The UK response - Part II - read OP

Beasty

A continuation from this thread

As usual please remain civil. As warned in the first thread this is not an excuse for Brit-bashing

Active threadbans:

splinter65
Declanflynn
blinding

TheValeyard

First!

A Dub in Glasgo

https://twitter.com/RP131/status/1286315271427428355

A Dub in Glasgo

https://twitter.com/RP131/status/1286680105843032064

A Dub in Glasgo

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

https://twitter.com/RP131/status/1286680105843032064

Thanks for posting these. It’s good to see the trends and 7 day averages

It will be interesting to see what comes from the recount that Hancock has instigated.

I’ve heard several anecdotal accounts of people who died after being tested positive, but not from covid 19. The last being a 93 year old lady from my parents church, who tested positive in April but died two weeks ago from a heart attack, yet still included in the overall figures.

S.M.B.

Identifying exactly who died as a result of being exposed to Covid isn't going to be that black and white either. That woman's heart may have been in great condition until she caught the virus.

I'm not quite sure what method they can or will use to ensure the numbers tell the true story.

A Dub in Glasgo

It does seem very strange that we are still seeing 60ish people die from COVID-19 per day in England

Donald Trump

Johnson kinda bumbles an admission that they messed up. Promises an inquiry.

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2020/0724/1155403-covid-uk/

"We didn't understand (the virus) in the way that we would have liked in the first few weeks and months," he added.

"And I think probably, the single thing that we didn't see at the beginning was the extent to which it was being transmitted asymptomatically from person to person.

"I think it's fair to say that there are things that we need to learn about how we handled it in the early stages ... there will be plenty of opportunities to learn the lessons of what happened."

Plenty of opportunity when it is all over.....they could have alternatively listened to what the global health experts were pleading with them before it started in the UK

Donald Trump

S.M.B. wrote: »

Identifying exactly who died as a result of being exposed to Covid isn't going to be that black and white either. That woman's heart may have been in great condition until she caught the virus.

I'm not quite sure what method they can or will use to ensure the numbers tell the true story.

Not only that, it is possible that most of the people in the UK who died from Corona in the UK might have gotten knocked down by a horse and cart while out walking the very next day even if they had not ever caught it.

Donald Trump

Aegir wrote: »

It will be interesting to see what comes from the recount that Hancock has instigated.

I’ve heard several anecdotal accounts of people who died after being tested positive, but not from covid 19. The last being a 93 year old lady from my parents church, who tested positive in April but died two weeks ago from a heart attack, yet still included in the overall figures.

Genuine question for you.


How do you know she is included in the overall figures? Do they publish names to go along with the official figures?

Donald Trump

Donald Trump wrote: »

Genuine question for you.


How do you know she is included in the overall figures? Do they publish names to go along with the official figures?

like I said, anecdotal and passed on by the family of the deceased.

based on the criteria for the figures though, it stands to reason.

Donald Trump

Donald Trump wrote: »

Not only that, it is possible that most of the people in the UK who died from Corona in the UK might have gotten knocked down by a horse and cart while out walking the very next day even if they had not ever caught it.

Genuine question for you.

WTF are you on about?

nacho libre

It will be impossible to really determine who died with covid19, as opposed to who died from covid 19. The former is what those who seek to downplay the current UK Governments handling of the pandemic focus on to suggest the mortality rate is inflated. If only Matt Hancock was as quick to want a review into his own performance during this pandemic.

nacho libre

nacho libre wrote: »

It will be impossible to really determine who died with covid19, as opposed to who died from covid 19. The former is what those who seek to downplay the current UK Governments handling of the pandemic focus on to suggest the mortality rate is in flated. If only Matt Hancock was as quick to want a review into his own performance during this pandemic.

Will it be a “world beating” review?

A Dub in Glasgo

https://twitter.com/RP131/status/1287040353258934280

RasTa

BREAKING: Govt to announce shortly that tourists in Spain will have to quarantine for two weeks when they return (unless they're back by midnight tonight). Second wave of Covid-19 there has prompted decision to kick Spain off the safe country list

Good luck with that.

A Dub in Glasgo

14-day quarantine imposed on travellers from Spain to England and Scotland. The Scottish govt had the right idea when they refused to remove quarantine but then relented to constant pressure this week to remove quarantine and now re-imposes it

dartboardio

UK government have now updated travel advice to 'avoid non essential travel to mainland spain' as of tomorrow.

Very short notice for many people travelling this evening or tomorrow morning.

They have made a mess up of this imo, one Catalonian region has had a big spike in cases, all the coastal areas have not, and they have very very little cases..

Lot's of businesses in Spain will do even worse now and have a smaller chance of survival because of this.

A Dub in Glasgo

It is obvious (to me) that the risk of lock down in the local area you visit or quarantine on return was a large risk so theose returning will just have to accept it

EDit

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

It is obvious (to me) that the risk of lock down in the local area you visit or quarantine on return was a large risk so theose returning will just have to accept it

Agree. Reading this morning about lots of holidaymakers being “devastated” and saying that if they’d known this was a possibility they might not have gone on holiday. You have to wonder where these people have been for the past 4 months for them not to realise that this kind of fluidity is to be expected anywhere, anytime

S.M.B.

100% agree, I haven't gone beyond a 10km radius in 5 months knowing the complexity and risk that comes with any sort of travel.

Anyone who travels anywhere, for pleasure or out of necessity, is doing so with the risk of disruption.

mick087

The UKs response dont look good at all.
But its apparently to early to say this. This is because the way the deaths in the uk and other countries are reported.
The UK are in the top 3 for deaths per million which is not good. Ireland is number 15 at deaths per million.

Harry Palmr

It's as if they weren't looking at the news or something.

bilston

dartboardio wrote: »

UK government have now updated travel advice to 'avoid non essential travel to mainland spain' as of tomorrow.

Very short notice for many people travelling this evening or tomorrow morning.

They have made a mess up of this imo, one Catalonian region has had a big spike in cases, all the coastal areas have not, and they have very very little cases..

Lot's of businesses in Spain will do even worse now and have a smaller chance of survival because of this.

It's not just Catalonia, there has been a rise in Madrid as well, look maybe they can look again at the islands, but for once this is actually decisive and clear action by the UK govt. Some people are pissed...I probably would be too...but let's be clear...if you choose to go abroad then you run the risk of this happening.

Dave0301

EDit wrote: »

Agree. Reading this morning about lots of holidaymakers being “devastated” and saying that if they’d known this was a possibility they might not have gone on holiday. You have to wonder where these people have been for the past 4 months for them not to realise that this kind of fluidity is to be expected anywhere, anytime

Well, you have Grant Shapps in Spain at the moment leading by example :pac:

4068ac1elhodqr

mick087 wrote: »

The UKs response dont look good at all.
But its apparently to early to say this. This is because the way the deaths in the uk and other countries are reported.
The UK are in the top 3 for deaths per million which is not good. Ireland is number 15 at deaths per million.

uk: 2nd worst in the world (after Belgium), factor in also NI & Scots applied their own methods of protection, to avoid following the path of Eng&Wales.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/1104709/coronavirus-deaths-worldwide-per-million-inhabitants/

And for all the abuse the US get, they're 9th place (Ireland 11th), and behind x5 European countries, for deaths per million.

Donald Trump

Edward Important Minefield wrote: »

uk: 2nd worst in the world (after Belgium), factor in also NI & Scots applied their own methods of protection, to avoid following the path of Eng&Wales.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/1104709/coronavirus-deaths-worldwide-per-million-inhabitants/

And for all the abuse the US get, they're 9th place (Ireland 11th), and behind x5 European countries, for deaths per million.

The criticism of the US is not based solely off of where they are now, but also the trajectory they are currently on.


Most European countries had a peak and a fairly quick tailing off. Even the UK graphs show a tailing off. The US hasn't slowed to the same extent.



Ireland is indeed 11th using that metric. Lets look at the deaths/million on 1st Apr, 1st May, 1st Jun, 1st Jul and today.

The numbers are about 17, 255, 333, 350 and 356 respectively
The corresponding numbers for US are about 20, 203, 331, 395, 451


Roughly equal on 1st Apr, by 1st May we were about 26% more than the US. By 1st June they have "caught up" on us. By 1st July they were about 13% higher than us and now they are about 27% higher. From 1st June to today, Ireland has lost 23 people per million. US has lost 220.





The US had enough notice to be able to put the brakes on it far earlier.

A Dub in Glasgo

https://twitter.com/RP131/status/1287403230457102336

mick087

Apparently Leicester has 1352.4 cases per 100 000 what on earth is going on there.
Lets hope the UK in not on the green list for sometime to come.

Enzokk

As with the overall response to the pandemic from the UK, its not the actions but the reaction to the actions by the government that puzzles me. Apparently it right to have the quarantine in place for Spain now, but not when the pandemic was at its height. How you get to that conclusion is puzzling, all in an effort not to admit fault.

Just say, "we were slow to act before but we are right in doing it now." Instead you have ministers looking like idiots who doesn't have any sense trying to defend what is probably the right action.

Not in Kansas

mick087 wrote: »

Apparently Leicester has 1352.4 cases per 100 000 what on earth is going on there.
Lets hope the UK in not on the green list for sometime to come.

I can't remember where I read this, but one of the reasons it's thought it got so out of control is that parts of Leicester has very high concentrations of people for whom English isn't their first language, and some who don't speak English at all. All of the messaging was in English!

The point was made that other important government messages are made available in a variety of languages, but no effort was made to inform those with poor English about Covid-19 guidelines.

whomitconcerns

mick087 wrote: »

Apparently Leicester has 1352.4 cases per 100 000 what on earth is going on there.
Lets hope the UK in not on the green list for sometime to come.

You do realise the UK is bigger then Leicester, yes?

Christy42

whomitconcerns wrote: »

You do realise the UK is bigger then Leicester, yes?

Are we going to stick on individual cities to the green list? That seems overly complicated and unnecessary.

mick087

whomitconcerns wrote: »

You do realise the UK is bigger then Leicester, yes?

Im wanting to go the UK myself i have friends family there.
But something is going wrong somewhere if Leicester does have such a high rate.

whomitconcerns

Christy42 wrote: »

Are we going to stick on individual cities to the green list? That seems overly complicated and unnecessary.

Yes of course it’s silly and unnecessary, the green list is silly anyway. San Marino is smaller than Wicklow but it’s ok, Italy isn’t. Gibraltar ok, Spain not. Monaco ok, France not....

But there is no point in blocking an entire country purely based on the mess in Leicester.

whomitconcerns

mick087 wrote: »

Im wanting to go the UK myself i have friends family there.
But something is going wrong somewhere if Leicester does have such a high rate.

A high proportion of pro Brexit, bulldog owning, Georges cross tattoo on the arm, type people. That’s what’s wrong there

Christy42

whomitconcerns wrote: »

Yes of course it’s silly and unnecessary, the green list is silly anyway. San Marino is smaller than Wicklow but it’s ok, Italy isn’t. Gibraltar ok, Spain not. Monaco ok, France not....

But there is no point in blocking an entire country purely based on the mess in Leicester.

I mean it is just further evidence on top of the rest of the UK being a mess. Plus if one area is a mess then other areas with similar responses should come under suspicion. We don't know how bad things are in the UK due to massive issues in their response.

I have no idea what the infection rate in San Marino or Gibraltar has been recently.

S.M.B.

mick087 wrote: »

Im wanting to go the UK myself i have friends family there.
But something is going wrong somewhere if Leicester does have such a high rate.

Something has gone wrong there and they put in local lockdown measures to try resolve the issue.

Joe_ Public

Its not just Leicester though, is it? According to the latest phe data, there are several potential hotspots around including Bradford, Oadby, Rochdale and Luton. And Blackburn has overtaken Leicester as the worst affected area and is facing tighter restrictions. If the below tracker is accurate, its now as bad as Leicester was when the latter was locked down.

https://www.vapourtec.com/covid-19-uk-hotspot-tracker/

S.M.B.

Yeah, there are hotspots popping up in a few places which is definitely worrying. I was just pointing out that it's not like the UK is entirely oblivious or content with what's going on in Leicester.

mick087

Joe_ Public wrote: »

Its not just Leicester though, is it? According to the latest phe data, there are several potential hotspots around including Bradford, Oadby, Rochdale and Luton. And Blackburn has overtaken Leicester as the worst affected area and is facing tighter restrictions. If the below tracker is accurate, its now as bad as Leicester was when the latter was locked down.

https://www.vapourtec.com/covid-19-uk-hotspot-tracker/

London is 0 Blackburn is 135 Per Million

4068ac1elhodqr

Surely basic logic dictates that areas (as shown recently) such as Leicester & Oadby(Leicestershire), along with Bradford, Rochdale, Luton et, all have a few things in common.
Sweatshops, slave labour, illegal labour, underpaid (below legal min wage) labour i.e. the blackmarket. Perhaps even int'l trafficking in relation to sweatshop type staffing.

The Boohoo Group PLC didn't have it's billions (£1.7bn loss) of stock worth drop by 50% in 2 weeks for doing nothing wrong.

serfboard

EDit wrote: »

Reading this morning about lots of holidaymakers being “devastated” and saying that if they’d known this was a possibility they might not have gone on holiday. You have to wonder where these people have been for the past 4 months for them not to realise that this kind of fluidity is to be expected anywhere, anytime

Harry Palmr wrote: »

It's as if they weren't looking at the news or something.

Indeed.

Yes Minister wrote:

Sun readers don't care who runs the country as long as she's got big tits.

A Dub in Glasgo

https://twitter.com/RP131/status/1287799768664637441

bilston

whomitconcerns wrote: »

A high proportion of pro Brexit, bulldog owning, Georges cross tattoo on the arm, type people. That’s what’s wrong there

Not that it really matters, but the reason cases are so high in Leicester is literally the complete opposite to what you're trying to suggest.

BonnieSituation

EDit wrote: »

Agree. Reading this morning about lots of holidaymakers being “devastated” and saying that if they’d known this was a possibility they might not have gone on holiday. You have to wonder where these people have been for the past 4 months for them not to realise that this kind of fluidity is to be expected anywhere, anytime

Has anyone else noticed an uptick in holiday and travel agent ads on UK TV channels of late?

The mind boggles.

Danno

whomitconcerns wrote: »

A high proportion of pro Brexit, bulldog owning, Georges cross tattoo on the arm, type people. That’s what’s wrong there

Leicester voted remain.

theological

We managed to have our socially distanced wedding which was great. It was a bit odd seeing how wide 2 metres actually is when laying out chairs. Hand sanitiser on the way in, but I think the size of it made it lovely. Went to a nice place in the countryside afterwards, which almost felt normal. We had breakfast outside, the staff didn't wear visors or anything, but it was all really nice. It would make me slightly more confident about going places again.

S.M.B.

Congrats!

A Dub in Glasgo

https://twitter.com/RP131/status/1288131297861406720