Dairy Chitchat 4, an udder new thread.

Bass Reeves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123966661#Comment_123966661

Have to disagree a bit with you. Buying land is about opportunity. Often rent is only part of the spend on land especially for dairy operations. Fencing, roadways, land fertility etc is an added cost and after that of a 5-15 year lease you can be out the door.

You would have paid through the nose for lands at 10k an acre between 2010 and 2015. Around 2015 not too far from me a 150+ acre farm.came for sale, it looked a bit rough. Three brothers and there father bought it @ about 7.2k an acre. It was very near them and afterwards they admitted they would have gone another bit. You got the normal they were crazy story and that it was bog. Its was a slightly wet farm where the drains were not maintained. They tidied it up probably cost about 1k and acre ( they did it straight after they purchased it ) which is tax deductable similar to renting etc.

Today that farm is worth 12-15k an acre. Land you own will always be 15-30% more productive than any land you rent as you can make long-term investment decisions.

As an example I am.hoping subject to planning to build a shed on the new farm. If I rented it I would never consider that. It's 7.5 miles between farms. Ya I could rent and build a second shed on the existing farm however costs involved in moving cattle and feed between land banks is significant.

If someone paid 3 million for land ten years ago it's probably worth twice it now.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123966760#Comment_123966760

It's a balancing act, land near you is always worth more rent or buying it to an extent. On rent you have to look at the numbers. Is there sufficient margin to justify the rent and extra costs involved.

AAs A beef farmer I would not be willing to pay more than 200 per acre and I am not sure I would even pay that to rent it.

jaymla627

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123966710#Comment_123966710

What has me so downbeat, is the solids per cow the modern day holstein cow worldwide is capable off, america eapecially is currently sitting at 4.23bf and 3.3pr at 12000 litres plus per cow of a national average for 2024 from memory, the amount of extra cheese/powder extra theyre now getting from the same pool of milk versus a decade ago is huge.

Multiply this accross the world and even at a flat milk supply, extra product is been produced

straight

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123966858#Comment_123966858

Farmers Lives matter....

DBK1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123966948#Comment_123966948

I know all about both side of the coin, I’m farming on 50% owned and 50% rented land. The land I own two thirds of it we’ve bought in the last 25 years.

The land is all fragmented too so I also know all about the cost of haulage, drawing silage back, getting slurry out etc. Even herding could take 1.5-2 hours here in summer by the time you get around to all the spots. I always say lads with all their land at the back of their yards don’t know how lucky they are!

As bad as all that extra work is, much the same as yourself, it’s all manageable on a dry stock farm. But having a couple of hundred acres of land 7.5 miles away from a dairy farm isn’t much good unless you’re going to get into zero grazing and all that type of thing which brings all its own costs and headaches so the chance to shop around for land isn’t as big an option. You’d be far better off giving a few thousand an acre more for a bit beside you and eliminate all them future costs. In @stanflt situation he would have had to find all that land for sale close to him too which most times isn’t there to be got so leasing is the only way forward.

older by the day

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123966948#Comment_123966948

I started reading this post, till 3 brothers and there father bought it.

I'm not a tarot card reader but that's going to end in tears 😢

Bass Reeves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123967019#Comment_123967019

No really, one brother is a single man. The other two have families. The single man and one brother are full time farmers, the other brother is in a professional career. They have a significant external investment as well. Father would be late 80's now they are around 50ish.

I say it is all sorted. TBH the farming operation would have paid for it I say, it definitely helped finance the external investment

straight

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123967002#Comment_123967002

There is another way. Do without all the exrra land and maximise the profit from smaller scale. No point being a busy fool.

DBK1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123967123#Comment_123967123

Ah but I’d hate to be idle 😆

stanflt

just on the land purchase two bounding parcels have been sold beside my milking platform in the last 15 years - in 2009 during the financial crisis 60 acres beside me made 42k an acre - this year 119 acres made over 30k an acre

I could never make money from dairying to pay that sort of money

neither parcels were bought by farmers btw

Bass Reeves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123967233#Comment_123967233

The way to solve that problem.is to sell up and buy larger elsewhere. Sentimentally and farming are bad bedfellas.

However a certain amount with land purchase is opportunity is opportunity, being in the right place financially at the right time. The 60 must have had something attractive about it in 2009. Doubt if the 119 acres cane up between 2010 abd 2015 if it would gave made half that probablyonky in the 10ish bracket. Them the breaks.

Tax relief on leasing and inheritance reliefs have a lot to answer for

Downtown123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123966452#Comment_123966452

Did the accountant tell you how much profit you’ve given the fertiliser companies over the last 15 years, how many tractors you’ve bought for the contractor or how many Ai quality stock bulls you’d have bought with your AI bills?

Land rent is a service to allow people expand their businesses, often times to the extent that they can employ extra labour or justify luxuries that take thedrudgery out of farming. It’s Not all about being a busy fool like some people imply. And “enrich” as some people have said. Land capital values have increased by about 4% per annum compounds over the past 20 years. Land rent is typically somewhere around 3%. SFP/schemes maybe 1%. We say 8% total? So you’re paying less than half of the return on an asset out of pocket.
If a man with a tractor is €70/hr + vat, depreciation is €10/hr, wage €15-20/hr and diesel €10/hr which is about 50% as well. The difference is you see the work with the contractor, you don’t with the land rent

stanflt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123967291#Comment_123967291

the 119 acre farm used to be 160 acre but 41 acres was sold in 2014 for 26000 an acre

Land prices around me are crazy being proximity to local towns

The 41 acres was bought by a farmer however his farm was developed on locally

greenfield21

It's quite downbeat on here, but interesting thinking back when we were all told to expand expand expand but the irony will probably be that only the traditional farms (free family labour) will be the ones who survive a real down turn. Who knows, the market has fallen so quick may also suggest we will see quick reversal.

straight

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123967454#Comment_123967454

Stan wouldn't be wasting his money on contractors or stock bulls.

jaymla627

Its gas looking back on google maps, was the guts of 100k spent reclaiming 30 acres of ground here back in 2015/16, all the brown patchces where rushes 3-4 ft tall, back in 2014 before it was reclaimed..

I doubt anyone in the i can produce milk for 30 cent a litre club had to draw down and still be repaying loans for projects like this

Screenshot_20251106_201333_Google Earth.jpg

Screenshot_20251106_201425_Google Earth.jpg

White Clover

This might be the best thread for my question.

Anyone know stockists for Teemore Engineering products in Cork/Kerry/Limerick ?

lmk123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123967914#Comment_123967914

denis Herlihy engineering

straight

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7th-10th Nov 8pm

Featuring 50 lots of

calved, in calf & maiden heifers.

Full catalogue:

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straight

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123967865#Comment_123967865

The 30c only applies to the lads with free land, facilities, labour. Not sustainable.

awaywithyou

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123967865#Comment_123967865

took me a little while to find ya but i did… ye have a fine setup there by the looks of it and it also looks like ye have a 2nd enterprise on the go with the cows…? surprised at the amount of forestry around you…

jaymla627

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123968034#Comment_123968034

Thats the fathers enterprise very nice earner, springs are the issue in our area, certain low lying fields are swamps and just end up been planted, the last bit of reclaimable ground on the farm was this piece, and was done this spring/summer

Screenshot_20251106_213234_Gallery.jpg

Screenshot_20251106_213209_Google Earth.jpg

Bass Reeves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123967914#Comment_123967914

Kenneth Boohan in Croom or is it Frenck stuff he has it fine anyway

lmk123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123968156#Comment_123968156

I thought he had Condons stuff, maybe he has both

Bass Reeves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123968219#Comment_123968219

I got diagonal barriers, adjustable gates and towbar gates off him around 2008/10 for a shed, it was either Teemore or awas it Jardinian off him at the time they are still there no issues with them.

WoozieWu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123967914#Comment_123967914

i dealt direct with them but further north than you

GrasstoMilk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123966661#Comment_123966661

what stan is saying is if he can make money paying rent on the land ppl that own big blocks of land are making a lot of money, if not they’re doing something seriously wrong

lmk123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123968270#Comment_123968270

I think Teemore and Jourdain are the same now, looks like good strong stuff in fairness

K.G.

My take on milking the last year's is that you can only afford 2 out of 3 and by 3 I mean land ,labour or bling.if you ve got plenty land you can afford a bit of bling and even some labour as well.if you dont have the land you either work on shoestring spending and have a bit of labour or you work hard and have a bit of bling.you can't have bling ,paid labour and pay for land-either rent or purchase.

straight

I guess thats the reality of life. You can't have it all.

It comes down to personalities too. I wouldn't have any interest in numbers, bling, etc.

I like to buy property and I see it as a reward for my efforts. Others see no value in buying property but want a nice fancy tractor or jeep or a few more rows of cows.

80 to 100 cows are loads for me.

mahoney_j

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123968897#Comment_123968897

100/120 cows ….good tidy functional yard….good tools/machinery to work with …some debt …enough but not too much ….good relief Milker and young lads keen to work and learn when needed …I’ve zero interest in property ….had some glad it’s gone …tenants have far too much rights and some people look on a landlord as. A millionaire who they can fool around as they please

Would like to say I could buy land ….but in all honesty I’d much prefer to rent …long term