What are your views on Multiculturalism in Ireland? - Threadbanned User List in OP

kildare lad

breezy1985 wrote: »

What I am hoping for is Ireland a country with no colonial hangup or need for white guilt can learn from the past and not ghettoise these people and I think the attitude of you and others on here is what creates that ghettoisation. You may be right about parts of Dublin as honestly I don't know much about the place outside the centre but I don't see any ghettoisation of any racial groups in my personal life and it's all the same old ghettoised white Irish where I am.

I accept that immigrants are often working class and in the low pay brackets just like most Irish including myself when I left home but is there a massive portion of certain groups contributing to social welfare I would be interested in stats on that cause honestly going on what I see it's not there.

I know nothing of this other poster you mention so I won't speak for him but I personally feel no need or requirement for Ireland or any other country to change its demographics or force itself to be more diverse I do prefer Ireland now to the one I grew up in and I am happy for my tax to pay for legal asylum and foreign aid and the Ireland that some people want to go back to is not my Ireland and I am about as Irish as it gets genetically so I'm sick of people talking about the real Ireland because there is no one definition of the country

They turn places into ghettos themselves by having large families , little money , a lack of interaction from parenting and a gang culture among it's youth copied from America / london . You only have to look at the trouble they're causing in balbriggan and other parts of dublin . They were given good accommodation and new houses in a lot of causes and yet they're already starting to turn those areas into ghettos.

Gervais08

kildare lad wrote: »

They turn places into ghettos themselves by having large families , little money , a lack of interaction from parenting and a gang culture among it's youth copied from America / london . You only have to look at the trouble they're causing in balbriggan and other parts of dublin . They were given good accommodation and new houses in a lot of causes and yet they're already starting to turn those areas into ghettos.

Gang of our new citizenry on the LUAS before lockdown, giving in the “yo blud” bull**** and giving out that “it’s about respec bruh”.

Yeah it is - you earned none!

kildare lad

Gervais08 wrote: »

Gang of our new citizenry on the LUAS before lockdown, giving in the “yo blud” bull**** and giving out that “it’s about respec bruh”.

Yeah it is - you earned none!

I see them hanging round in my town with them tights on their heads acting like they're in compton . Do they realise what a golden ticket they've been given and yet all they aspire to be is gangsta rappers. Future doctors and engineers I think not.

Strumms

Strumms wrote: »

The EU need to reform immigration policy.

It was set up and implemented in a NON covid world.

As things are now, we simply cannot afford to accept more people into the country. Regardless of why they need or want to arrive.

The EU is only part of the problem, with the UN taking the lion share of responsibility... since it is their mandates about refugee/migrant rights which pushes the EU towards such magnanimous gestures (which others have to pay for). Without the UN, then individual nations would be in a better position to refuse or negotiate with the EU about immigration, but their independence is weakened because so much of international law is only applied to western nations, and not extended to non-western nations.

Non covid? All well and good, now ? No ! We don’t have the cash or the resources to help. We may have a LOT of Irish people trying to relocate back if things go tits up elsewhere covid wise or potentially economy wise. As Irish people and holders of Irish passports that’s their entitlement.

We can’t be extending generosity far beyond our passport holders unfortunately in this climate.

I can't agree. Covid changed a lot, but the world economy was extremely shaky long before covid happened. The turn towards debt financing by companies and government institutions has severely weakened the stability of national markets, and the "fear" that remains from the Banking crash, continues to this day, allowing greater regulation of small/medium business, but relaxations on regulation for big business.

Europe was having economic problems before covid came along. Sure, it was still a prosperous zone, but with that prosperity, government spending (and inefficiency) rose significantly. We also have the serious problem of education not keeping up-to-date with a changing world, preparing students for positions that will likely be redundant within a decade or two... and no initiative to reskill/re-educate the existing workforce towards jobs that won't be affected by automation. We're likely to see a massive rise in unemployment across all of Europe, simply because technology has changed so much, and the fragility of western economic models, calls into questions whether there will be companies there to provide the jobs.

We seriously need to stop living in the past, and believing the money tree will continue forever, without serious consequence. At it's current state, the Irish economy can't provide (and maintain) top level services across the board. And the demands for improvements continue each year, with little appreciation for where that money will come from. National debt is a terminal disease for a small nation... and we're running headlong towards embracing it.

Covid just adds another layer of risk to the equation, but even before covid, Ireland (and Europe) was heading towards hard times. This push to bring in migrants who cannot contribute to the economy, is irresponsible, and completely lacking in medium-long term planning.

ThunbergsAreGo

[Deleted User] wrote: »

The EU is only part of the problem, with the UN taking the lion share of responsibility... since it is their mandates about refugee/migrant rights which pushes the EU towards such magnanimous gestures (which others have to pay for). Without the UN, then individual nations would be in a better position to refuse or negotiate with the EU about immigration, but their independence is weakened because so much of international law is only applied to western nations, and not extended to non-western nations.



I can't agree. Covid changed a lot, but the world economy was extremely shaky long before covid happened. The turn towards debt financing by companies and government institutions has severely weakened the stability of national markets, and the "fear" that remains from the Banking crash, continues to this day, allowing greater regulation of small/medium business, but relaxations on regulation for big business.

Europe was having economic problems before covid came along. Sure, it was still a prosperous zone, but with that prosperity, government spending (and inefficiency) rose significantly. We also have the serious problem of education not keeping up-to-date with a changing world, preparing students for positions that will likely be redundant within a decade or two... and no initiative to reskill/re-educate the existing workforce towards jobs that won't be affected by automation. We're likely to see a massive rise in unemployment across all of Europe, simply because technology has changed so much, and the fragility of western economic models, calls into questions whether there will be companies there to provide the jobs.

We seriously need to stop living in the past, and believing the money tree will continue forever, without serious consequence. At it's current state, the Irish economy can't provide (and maintain) top level services across the board. And the demands for improvements continue each year, with little appreciation for where that money will come from. National debt is a terminal disease for a small nation... and we're running headlong towards embracing it.

Covid just adds another layer of risk to the equation, but even before covid, Ireland (and Europe) was heading towards hard times. This push to bring in migrants who cannot contribute to the economy, is irresponsible, and completely lacking in medium-long term planning.

Have to agree with this. One of the reasons we have a growing health and housing crisis is the large population growth we have seen. Yet that is never talked about.

Hamachi

Mules wrote: »

One of the really taking the piss things is the amount of Saudi's claiming asylum. I couldn't understand it until I read a piece in the Times about a Pakistani family who moved to Saudi years earlier but moved to Ireland to claim asylum after Saudi recently brought in taxes. Obviously Irish taxes are a hell of a lot more than Saudi taxes so you'd wonder are they planning to work here at all. The mad thing was the man being interviewed didn't even say anything that would indicate a legitimate asylum claim. He just came straight out and said it was because he didn't want to pay tax.

You know I’ve always been bemused by those soft soap ‘New to the Parish’ pieces in the Irish Times. The immigration back stories of some of the subjects have more holes in them than a block of Swiss cheese. People claiming asylum from safe, albeit economically under-developed countries or moved here from another EU state between 2000-2004 to exploit the jus soli citizenship loophole.

I could never understand why these flimsy tales were never more rigorously probed by a journalist working for a supposedly quality newspaper.

The girlfriend of one of my old college mates works in media circles. I asked her about this Sorcha Pollak character, who authors ‘New to the Parish’. I learned that she is the daughter of Andy Pollak. Who’s he you may ask?

A quick Google search reveals that he sits on the board of an NGO called ‘Places of Sanctuary Ireland’, an organization whose mission statement is to make Ireland a safe space for all and sundry. Quelle Surprise!

The object lesson here is that if something stinks, your gut instinct is usually right. Follow the money trail and you’ll find the answer.

With the horrendous Covid-induced recession that we are all facing, Sorcha may well discover that the Irish public’s appetite for her never ending stream of puff pieces, diminishes significantly.

ThunbergsAreGo

ThunbergsAreGo wrote: »

Have to agree with this. One of the reasons we have a growing health and housing crisis is the large population growth we have seen. Yet that is never talked about.

True, the population increase is part of it, but the problems were there before that too. The Celtic Tiger ruined Ireland in some ways, because it gave Irish people an unrealistic (unsustainable) expectation for what a small nation like Ireland, with no natural resources except for people, could achieve. That expectation became the norm, with the quality of life skyrocketing in comparison to previous decades, but also the costs to maintain that standard increasing for both the individual and the State.

The real elephant in the room is the expectation that Ireland should be able to provide the same standard of living as a powerhouse like Germany. There is this expectation that Ireland should have the same quality of services, and other aspects of a first world nation, that older, more established nations existing on the European mainland have... without recognising that we don't have the historical connections with powerful neighbors (apart from the UK, which has slid downhill since WW1).

Personally I suspect it's this desire to be similar to all the Northern European nations, who typically, are economically successful, and have the best services available but little recognition for the true costs involved in having such a system.

The health system is failing due to inefficiencies, mismanagement, and allocation of resources towards areas of lesser importance. It comes back to this expectation that Ireland should be on par with Germany, and so, it need to make grand gestures to show how prosperous we are. (or we're being taken to the cleaners for costs to the individual.. 60-80 euro for a ten minute checkup, and all the doctors are working out of the same clinic? an extra 40 euro for any document that they need to sign? come on. The costs that people have to pay in this country are nuts.. and while other EU countries can have similar costs, it begs the question why are these costs so high?) I went to get a Covid clearance certificate so that I could travel. A swab test, and a basic certificate need for me to travel internationally... 180 euro. A rip off. And there's no shortage of examples to choose from of other rip offs... I would suspect it of dodgy Spain, but Ireland? How things have changed...

The housing crisis is far more complicated, and I'm not going to debate it here. It's far too emotional a topic, and people tend to lose control of their speech when discussing it... but I wouldn't be pointing fingers at our population increases, but more at the focus on Dublin (and Cork, to a lesser degree). Just my IMHO, and I don't want the thread sidetracked about property/houses. I wouldn't consider it an issue to do with immigration.

Mules

Hamachi wrote: »

You know I’ve always been bemused by those soft soap ‘New to the Parish’ pieces in the Irish Times. The immigration back stories of some of the subjects have more holes in them than a block of Swiss cheese. People claiming asylum from safe, albeit economically under-developed countries or moved here from another EU state between 2000-2004 to exploit the jus soli citizenship loophole.

I could never understand why these flimsy tales were never more rigorously probed by a journalist working for a supposedly quality newspaper.

The girlfriend of one of my old college mates works in media circles. I asked her about this Sorcha Pollak character, who authors ‘New to the Parish’. I learned that she is the daughter of Andy Pollak. Who’s he you may ask?

A quick Google search reveals that he sits on the board of an NGO called ‘Places of Sanctuary Ireland’, an organization whose mission statement is to make Ireland a safe space for all and sundry. Quelle Surprise!

The object lesson here is that if something stinks, your gut instinct is usually right. Follow the money trail and you’ll find the answer.

With the horrendous Covid-induced recession that we are all facing, Sorcha may well discover that the Irish public’s appetite for her never ending stream of puff pieces, diminishes significantly.

Interesting.

rgossip30

These 2 are from South Africa no war what are they fleeing ? The government should be accountable as to how the money is spent . Does this mean that an asylum seeker could get own door accommodation before his claim is accessed ! What happens when the claim is rejected and they get a deportation order some may even be working ? To deport them will be almost impossible its getting easier than applying for a work permit to come here .

https://www.businesspost.ie/legal/high-court-challenge-to-ban-on-asylum-seeker-driving-licences-a2d649f6

Asylum seekers will soon be better off than citizens . The own door accommodation and ending DP will bring in more costs with the economy in decline !

https://www.gov.ie/en/press-release/80541-minister-ogorman-announces-121-million-budget-package/

Arthur Daley

The people fleeing South Africa will be the white farmers if things there keep going the way they have of late.

Justin Credible Darts

Arthur Daley wrote: »

The people fleeing South Africa will be the white farmers if things there keep going the way they have of late.

but multiculturalism works I was told ?

nj27

Arthur Daley wrote: »

The people fleeing South Africa will be the white farmers if things there keep going the way they have of late.

https://youtu.be/awtNlnWv2Co

Montage of Feck

Arthur Daley wrote: »

The people fleeing South Africa will be the white farmers if things there keep going the way they have of late.

Things aren't so great for black African migrants to SA also. Xenophobia was increased there massively since the end of appartite.

nj27

Montage of Feck wrote: »

Things aren't so great for black African migrants to SA also. Xenophobia was increased there massively since the end of appartite.

I’m sure it’s awful for everyone in SA right now, like it was in Zimbabwe after they kicked the white farmers out. They literally celebrated when they came back, despite the consequent return of white privilege.


https://youtu.be/MAZtvPDiBZ8

Wibbs

Montage of Feck wrote: »

Things aren't so great for black African migrants to SA also. Xenophobia was increased there massively since the end of appartite.

Hardly surprising to be fair M. It was an artificially created colony nation made up of a fair few ethnic and political groups lorded over by a nasty bunch of racist to the marrow fascist planter pricks who stoked that division and kept the population down by force. Atomic powered versions of Orangemen with shedloads of cash, a large military force and the support of the West for many decades. Until it suited to cut them adrift.

Yellow_Fern

http://www.theburkean.ie/articles/2020/10/18/is-irelands-international-student-bubble-about-to-burst

enricoh

black youths in Ireland are being exploited into becoming money mules, over 80% of those caught are black. No mention of what nationality the criminals are funnily enough!
The solution according to a migrant network spokesperson - more welfare!!

The soluhttps://m.independent.ie/irish-news/crime/black-youths-targeted-to-be-money-mules-39637146.html

More than 80pc of people targeted to become so-called money mules for criminal gangs are young, innocent black Irish men, according to the most recent garda analysis.

Poverty is the key issue. A lot of young black Irish students do not have access to social welfare, or their parents don't.

enricoh

enricoh wrote: »

black youths in Ireland are being exploited into becoming money mules, over 80% of those caught are black. No mention of what nationality the criminals are funnily enough!
The solution according to a migrant network spokesperson - more welfare!!

The soluhttps://m.independent.ie/irish-news/crime/black-youths-targeted-to-be-money-mules-39637146.html

More than 80pc of people targeted to become so-called money mules for criminal gangs are young, innocent black Irish men, according to the most recent garda analysis.

Poverty is the key issue. A lot of young black Irish students do not have access to social welfare, or their parents don't.

More welfare is always the answer.:D

paw patrol

nj27 wrote: »

I’m sure it’s awful for everyone in SA right now, like it was in Zimbabwe after they kicked the white farmers out. They literally celebrated when they came back, despite the consequent return of white privilege.


https://youtu.be/MAZtvPDiBZ8

white privilege :rolleyes:

biko

I don't see the white privilege in that video.
Privilege is to force other people off their property without repercussions because your government is ok with it.

kildare lad

[Deleted User] wrote: »

More welfare is always the answer.:D

I know it's a long shot but maybe they could get a job ??

kildare lad

kildare lad wrote: »

I know it's a long shot but maybe they could get a job ??

I understand the sentiment, but the practical aspect is that they're students, or young people with few skills, so it's unlikely that they would easily find a job, especially during the covid period.

In any case, considering the subject matter, I don't think it's a matter of income, but rather that of ethic/morality or fear of being caught. I don't believe that too many people are truly naive enough in this internet age, to be so gullible to do these things without knowing what they're doing. I think it's more to do with a cultural difference thinking they can get away with it... and then getting caught.

So, I'd agree with educating people about the risks, but also being aware that culture plays a part in this. If their families hold to their 'original' cultural beliefs, they might be more "flexible" about the law and breaking it.

Cordell

enricoh wrote: »

More than 80pc of people targeted to become so-called money mules for criminal gangs are young, innocent black Irish men, according to the most recent garda analysis.

Not innocent, I'm sure they would know quite well that what they're doing is illegal.

biko

https://markhumphrys.com/clonskeagh.html

The Islamic Cultural Centre of Ireland (the Clonskeagh mosque in Dublin, the largest mosque in Ireland) is a reactionary Islamist mosque that is apparently linked to the Muslim Brotherhood. It seems to be the main Muslim Brotherhood centre in Ireland, and one of the main Muslim Brotherhood centres in Europe.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/religion-and-beliefs/centre-in-clonskeagh-is-major-symbol-of-islam-in-ireland-1.3423079

Egyptian-born but Qatar-based Yusuf al-Qaradawi (91) is, it is claimed, a member of the Muslim Brotherhood. He has denied this.

Somaia Halawa has said there were no overt links between her family and the Muslim Brotherhood but that she had friends who were members. Her family was “not political in that way”, she said.

However, Soha Gendi, Egyptian ambassador to Ireland, has been adamant in the past that “the whole family is part of the Muslim Brotherhood, whether they deny it or not”.

If this is true it's incredibly bad news for Ireland.
The Muslim Brotherhood is classed a terror organisation by many Arab states, but still legal in liberal Western countries, like Ireland.


The 1991 census put Muslim numbers in Ireland at 3,875.
By the census of April 2016, it was 63,400...

rgossip30

biko wrote: »

https://markhumphrys.com/clonskeagh.html


https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/religion-and-beliefs/centre-in-clonskeagh-is-major-symbol-of-islam-in-ireland-1.3423079

If this is true it's incredibly bad news for Ireland.
The Muslim Brotherhood is classed a terror organisation by many Arab states, but still legal in liberal Western countries, like Ireland.


The 1991 census put Muslims number in Ireland at just 3,875.
By the census of April 2016, it was 63,400...

Not much said about them of late covid is great distraction .

Deshawn

enricoh wrote: »

black youths in Ireland are being exploited into becoming money mules, over 80% of those caught are black. No mention of what nationality the criminals are funnily enough!
The solution according to a migrant network spokesperson - more welfare!!

The soluhttps://m.independent.ie/irish-news/crime/black-youths-targeted-to-be-money-mules-39637146.html

More than 80pc of people targeted to become so-called money mules for criminal gangs are young, innocent black Irish men, according to the most recent garda analysis.

Poverty is the key issue. A lot of young black Irish students do not have access to social welfare, or their parents don't.

We will give you free money if you don't commit crime.

Sounds great

jmayo

breezy1985 wrote: »

I agree chancers who are claiming asylum and not entitled should be sent back and I wish the govt would sort out direct provision to make this happen quicker

The Magdalene laundries closed finally in the mid 90s

And as many Irish scammed as the people coming here now which then like now is a very small percentage and I know from living in London that a decent amount of the drunk beggers round central are Irish who haven't been given short shrift and sent home

By the 90s the Magdalene laundries AFAIK were mainly long term residents that had sadly become institutionalised.

Some very sad storied there of lives destroyed.
Remember hearing one story of Kerry woman whose life was totally shattered and she died in a home.

Tell me how wrote: »

Just take it as a sign of progress that the narrative has shifted to acknowledging that there are perfectly functioning multicultural societies.

Where are these great multicultural successful perfectly functioning societies you speak of?

Arthur Daley wrote: »

The people fleeing South Africa will be the white farmers if things there keep going the way they have of late.

Ireland has a fair few white South Africans that moved here since the late 90s.
They saw no future for their children in South Africa and only see it going the way of Zimbabwe.

biko wrote: »

https://markhumphrys.com/clonskeagh.html


https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/religion-and-beliefs/centre-in-clonskeagh-is-major-symbol-of-islam-in-ireland-1.3423079

If this is true it's incredibly bad news for Ireland.
The Muslim Brotherhood is classed a terror organisation by many Arab states, but still legal in liberal Western countries, like Ireland.


The 1991 census put Muslim numbers in Ireland at 3,875.
By the census of April 2016, it was 63,400...

jaysus Biko we have all known about Daddy Halawa and his Muslim Brotherhood links for years now.

Funny how if certain right wing commentators or activists are supposed to come to Ireland for a talk, we have loads of eejits in social media, on published media, on radio, etc giving out about it and demanding that their invitation be removed.
Hell Richard Dawkin's recent invite was rescended lest he upset some students.

But fook me pink if they ever really looked closely at who has come and gone from Clonskeagh they would or rather should cr** themselves.

nj27

paw patrol wrote: »

white privilege :rolleyes:

I forgot sarcasm doesn't work in text!

Kivaro

I see that the French government have finally started to act on obvious threats to the principles behind the French Republic and their secularism. A radical mosque was shut down yesterday and plans are being implemented to shut down NGOs involved in the spreading of hate and Islamisation across France.

It would be a good idea for the Irish government to act early before these types of entities try to repeat their success as seen across Europe. Put laws in place to prohibit any threat to Ireland's laws and way of life, including our freedom of speech and the way our teachers teach our children.

Kivaro

As another example of integration problems with some Muslims in Europe, a Lebanese doctor was refused German citizenship after he refused to shake hands with a woman. The man aced the German naturalization test, but refused to shake hands with the female official handing over his citizenship.

From the news report Link:
The Administrative Court of Baden-Württemberg (VGH) ruled that someone who rejects a handshake due to a "fundamentalist conception of culture and values" because they see women as "a danger of sexual temptation" was thereby rejecting "integration into German living conditions."
The court found that anyone who refuses to shake hands on gender-specific grounds is in breach of the equality enshrined in the German constitution.

I'm glad to see that Germany made the correct ruling in this instance, but it should also officially proclaim that if migrants want to come to their country, then they should follow the rules and constitution of the country, and the indigenous people of a modern progressive country should not be required to change their cultures and laws in order to suit arriving migrants.