement staff?