School reopenings -current plan WAS McHugh's plan

mtoutlemonde

Will Yam wrote: »

How did nurses, doctors, guards, hairdressers, waitresses, bus drivers deal with high risk and very high risk?

Teachers are among the last to return to work - surely to god they or their unions could check with the other sectors who have been working for months now?

Nurses and doctors don't spend up to 80 minutes in the same room as 20 patients (that's a minimum, classes are much bigger) in tight, unconditioned rooms. They also have PPE.

With exception to the guards and maybe hairdressers, all of the others you mention work behind perspex screens, I have not heard of any schools installing perspex screens for their teachers. I don't think a hairdresser will have up to 200 customers every day.

shesty

Specifically in that IT article, it sounds like that teacher needs to go back to his consultant and ask him to insert the word "very" into the letter.I can't remember the exact detail but I think he filled at least one criteria of that HSE definition of very high risk.Surely he would be better off just doing that instead of trying to muddle along?

Sorry I know that is specific to him, but it would probably be worth his trouble to do it.

Will Yam

mtoutlemonde wrote: »

Nurses and doctors don't spend up to 80 minutes in the same room as 20 patients (that's a minimum, classes are much bigger) in tight, unconditioned rooms. They also have PPE.

With exception to the guards and maybe hairdressers, all of the others you mention work behind perspex screens, I have not heard of any schools installing perspex screens for their teachers. I don't think a hairdresser will have up to 200 customers every day.

But shelf stackers in supermarkets don’t have Perspex screens. How did they manage the high risk, and very high risk in their ranks?

Waitresses don’t work behind Perspex screens. What happened their high risk and very high risk?

Mardy Bum

Will Yam wrote: »

But shelf stackers in supermarkets don’t have Perspex screens. How did they manage the high risk, and very high risk in their ranks?

Waitresses don’t work behind Perspex screens. What happened their high risk and very high risk?

Unfortunately, they are now on the Covid payment because they were on 0 hour contracts. Some have had to retire prematurely as a result.

Loafing Oaf

mtoutlemonde wrote: »

I have not heard of any schools installing perspex screens for their teachers.

what about this one?:P:P

Will Yam

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

what about this one?:P:P

Maybe this was installed for the PUPILS.?

wirelessdude01

Every staff member in our school has had them installed on 3 sides of there desks. We've been told where/when/if possible to stay there.

Will Yam

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Every staff member in our school has had them installed on 3 sides of there desks. We've been told where/when/if possible to stay there.

Looks like your school is looking for solutions as opposed to looking for problems.

Well done school.

wirelessdude01

Will Yam wrote: »

Looks like your school is looking for solutions as opposed to looking for problems.

Well done school.

But the reality is that you don't/can't really teach at primary level from a desk. It's all window dressing really. Can't complain though. 2/3 of us approached the principal to install them and they did.

Count Hairyfoot

Will Yam wrote: »

How did nurses, doctors, guards, hairdressers, waitresses, bus drivers deal with high risk and very high risk?

Teachers are among the last to return to work - surely to god they or their unions could check with the other sectors who have been working for months now?

You've asked that question more than once now. Do you know the answer - if so please share your wisdom.

Teachers aren't among the last to return to work. They finished out the term at the normal time using whatever methods were available. They had their holidays and are now going back to work at the normal time.

Rosita

Will Yam wrote: »

How did nurses, doctors, guards, hairdressers, waitresses, bus drivers deal with high risk and very high risk?

Teachers are among the last to return to work - surely to god they or their unions could check with the other sectors who have been working for months now?

The other poster asked where the definitions are coming from. Not sure that "ring a bus driver" is really a satisfactory answer to a simple enough question.

Will Yam

Count Hairyfoot wrote: »

You've asked that question more than once now. Do you know the answer - if so please share your wisdom.

Teachers aren't among the last to return to work. They finished out the term at the normal time using whatever methods were available. They had their holidays and are now going back to work at the normal time.

No, I don’t know the answer. And nobody, thus far, has provided one. Simply saying how different one sector is from another doesn’t answer it.

The question is what should happen with high risk and very high risk people. Surely the same thing should happen to such a person regardless of sector, unless there is reason why one sector should be treated differently?

rainbowtrout

Will Yam wrote: »

No, I don’t know the answer. And nobody, thus far, has provided one. Simply saying how different one sector is from another doesn’t answer it.

The question is what should happen with high risk and very high risk people. Surely the same thing should happen to such a person regardless of sector, unless there is reason why one sector should be treated differently?

It's about the nature of the job. If I'm working in a hospital I will be provided with medical grade masks and gowns where necessary. I've eaten out in the last few weeks a couple of times and the staff who have served me have been wearing masks/visors but haven't spent more than a minute at the table taking my order and leaving a meal down in front of me takes seconds.

The very nature of teaching requires a teacher to be in a crowded classroom, you need to be able to stand to write on the board, so perspex around my desk isn't going to be any way effective unless it's long sheets hanging from the ceiling. I need to be able to circulate to check on my students work. You can have the argument that a student can go home and take a photo of their work and upload it - which they can - but you cannot replace bending down beside a desk and writing in a student's copy to show them how to solve a maths problem or pointing out where they are going wrong. Standing at their desk and adjusting equipment for a science experiment so they don't have an accident or cause an explosion. By it's nature a lot of teaching does require close contact.

Teenagers aren't always the most compliant group of people, just because you ask them to do something in a particular way doesn't mean they will.

rainbowtrout

So the date for the Leaving Cert has been announced.


No orals, and no practicals just written exams.

https://www.thejournal.ie/postponed-leaving-cert-5186970-Aug2020/

mirrorwall14

rainbowtrout wrote: »

So the date for the Leaving Cert has been announced.


No orals, and no practicals just written exams.

https://www.thejournal.ie/postponed-leaving-cert-5186970-Aug2020/

Hang on, how is that going to work for subjects like music where it’s worth 50% and wasn’t done before shut down?

rainbowtrout

mirrorwall14 wrote: »

Hang on, how is that going to work for subjects like music where it’s worth 50% and wasn’t done before shut down?

Grade will be based on written exam only

Will Yam

rainbowtrout wrote: »

So the date for the Leaving Cert has been announced.


No orals, and no practicals just written exams.

https://www.thejournal.ie/postponed-leaving-cert-5186970-Aug2020/

Would they not just be better off making sure the leaving next year runs?

Is this necessary?

Mardy Bum

Will Yam wrote: »

Would they not just be better off making sure the leaving next year runs?

Is this necessary?

Hugely necessary. It provides students with a chance to prove themselves if they feel aggrieved.

rainbowtrout

Will Yam wrote: »

Would they not just be better off making sure the leaving next year runs?

Is this necessary?

Yes, because those exams are not just there to facilitate Leaving Certs, they are there to facilitate early school leavers (Junior Cert), and mature students also.

There would also be a legal challenge if they don't provide the exams after saying they have.

Weren't you the one on earlier whinging about teachers looking for problems rather than solutions. A solution is being provided and you're still whinging. :rolleyes:

soso02

mirrorwall14 wrote: »

Hang on, how is that going to work for subjects like music where it’s worth 50% and wasn’t done before shut down?

Can't imagine too many will jump at the opportunity to have their grade dictated by composition and listening !!

Are we expected to mentor those who opt to sit exams ? Or are students on their own ?

soso02

rainbowtrout wrote: »

There would also be a legal challenge if they don't provide the exams after saying they have.

There will be a legal challenge for not providing students with the opportunity to sit their oral/practical exams.
It's as if they're looking for trouble.

rainbowtrout

soso02 wrote: »

There will be a legal challenge for not providing students with the opportunity to sit their oral/practical exams.
It's as if they're looking for trouble.

To be honest, if there are extra places at college due to a lack of foreign students this year then more might get places than normal. If teachers have graded higher than normal and the curve isn't adjusted too much, students will probably be generally happy with their grades. Considering there are typically about 2000 repeats per year, the majority will move on with what they get on the 7th and be glad to have the whole thing over.

Students are only going to repeat a subject if they fail one that they need (typically maths) or if they are looking for 5-10 points and feel they can bring up one of their grades. If they have 2 months to prepare for one exam and nothing else they might see it as a fair trade off.

Treppen

soso02 wrote: »

Can't imagine too many will jump at the opportunity to have their grade dictated by composition and listening !!

Are we expected to mentor those who opt to sit exams ? Or are students on their own ?

Students will be on their own I presume as they've finished out the year!
I suspect the LC will take place in seperate exam centers to the school grounds if numbers are sufficiently low.

What do ye reckon, will vast majority just accept the grade/course and move on... Or subject themselves to a massive revision session and sit in November?

Edit: I see RT has answered above and id generally concur.

rainbowtrout

Treppen wrote: »

Students will be on their own I presume as they've finished out the year!
I suspect the LC will take place in seperate exam centers to the school grounds if numbers are sufficiently low.

What do ye reckon, will vast majority just accept the grade/course and move on... Or subject themselves to a massive revision session and sit in November?

Edit: I see RT has answered above and id generally concur.

In the article in the Indo it said there would be more details in the coming weeks. I'd imagine the SEC want to see what the uptake is like first before committing to anything regarding venues. Probably won't see anything concrete until after the cut off for acceptance of first round offers from CAO. But it did say exams would take place at weekends and in the evenings, now I'd imagine that would be so teachers could be used for supervision of exams, but it might mean exams take place in schools. One classroom would probably be enough in the majority of cases. In the bigger cities and towns it might make more sense to hire a venue like a function room in a hotel or something. Presuming the spread of students reflects the population as a whole, I'd imagine there would be more in Dublin than anywhere else.

Will Yam

rainbowtrout wrote: »

Weren't you the one on earlier whinging about teachers looking for problems rather than solutions. A solution is being provided and you're still whinging. :rolleyes:

I never “whinged” about teachers. But dont let that stop you.

What i said - had you bothered to read it - was i commended a posters school because they seemed to be very pro-active at addressing the challenges to be overcome.

It was a pleasant change to see focus on solutions rather than endless iterations of problems. Rather like the health sector, supermarket sector, restaurant sector and many other diverse sectors, all with differing challenges.

And as for the Leaving Cert, it was a reasonable question to ask, and now it has been answered.

rainbowtrout

Will Yam wrote: »

I never “whinged” about teachers. But dont let that stop you.

What i said - had you bothered to read it - was i commended a posters school because they seemed to be very pro-active at addressing the challenges to be overcome.

It was a pleasant change to see focus on solutions rather than endless iterations of problems. Rather like the health sector, supermarket sector, restaurant sector and many other diverse sectors, all with differing challenges.

And as for the Leaving Cert, it was a reasonable question to ask, and now it has been answered.

If you come on to a teaching forum into a thread where all the posters are teachers and starting going on about people looking at problems rather than solutions you are complaining about teachers.

And this is a solution to the Leaving Cert problem. And it was a solution that was offered earlier in the summer, only now we have a concrete date for it.

Alqua

Thunder and lightning raging outside today while the principal's live-stream from the other room kept freezing - all felt very ominous!

wirelessdude01

Alqua wrote: »

Thunder and lightning raging outside today while the principal's live-stream from the other room kept freezing - all felt very ominous!

Don't you just love when a zoom staff meeting has issues.

Will Yam

rainbowtrout wrote: »

If you come on to a teaching forum into a thread where all the posters are teachers and starting going on about people looking at problems rather than solutions you are complaining about teachers.

And this is a solution to the Leaving Cert problem. And it was a solution that was offered earlier in the summer, only now we have a concrete date for it.

Did it ever cross your mind that maybe, just maybe, some parents come in here, or, perish the thought, students come in here.

Anyway looking forward to getting back on Sept 7th!

amacca

Will Yam wrote: »

Did it ever cross your mind that maybe, just maybe, some parents come in here, or, perish the thought, students come in here.

Anyway looking forward to getting back on Sept 7th!

Didnt you come on saying it was nice to see solutions being talked about rather than problems as if all thats ever talked about is problems (implication being teachers are whingers, maybe thats not what you meant but i imagine most people might take it up that way)

Not surprised someone took issue with it tbh

In any event whats wrong with teachers on a teaching forum discussing issues/problems with reopening during covid.....it doesnt have to be obstructionist

It coukd raise awareness
Prompt a solution or possible solutions tried 8n other schools
Or even just allow a bit of venting/getting it off the chest with insurmountable issues/niggles

None of that is necessarily a bad thing to see for students or parents

It doesnt need someone interjecting say8ng how nice it is to see solutions (and all that implies) .....certainly not doing it and expecting it to be taken lying down anyway