BBQ Hut/Shelter

oleras

I am planning to build a BBQ hut/shelter onto the gable of my garage.

Got the area excavated last year and the slab poured.





The featherboards mark out the area i would like undercover, 5m x 4.2m.

This is a kind of layout i would hope to end up with.



I am trying to keep it simple as have never done anything like this before.

What I intend to do is build a basic frame system with 150mm or 100mm fence posts, bolted to the concrete with anchors, have a 7x2 bolted to the gable and tie the posts into this using 9x2 across the front and 7x2 at the back and side, like the sketch below.



Some questions.

Will 100mm fence posts do or should i use 150mm
Will the 2 inch fall over 4.2m be enough of a pitch ?
Will the rafters have to be pressure treated or will white deal i preserve myself do ?
On the rafters, is 9x2 overkill, will 7x2 do ?
Roof...OSB and felt or corrugated ? again, solid colour or clear ?
How should i space the rafters, 18inches ?

Lots more questions, but by even just typing this out things have become somewhat clearer in my mind...somewhat, YouTube overload !

I also will be flashing the gable side,are lead and leadex much the same end result ?

Once the roof is on i will proably shiplap the rear, side and a portion of the front, like the pic above.

What would you do different ? What would you add or takeaway if you were to do this ?

Lumen

I would look at doing a very light structure with polycarbonate roof, but make it so that vines of some sort could be trained up under the roof.

That way you get lots of light but some shading and a naturalistic feel.

Dunno how much of a gardener you are though.

Do you really need to bolt it and flash it to the house? There's no access through there.

oleras

Lumen wrote: »

I would look at doing a very light structure with polycarbonate roof, but make it so that vines of some sort could be trained up under the roof.

That way you get lots of light but some shading and a naturalistic feel.

Dunno how much of a gardener you are though.

Do you really need to bolt it and flash it to the house? There's no access through there.

Cheers for the reply, its a detached garage it would be attached to, just dont want water running down the inside when it rains..may eventually stick a tv on that wall.

The vine idea is a good one !

Lumen

oleras wrote: »

Cheers for the reply, its a detached garage it would be attached to, just dont want water running down the inside when it rains..may eventually stick a tv on that wall.

The vine idea is a good one !

Sorry, I didn't mean attach it and don't flash it, I meant have it freestanding.

I'm not sure what you gain by having it attached, apart from maybe one less gutter.

Lumen

Some pics I took in Croatia, for inspiration.

http://imgur.com/a/yO3IRKX

Calahonda52

If open on one side wind uplift would be a concern.
The other concern I have is water on the slab outside the finished area.
Like L-n says, don't put a solid roof on it. will be very dark

oleras

Calahonda52 wrote: »

If open on one side wind uplift would be a concern.
The other concern I have is water on the slab outside the finished area.
Like L-n says, don't put a solid roof on it. will be very dark

Prevailing wind is from the left, westerly. Slab slopes to the front, so no standing water as such, wouldent be too worried about rain coming in from the front.

I will be smoking and grilling inside it, so intend to leave a nice gap all around between roof and paneling, trellis type thing, wind will have somewhere to escape.

oleras

Lumen wrote: »

Sorry, I didn't mean attach it and don't flash it, I meant have it freestanding.

I'm not sure what you gain by having it attached, apart from maybe one less gutter.

Just want it somewhat waterproof, wind and rain hit that garage wall and a lot of water would be coming in if i left a gap i feel.

loyatemu

you might get some ideas here:
https://www.facebook.com/twoislandslandsoutdoorliving/

Mellor

oleras wrote: »

1. Will 100mm fence posts do or should i use 150mm
2. Will the 2 inch fall over 4.2m be enough of a pitch ?
3. Will the rafters have to be pressure treated or will white deal i preserve myself do ?
4. On the rafters, is 9x2 overkill, will 7x2 do ?
5. Roof...OSB and felt or corrugated ? again, solid colour or clear ?
6. How should i space the rafters, 18inches ?
7. I also will be flashing the gable side,are lead and leadex much the same end result ?
8. Once the roof is on i will proably shiplap the rear, side and a portion of the front, like the pic above.

1. 100mm would be plenty strong in compression imo. Racking strength would be the concern, but easy to add a diagonal tie to the side opposite the gable. Could be eliminated in base connections are solid.
2. A flat room membrane could co 2". A pitch roof, like metal sheet, prob needs 8". Although, don't need to be as strict as with a habitable space.
3. You could preserve the rafters yourself, but would be easier to just buy pre-treated timber. Are you leaving it rough or goign to the planed/sanded look?
4. Depends on there spacing and the strength class. But 9x2 could be suitable for floors. Either 7x2 @ higher strength and 400c/c, or 8x2 @ lower strength and 600c/c. The latter could be more cost effective.
5. Personal preference. I wouldn't be too worried about getting lots of light in there. could do a combo of steel and poly to let in some light.
6. As above, depends on the size strength. 16-18 or 24 if joists are deeper.
7. Much the same.
8. I'd look at shiplap too. Could also consider a dual sided hit and miss to let air/smoke through.

oleras

Putting together a shopping list, just a few questions.

I intend using these to attach the upright posts to.



Fixing those to the concrete base, what diameter bolt/screw will that take does anyone know ?M10 or M12 ? and how deep should i go, 75,100mm ?

Also, are concrete screws adequate or should i use sleeve anchors ?



Or



Thanks.

Mellor

How does the post fix to the base? Does it just sit into it and reply on friction. I'd prefer something with a fixing into or through the post.
https://www.pryda.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/PSCF-RANGE-Post-Anchor-Centre-Fix.jpg

If you have the depth, and hitting reo isn't a concern go with 100mm. M10 with multiple fixings is fine.
I'd use the sleeve anchors. Mainly because I prefer them as they are more forgiving with hole size.
But they are also easier to fix as a DIY job.

oleras

Mellor wrote: »

How does the post fix to the base? Does it just sit into it and reply on friction. I'd prefer something with a fixing into or through the post.
https://www.pryda.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/PSCF-RANGE-Post-Anchor-Centre-Fix.jpg

If you have the depth, and hitting reo isn't a concern go with 100mm. M10 with multiple fixings is fine.
I'd use the sleeve anchors. Mainly because I prefer them as they are more forgiving with hole size.
But they are also easier to fix as a DIY job.

Cheers Mellor, i have a good 200mm of concrete base.

Good idea about physically having the post connected to the base, will look for those type.

moonshadow

Similar project in mind myself slightly smaller in that my base is 9 m long and 3 m deep, again a lean to on to the rear of the garage, roughly 3x3 shiplap room with glazing and doors on left, 3m open space in middle and 3m sheltered on the right .
The difference for me is that I’m putting clear corrugated sheeting, on all of the roof and two sides half way down at the sheltered end with shiplap up from the ground to meet.
Materials due tomorrow hopefully.

Calahonda52

This would be my suggestion
https://www.klokow-gmbh.de/en/Fastening/Wood-joints/Truss-posts-post-carriers/Simpson-Strong-Tie-Column-shoe-Typ-D.html
drill the hole, clean it out very well and then epoxy it in, the one u posted earlier is sh1te

moonshadow

While they are lovely , I had to remove four of the OPs fixings yesterday, they had been fitted at least 20 years with the original 100mm square post and it took a grinder to do so.

oleras

moonshadow wrote: »

While they are lovely , I had to remove four of the OPs fixings yesterday, they had been fitted at least 20 years with the original 100mm square post and it took a grinder to do so.

Is this a pro or a con ?

I don't intend moving it regularly...:D

moonshadow

With regard to the roofing, I had the chance to get to lidl today and picked up some solar lighting units, the "stainless" ones at 17.99 I have tested under corrugated cover and charge just fine and work real well.
The aldi staked uplighters are also versatile as downlighters on the front.

Mellor

moonshadow wrote: »

With regard to the roofing, I had the chance to get to lidl today and picked up some solar lighting units, the "stainless" ones at 17.99 I have tested under corrugated cover and charge just fine and work real well.
The aldi staked uplighters are also versatile as downlighters on the front.

They work well now. Give them 6 months.
Any cheap solar lights I have used have lasted no time.


I'd definitely be getting power to the rear wall of the shed/garage.
How else will the beer fridge work??

listermint

Hi OP lovely start there, nice big space to operate in.

I would echo what's said above. If you roof that entire thing it will be dark and cold . Actually completely self defeating. You'd have to light it with unnatural light which then begs the question what's the point in being outside at all.

Don't forget you live in Ireland. A fully covered area might work somewhere that's warm with constant sun to hide from but not here.

I would cover only half of it at max. The left side over the cooking space. And leave the entire right side open to natural light and sunshine. You can always open a parasol over tables or even better attached a retractable roof to the side of the garage.


Work within our weather confines. Shaded dark area open to the elements will be cold and uninviting.

JustAThought

We have an outdoor covered area where clear perspex was used for the whole roofing - its been up about 20 years now and has become quite the tropical suntrap. Because of the clear perspex roof all kinds of plants are thriving in pots out there and it gives it a lovely feel - patio tables and chairs dry out when left out and its a nice place to be. A covered ‘drying area’ along the way that bizarrely has a solid roof is like entering the 1950’s - definately recommend a clear perspex roof. You can clean it every 8 or so years with a hose and brush if needed.

If you are putting in a TV and fridge can you put in an expelair above the BBQ? Might prevent the people being smoked out of it like kippers or are you only planning on using the area to BBQ when its not raining?

Also - seeing as you are so into it and good at it why not build in a wood fired pizza oven - would be really cool to sit around and give you somewhere to put your drinks/ BBQ equipment while you cook and party!

JustAThought

Can’t attach as its too big but if you google adobe style pizza ovens or BBQ party areas you would get a million cool ideas!

Mellor

listermint wrote: »

I would cover only half of it at max. The left side over the cooking space. And leave the entire right side open to natural light and sunshine. You can always open a parasol over tables or even better attached a retractable roof to the side of the garage.

The entire rest of the garden in uncovered.
By only building half a roof you are only reducing the effective area on the addition.

Horses for courses. But I’d never call dedicated outdoor area for cooking meat uninviting

listermint

Mellor wrote: »

The entire rest of the garden in uncovered.
By only building half a roof you are only reducing the effective area on the addition.

Horses for courses. But I’d never call dedicated outdoor area for cooking meat uninviting

Well you must have just moved to Ireland then because it's not the tropics mellor.

Dark covered out there area cooking in Irish weather. Nah.

Needs sunshine and lots of it. Poster above demonstrated exactly why.

Mellor

listermint wrote: »

Well you must have just moved to Ireland then because it's not the tropics mellor.

Dark covered out there area cooking in Irish weather. Nah.

Needs sunshine and lots of it. Poster above demonstrated exactly why.

A poly roof let’s through about as much light as no roof. It also stops the rain. Which is pretty important in Ireland.
Using “Irish weather” as your reason for leaving off the roof is odd. Irish weather is exactly the reason why I would cover the area.

listermint

Mellor wrote: »

A poly roof let’s through about as much light as no roof. It also stops the rain. Which is pretty important in Ireland.
Using “Irish weather” as your reason for leaving off the roof is odd. Irish weather is exactly the reason why I would cover the area.

You've misread what I wrote. Entirely.

Mellor

listermint wrote: »

You've misread what I wrote. Entirely.

No. I didn’t.
I’m just pointing out my I think an uncovered area is not a great idea.

Lumen

Maybe just put a cheapo gazebo up for the summer as an experiment before committing to major construction.

Rows Grower

Token post as I'm thinking of doing something like this and want updates on this thread.

CJhaughey

Mono pitch roof, make a decent fall to one gutter.
Use twinwall plastic for the roof, strong and rigid.
The red base for the uprights are OK but I'd look for hot dip galv, if you are worried about them pulling out drill a hole and wind in a big coach screw

g6fdyotp5nj2l7

I'm planning to do similar on a smaller scale. What's the best way to attach the wall plate to the garage wall. Sorry for hijacking the thread. Thanks in advance for any suggestions.

moonshadow

Concrete screws through whatever your using and joist hanger if a decent length of joist or if 4x2 sit on top and fix directly.

oleras

€1600 ordered between structure, wood, roof, fixings and cladding.

The €200 on an impact driver last week is between us...shshhhhh

oleras

It begins !

The drama that is...no doubt the first of many issues.

Right, the 4x4 posts i ordered seeming come in 95mm sq.

The post holders are 100mm sq...




Would packers made from the posts themselves be ok or will i get 5mm stainless plates to fill the voids ? Whats the best way to fill the gaps ?

GreeBo

This will help explain what happened...lumber has nominal and actual sizes...
http://mistupid.com/homeimpr/lumber.htm

Can you just return the post holders and get the correct size?

Rows Grower

GreeBo wrote: »

This will help explain what happened...lumber has nominal and actual sizes...
http://mistupid.com/homeimpr/lumber.htm

Can you just return the post holders and get the correct size?[/QUOTE]

Absolutely the right thing to do.

oleras

GreeBo wrote: »

This will help explain what happened...lumber has nominal and actual sizes...
http://mistupid.com/homeimpr/lumber.htm

Can you just return the post holders and get the correct size?

Thats what they have, 2 different yards, 100mm holders and 95mm posts. :rolleyes: oh well...lol

Edit, just checked, yeah, posts are closer to 90mm

oleras

Rows Grower wrote: »

GreeBo wrote: »

This will help explain what happened...lumber has nominal and actual sizes...
http://mistupid.com/homeimpr/lumber.htm

Can you just return the post holders and get the correct size?[/QUOTE]

Absolutely the right thing to do.

Rang both guys again and was informed they start life as 100mm, but between planing and pressure treating they end up 90mm...post supports still come in 100mm ? ?

Its either pack them out or buy 75mm post holders and cut them down ?:pac:

Mellor

You could pack each out with two/four slices off the bottom of the post. But getting a better size match would be better.

oleras

Mellor wrote: »

You could pack each out with two slices off the bottom of the post.

Thats what i was thinking, i have to take 300mm from the posts in the rear to account for fall so have offcuts.

Class MayDresser

I'd pack them out as a last resort on the blind sides, are you fixing them to the wall as well?

Rows Grower

If you ordered 4x4 and he sent out 95mm x 95mm without explaining what he had I'd be telling him to come and collect them and refund the money.

GreeBo

oleras wrote: »

Thats what they have, 2 different yards, 100mm holders and 95mm posts. :rolleyes: oh well...lol

Edit, just checked, yeah, posts are closer to 90mm

I'd just return them for a refund and get them somewhere else so...they are pretty common. (B&Q have 'em!)...and I wouldnt be too impressed with your supplier.
Id check that the nuts fit the bolts you bought!

oleras

Class MayDresser wrote: »

I'd pack them out as a last resort on the blind sides, are you fixing them to the wall as well?

2 will be against a wall, may not even use the supports for them when i can bolt directly into the gable.

I also intend driving 2 50mm coach screws into each post through the sides.

Unfortunately the likes of B and Q are still closed, although i am not in a massive hurry i am wiling to compromise somewhat on aesthetics, not on safety obvs.

The actual bottom of the posts will be hidden with shiplap so it is just aesthetic.

CJhaughey

Pack them and put big coach screws in the holes to secure them.

mjp

Look forward to seeing it all when finished. Following as planning on doing same attached to our garage.

Lumen

I've been caught out by that before with framing timber. Goodwins (who are otherwise great to deal with) just give you whatever they have in the yard, which might be rough sawn or PAO.

Cue much swearing....

Class MayDresser

oleras wrote: »

2 will be against a wall, may not even use the supports for them when i can bolt directly into the gable.

I also intend driving 2 50mm coach screws into each post through the sides.

Unfortunately the likes of B and Q are still closed, although i am not in a massive hurry i am wiling to compromise somewhat on aesthetics, not on safety obvs.

The actual bottom of the posts will be hidden with shiplap so it is just aesthetic.

I'd just pin them to the wall, chase the Bell cast out of the rendering(or notch the back of the uprights), and stop them half inch short of the ground. Each to their own though.

looksee

I had a helluva job getting post holder and timber to match - you'd think no one thought...oh lets make them in matching sizes. In the end, on two separate jobs I ended up with one post trimmed a bit and on the other some packing.

oleras

Thanks for all the replies folks, its a learning curve and hopefully any issues that arise will make it easier for anyone else planning something similar.

Hope you are not in a rush mjp..:pac:

Lumen

I saw this on FB and thought of this thread.