Can we have some fcuking control on the airports from high risk countries please?

beggars_bush

Is it there any coincidence that numbers of covid cases are falling and outbreaks are falling since the mandatory quarantine has come in?

Just wondering

NSAman

beggars_bush wrote: »

Is it there any coincidence that numbers of covid cases are falling and outbreaks are falling since the mandatory quarantine has come in?

Just wondering

Or could it be that vaccinations figures have an impact? Hmmmmmmmm

1100 people in MHQ or a few thousand vaccinations a day.......Hmmmmm

I wonder!

beggars_bush

beggars_bush wrote: »

Is it there any coincidence that numbers of covid cases are falling and outbreaks are falling since the mandatory quarantine has come in?

Just wondering

based on historic transmission rates the link would be tenuous at best.

saabsaab

beggars_bush wrote: »

Is it there any coincidence that numbers of covid cases are falling and outbreaks are falling since the mandatory quarantine has come in?

Just wondering

Maybe. But to be fair and it's against my arguments I'd say it both the vaccine roll outs and less seeding from outside the state.

Valhallapt

beggars_bush wrote: »

Is it there any coincidence that numbers of covid cases are falling and outbreaks are falling since the mandatory quarantine has come in?

Just wondering

Nailed it. Nothing to do with the 1m shots gone into peoples arms or the level 5 lockdown or the .25m people who already had covid

saabsaab

Deleted User wrote: »

I think I'm being very clear what "narrative im trying to push". Everyone coming into the county should have to quarantine in order to stop the spread of the virus. You seem to be suggesting there is some sort of hidden message in my argument? Come on so lets have it. Let me guess, I'm a racist trump loving Nazi?

Thankfully you are not alone in that opinion.

NSAman

saabsaab wrote: »

Thankfully you are not alone in that opinion.

Its ok Saab we don't all think he is a racist Trumpeteer.

saabsaab

Valhallapt wrote: »

I hope the government are forced into a humiliating climb down. MHQ is repugnant to the Irish constitution, EU freedom of movement and is bananas.

Pure hyperbole.

NSAman

NSAman wrote: »

Its ok Saab we don't all think he is a racist Trumpeteer.

You are looking to run with defence against an insult which was never hurled in the first place.

NSAman

Deleted User wrote: »

I think I'm being very clear what "narrative im trying to push". Everyone coming into the county should have to quarantine in order to stop the spread of the virus. You seem to be suggesting there is some sort of hidden message in my argument? Come on so lets have it. Let me guess, I'm a racist trump loving Nazi?

saabsaab wrote: »

Thankfully you are not alone in that opinion.

NSAman wrote: »

Its ok Saab we don't all think he is a racist Trumpeteer.

Deleted User wrote: »

You are looking to run with defence against an insult which was never hurled in the first place.

Just clarifying that I don't think he is as he describes himself... is that so bad?

20silkcut

Corholio wrote: »

Part of it is the 'AZ only offers 10% protection against the SA variant' is from very tiny research and loose methods, but yet is said with such sureness it's almost made out to be fully true? It's not.

Dr David nbarro is saying pretty much that in today’s independent. That variants beat the vaccines. Basically the vaccine is useless without border control. Pretty depressing read. He is talking in terms of years before we get on top of this. The virus is currently surging on a global scale.

saabsaab

20silkcut wrote: »

Dr David nbarro is saying pretty much that in today’s independent. That variants beat the vaccines. Basically the vaccine is useless without border control. Pretty depressing read. He is talking in terms of years before we get on top of this. The virus is currently surging on a global scale.

We all hope he is wrong.

20silkcut

saabsaab wrote: »

We all hope he is wrong.

Variants can be good though. Eventually it will evolve into a harmless variant and it’s all over.

Corholio

20silkcut wrote: »

Dr David nbarro is saying pretty much that in today’s independent. That variants beat the vaccines. Basically the vaccine is useless without border control. Pretty depressing read. He is talking in terms of years before we get on top of this. The virus is currently surging on a global scale.

He said it's a possibility that new variants beat 'current' vaccines if cases keep surging in larger countries like India. Vaccines will be constantly updated too. I read it and he actually says very little other being very cautious. I don't think anyone thinks covid is going to disappear and will always be battling it in some way, like other viruses

caveat emptor

Valhallapt wrote: »

I hope the government are forced into a humiliating climb down. MHQ is repugnant to the Irish constitution, EU freedom of movement and is bananas.

It may well end up before the Supreme Court but the law is clear. We did not give away sovereignty or our constitution.

The commission can enquire all it wants.

The formula contained in what was then Art. 29.4.3 of the Constitution worked relatively well until its limitations were highlighted by the Supreme Court’s decision in April 1987 in Crotty v. An Taoiseach.11 The plaintiff in this case had challenged the decision of the Government to ratify the Single European Act (SEA) by means of parliamentary legislation only, without a referendum. The Supreme Court ultimately held that ratification of Title II of the SEA (dealing with the creation of the single market) was within the scope of the 1972 constitutional amendment, since it did no more than attempted to give effect to market integration policies which had been contained in the original 1957 EC Treaty. The Court took a different view of Title III (which provided for formalised common foreign policies rules), holding that a constitutional amendment was necessary to ratify this aspect of the Treaty.

The Supreme Court’s reasoning may be summarised thus:
(a)
There was no Community legal – as distinct from political – obligation to ratify the SEA. Ratification by parliamentary legislation was therefore not protected from constitutional attack by the ‘necessitated obligations’ clause in the 1972 amendment.

(b)
Without the protection of the ‘necessitated obligations’ clause, ratification was unconstitutional, since Title III of the SEA curbed an essential feature of state sovereignty. In the Court’s view the power to conduct the foreign affairs of the state was an essential part of sovereignty, and the Government could not by a binding Treaty commitment agree to transfer that power to other states or to the Community.

https://link.springer.com/chapter/10.1007/978-94-6265-273-6_28

Larbre34

20silkcut wrote: »

Variants can be good though. Eventually it will evolve into a harmless variant and it’s all over.

No.

Its just like influenza in the sense that Covid will roam the globe, indefinitely, mutating and thriving in areas with weak public health, reappearing in the first world each winter, when immunity is lowest and ventilation and outdoor activity are poorest. I've heard several public health types in recent weeks say that there'll be modified vaccines being administered for years and years to come, just like the flu.

20silkcut

Corholio wrote: »

He said it's a possibility that new variants beat 'current' vaccines if cases keep surging in larger countries like India. Vaccines will be constantly updated too. I read it and he actually says very little other being very cautious. I don't think anyone thinks covid is going to disappear and will always be battling it in some way, like other viruses

It’s not a good read for anyone in the travel or tourism sector. Basically there will be areas of the world where covid is rampant and areas where it’s under control with the vaccine.
Hard to see how Travel can return to normal in those circumstances.

scouserstation

caveat emptor wrote: »

It may well end up before the Supreme Court but the law is clear. We did not give away sovereignty or our constitution.

The commission can enquire all it wants.




https://link.springer.com/chapter/10.1007/978-94-6265-273-6_28

It could be a case where legally you are consenting to MHQ by going onto their online booking portal and making a "reservation"

Of course we all know this is done by coercion by using airlines to refuse travellers without quarantine bookings but this would be very hard to make stick in a supreme court setting

hotmail.com

A new born baby may have to be interned in the hotels.


This is what people here support.

Appalling.

Valhallapt

caveat emptor wrote: »

It may well end up before the Supreme Court but the law is clear. We did not give away sovereignty or our constitution.

The commission can enquire all it wants.




https://link.springer.com/chapter/10.1007/978-94-6265-273-6_28

The french will find some goods which went from England to Northern Ireland to Ireland and then onto France which did not follow single market rules. See how fast the Irish government climbs down when the french have to exclude Ireland from the single market ...

hotmail.com

The EU lovers won't like the fact that the EU are against these ridiculous measures.

Valhallapt

hotmail.com wrote: »

A new born baby may have to be interned in the hotels.


This is what people here support.

Appalling.

I could never understand how the average person was ok with those mother and baby homes back in the day, everyone just kinda went along with it. For the good of society or something....

Ireland still failing her children today

scouserstation

20silkcut wrote: »

It’s not a good read for anyone in the travel or tourism sector. Basically there will be areas of the world where covid is rampant and areas where it’s under control with the vaccine.
Hard to see how Travel can return to normal in those circumstances.

With different parts of the world going through different seasons the virus will always have a different status depending on what side of the globe or what hemisphere you are in, ie winter = virus season, summer = regress

I dont see travel ever returning to "normal" especially long distance travel, what is needed is long term solutions to get international borders back open and trading with each other seamlessly, tourism bubbles would be a good start and then we could look at more sustainable solutions for travelling to different continents and opening back up business and trade routes

hotmail.com

Donnelly should publish his legal advice on this internment process.

saabsaab

Valhallapt wrote: »

The french will find some goods which went from England to Northern Ireland to Ireland and then onto France which did not follow single market rules. See how fast the Irish government climbs down when the french have to exclude Ireland from the single market ...

Will, never, happen!

Valhallapt

saabsaab wrote: »

Will, never, happen!

So it’s ok for us to lockup their citizens and minors, but it’s not ok for them to refuse a vessel to dock and offload?

GeorgeBailey

Valhallapt wrote: »

So it’s ok for us to lockup their citizens and minors, but it’s not ok for them to refuse a vessel to dock and offload?

yip. They can't interfere with the free movement of goods within the union. They're also not allowed discriminate on nationality either but that just means you have to ban people based on where they've departed from, not on where they themselves are from.

hamburgham

Edz87 wrote: »

Some strong words from the Italian ambassador to Ireland this afternoon.

I think we should contact the Italian embassy to thank them for expressing the views of a huge number of Irish people who are being completely ignored by their supposed public representatives who are afraid to open their mouths.

Valhallapt

GeorgeBailey wrote: »

yip. They can't interfere with the free movement of goods within the union. They're also not allowed discriminate on nationality either but that just means you have to ban people based on where they've departed from, not on where they themselves are from.

But can they just not ban vessels departing from areas where single market rule infringement is high??? The four pillars of the eu are inseparable

saabsaab

Valhallapt wrote: »

So it’s ok for us to lockup their citizens and minors, but it’s not ok for them to refuse a vessel to dock and offload?

Will never happen!