Now ye're talking - to an electric car driver

Boards.ie: Niamh

Our next guest has been an EV driver for the last 6 years and says he would never go back.

We are a 2 EV household with one long range and one short range car. We are hoping to upgrade the shorter range car this year. There is a different driving experience with an EV, not better or worse than an ICE car just different, coupled with massive savings. We've been all over Ireland in the long range car without any issues.

If you have any questions about driving or owning an electric car, ask them here

earlyapex

What charger did you get installed at your house and why are they such a rip off?

irishejit

Do you find the battery life/range deteriorating with age?

What's the long range you mention?

johnayo

Are you mainly charging at home, And have you had many bad experiences at public chargers with people hogging the space.

DrPhilG

Cool, I'm waiting now to see who it is, lol.

I've been an EV driver nearly 5 years too and also could never go back.

Watching...

Shefwedfan

DrPhilG wrote: »

Cool, I'm waiting now to see who it is, lol.

I've been an EV driver nearly 5 years too and also could never go back.

Watching...

No revealing of identity allowed....but I am sure we can guess :P

DrPhilG

Shefwedfan wrote: »

No revealing of identity allowed....but I am sure we can guess :P

Not me, I don't really keep up to date with the owners.

Pablod

Mines a multi-part question - hope that's ok

Are you allowed to tell us which make/models you have and if you have preference?

Also in relation to long range, do you drive long distance on a continuous/frequent basis,
If so what type of distance and how frequently would you have to charge do you get?

Do you have the cars long enough that you seen or noticed any performance/battery degradation etc ?

Thanks in advance

manonboard

Every year, the evs come out with better and better spec. Do you feel they are now at a spec where they suit pretty much everyone?

How bad is the Irish EV infrastructure? Its the biggest blocker to me about getting an EV.

Do you think the price out weighs the benefits still? They seem super expensive. Do you think they are affordable to Joe average?

What is something about Evs you've had that you dislike in general?

Gru

Are there any weather or driving conditions where you feel let down by the EV?

Have you had to adjust/cancel potential journeys due to range?

If an EV could have one new major upgrade what would you choose (besides battery life)?

I'm an EV driver, AMA

Thanks Niamh. :-) Will start answering this morning.

sydthebeat

Have you done a "pay back" analysis as to when you will break even in comparison to a similar ICE car... And if so, can you share those calcs here?

What is the one huge plus you find, and what is the one major negative?

I'm an EV driver, AMA

earlyapex wrote: »

What charger did you get installed at your house and why are they such a rip off?

The charger we have outside is a 7kW EV box. Very small, secure and slender unit. The beauty of it is that its card operated. We live in a duplex and we had to have permission to install it.... long process so it had to be small.

As for them being a rip off. On an overall price basis hard to disagree. There has been much talk about this on a lot of the forums. Best thing you can do is shop around, do not take the first price you get. I found the one that shouts the loudest is also the most expensive and in the end quantity does not equal quality. The units themselves are not massively expensive, depending on the amount of quality / control you want.

Go onto every form you can and ask as many questions as you can about them. Some suggestions would be....

1. Is it secure / easy to break into? would it require modification, for instance, one example I can think of, having to change the screws to be secure?
2. What are peoples experience with them. Do they burn out easily? Are they reliable?
3. What level of control do they have?
4. Whats the warranty on them?
5. Is it being installed by the contractor or a subcontractor? (This is relevant to question 4)
6. Lastly whats peoples experience on price.

sKeith

Does your range suffer when you have the air con on?

False Prophet

How much was the long range car (approx is fine)


If electric didn't exist would you have spend the same amount of money on a ICE car?

I'm an EV driver, AMA

irishejit wrote: »

Do you find the battery life/range deteriorating with age?

Bottom line on this is yes but the way I look at that is the same happens in a car, wear and tear, lower fuel efficiency etc.

We had an older leaf (13) which only gave 80km (About) at the end of its time. But now we have 2 Ioniqs which offer anywhere between 2 -300Km range depending on a lot of factors. Last battery measurement on both gave very little degradation on the battery.

I'm an EV driver, AMA

Augeo wrote: »

What's the long range you mention?

2 - 280 Km (X2) Ioniqs Depending on time of year, weather etc... Funny enough found it to be wide and varied.

I'm an EV driver, AMA

johnayo wrote: »

Are you mainly charging at home, And have you had many bad experiences at public chargers with people hogging the space.

We are both in the fortunate position to have a mix of where we can charge. Home, work and on public chargers. There is a long history of issues with hogging and yes I have had a bad experience with very inconsiderate people.

There is an app you can use to help alleviate this, I would recommend it to all drivers called "need to charge". Its a great idea, so that when cars are done and people don't realise they can can be called back. Its a simple app. No numbers or anything are exchanged, just registration. If your an EV driver look it up.

I'm an EV driver, AMA

DrPhilG wrote: »

Cool, I'm waiting now to see who it is, lol.

I've been an EV driver nearly 5 years too and also could never go back.

Watching...

;-) Good luck Phil

I'm an EV driver, AMA

Shefwedfan wrote: »

No revealing of identity allowed....but I am sure we can guess :P

I am Batman :):eek::eek::eek:

I'm an EV driver, AMA

Pablod wrote: »

Mines a multi-part question - hope that's ok

Are you allowed to tell us which make/models you have and if you have preference?

Also in relation to long range, do you drive long distance on a continuous/frequent basis,
If so what type of distance and how frequently would you have to charge do you get?

Do you have the cars long enough that you seen or noticed any performance/battery degradation etc ?

Thanks in advance

Hi thanks for the question.
At the moment I think my preference is for the KIA Nero but that only because it fits my needs and its on my shopping list this year. In saying that I have only chosen that based on 3 criteria. Cost, range and capacity.

The older Ioniq we have is a 171 and has 70K Km on the clock. So, do I do a lot of milage, I would consider it to be so but to some people that would be nothing. On that one I haven't noticed that much of a reduction on the battery, its still working well and giving 200+ in winter driving.

The old leaf (Gone now only just) had a big reduction but at the same time it had plateaued.

Gumbo

earlyapex wrote: »

What charger did you get installed at your house and why are they such a rip off?

Like everything out there, it’s only a rip off of you go shopping blind.
There’s a €600 grant which if used correctly, can be more than you need.

I bought my 32a charger for €200. Paid €70 on wiring and 40a RCBO.
Ran the cable from fuse board to charger location.

Got a sparks to connect to fuse board and connect to chat point in side entrance. He asked for €70. I gave him €200. Total outlay €370. Then €600 grant back

I'm an EV driver, AMA

manonboard wrote: »

Every year, the evs come out with better and better spec. Do you feel they are now at a spec where they suit pretty much everyone?

Almost, its not quite there yet but getting there.

How bad is the Irish EV infrastructure? Its the biggest blocker to me about getting an EV.

Still bad but getting better. There are private companies starting to come and schemes by, for example EV box, where community schemes are coming on stream. As the numbers grow this will have to change.

Do you think the price out weighs the benefits still? They seem super expensive. Do you think they are affordable to Joe average?

It's in my bio line, I would never go back. Cost of maintenace, running (Fuel) and Tax/ insurance blows an ICE vehicle away. With the longer range cars coming in this will only get better.

What is something about Evs you've had that you dislike in general?

Inabilty to tow. There is only one out there at the moment that can and that's wwwaaaayyyy outside of my price range. (Tesla Model X)

I'm an EV driver, AMA

Gru wrote: »

Are there any weather or driving conditions where you feel let down by the EV?

Have you had to adjust/cancel potential journeys due to range?

If an EV could have one new major upgrade what would you choose (besides battery life)?

Weather does effect range on an EV but the funny thing is so does it on an ICE. Where the difference lies is the range, an ICE can go further currently so you notice it more in an EV.

Never had to cancel a journey due to weather, why would I or any EV driver? Only reason ever was to do with the infrastructure.... That has let me down

Pkiernan

Our next purchase will be a Kia Niro.

I note that you've bought at least 2 EVs in 6 years and are now considering a new one again.

Does this not run against sustainability principles?

I'm an EV driver, AMA

sydthebeat wrote: »

Have you done a "pay back" analysis as to when you will break even in comparison to a similar ICE car... And if so, can you share those calcs here?

What is the one huge plus you find, and what is the one major negative?

Cost analysis yes we did, particularly when buying new. Ill look it up and post it.

Huge plus is cost, minus..... the infrastructure.

I'm an EV driver, AMA

Pkiernan wrote: »

Our next purchase will be a Kia Niro.

I note that you've bought at least 2 EVs in 6 years and are now considering a new one again.

Does this not run against sustainability principles?

One second hand, other new. The plan is to keep the new one for 7 years and the next new one for the same approximate period (Depending on market)

I'm an EV driver, AMA

Bottom line, yes. some of the cars don't have this issue if there is a heat pump installed and the loss in range will depend on the state of the heat pump. Is it at full capacity (Small loss) low capacity (Large loss) but again this is no different to an ICE car.

I'm an EV driver, AMA

False Prophet wrote: »

How much was the long range car (approx is fine)

If electric didn't exist would you have spend the same amount of money on a ICE car?

Actual spend new was 27K, 19k for second hand version. To your second question new yes I would, second hand hard to say. That's like comparing apples and oranges.

False Prophet

I'm an EV driver, AMA wrote: »

Actual spend new was 27K, 19k for second hand version. To your second question new yes I would, second hand hard to say. That's like comparing apples and oranges.

Reason I was asking is that if you are spending approx same money , then electric saves you money.
If you were spending say 10 grand extra on electric then majority of people wouldn't be making savings

oceanfroggie

One year in for us and it has been an almost seamless transition and completely painless. We've been practically everywhere in Ireland on a single charge (ie from Dublin) to places like Donegal, Kerry, Cork, Waterford, Galway, Limerick. From a driving perspective its very relaxing in ways I had not foreseen, but can accelerate like a bat out of hell if needed. We drive at 120kph on the motorways, so none of this urban legend nonsense about having to drive like a hearse with the heating off, etc.

Range is down about 10-20% during the colder winter months, but we did Donegal on a single charge last Jan, and Kenmare in February on a single charge only stopping for rest room and quick coffee, no charging needed, and we had the heating well on including heated seats and heated steering wheel. Believe all the myths if you like, 'hydro carbon' interests have spend hundreds of millions sponsored many urban myths about BEVs in an attempt to slow down the rate of market transition from ICE to BEV.

Cost savings are truly massive we only charge at home on night rate electricity twice a week, and about only 6 times in the past year used public charging infrastructure which was painless. We pay about €8/week now on extra electricity instead of €85/week on our previous diesel compact SUV. Another cost saving is virtually zero servicing costs compared to ICE, no brake ware due to non mechanical regenerative braking, no oil, no filters to change, a 100th of the no of mechanical moving parts so little to go wrong or service. Tyres are the only consumable item.

Ok it wasn't all perfect, we had to give up a tow bar and give up AWD, but at least being front wheel drive with socks or chains or in our case winter tyres from Nov to March snow would be manageable had it happened. During summer months we achieve real world driving range of 500km around the greater Dublin area, and 440km on long motorway trips which was about 380km during winter months. Have not yet experienced a range issue and I'm happy to drive down to 1% confident in the range remaining data the GOM is displaying (Guess O'meter).

I would never go back, my wife's next car will also be a BEV, not sure which make/model just yet except it will certainly NOT be a Nissan Leaf

Pros

• Massive running cost savings
• Relaxing to drive
• Quiet
• No range issues
• Refulling easy - happens while you sleep at home
• Regen braking facilitates almost one pedal driving
• Acceleration
• Zero tail pipe emissions
• Net low true emissions cause Irelands electricity grid is greener than most countries
• AppleCar play using GoogleMaps and Waze integrates well
• 8 year Battery warranty

Cons

• No tow bar
• No 4x4, AWD
• Marginally smaller than our former diesel SUV
• You need to plan a little for long trips (>300km) but this becomes automatic second nature after a while

There are many other myths about BEVs having net higher dust2dust CO2 foot prints, but these have been debunked. There are enough research papers out there executed by charitable scientific research foundations sponsored by big oil to wall paper the Aviva stadium. Ireland's electricity grid is close to averaging 50% wind with a target of 80% using French grid interconnector for the balance (ie CO2 zero nuclear), or when the wind doesn't blow enough.

The legacy ICE manufacturers who don't keep pace with the now well established transition era risk becoming the next Nokia's.

In truth I was really apprehensive when making the switch and wondered if I had made a big mistake until the first few long trips.

Had also been a little concerned about battery degradation but based on real world data from existing base that has not been an issue. Mobile phone batteries have helped create this concern for battery lives. On recycling BEVs have no oils to dispose of, and battery packs get repurposed to domestic and commercial storage batteries. After that battery packs can be recycled and all the precious metals extracted and reused in manufacture of new battery packs. Battery technology continues to evolve in terms of density, power output/kg, with smart battery management systems including thermal management for better cold weather performance (ie <10ºC) and hot weather recharging speeds. Battery prices continue to fall exponentially approaching $100/kWh.

Conclusion. Glad we did it, wife and son also going BEV. It does what it claims in the tin and none of the scare stories came to pass.

Wished I'd done it a few years ago, its a no brainer. Take it or leave it, its a free world. Don't do it to save the planet, or because you feel climate change shamed by ranting nutters, rather do it to save your family money.

PS: You gotta remember there is a war being waged out there right now by big oil and legacy ICE interests to delay or slow down the adoption to BEV. These interests are using micro targeting on social media and through the normal media seeding the market with FUD about EVs. The only truth is hybrids are a double con job on consumers and the marketing phrase used by some 'self charging' is a lie defying the laws of physics, newton and einstein. These are petrol cars with a tiny battery that cannot travel 50% of their distance in electric mode unless santa is real and elvis lives and physics has been reinvented by the tooth fairy

blue5000

Have you ever driven a tesla? If so how does it compare?

Have you night rate electricity at home and would it be good enough (9 hrs) for a full charge?

Boards.ie: Mark

Mod: Deleted some posts. Please remember that an AMA is for the purpose of directing questions to a chosen participant. If you would like to get involved in a discussion about electric cars or hear further insights from owners/share your own experiences, please visit the Electric Vehicles & Hybrids forum.

BuboBubo

Is the tesla the only car that can pull a small trailer? I occasionally pull a small single axle trailer with small loads. My petrol car does this very well.

I'm an EV driver, AMA

I'm an EV driver, AMA wrote: »

2 - 280 Km (X2) Ioniqs Depending on time of year, weather etc... Funny enough found it to be wide and varied.

So, LR is 280km. Is that average, best, worst?

The Tetrarch

Saving the environment seems to be a motivation for buying an electric car.
Over 20% or Ireland's electricity is generated by coal burning Moneypoint.

With more than a million electric cars sold a year is there a problem with the source of the electricity, with the recycling of batteries when the car is scrapped or when the battery get old, won't hold a charge as well, and is replaced.

Hotblack Desiato

Moneypoint is rarely used these days and is due to be completely decommissioned by 2025, probably sooner as it's totally uneconomic.

The wind blows at night same as it does during the day, this is ideal for EV charging at a time of low grid demand otherwise.

I still think we should get a medium sized nuclear power plant.

DrPhilG

Has the AMA guest abandoned ship?

Gloomtastic!

DrPhilG wrote: »

Has the AMA guest abandoned ship?

Maybe he's recharging......

blue5000

DrPhilG wrote: »

Has the AMA guest abandoned ship?

Perhaps they've gone away for Easter hols?:P

I'm an EV driver, AMA

blue5000 wrote: »

Have you ever driven a tesla? If so how does it compare?

Have you night rate electricity at home and would it be good enough (9 hrs) for a full charge?

Tesla is an amazing piece of kit but for me personally no I wouldn't buy one, mostly thats down to the current cost. For a 3rd of the money you can get something just as nice, thats far more practical.

Regarding night rate, yes we do and would the cars charge fully on that, yes it would.

I'm an EV driver, AMA

BuboBubo wrote: »

Is the tesla the only car that can pull a small trailer? I occasionally pull a small single axle trailer with small loads. My petrol car does this very well.

Currently yeah TESLA is the only one There are some coming such as RIVAN and the new Hyundai but they are while off.

I'm an EV driver, AMA

Deleted User wrote: »

So, LR is 280km. Is that average, best, worst?

Best and definitely only on summer driving. 200 210 would be the happy medium. I would out on it.

I'm an EV driver, AMA

The Tetrarch wrote: »

Saving the environment seems to be a motivation for buying an electric car.
Over 20% or Ireland's electricity is generated by coal burning Moneypoint.

With more than a million electric cars sold a year is there a problem with the source of the electricity, with the recycling of batteries when the car is scrapped or when the battery get old, won't hold a charge as well, and is replaced.

In part agree and in part disagree with that statement for 3 reasons.

1) If you look at how energy is generated, mechanical for cars and electrical for every day use which would you say is easier to clean, the exhaust from a car or a single stack from an energy generation plant.

2) Air quality is made up of 2 parts (A) The particles in the air and second the CO2 levels. Again if you look back at part one you will see the point here and about cleaning the output.

3) EV's are in the longer term part of a bigger solution with grid feed back and energy storage.

While not ideal, I think in the longer run its the lesser of the 2 evils.

I'm an EV driver, AMA

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

Moneypoint is rarely used these days and is due to be completely decommissioned by 2025, probably sooner as it's totally uneconomic.

The wind blows at night same as it does during the day, this is ideal for EV charging at a time of low grid demand otherwise.

I still think we should get a medium sized nuclear power plant.

Money point is economically nonviable but unfortunately there is no alternative for it at the moment. It's nearly always running at peak capacity and with the way thing are going they will be lucky to have it decommissioned by 2030.

Nuclear.... nnnoooo.... I see the benefits but I also dont want to glow in the dark.

I'm an EV driver, AMA

DrPhilG wrote: »

Has the AMA guest abandoned ship?

Not quite Dr.Phil. Nuts weekend!!

I'm an EV driver, AMA

blue5000 wrote: »

Perhaps they've gone away for Easter hols?:P

Christ I wish!! What a weekend of weather we had. :):). Even playing catchup on work stuff right now!

I'm an EV driver, AMA

I'm an EV driver, AMA wrote: »

Best and definitely only on summer driving. 200 210 would be the happy medium. I would out on it.

Appreciate the candid reply - it's like dentistry to get a straight or honest answer in the ev forum. Over there everything does 500km on a charge and all Dutch people drive Teslas :rolleyes:

I had been considering Ioniq for next car, but not a chance at this range

Hotblack Desiato

I'm an EV driver, AMA wrote: »

Money point is economically nonviable but unfortunately there is no alternative for it at the moment. It's nearly always running at peak capacity and with the way thing are going they will be lucky to have it decommissioned by 2030.

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/energy-and-resources/esb-to-cut-jobs-at-coal-fired-moneypoint-power-plant-in-clare-1.3950579

It was reported last year that ESB sought to make half of Moneypoint's staff redundant.

ESB said an increasingly competitive energy market, the growing volume of renewables and the impact of carbon prices on Moneypoint output “has meant that Moneypoint is now running far less than previously and given these market fundamentals, a low-running regime is likely to persist into the future. The impact of these factors is that Moneypoint’s income has been significantly reduced.”

https://www.rte.ie/news/environment/2020/0220/1116576-moneypoint-esb-christian-aid/

The ESB says generation at Moneypoint has "declined dramatically" over recent years.

An ESB spokesman also said that the volume of coal purchased for Moneypoint dropped from 1 million tonnes in 2018 to 72,000 tonnes in 2019.

...........

Nuclear.... nnnoooo.... I see the benefits but I also dont want to glow in the dark.

Ah jaysus, that's as ignorant as anything I've ever heard an ICE driver say about EVs

I'm an EV driver, AMA

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

Ah jaysus, that's as ignorant as anything I've ever heard an ICE driver say about EVs

But Im not an ICE driver, haven't been for years. :-)

On Moneypoint, there is the lipservice to the media and what is practical for the network. Currently it is not viable to get rid of it and wont be for a long time to come.

But I am not here to talk about generation or grid stuff. I am here to talk about EVs :-)