General Premier League Thread 2020-21 - Mod Notes in 1st post. [Updated 17/12/20]

Quazzie

Quazzie wrote: »

Rashford is better than Kane was at the age Rashford is now.

The same goes for Son.

If Rashford progresses at the same rate as both Kane and Son, then he will be a better player than both.

That's obviously a big IF though.

When Kane was 23 he was scoring 25+ league goals.....

Cookiemunster

6 wrote: »

When Kane was 23 he was scoring 25+ league goals.....

Kane is a central striker. Rashford isn't. What are they even being compared?

DVDM93

Is this not a discussion on a combined XI of the current Spurs-United teams?

How is how good Rashford MIGHT be relevant?

Also, let's just say for argument's sake he does become better than Son when he is of the same age as they are now, who is to say he will still be playing for United? So you can't even put a 28 year old Rashford in a combined Spurs/United XI because he might not even be there come the time.

You can see how predicting what might happen 4 or 5 years down the line is largely irrelevant to this discussion.

No offence meant to United there either, but if United stay going as they are (for the record I don't think they will, I believe in Ole, but it's a possibility none the less) and Rashford fulfils his potential, then he'll be too good for them & would deserve a better club.

On current form, Son is better than Rashford.

TheadoreT

Son and in particular Kane are smarter players for sure and both more likely to go deeper in their careers than Rashford imo. Rashford faster than both but those players often burn brighter when young and any mounting injuries over their careers tend to minimize their biggest threat.

Kane shouldnt even be in this conversation, hes among the very best in the world right now. Flawless forward.

RasTa

TheadoreT wrote: »

Son and in particular Kane are smarter players for sure and both more likely to go deeper in their careers than Rashford imo. Rashford faster than both but those players often burn brighter when young and any mounting injuries over their careers tend to minimize their biggest threat.

Kane shouldnt even be in this conversation, hes among the very best in the world right now. Flawless forward.

I do laugh at the best player in the world's honours list.

Honours

Tottenham Hotspur

Football League Cup runner-up: 2014–15[75]
UEFA Champions League runner-up: 2018–19[277]

Maybe he's just loyal. Hardly a stick to beat him with.

I'm sure he's had plenty of offers, but maybe none were as good as where he is now.

Fitz*

RasTa wrote: »

I do laugh at the best player in the world's honours list.

Honours

Tottenham Hotspur

Football League Cup runner-up: 2014–15[75]
UEFA Champions League runner-up: 2018–19[277]

Why are you using team honours to measure and compare individual players?

Kane has won PL POTM 6 times. Rashford has 1.
Kane has been chosen in PL TOTY 4 times, Rashford has 0.
Kane also won PL YPOTY 1 time. Rashford has not.

RasTa

Fitz* wrote: »

Why are you using team honours to measure and compare individual players?

Kane has won PL POTM 6 times. Rashford has 1.
Kane has been chosen in PL TOTY 4 times, Rashford has 0.
Kane also won PL YPOTY 1 time. Rashford has not.

lol. I'm not even comparing those two players, you can't label Kane world class with zero medals around his neck.

Look at Ronaldo, now that's world class.

8-10

RasTa wrote: »

lol. I'm not even comparing those two players, you can't label Kane world class with zero medals around his neck.

Of course you can! Team medals aren't a requirement for a player being world class

Kiith

I think the idea that a player can't be world class without winning a major trophy is laughable tbh.

RasTa

Name another world class player with zero medals.

Wuff Wuff

Kiith wrote: »

I think the idea that a player can't be world class without winning a major trophy is laughable tbh.

indeed and by that logic

Kingsley Coman has won the league every season hes played as a professional, he must be the best footballer of all time.

Kiith

Giuseppe Signori. And yes i googled that :pac:

Just because it doesn't happen often (ever), doesn't mean you're right. A player can be a fantastic player, and stay at a club for various reason, and that club may still not win anything. If Spurs in the league this year, does Kane instantly become a world class player?

8-10

RasTa wrote: »

Name another world class player with zero medals.

Zero of any kind or zero of any note?

There's a few players who have only won medals in lower tier leagues that would be in the conversation. I don't see much of a difference between not winning anything for a top 6 PL club v winning a random cup in a lower league

e.g. the likes of Erik Haaland, Ciro Immobile, Bruno Fernandes, Jadon Sancho are all among the best in their positions right now without ever winning anything of note.

Romelu Lukaku isn't someone I'd describe as world class but his lack of medals doesn't reflect on him being not up to scratch at the top level

GLaDOS

I would have said Salah was World class after his first season at Liverpool. At that point he'd only won a Swiss league title.

RasTa

Kiith wrote: »

Giuseppe Signori. And yes i googled that :pac:

Just because it doesn't happen often (ever), doesn't mean you're right. A player can be a fantastic player, and stay at a club for various reason, and that club may still not win anything. If Spurs in the league this year, does Kane instantly become a world class player?

Nope, unless you also think Vardy is world class too.

World class is an elite player, top of their game throughout their whole career. It's branded about to easy these days.

Ronaldo, Messi are the only 2 atm. You can't be including Kane in the same bracket at them.

Talisman

RasTa wrote: »

Nope, unless you also think Vardy is world class too.

World class is an elite player, top of their game throughout their whole career. It's branded about to easy these days.

Ronaldo, Messi are the only 2 atm. You can't be including Kane in the same bracket at them.

Fantasy stuff.

gimli2112

Unless you're counting the Copa del Rey the first tournament of any note that Maradona won was the World Cup.

Bridge93

Kane hasn't scored less than 17 premier league goals in a season since he was 20. The 17 were in a season where he missed a good chunk of games due to injury. He's now added assists to his game and his helping out in his own box. Obviously everyone's definition of world class is different. But to me he's world class

rob316

RasTa wrote: »

Name another world class player with zero medals.

That is a ridiculous barometer of a world class player. Gerrard won a CL and no league titles, if he didnt win the CL you wouldn't call him world class? Shearer won a solitary premier league medal, regarded as one of the finest strikers England has ever produced.

JPA

Quazzie wrote: »

Rashford is better than Kane was at the age Rashford is now.

The same goes for Son.

If Rashford progresses at the same rate as both Kane and Son, then he will be a better player than both.

That's obviously a big IF though.

Harry Kane scored 25 goals in the league when he was 22. Rashford has a way to go to get near Kane's consistency.

How has this gone from comparing Son and Rashford to Kane and Rashford?

RasTa

rob316 wrote: »

That is a ridiculous barometer of a world class player. Gerrard won a CL and no league titles, if he didnt win the CL you wouldn't call him world class? Shearer won a solitary premier league medal, regarded as one of the finest strikers England has ever produced.

So are Vardy, Cole, Yorke, OGS, Scholes, Lampard etc all world class players then if Kane is suddenly one?

Might aswell add Defoe and Les Ferdinand in there too.

Must be some amount of world class players on your list.

TitianGerm

RasTa wrote: »

World class is an elite player, top of their game throughout their whole career.

If that's the case there'd be no world class players.

When Ronaldo first came to United he wasn't at the top of his game and there were better players in the world than him in his position.

If you can rule Ronaldo out then there's probably no World Class players.

Shanotheslayer

World class is subjective. Just end the conversation.

The way Rasta described World Class there is no such thing as WC player ever

RasTa

RasTa wrote: »

So are Vardy, Cole, Yorke, OGS, Scholes, Lampard etc all world class players then if Kane is suddenly one?

Might aswell add Defoe and Les Ferdinand in there too.

Must be some amount of world class players on your list.

There are 457 on my list. I'm pretty sure I saw a rule written down once that you can only have 32.

DeanAustin

RasTa wrote: »

So are Vardy, Cole, Yorke, OGS, Scholes, Lampard etc all world class players then if Kane is suddenly one?

Might aswell add Defoe and Les Ferdinand in there too.

Must be some amount of world class players on your list.

If you think Scholes and Lampard weren't world class players, I give up.

There isn't a club on the planet that wouldn't take Kane in a heartbeat. There isn't a team he wouldn't get into. He's world class.

Agent Coulson

I see a number of ex pro's are calling out Kane now for his backing in and saying he should be getting red cards for it before he seriously hurts someone.

RasTa

DeanAustin wrote: »

If you think Scholes and Lampard weren't world class players, I give up.

There isn't a club on the planet that wouldn't take Kane in a heartbeat. There isn't a team he wouldn't get into. He's world class.

So is Jamie Vardy then, when does it end?

bucketybuck

RasTa wrote: »

Cole, Yorke, OGS, Scholes, Lampard etc all world class players then

League and Champions league winners one and all, so they must be world class, isn't that how it works?

Or do medals only count if the player doesn't have them?