COVID-19: Vaccine/antidote and testing procedures Megathread [Mod Warning - Post #1]

Thierry12

3xh wrote: »

So it’s not just me then.....

Yeah its really annoying

mandrake04

I see AZ is starting production of AZD1222 at CSL in Melbourne next week, although production probably already started in other Global sites I would say this is a further indication that things are looking promising.

Irish Stones

hmmm wrote: »

Preliminary studies suggest that this virus exhibits decreased susceptibility to neutralizing antibodies from several people with a history of infection.
[...]

and involve a risk of impaired immunity to these after over COVID-19 infection, which is important for the individual and for herd immunity in society."

These two sentences imply that those who recovered from the coronavirus have developed an immunity, which sounds like the opposite to what so far has been said, that is that people who recovered form the coronavirus might not have an immunity to it.

Dressoutlet

So does this mink situation mean we could all end up worse off. I know they say it's a threat to the vaccine but will the mutated virus be a threat to humans as SarsCov2 is.

stephenjmcd

Dressoutlet wrote: »

So does this mink situation mean we could all end up worse off. I know they say it's a threat to the vaccine but will the mutated virus be a threat to humans as SarsCov2 is.

Taken from main thread

https://twitter.com/firefoxx66/status/1324095189242302471?s=19

Most seasoned scientific observers seem to be calling out poor journalism with regards to this story.

Mutations occur, it happens. Wouldn't be reading too much into any of this at the moment, also suggestions of the close environment of minks that it may replicate less effectively. Unknowns here really but I'll wait until theres a paper on it and not the rehash journalism thats flying around.

Irish Stones

Just out of curiosity...

When this pandemic began, we were promptly told to wash our hands often, wear a mask, keep distances, avoid gatherings, not to travel unless necessary, and so on. We also had lockdowns and closures announced like, for instance, "as from tomorrow all shops will be closed for a month".
Alright.
What I can't figure out, though, is if/when the pandemic ends (in a couple of years or a decade, we don't know) how we will be told that we can go back to do roughly what we used to do before?
I mean, would it be something like:
"Ladies and Gentlemen, this is your beloved President/Taoiseach/Prime Minister speaking. I'm glad to announce to you all that as from midnight tomorrow, no masks, hand washing, distances will ever be necessary again. Rejoice!".
Or what? How do you imagine an end to this existence of restrictions and such a transition to a different life?

Dressoutlet

Dressoutlet wrote: »

So does this mink situation mean we could all end up worse off. I know they say it's a threat to the vaccine but will the mutated virus be a threat to humans as SarsCov2 is.

As it stands not really no. It's not something to panic about but it's not something to downplay either. Just to be clear the virus showed reduced susceptibility to existing antibodies. It did not show antibodies were ineffective and they were very clear on this. It did not affect cellular immunity either.

The issue is it's hard to predict the long term implications if it mutates further. The Danes have decided they're not taking any chances and have gone with the nuclear option.

stephenjmcd

Irish Stones wrote: »

Just out of curiosity...

When this pandemic began, we were promptly told to wash our hands often, wear a mask, keep distances, avoid gatherings, not to travel unless necessary, and so on. We also had lockdowns and closures announced like, for instance, "as from tomorrow all shops will be closed for a month".
Alright.
What I can't figure out, though, is if/when the pandemic ends (in a couple of years or a decade, we don't know) how we will be told that we can go back to do roughly what we used to do before?
I mean, would it be something like:
"Ladies and Gentlemen, this is your beloved President/Taoiseach/Prime Minister speaking. I'm glad to announce to you all that as from midnight tomorrow, no masks, hand washing, distances will ever be necessary again. Rejoice!".
Or what? How do you imagine an end to this existence of restrictions and such a transition to a different life?

Slow burner, you reduce restrictions gradually bit by bit over a period of time. Its not a lightswitch that'll be all reversed overnight. By slowly reducing restrictions its not a big bang, people gradually resume normal life while still being cautious. The washing your hands and cough etiquette won't change, thats just good hygiene anyway.

When vaccine rollout begins and there's less pressure on hospitals as a result then the let up begins. This has / is only ever been about hospital capacity

dominatinMC

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Slow burner, you reduce restrictions gradually bit by bit over a period of time. Its not a lightswitch that'll be all reversed overnight. By slowly reducing restrictions its not a big bang, people gradually resume normal life while still being cautious. The washing your hands and cough etiquette won't change, thats just good hygiene anyway.

When vaccine rollout begins and there's less pressure on hospitals as a result then the let up begins. This has / is only ever been about hospital capacity

Well said, I get the impression a lot of people are expecting a singular, pivotal moment, at which we will be told that the virus is defeated and we can return to normal - something like VE Day. As you say, the reality is a slow, gradual, deliberate and systematic reduction in restrictions over time until normality is resumed. Hopefully by this time next year!

Irish Stones

dominatinMC wrote: »

Well said, I get the impression a lot of people are expecting a singular, pivotal moment, at which we will be told that the virus is defeated and we can return to normal - something like VE Day. As you say, the reality is a slow, gradual, deliberate and systematic reduction in restrictions over time until normality is resumed. Hopefully by this time next year!

But I don't think that some habits we have adopted will be cancelled, even later on. Like hugging, and shaking, getting in close contact. I believe people will be always wary of abolishing this precautions for good.

Irish Stones

stephenjmcd wrote: »

The washing your hands and cough etiquette won't change, thats just good hygiene anyway.

Well, these two specific things were in place even before this pandemic.

Irish Stones

Irish Stones wrote: »

But I don't think that some habits we have adopted will be cancelled, even later on. Like hugging, and shaking, getting in close contact. I believe people will be always wary of abolishing this precautions for good.

People will absolutely continue to hug and shake hands

iguana

Irish Stones wrote: »

But I don't think that some habits we have adopted will be cancelled, even later on. Like hugging, and shaking, getting in close contact. I believe people will be always wary of abolishing this precautions for good.

Yes, just like after the Spanish Flu pandemic people stopped touching each other forever.

stephenjmcd

Irish Stones wrote: »

Well, these two specific things were in place even before this pandemic.

Really ?

How many people would you have seen cough into their elbow and pay as much attention to washing their hands regularly. I highly doubt people were washing there hands countless times a day as they are now and using sanitizer multiple times a day.

Irish Stones

iguana wrote: »

Yes, just like after the Spanish Flu pandemic people stopped touching each other forever.

I'm not sure that such tight restrictions were in place a century ago. I was just thinking what kind of limitations and strict rules were in place at those times.

In this part of the world (Italy), though, after that pandemic, hand shaking had been discouraged, and the Roman Salute was welcome. It wasn't just an ideology, it was also for sanitary reasons as well.

BTW, are we allowed to refer to the 1918 pandemic as the Spanish Flu pandemic? Right now we can't even think to give the Covid-19 pandemic another geo referencing name, especially on Boards.ie, or you are banned.

Hmmzis

Hardyn wrote: »

As it stands not really no. It's not something to panic about but it's not something to downplay either. Just to be clear the virus showed reduced susceptibility to existing antibodies. It did not show antibodies were ineffective and they were very clear on this. It did not affect cellular immunity either.

The issue is it's hard to predict the long term implications if it mutates further. The Danes have decided they're not taking any chances and have gone with the nuclear option.

Even less reason to panic:

https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.11.03.367391v1.full.pdf+html

Our data indicate that the anti-SARS-CoV-2 memory B cell response evolves during the first 6 months after infection, with accumulation of Ig somatic mutations, and production of antibodies with increased neutralizing breadth and potency.

Starting from line 130 there is a more details analysis of escape mutants and the evolved antibodies.

While caution is certainly a good approach here, it's not all that worrisome for convalescent individuals or vaccines.

The other part in that paper is even more interesting, the persistence of the virus in the small intestine. Haven't read much about what these viruses do in bats but form the little I know they are mostly residing in the GI tract in bats. The constant IgA production due to this might explain why bats don't suffer respiratory symptoms from them. Immunology can be weird sometimes.

Irish Stones

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Really ?

How many people would you have seen cough into their elbow and pay as much attention to washing their hands regularly. I highly doubt people were washing there hands countless times and day as they are now and using sanitizer multiple times a day.

Coughing in your elbow is wrong, as it has been stated by WHO itself a few months ago. And I think that it was wrong even if they didn't mention it.

As for washing hands, in a previous post of mine I already wrote that in my country (Italy) washing our hands frequently has been a habit for several years now. Many people do that on a regular basis, most of us do it as soon as they come home from outside (along with removing our shoes and wear more comfortable and surely cleaner slippers). And, I'd say, 99.9% of us do that before eating.
It's what remained as a lesson after the epidemic in the 1970's.

Micky 32

iguana wrote: »

Yes, just like after the Spanish Flu pandemic people stopped touching each other forever.

I know. It’s clear some posters are delusional.

VonLuck

Irish Stones wrote: »

Coughing in your elbow is wrong, as it has been stated by WHO itself a few months ago. And I think that it was wrong even if they didn't mention it.

As for washing hands, in a previous post of mine I already wrote that in my country (Italy) washing our hands frequently has been a habit for several years now. Many people do that on a regular basis, most of us do it as soon as they come home from outside (along with removing our shoes and wear more comfortable and surely cleaner slippers). And, I'd say, 99.9% of us do that before eating.
It's what remained as a lesson after the epidemic in the 1970's.

How is coughing into your elbow wrong? Genuinely curious as this is what I've always done, even pre-pandemic.

Irish Stones

VonLuck wrote: »

How is coughing into your elbow wrong? Genuinely curious as this is what I've always done, even pre-pandemic.

Coughing, or sneezing, in your elbow leaves whatever you cough out in the fold of your elbow or clothes, and you carry that stuff along with you wherever you go, later you might touch your elbow for whatever reason and then have that "stuff" on your hands too and touch other surfaces, thus spreading what you have coughed out.
At the end of the day it's nearly like having coughed straight in your hands.


I think it was August or early September when WHO said that coughing/sneezing in your elbow was to be avoided.

Witcher

Irish Stones wrote: »

Coughing, or sneezing, in your elbow leaves whatever you cough out in the fold of your elbow or clothes, and you carry that stuff along with you wherever you go, later you might touch your elbow for whatever reason and then have that "stuff" on your hands too and touch other surfaces, thus spreading what you have coughed out.
At the end of the day it's nearly like having coughed straight in your hands.


I think it was August or early September when WHO said that coughing/sneezing in your elbow was to be avoided.

The WHO never said that.

iguana

A question about the mutated mink virus. It can infect humans but can that infected human infect other humans with this new strain?

Irish Stones

Witcher wrote: »

The WHO never said that.

The WHO said not to cough in elbows, the explanation is what I think it might be the reason.
Would you say it's wrong? Would you say that your elbow is safe after you sneezed and coughed in a couple of times a day?

Irish Stones

ACitizenErased wrote: »

There's a big line between you posting something conspiracy like and posting simply dangerous content.


I think this crosses into dangerous content.

Why are you saying that?
Because I said that over here it's a habit to wash our hands frequently and before eating?

Irish Stones

Irish Stones wrote: »

The WHO said not to cough in elbows, the explanation is what I think it might be the reason.
Would you say it's wrong? Would you say that your elbow is safe after you sneezed and coughed in a couple of times a day?

The WHO twitter account has a banner photo that advises to cough or sneeze into flexed elbow, or cover with tissue, it is still the current advice.

Le Bruise

Irish Stones wrote: »

Why are you saying that?
Because I said that over here it's a habit to wash our hands frequently and before eating?

I would say it was more about making up WHO statements....but I think you know that.

Irish Stones

Deleted User wrote: »

The WHO twitter account has a banner photo that advises to cough or sneeze into flexed elbow, or cover with tissue, it is still the current advice.

I remember a press conference of the President of the WHO.
Anyway, would you still say that you elbow is safe after sneezing in it?

Irish Stones

Deleted User wrote: »

The WHO twitter account has a banner photo that advises to cough or sneeze into flexed elbow, or cover with tissue, it is still the current advice.

Furthermore, I wonder how one can cough in their elbow with the mask on :P

VonLuck

Coughing into your elbow is surely the better option than dispersing it into whatever space you're in. What's the better alternative?

ACitizenErased

Irish Stones wrote: »

Why are you saying that?
Because I said that over here it's a habit to wash our hands frequently and before eating?

Because you're posting absolute ****e about coughing etiquette.