Aer Lingus Fleet/ Routes Discussion Pt 2 (ALL possible routes included)

Lifelike

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120087902#Comment_120087902

I was actually referring to the busiest airport in terms of overall passengers rather than busiest in terms of point-to-point DUB pax. DEN has far greater potential for American connections than LAS, which means that in terms of overall potential the two destinations are probably quite close. I can’t think of any other unserved destinations beyond the range of an A321XLR which come close in terms of revenue potential than these airports.

PeasantHater

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120087955#Comment_120087955

Apologies, and yes, good point.

Lifelike

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120087926#Comment_120087926

Half the battle in terms of improving their product would be to sort out the embarrassment that is the two ex-Qatar Airways A330s. I don’t think there’s anything particularly wrong with the product on the rest of their A333/A321 fleet, I actually found their newest A330 (delivered in 2020) to be quite pleasant to fly on last year. On the ex-Qatar A333s however you hear both crew and pax deride the quality of the interior of the aircraft.

x567

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120087926#Comment_120087926

...and whilst you're at it, that their second focus should be to maximise their coordination and interlining with American Airlines, their joint business partner...

Murph85

Other than the unspeakable and denver. Any other routes are Mickey mouse in terms of passenger demand, going off the 2019 figures of unerved routes from Dublin...

Murph85

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120087723#Comment_120087723

Yes. Aer lingus themselves have mentioned THAT city. Of course other posters here say its pie in the sky stuff. These same posters, who didn't have a clue of the actual demand, realistically reckoned it was probably 20% max of the actual figure, but dont even have the humility to admit they severely underestimated how much demand there is on that route ex dublin..

My explanation for them not launching the route, is they are a hyper Conservative airline ....

Lifelike

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120088199#Comment_120088199

I think it has less to do with conservatism and more to do with a range of different circumstances in the last few years. Back during their TA expansion around 2017/18 the ex-CEO Stephen Kavanagh was quoted in the media saying that EI were looking into launching LAS in the near future but it appears that MIA and SEA won out in the end for one reason or another. In 2021 then Manchester ended up being the target of expansion, likely an attempt at diversification due to an initial reluctance to lift COVID travel restrictions here. LAS/DEN could be next in line if there is further expansion to the A330 fleet. If you compare EI’s long-haul network to that of 10 years ago their strategy could hardly be described as conservative, their short-haul network on the other hand is another story…

cson

Demand =/= O&D from DUB. 🤦‍♂️

Ireland is country of 5M people, our pax numbers are a drop in the ocean compared to what EI can pull from continental Europe and the US respectively.

The CLE MSA is 3.6M people on its own to which Aer Lingus will be the only direct connection to Europe.

Bake in the subsidies and that type of 'mickey mouse' route becomes bread and butter.

john boye

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120088199#Comment_120088199

You've been banging on about this for years and still it's no closer so maybe the "pie in the sky" stuff isn't too far off the mark. Maybe some people know more than someone who desperately wants a direct route to a city he flies to sometimes and can't see the wood for the trees?

And calling other routes "Mickey Mouse" is just childish and immature and makes your protestations even more difficult to take seriously.

Noxegon

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120087926#Comment_120087926

I was going to say something like that but you beat me to it.

I'd also like to see long haul to destinations not in North America, but I guess I'll be waiting a long time for those.

HTCOne

The EI J class was a revelation when it debuted. The hard product in J is still good compared to others in I’ve experienced recently in Europe…slightly behind AF & KL (unless you get a throne seat with EI which is more like a F seat), WAYYY better than both BA & LH. Minor but noticeable improvements would be better quality headphones and a better amenity kit, maybe sharpen up the lavs. The lounge in Dub is OKAY in that it has lovely views but the food selection needs to be better. The LH lounges in MUC in particular I’ve experienced are worse, but BA, AF and KL (LHR, CDG & AMS respectively) are all streets ahead, as is the LH one in FRA.

The European airlines need to wake up on the NAT as the yanks used to have terrible J products whereas now Delta One and United Polaris are very very good. Add in the JetBlue Mint suite now too.

I hear the food in J in EI took a nosedive in quality in recent times though, and the news is spreading. Penny wise, pound foolish.

Murph85 you seem to have taken a bit of a bashing over the last few days from loads and loads of different posters all a bit fed up of your attention seeking. Perhaps a moment of reflection needed re your posting style?

kevinandrew

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120089113#Comment_120089113

They've just rolled out a new menu in business class and by all accounts it looks pretty decent. It appears higher end in presentation and of the few reviews available, seems like a nice improvement overall. It's a slightly more adventurous menu by Aer Lingus standards, the new coconut curry and fluffy American style pancakes being particularly well received.

I think the lounge needs a complete overhaul to be honest, it's embarrassing for a flagship lounge. I know it recently had a bit of a refresh but we're talking moving some chairs around and putting down a new carpet, it was purely cosmetic. It desperately needs better fresh and hot food options.

The amenity kit has become even more basic if that was possible, still uses the same Voya products (minus the pen) but now comes in a flimsy green fabric bag. Headphones definitely need a update but many airlines struggle with this.

Overall business is still a decent product. Even their long haul economy product seems very much on par and often slightly ahead of similar carriers. The meals are hit and miss but that's the case everywhere, the service is almost identical to rivals and fares remain very competitive.

It's short haul they really struggle with these days, not just from a network point of view but also product. No more on board menus, bare minimum stock levels, dirty cabins, outdated app, years late on in-seat power and connectivity, inconsistencies in product and lacklustre premium offerings, removing seat pockets, those horrible plastic safety card sleeves etc.

There's a lot of work to be done in various areas of the passenger facing business. Who knows what's going on behind the scenes.

LiamaDelta

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120089477#Comment_120089477

Wholehearted agree here re the short haul product...I was on short haul recently, no menu, had to ask what they had, I think there's two types of sandwich and a wrap. They don't have the incentive to sell like their main competitor does. They don't seem to realise/care if you had a menu to pick from you're more likely to pick a few more things and/or a bundle of things.

It's very strange, they seem to have slid even lower than BA in terms of their cabins, cleanliness, offerings, service etc. It's what happens when there's not enough competition and/or the owners are happy with the current returns so there's no push to be better.

cson

The amenity kit is like something you'd get in Premium Economy elsewhere, not a patch on competitors.

The salmon starter on the new menu is a star for sure, everything else is very underwhelming. Not a fan of the champagne they're using either & the crackers/onion jam accompaniment is bizarre.

51&G is nice but has gone backwards in terms of the F&B offering along with being too jammed in that morning bank. Agree with everyone on the main EI lounge.

Little details, but they add up.

The hard product is there, the staff are there but the executive team need to start paying attention to the details.

FR738

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120087834#Comment_120087834

I was thinking something similar to what Condor do with their 763/A339 to smaller markets but I guess Ireland is a much different market to Germany. although Ireland is a more popular tourist destination than Germany for Americans

Lifelike

As far as I’m aware Condor’s TA routes are heavily geared towards German tourists headed to the US/Canada rather than the other way around, many of their destinations such as Whitehorse, Fairbanks, Anchorage etc don’t even generate enough local traffic to warrant key domestic routes, let alone TA routes. They tend to work due to a mixture of the size of the German market and the popularity of isolated, “wild” destinations among German tourists, therefore the model really isn’t transferable to EI at all.

cson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120090807#Comment_120090807

Ireland is actually not a more popular destination for Americans according to wiki: 2.6m (Germany) vs 2.1m (Ireland) based on the most recent (2017) numbers for inbound tourists.

Astral Nav

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120091771#Comment_120091771

Still pretty good for an island of 6 million people vs a large country of 80 million plus.

As Lifelike put it so clearly the German visitors to remote Canadian regions is a niche market peculiar to their travel preferences. It doesn't transfer. Interestingly Germans also still largely book through travel agents rather than self book. They really do like things organized for them.

Gary walsh 32

I see ei edy been in Manchester the last couple of days flying to Orlando and ei lre in his way to Manchester is this to cover for the Manchester aircrafts to go to maintenance

California Dreamer

Do you think there is merit to the amount of complaints that EI has gotten since last year about cancelled flights, lost bags, refusal of the company to sort things out or would be it about 1% and at what stage can the beancounters lower the overall product before the shareholders sit up and start asking questions?

IngazZagni

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120093494#Comment_120093494

These issues weren't unique to Aer Lingus. Many airlines across Europe had their worst year ever for on time performance, cancellations and lost baggage etc. Massive issues at various airports across Europe which often was outside the control of EI and lots of ATC delays as well. Yes indeed many of the issues were the fault of Aer Lingus as well. I'm hopeful this year will see significant improvements and will highlight what airlines have got got their act together.

LiamaDelta

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120088199#Comment_120088199

You're entitled to your explanation/reason, other people are entitled to theirs. Repetitively ramming your explanation down their throat doesn't help debate and becomes tedious for other posters who usually are more nuanced and open to discuss it.

As has been pointed out repeatedly, bare passenger numbers are not the only consideration. Seasonality, yield, cargo demand, commercial supports etc are all factors that feed a decision on a route. Your assertion of hyper-conservatism is based on one factor only. Surely to be considered hyper-conservative would be to serve a route with guaranteed passenger numbers rather than other routes that need more rounded development.

Tenger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120087686#Comment_120087686

A330-300 on DUB-SFO.

DUB-JFK is also an A330.

DUB-EWR currently an A321LR, but should be back to 330 this summer.

cson

Something I've been wondering about: how does the crewing work on the SNN-US-LHR flights?

Aircraft comes from JFK/BOS, that crew presumably overnight in SNN, a new crew takes it to LHR and back and another crew (that rested in SNN the flight the day before the first I mentioned?) take it back to the US?

Locker10a

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120103392#Comment_120103392

Yes and crew are also positioned by road from Cork and Dublin bases

Tenger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120088255#Comment_120088255

Kavanagh didnt make that statement. In an interview the journalist brought the subject up, he was asked "would Las Vegas an option in the future?" (or words to that effect)

He then replyed along the lines of "Las Vegas is certainly an option that we are looking at, along with over a dozen other potential routes"

PeasantHater

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120123155#Comment_120123155

Not true, he clearly stated they had planned to launch a seasonal direct route in winter 2017 and would look into extending it beyond the season depending on performance.

soiben

The Cork to Paris route has been placed on sale for the month of October as well as the 22nd and 24th of September (presumably to accomodate fans of the Irish Rugby Team enroute to Paris to see Ireland v South Africa). Could we see it return during winter given Vueling's limited frequency and Air France's absence beyond summer? Presumably more will become clear once the winter schedule is out

Van.Bosch

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120123867#Comment_120123867

A bargain!