COVID-19: Vaccine/antidote and testing procedures Megathread [Mod Warning - Post #1]

Hmmzis

Japan is gearing up for vaccinating en masse early next year, they want their Olympics one would guess:

https://www.takeda.com/newsroom/newsreleases/2020/novavax-and-takeda-announce-collaboration-for-novavax-covid-19-vaccine-candidate-in-japan/

https://www.fiercepharma.com/vaccines/pfizer-and-biontech-keep-supply-deals-rolling-120m-dose-japan-pact


ChAdOx1 will also be produced in China:

https://www.fiercepharma.com/manufacturing/astrazeneca-takes-covid-19-vaccine-to-china-biokangtai-deal-for-200m-dose-capacity-by

drunkmonkey

Interesting article about testing and how futile it is having to abide by the current rules in America, it argues that people should be sent a cheap at home test kit they can do themselves. That way we catch most of the virus in the one go and brake the chain of transmission.

America has a different problem with backlogs we don't have anymore but using the same logic around testing would give us a clear picture of where we are and avoid these random lockdowns

"We need to change the whole script of what it means to test people,” he says. “In our country, we have always assumed that testing belongs in the clinical sphere, in the diagnostic sphere, and has to be run by laboratories or diagnosticians. The result is that we have a system for coronavirus testing…which is flailing, with raging outbreaks occurring.” What the country needs instead are rapid tests, widely deployed, so that infectious individuals can be readily self-identified and isolated, breaking the chain of transmission."

Failing the Coronavirus-Testing Test
https://harvardmagazine.com/2020/08/covid-19-test-for-public-health

YFlyer

Are home kits robust? Problem is too high percentage of false positives. Some would say that is not as bad as false negatives. Perhaps for Ebola.

CalamariFritti

Absolutely. Its got to be accurate though.

Its not all just vaccine IMO. May not even work. There are other possible game changers. Easy home test could be one of them.

drunkmonkey

YFlyer wrote: »

Are home kits robust? Problem is too high percentage of false positives. Some would say that is not as bad as false negatives. Perhaps for Ebola.

Less than a €1, they could send us 3 each. They've easily spent that on sending us information booklets at home.

drunkmonkey

CalamariFritti wrote: »

Absolutely. Its got to be accurate though.

Its not all just vaccine IMO. May not even work. There are other possible game changers. Easy home test could be one of them.

That's a good point, if we can stop the transmission without any vaccine that's a perfect solution.

YFlyer

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Less than a €1, they could send us 3 each. They've easily spent that on sending us information booklets at home.

Didn't Abbott have a quick turn around test? Doubt there be a litmus paper type test. However these test could be implemented globally.

touts

In theory the idea of basically picking a weekend and testing everyone almost like a census is a great idea. But it would take months to process 4.5 million tests in the lab. The first company to mass produce DIY test kits like pregnancy tests would make a fortune but likewise it would take months for the supply chains to have 4.5 million tests all ready to go especially with every other country in the world looking for them.

So great idea but unfortunately it wont happen any time soon.

CalamariFritti

No you need something that doesn't require a lab. Like you spit on it and 10 minutes later you know.

Don2012

No I don't agree with this at all. I think things have gotten out of hand.

stargazer 68

CalamariFritti wrote: »

No you need something that doesn't require a lab. Like you spit on it and 10 minutes later you know.

Have to agree. Unless the testing procedure changes, back of the throat and up the nose, it's no good. I've been tested 4 times and there is no way I could do it myself. Cant imagine I'm alone in that.

MOH

No.

Massive prevalent lack of personal responsibility already.

Group of people test positive. One individual has just returned from abroad, suspects they're the source.
Home test, fears blame, declares self negative.

mandrake04

touts wrote: »

In theory the idea of basically picking a weekend and testing everyone almost like a census is a great idea. But it would take months to process 4.5 million tests in the lab. The first company to mass produce DIY test kits like pregnancy tests would make a fortune but likewise it would take months for the supply chains to have 4.5 million tests all ready to go especially with every other country in the world looking for them.

So great idea but unfortunately it wont happen any time soon.

Sounds good in theory but it wont happen, the current reverse transcription PCR test is the most reliable test as this is able to differentiate the SARS-COV-2 virus from other similar viruses its very specific and it needs to be very specific.

Basically it takes the sample which is a swab of your cells, breaks them open using a reagent called lysis buffer and extracts your DNA and the virus RNA and splits the helix, it then uses a reagent called Primer (or Probe) that is complementary to the virus RNA and that becomes the Target. All the waste is washed away and you are just left with the target which is still too small to be detected. So its then amplified using a thermal cycler that increases the molecular mass to the power of n2 each cycle so a single strand becomes 2-4-8-16-32-64-etc-etc until you have billions and so it can be detected by the camera.

You use this (90 mins)



then this (90 mins)



these can pump out 96 samples in 3 hours


Or you can use this




Does about 5000 straight samples per day but if you stick a pooler on front end it can do about 40,000 per day

Or you can use the Abbott NOW (was the Alere back in my day)

does single test in 14 mins.

or you can use

genexpert 4



which can do 4 tests in 45 mins


a DIY test like a pregnancy kit hard to replace what these things do and that's a fact, sure they always try game changers but the risk of failure would be more of a disaster.

mandrake04

CalamariFritti wrote: »

No you need something that doesn't require a lab. Like you spit on it and 10 minutes later you know.

There are tests that rely on your body chemical response to the virus, but they will show negative well after a PCR will show positive. They work best when yoI have high viral load in late stages of infection, they don’t work on everyone and don’t work at all in some asymptomatic patients.

By this stage Antibody test would be more accurate, but this is no good catching disease before you become infectious.

PCR test will detect the virus 3-4 days after infection, you might not get symptoms for another 2-3 days but could be up to 14 days. You could be shedding the virus for a week before a spit test would test positive.

That would provide a false sense of security that you negative when you are clearly infectious. Disaster

mandrake04

stargazer 68 wrote: »

Have to agree. Unless the testing procedure changes, back of the throat and up the nose, it's no good. I've been tested 4 times and there is no way I could do it myself. Cant imagine I'm alone in that.

If it’s uncomfortable and makes gag and makes your eyes water then it’s done correctly, if you don’t get a good swab collection chances are you have a misample won’t be good enough to determine correct result.

Some people naturally don’t present the test area (nose/throat) well, the most reliable area would be stool but getting an anal swab might put people off.

YellowBucket

If and when a remotely test exists it would make sense, but to date that criteria hasn’t been met and there have been some extremely bad self test kits produced.

Marhay70

Any word on where Ireland's vaccine supplies will be coming from, will they be manufactured here for distribution here or will the EU have a central distribution centre?

Santy2015

It’s one thing that’s never coming up at any press conference. Does it show they’re not very optimistic about it

timsey tiger

Santy2015 wrote: »

It’s one thing that’s never coming up at any press conference. Does it show they’re not very optimistic about it

You will have to wait for articles in the guardian/ sky news about vaccine distribution , before our journos think to ask about vaccines.

timsey tiger

Marhay70 wrote: »

Any word on where Ireland's vaccine supplies will be coming from, will they be manufactured here for distribution here or will the EU have a central distribution centre?

EU organising purchase of vaccines centrally, so I guess they will organise distribution also.

Micky 32

Santy2015 wrote: »

It’s one thing that’s never coming up at any press conference. Does it show they’re not very optimistic about it

Yeah, it’s very concerning. All doom and gloom in the media, it’s here for years blah blah blah but rarely mentioned about the potential vaccines, it’s like they hardly exist. I have to wonder about people, even if a vaccine became available tomorrow would the lockdown merchants still want us locked up and demonize us for travelling, will we still have to quarantine etc etc

I have close family in the USA that i regularly visit and i think i’m resigning to the fact i may never see them again, depressing....

Santy2015

Micky 32 wrote: »

Yeah, it’s very concerning. All doom and gloom in the media, it’s here for years blah blah blah but rarely mentioned about the potential vaccines, it’s like they hardly exist. I have to wonder about people, even if a vaccine became available tomorrow would the lockdown merchants still want us locked up and demonize us for travelling, will we still have to quarantine etc etc

I have close family in the USA that i regularly visit and i think i’m resigning to the fact i may never see them again, depressing....

It is the media. Out of all the press conferences I’ve watched I don’t think Dr Tony or Dr Glynn were ever asked about potential vaccines or treatments by the media. Also you only see news about these like you said in the UK press or here

Call me Al

Santy2015 wrote: »

It is the media. Out of all the press conferences I’ve watched I don’t think Dr Tony or Dr Glynn were ever asked about potential vaccines or treatments by the media. Also you only see news about these like you said in the UK press or here

The current CMO answered a question on vaccines a few weeks back during the press conference.
He said he was optimistic that one would be available and that studies looked positive.
But I think he was non-committal wrt time frame.
It's a while back now though so I'm a bit hazy on the details.

Marhay70

I listen to Prof. Luke O'Neill on radio regularly and find him a breath of fresh air. He regularly discusses vaccines and treatments which he considers have merit in the fight against Covid-19 but apart from the Oxford Vaccine and maybe one or two others, I have never heard any of the rest discussed here in Ireland, apart from present company. Only last week he was discussing four currently tried and tested treatments for other diseases which have shown to have a remarkable effect on Covid in higher mammals but have never been mentioned , to my knowledge, on Irish media. I often wonder if they don't want to give us any hope, bad news sells papers, says the cynic in me.

Azatadine

Luke O'Neill..... Wonder which way the wind is blowing today....

Marhay70

Azatadine wrote: »

Luke O'Neill..... Wonder which way the wind is blowing today....

You sound sceptical, do you have a problem? Please share.

mr zulu

Colm Hendry on the radio during the week said none of the experts believe that a vaccine will be availbe for 12 to 18 months, since this whole thing kicked off all I hear is 12 to 18 months.

Micky 32

mr zulu wrote: »

Colm Hendry on the radio during the week said none of the experts believe that a vaccine will be availbe for 12 to 18 months, since this whole thing kicked off all I hear is 12 to 18 months.

Yet the people who are involved making the vaccine say end of year or early next year. You’d imagine they’d know a little bit more than the ‘experts’.

Quantum Erasure

'since this whole thing kicked off...' six months ago?

Bit cynical

Micky 32 wrote: »

Yet the people who are involved making the vaccine say end of year or early next year. You’d imagine they’d know a little more than the ‘experts’.

I think you have to have to be a little bit sceptical of spokespersons for drug companies too. I would not accuse them of lying but there's an incentive to be very optimistic when promoting their own products and seeking funding.