Relaxation of Restrictions, Part V - **Read OP for Mod Warnings**

Gael23

Assetbacked wrote: »

It's been updated I think. According to the DFA website it was updated today. I don't actually know what the changes were though

https://www.gov.ie/en/publication/8868e-view-the-covid-19-travel-advice-list/

It's arbitrary anyway as it is only guidance. Personal responsibility is the most important thing.

Insurers only cover green list countries but apart from that your right it’s not worth the paper it’s written on

dalyboy

GocRh wrote: »

I've noticed that. No changes at all to the list itself, it still mentions that's the situation as of 4th of August, and Greece is still on the list even though it has more cases per 100k than the UK and Germany.

I've family in Germany and at this point we're seriously considering ignoring the green list. Risk in Germany is much lower and government doesn't appear to be taking the list seriously. There's no logic at all to it. Americans can still enter Ireland for tourism.
Might as well just drop the list as it's beyond useless.

Regarding the green list . It was meant to have been revised on Tuesday the 18th of august but they kept on kicking the can down the road (they’re experts at this in all government departments)

The green list is a laughing stock at this point. It’s another example of the government moving the goal posts yet again.

The idea of the green list was to indicate countries that had same or less infection numbers as Ireland thus creating a semi safety destination choice for the Irish passenger.

Germany , UK and Portugal are (on the numbers) presently safer than Ireland at the moment to visit. Why the hell have these countries not been added (along with others) to our ridiculous green list ? I think we all know why. They spent a bomb of cash on their “staycation” propaganda and want to save face.

Anyone find it strange that the Irish times are giving coverage to the protests planned for today in Dublin?

By all accounts I don’t believe it is going to be a very large protest.

Sadly though, I can see these protests gaining momentum eventually.

It always starts with the extremists.

Stormyteacup

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Anyone find it strange that the Irish times are giving coverage to the protests planned for today in Dublin?

By all accounts I don’t believe it is going to be a very large protest.

Sadly though, I can see these protests gaining momentum eventually.

It always starts with the extremists.

Not all that strange in light of recent shenanigans in Clifden. Huge amount of anger directed at increasingly incompetent government.

So if you feel as a citizen you may want to demonstrate your dissatisfaction, the Irish Times is pointing out that you will be standing alongside the Far Right, Anti-Vaxxers and other various cohorts of nutters, and also some Germans.

So best to stay home.

MickeyLeari

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

No.. no we don't

Aside from the fact it's completely unworkable, all your plan would do is accelerate the damage being caused to the economy, people's jobs, mental health, other medical needs, and numerous other key concerns that have been sidelined by the rush to "lock everything down"

Look at the reality of where we are now. Few seriously sick, even fewer dying. This despite the country being (mostly) reopened since the end of June and even without the magic of masks for most of that period.
All the new cases tell us is someone caught the virus. The numbers show that the vast majority will be fine or my not even realise they had it. As I keep saying, OUTCOME of cases is the key metric that should be looked at.

But let's say we adopt your idea.. How long do we lock up the country for? Till we get to zero? Ok.. what happens when it gets "imported" again when we reopen the airports? Or do we wait until EVERY country gets to zero? How do you propose to pay for this? How do you manage the damage to our export industry and supply chain problems that would result?

You are dead right.

I was listening yesterday to RTÉ all day and to be honest I think I got a bit brain washed. Between the crap about the dinner and the likes of Scally I was thinking maybe it is just easier to lock down again. I was on the wrong Road to Damascus but decided to do a U Turn.

MadYaker

Stormyteacup wrote: »

Not all that strange in light of recent shenanigans in Clifden. Huge amount of anger directed at increasingly incompetent government.

So if you feel as a citizen you may want to demonstrate your dissatisfaction, the Irish Times is pointing out that you will be standing alongside the Far Right, Anti-Vaxxers and other various cohorts of nutters, and also some Germans.

So best to stay home.

If I was in Dublin id go down to watch, it'll surely be a laugh

Diabhalta

Any information about that protest in Dublin today? (outside customs house iirc)

Is it happening, what are the numbers? Any burning cars and buildings?

GocRh

dalyboy wrote: »

They spent a bomb of cash on their “staycation” propaganda and want to save face.

That's a good point. Govt probably waiting for schools to reopen so families won't travel.
I wouldn't be at all surprised if the list is reviewed towards the end of the month.

Really disappointing the situation we're in. Not that long ago everyone was criticising the Brits, but they seem to have turned things around, reduced the number of cases while also having a somewhat clear policy towards travel.

Clonmel1000

Paddy knows best.

i_surge

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

No.. no we don't

Aside from the fact it's completely unworkable, all your plan would do is accelerate the damage being caused to the economy, people's jobs, mental health, other medical needs, and numerous other key concerns that have been sidelined by the rush to "lock everything down"

Look at the reality of where we are now. Few seriously sick, even fewer dying. This despite the country being (mostly) reopened since the end of June and even without the magic of masks for most of that period.
All the new cases tell us is someone caught the virus. The numbers show that the vast majority will be fine or my not even realise they had it. As I keep saying, OUTCOME of cases is the key metric that should be looked at.

But let's say we adopt your idea.. How long do we lock up the country for? Till we get to zero? Ok.. what happens when it gets "imported" again when we reopen the airports? Or do we wait until EVERY country gets to zero? How do you propose to pay for this? How do you manage the damage to our export industry and supply chain problems that would result?

How do you propose to live with it for two more years plus?

That is two years of economic damage. That is many businesses bled dry and the exchequer too.

Your level 1 thinking on this is crap tbh. It is a fantasy that the economy will be fine once we pretend there is no risk and get back to normal.

i_surge

GocRh wrote: »

That's a good point. Govt probably waiting for schools to reopen so families won't travel.
I wouldn't be at all surprised if the list is reviewed towards the end of the month.

Really disappointing the situation we're in. Not that long ago everyone was criticising the Brits, but they seem to have turned things around, reduced the number of cases while also having a somewhat clear policy towards travel.

Many western countries have been flippant about it, learned the lesson the hard way and corrected course.

We are late to learning that lesson but are about to have our moment with schools overlapping with peak social discontent.

GocRh

i_surge wrote: »

We are late to learning that lesson but are about to have our moment with schools overlapping with peak social discontent.

Flu season also not very far away. We will have to learn very quickly, or go back to lockdowns. Cases will inevitably go up.

_Kaiser_

i_surge wrote: »

How do you propose to live with it for two more years plus?

That is two years of economic damage. That is many businesses bled dry and the exchequer too.

Your level 1 thinking on this is crap tbh. It is a fantasy that the economy will be fine once we pretend there is no risk and get back to normal.

Not at all.. in fact our economy is very much exposed to what happens in the rest of the world. It's why the crash was much harder from 2008 onwards, and why the recovery was so much faster from about 2014 on.

However, the course we are now following is making that situation much worse and will take a lot longer to recover from as a result. You're not wrong in your analysis by the way - the current strategy of "extend and pretend" won't last indefinitely, but I'll flip it around on you.. how do YOU propose we pay for everything we can't cut in the meantime if we continue to have lockdowns and businesses closed and people out of work?

No-one has said there's no risk. Please point out where I said that. There's risk in everything we do, every day! But, like those activities the risk from CV-19 is known to be worst for those who are elderly or with underlying conditions, and significantly less so for most everyone else. That's the point... those who are at greater risk need to take responsibility for that and restrict their movements/interactions as much as possible. Those who are at less/minimum risk need to get on with things as much as possible so as to help support themselves and the first group.

And ultimately, the numbers don't lie... 6 months into this event in Ireland we still have less than 2000 deaths, small numbers critically ill, and many people not even realising they have it if they do catch it. I honestly do not understand why people like yourself can't see this for the extremely positive news it is - especially given the predictions at the start.

To be blunt.. Zero deaths from CV-19 is a fantasy. It would be great if it was so, but then it wouldn't really be a pandemic would it? Luckily we know who is most at risk though and it's those people we need to target our resources to.

Even the Government have (albeit several months late) started to come round to the idea that excessive restrictions are just not workable outside a theoretical model or medical lab. In a real world living country with all the demands therein, we need to consider the welfare and needs of the many as well as the more serious needs of the few.
That's why the idea of a national lockdown last week (as recommended by NPHET) was rejected. It's not something we can go back to given where we are economically and socially, but it's also not necessary given where we are medically too. Hospitals are not overrun, deaths continue to be very low, serious ICU cases the same.

Again these are GOOD THINGS. It's disappointing and frankly worrying that you and many others can't see that.

drunkmonkey

Diabhalta wrote: »

Any information about that protest in Dublin today? (outside customs house iirc)

Is it happening, what are the numbers? Any burning cars and buildings?

Not yet BLM and Antifa are waiting around the corner though, live stream https://www.facebook.com/106659550863842/videos/824383981637579/

Loafing Oaf

Deleted User wrote: »

Anyone find it strange that the Irish times are giving coverage to the protests planned for today in Dublin?

Hyping it up are they? And of course if they weren't covering it they'd be censoring the news...

drunkmonkey

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

Hyping it up are they? And of course if they weren't covering it they'd be censoring the news...

RTE are dumming it down, way more at it than they are saying.

drunkmonkey

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

Hyping it up are they? And of course if they weren't covering it they'd be censoring the news...

they are censoring it....not a mask in sight but it's just a anti lockdown protest according to RTE :rolleyes:

MickeyLeari

drunkmonkey wrote: »

they are censoring it....not a mask in sight but it's just a anti lockdown protest according to RTE :rolleyes:

Where is it on? Will be in town soon and want to avoid it if at all possible.

drunkmonkey

MickeyLeari wrote: »

Where is it on? Will be in town soon and want to avoid it if at all possible.

I posted the link above, 3 more speakers to go. So happy to see the people out, don't agree with them all but some sense in there. Egging on the Guards now:D

statesaver

Customs House

drunkmonkey

MickeyLeari wrote: »

Where is it on? Will be in town soon and want to avoid it if at all possible.

Customs House

statesaver

The common cold got a good round of applause there

_Kaiser_

drunkmonkey wrote: »

I posted the link above, 3 more speakers to go. So happy to see the people out, don't agree with them all but some sense in there. Egging on the Guards now:D

Tried watching it, but it's hard going, even though as you say there is some sense in there too. Looks like a fairly big crowd.

drunkmonkey

Masker just got sucker punched, who's actually fighting who hard to make out, umbrella lad : )

odyssey06

This will look like a god-send to the government... if the opposition to what they are doing is a mob of thugs on the street...

drunkmonkey

odyssey06 wrote: »

This will look like a god-send to the government... if the opposition to what they are doing is a mob of thugs on the street...

It's hard to know, you had a peaceful protest by the anti maskers/lockdowners but BLM and Antifa rocked up, not sure which side the chap getting a nose job is but he must be far left as the other chap isn't in a mask.

stargazer 68

Their families must be so proud. Hope these pics make their way to their employers too!

polesheep

odyssey06 wrote: »

This will look like a god-send to the government... if the opposition to what they are doing is a mob of thugs on the street...

Looks like a mob of thugs on both sides of the street to me. I suspect they'd be doing what they're doing no matter what the protest were about. These days it's hard to go to your local Spar without some or other mob joining in.

odyssey06

polesheep wrote: »

Looks like a mob of thugs on both sides of the street to me. I suspect they'd be doing what they're doing no matter what the protest were about. These days it's hard to go to your local Spar without some or other mob joining in.

I think that's going to be the reaction of most people to seeing such pictures \ footage on the front page \ news headlines. That's how it looks even if as I said I don't know exactly what went down.

polesheep

odyssey06 wrote: »

I think that's going to be the reaction of most people to seeing such pictures \ footage on the front page \ news headlines. That's how it looks even if as I said I don't know exactly what went down.

Possibly, but it may also feed into the narrative that the government has lost all control.