Will you travel? [Mod Note in Post #1 - Travel Discussion Only! Megathread]

Tenzor07

Benimar wrote: »

I know some on here think the 14 day rule can just be bypassed, but employers might not be so keen.
I know its not the workforce, but the sports club I'm involved in will not leave players back until 14 days after they return from trips abroad.

As nearly all office workers, those in Finance, I.T, other services are all still advised to Work from home anyways, the 14 day quarantine won't make any difference, plus better to go on vacation now than in late August/September when offices may all be due to return.

Micky 32

“Public Health expert Dr Gabriel Scally said he would favour the continuation of quarantining to achieve a zero-Covid Ireland.

Speaking on the same programme, Dr Scally said he doubts that anyone outside the aviation industry thinks dropping the quarantine period is a good idea and that the quarantine measures should be extended past 9 July.

The only safe way forward, he said, is to keep up the barriers and be a zero-Covid island, before opening travel links with other countries who are in a similar Covid situation.“

Tenzor07

Micky 32 wrote: »

“Public Health expert Dr Gabriel Scally said he would favour the continuation of quarantining to achieve a zero-Covid Ireland.
Speaking on the same programme, Dr Scally said he doubts that anyone outside the aviation industry thinks dropping the quarantine period is a good idea and that the quarantine measures should be extended past 9 July.
The only safe way forward, he said, is to keep up the barriers and be a zero-Covid island, before opening travel links with other countries who are in a similar Covid situation.“

Yea he said this back in April, so 2 months later the airports are still practically Ghost-towns.

Zero cases will never be achieved as an EU country with an open border with the UK.

Time to get in step with the rest of the EU and allow tourists and travel again.

Wallander

Micky 32 wrote: »

“Public Health expert Dr Gabriel Scally said he would favour the continuation of quarantining to achieve a zero-Covid Ireland.

Speaking on the same programme, Dr Scally said he doubts that anyone outside the aviation industry thinks dropping the quarantine period is a good idea and that the quarantine measures should be extended past 9 July.

The only safe way forward, he said, is to keep up the barriers and be a zero-Covid island, before opening travel links with other countries who are in a similar Covid situation.“

New Zealand and others have shown becoming totally Covid-free is next to impossible despite extreme immigration measures and much greater remoteness. It'd be a massive game of whack-a-mole, and once there is no Covid, social distancing would get dropped, leading to a couple of big problems:


a) You can't open the borders again until Covid has gone everywhere

b) If Covid sneaks in again (say from the various people who still need to travel to keep supplies open) you'd suddenly need to reinstate social distancing or risk another wave arising from the false sense of security your quarantining has given you

faceman

Micky 32 wrote: »

“Public Health expert Dr Gabriel Scally said he would favour the continuation of quarantining to achieve a zero-Covid Ireland.

Speaking on the same programme, Dr Scally said he doubts that anyone outside the aviation industry thinks dropping the quarantine period is a good idea and that the quarantine measures should be extended past 9 July.

The only safe way forward, he said, is to keep up the barriers and be a zero-Covid island, before opening travel links with other countries who are in a similar Covid situation.“

He's telling lies. The ECDC disagree with him. They're not the aviation industry.

Micky 32

faceman wrote: »

He's telling lies. The ECDC disagree with him. They're not the aviation industry.

Seems a bit of a dreamer alright with his zero cases.

yellow hen

We had our outbound Ryanair flights to Italy cancelled but the return leg on the 1st July has not been cancelled.

Am I correct in that we are stuck with the cost burden of this flight because:
a. EU Law will not cover a flight that is still going irrespective of your countries Dept of Foreign Affairs warning
b. Our travel insurance explicity lists the following exclusion: Your travel to a country or specific area or event to which the Travel Advice Section of the Department of Foreign Affairs or World Health Organisation have advised the public not to travel.

I'm fairly sure I'm answering my own question but just want to be a 100% sure before I mentally say goodbye to that money.

Beasty

Threads merged

scrips

Yellow Hen, I don't know the answer to (a), but the answer to (b) might depend on whether you took out your insurance and booked your holiday before or after this pandemic blew up. We had a rollover annual travel insurance policy and found we were covered for cancellation, but not covered while travelling against the advice of the DFA.

scrips

scrips wrote: »

Yellow Hen, I don't know the answer to (a), but the answer to (b) might depend on whether you took out your insurance and booked your holiday before or after this pandemic blew up. We had a rollover annual travel insurance policy and found we were covered for cancellation, but not covered while travelling against the advice of the DFA.

And just to clarify that further, I mean we were covered if WE cancelled the holiday because it was no longer viable. However, the excess was so high that we would have got nothing back for the flights anyway.

yellow hen

scrips wrote: »

Yellow Hen, I don't know the answer to (a), but the answer to (b) might depend on whether you took out your insurance and booked your holiday before or after this pandemic blew up. We had a rollover annual travel insurance policy and found we were covered for cancellation, but not covered while travelling against the advice of the DFA.

Thanks scripps. Our travel insurance was booked long before thew pandemic but the exclusion clause seems pretty clear?

scrips

Yellow Hen - my understanding is that you would not be covered for an accident, theft or anything untoward that might happen while you are on holiday, but if forced to cancel your holiday altogether (which effectively you now have to do) due to matters unforseen at the time of booking, you might be entitled to claim on the cancellation or curtailment section on your insurance.

yellow hen

scrips wrote: »

Yellow Hen - my understanding is that you would not be covered for an accident, theft or anything untoward that might happen while you are on holiday, but if forced to cancel your holiday altogether (which effectively you now have to do) due to matters unforseen at the time of booking, you might be entitled to claim on the cancellation or curtailment section on your insurance.

I really doubt we'll get anything but I'll chance it with the travel insurance company anyway. Will report back!

joseywhales

This will be the first year in a decade of working abroad in various countries that I think I won't be able to see my parents. They encourage me to fly but coming from the us now, in any given two week period I could find travel restrictions changing fast. I believe if I wear full ppe on the flight, I am pretty safe but then I risk infecting my parents and best case I would have to stay in the house for two weeks before flying back.

Q: even if quarantine ends on July 1st, it would be madness to let a bunch of Americans suddenly flow into the country. Even though my region, New England, isn't so bad really particularly outside mass, I guess the maniacs in the south are headed for the worst period we've seen so far.

Del Griffith

When is this 14 day quarantine sh*te due to end currently? or is there no end date and its just "we'll see" ?

faceman

Del Griffith wrote: »

When is this 14 day quarantine sh*te due to end currently? or is there no end date and its just "we'll see" ?

Government are meeting about it today.

faceman

The leaks are out.

‘No chance’ foreign travel restrictions will lift before middle of July – Government source
via The Irish Times
https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/travel/no-chance-foreign-travel-restrictions-will-lift-before-middle-of-july-government-source-1.4288205

stephenjmcd

faceman wrote: »

The leaks are out.

‘No chance’ foreign travel restrictions will lift before middle of July – Government source
via The Irish Times
https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/travel/no-chance-foreign-travel-restrictions-will-lift-before-middle-of-july-government-source-1.4288205

kick the can down the road to the next government. If it goes belly up they came blame Martin then seeing as he's been calling for it to be lifted for weeks.

I'd love to know how follow ups will be done when numbers even get back to relatively low levels traveling. I know of 2 couples heading off for 2 weeks to Spain on 1st July. Flights all going ahead, apartments open so if they don't go they lose the money, now they've no issues going and they'll fill in the form on the way back in if its still a thing when they come back but if there's more movement through the airports the calls for follow ups all of a sudden take longer to carry out.

normanoffside

Del Griffith wrote: »

When is this 14 day quarantine sh*te due to end currently? or is there no end date and its just "we'll see" ?

9th July

scrips

The purpose of travel advisories is surely to warn travellers and tourists that they might be more at risk when travelling to certain destinations. Seems to me that the Irish gov't is mis-using the travel advisory, as we are in no more danger of contracting COVID in many European countries than we are here.

To quote from a travel website, 'Governments issue travel advisories to let their citizens know about safety concerns that may affect travel to a particular country or region. Travel advisories may also note parts of the world where a government does not have the ability to respond to the problems of citizens traveling there—for example, if the government doesn’t have an embassy in a particular country, or if the functioning of its embassy is threatened by local violence.'

I'm thinking about flying to manchester and wfh from a freind's house for a while. Am I mad? Looks like 9th of July will change things

Wallander

scrips wrote: »

The purpose of travel advisories is surely to warn travellers and tourists that they might be more at risk when travelling to certain destinations. Seems to me that the Irish gov't is mis-using the travel advisory, as we are in no more danger of contracting COVID in many European countries than we are here.

To quote from a travel website, 'Governments issue travel advisories to let their citizens know about safety concerns that may affect travel to a particular country or region. Travel advisories may also note parts of the world where a government does not have the ability to respond to the problems of citizens traveling there—for example, if the government doesn’t have an embassy in a particular country, or if the functioning of its embassy is threatened by local violence.'

Here's the blurb on the official EU reopening website - much nicer words for anyone in an airport in the next couple of weeks to think of:


"The European Union, and all of its member states, are planning for a safe re-opening of Europe. While protecting the public health remains our priority, we want everyone to enjoy their holidays, to reunite with family and friends, and to be able to travel for any purpose."


https://reopen.europa.eu/en

lainey_d_123

The travel advisory is just silly at this point, especially here in the UK. We have one of the worst coronavirus case rates in Europe, but I'm advised not to travel to Slovenia, or the Canaries? What's the point?

brighterspark

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

The travel advisory is just silly at this point, especially here in the UK. We have one of the worst coronavirus case rates in Europe, but I'm advised not to travel to Slovenia, or the Canaries? What's the point?

Agree totally - if Uk have travel agreements with other countries this means that anyone can fly into Belfast and drive across the border. Why not offer visitors and our own citizens testing at our airports and at least we have some control of the situation? I intend to fly in the near future and would be happy to pay for this service instead of this stupid blanket ban!

Tenzor07

brighterspark wrote: »

Agree totally - if Uk have travel agreements with other countries this means that anyone can fly into Belfast and drive across the border. Why not offer visitors and our own citizens testing at our airports and at least we have some control of the situation? I intend to fly in the near future and would be happy to pay for this service instead of this stupid blanket ban!

I'd like to know which mandarin came up with the idea to keep this crazy 14 day rule in for our closest neighbour when you can just get the Bus to Dublin from Belfast airport...

Plus the fact that there's companies who want to kick start projects/work in the Republic but can't get project leads/directors into the country so therefore we are losing business/money every day this goes on, and work will move to countries with no quarantine rules or just random testing.

owlbethere

Tenzor07 wrote: »

I'd like to know which mandarin came up with the idea to keep this crazy 14 day rule in for our closest neighbour when you can just get the Bus to Dublin from Belfast airport...

Plus the fact that there's companies who want to kick start projects/work in the Republic but can't get project leads/directors into the country so therefore we are losing business/money every day this goes on, and work will move to countries with no quarantine rules or just random testing.

Testing at airports isn't going to be the solution either. Testing with quick results, it might give people a false sense of security with the virus. A negative result will have people going into communities and mixing with people but what if they picked up the virus along their travels but there wasn't enough virus to be detected at the time of the test?

faceman

owlbethere wrote: »

Testing at airports isn't going to be the solution either. Testing with quick results, it might give people a false sense of security with the virus. A negative result will have people going into communities and mixing with people but what if they picked up the virus along their travels but there wasn't enough virus to be detected at the time of the test?

We can’t operate on the basis of zero risk activities only. We are currently outliers in the EU and the scaremongering is akin to AIDS in the 80’s.

Testing and contact tracing is the only viable solution until a treatment or vaccine is found.

Many countries that have experienced an outbreak since reopening have the contact tracing and controls in place to manage them successfully without impacting the wider community. Spain and Germany being 2 good examples.

How long do you want the country to stay in lockdown? Until a vaccine is found, if ever? Do we keep schools closed and cancer screenings on halt in the meantime too? (More people die daily of cancer in Ireland than C19)

There is growing speculation that an annual vaccine for C19, similar to the flu, will be necessary. Do we shut down the country in the months prior to each year’s vaccine in place?

We have to be realistic here. Holohan’s job is to make health recommendations. The government’s job is take on those recommendations, alongside the advise from other sectors of government, when making decisions affecting the lives, civil liberties and livelihoods of citizens of the country.

owlbethere

faceman wrote: »

We can’t operate on the basis of zero risk activities only. We are currently outliers in the EU and the scaremongering is akin to AIDS in the 80’s.

Testing and contact tracing is the only viable solution until a treatment or vaccine is found.

Many countries that have experienced an outbreak since reopening have the contact tracing and controls in place to manage them successfully without impacting the wider community. Spain and Germany being 2 good examples.

How long do you want the country to stay in lockdown? Until a vaccine is found, if ever? Do we keep schools closed and cancer screenings on halt in the meantime too? (More people die daily of cancer in Ireland than C19)

There is growing speculation that an annual vaccine for C19, similar to the flu, will be necessary. Do we shut down the country in the months prior to each year’s vaccine in place?

We have to be realistic here. Holohan’s job is to make health recommendations. The government’s job is take on those recommendations, alongside the advise from other sectors of government, when making decisions affecting the lives, civil liberties and livelihoods of citizens of the country.

How did you manage to pick my post about testing and quarantine apart and apply it to the lockdown and the restrictions and claim I don't want the country to open up? Seriously. How did you manage to get all that from my few lines?

The country and the economy is opening up in case you're a bit behind in the phases. Reopening the economy is different from any quarantine measures.

Quarantine for arrivals would be no harm. Tony Holohan himself expressed concern yesterday about new cases connected to travel.

killbillvol2

owlbethere wrote: »

How did you manage to pick my post about testing and quarantine apart and apply it to the lockdown and the restrictions and claim I don't want the country to open up? Seriously. How did you manage to get all that from my few lines?

The country and the economy is opening up in case you're a bit behind in the phases. Reopening the economy is different from any quarantine measures.

Quarantine for arrivals would be no harm. Tony Holohan himself expressed concern yesterday about new cases connected to travel.

I think you'll find basic comprehension isn't a strong point with some on this thread. There are a few who can barely string two sentences together who think they know more than any Chief Medical Officer!

faceman

owlbethere wrote: »

How did you manage to pick my post about testing and quarantine apart and apply it to the lockdown and the restrictions and claim I don't want the country to open up? Seriously. How did you manage to get all that from my few lines?

The country and the economy is opening up in case you're a bit behind in the phases. Reopening the economy is different from any quarantine measures.

Quarantine for arrivals would be no harm. Tony Holohan himself expressed concern yesterday about new cases connected to travel.

Don’t take it personal, I wasn’t having a go at you. Quarantine and lockdown aren’t mutually exclusive.

I posted this in another thread about travel, it’s relevant here.

The advice of the NPHET is not aligned with ECDC or with WHO. In fact research based evidence by WHO shows:

“...evidence shows that restricting the movement of people and goods during public health emergencies is ineffective in most situations and may divert resources from other interventions. Furthermore, restrictions may interrupt needed aid and technical support, may disrupt businesses, and may have negative social and economic effects on the affected countries. However, in certain circumstances, measures that restrict the movement of people may prove temporarily useful, such as in settings with few international connections and limited response capacities.

Travel measures that significantly interfere with international traffic may only be justified at the beginning of an outbreak, as they may allow countries to gain time, even if only a few days, to rapidly implement effective preparedness measures. Such restrictions must be based on a careful risk assessment, be proportionate to the public health risk, be short in duration, and be reconsidered regularly as the situation evolves.

Travel bans to affected areas or denial of entry to passengers coming from affected areas are usually not effective in preventing the importation of cases but may have a significant economic and social impact.”