Will Britain piss off and get on with Brexit II (mod warning in OP)

Donald Trump

Aegir wrote: »

So it’s going to be difficult, but no one can actually give a solid example of how?

You can't be actually serious?


Do you think the average person living over in the UK could decide to just up sticks and move to the US on a whim? Just land and then sure start thinking about a job there, find one, or just set up your own business and live happily ever after?


Because once you are outside of the EU, in the absence of an agreement otherwise, it will be the same trying to do that in the US.


Why can the big companies do it? Because they bring something to the table. If you have enough dollars (without borrowing) to invest in the US in a company that will employ enough US citizens, you can do it there too.

davedanon

davedanon wrote: »

Among the points made this week, Grey notes that the UK govt.'s "Shock & Awe" media blitz has been distinctly underwhelming, with British citizens left to discover for themselves the myriad ways in which life is going to get harder or more unpleasant - all sorts of things associated with the EU, and beyond, both big and small, are going to become more difficult: going on holiday, buying a home, purchasing goods online, accessing drugs and healthcare, insurance.

I just wanted to include the above, to remind people what I was replying to originally.

First Up wrote: »

Well you could expand your horizons beyond holidaymakers but here's two to get you thinking (as if).

All EU citizens and entities have the same access to all services as local citizens across all member states. Non EU citizens and entities don't.

aah, that must be why there are no non-eu visitors to europe. It isn't a big thing for 99% of people and certainly doesn't make life harder or more unpleasant for the Brits

First Up wrote: »

EU citizens can start or participate in a business anywhere in the EU. Non EU citizens can only do so if they are granted residency in the EU member state concerned - and that ain't easy.

There's lots more but let's see if you can understand the importance of those two first.

aah, that must be why there are no non-eu business owners in europe. It isn't a big thing for 99% of people and certainly doesn't make life harder or more unpleasant for the Brits

First Up

Aegir wrote:

aah, that must be why there are no non-eu visitors to europe. It isn't a big thing for 99% of people and certainly doesn't make life harder or more unpleasant for the Brits

There is more to international business than passport queues but I'll let you figure that out for yourself.

Aegir wrote:

aah, that must be why there are no non-eu business owners in europe. It isn't a big thing for 99% of people and certainly doesn't make life harder or more unpleasant for the Brits

99% of people don't need to know about the legal and logistical minefields involved in setting up and running an overseas business. But the people who depend on those businesses for their jobs are glad that someone does.

First Up

First Up wrote: »

There is more to international business than passport queues but I'll let you figure that out for yourself.

I didn't say that though, did I?

First Up wrote: »

99% of people don't need to know about the legal and logistical minefields involved in setting up and running an overseas business. But the people who depend on those businesses for their jobs are glad that someone does.

it is something that is done once though and many of those companies would already have entities outside of the eu, so already have the experience. It certainly doesn't make life harder or more unpleasant for the Brits.

First Up

Aegir wrote:

I didn't say that though, did I?

You didn't say anything much but you seem to see it only as a travel issue.

Aegir wrote:

it is something that is done once though and many of those companies would already have entities outside of the eu, so already have the experience. It certainly doesn't make life harder or more unpleasant for the Brits.

It certainly does when it takes British SMEs out of the free access to the EU market they enjoyed for 40+ years.

Big companies are geared up for the hassles of trade across international borders and boundaries. Small ones are not.

Donald Trump

Aegir wrote: »

I didn't say that though, did I?



it is something that is done once though and many of those companies would already have entities outside of the eu, so already have the experience. It certainly doesn't make life harder or more unpleasant for the Brits.

They really need to get you on the Boards of these UK companies so that you can tell them how to do things.


https://www.uhy-uk.com/news-events/news/eu-cuts-contracts-given-to-uk-businesses-public-procurement-spend-falls-30-in-a-year/


For EU public procurement contracts, UK went from 161m in 2016 to 108m in 2019

Jizique

Donald Trump wrote: »

They really need to get you on the Boards of these UK companies so that you can tell them how to do things.


https://www.uhy-uk.com/news-events/news/eu-cuts-contracts-given-to-uk-businesses-public-procurement-spend-falls-30-in-a-year/


For EU public procurement contracts, UK went from 161m in 2016 to 108m in 2019

Breaking news tonight as the Telegraph reports that Britain (surely England) is looking to Merkel to break the impasse.
Is this the 10th or 11th time I have seen this headline?

Donald Trump

Jizique wrote: »

Breaking news tonight as the Telegraph reports that Britain (surely England) is looking to Merkel to break the impasse.
Is this the 10th or 11th time I have seen this headline?

That's very altruistic of the UK. Especially given that the EU needs the UK more than the UK needs the EU. They are putting in a lot of effort to try to stop Merkel from hurting her country needlessly. Great bunch of lads so they are

Professor Moriarty

Jizique wrote: »

Breaking news tonight as the Telegraph reports that Britain (surely England) is looking to Merkel to break the impasse.
Is this the 10th or 11th time I have seen this headline?

The Guardian reporting tonight that the German government has requested more realism from the UK. Doesn't sound like they're trying to break an impasse.

Jizique

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

The Guardian reporting tonight that the German government has requested more realism from the UK. Doesn't sound like they're trying to break an impasse.

It is the Telegraph after all - German car makers riding to the rescue

Junkyard Tom

theological wrote: »

The UK was never a net beneficiary so never benefited in this regard.

I'd imagine Britain got much more out of the EU than the funds it put in. According to one source Brexit has already cost Britain more since 2016 than its entire combined contribution in 45 years in the EEC/EC/EU.

Jizique

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

I'd imagine Britain got much more out of the EU than the funds it put in. According to one source Brexit has already cost Britain more since 2016 than its entire combined contribution in 45 years in the EEC/EC/EU.

Most of their service-based economy was based on access to the EU; I really hope that Brexit destroys much of their financial services sector, it’s the least they deserve

Jizique

Jizique wrote: »

Most of their service-based economy was based on access to the EU; I really hope that Brexit destroys much of their financial services sector, it’s the least they deserve

Apparently 99% of people won't be affected by Brexit so yeah, screw the rich 1% and their financial services sector. Its demise certainly wouldn't make life harder or more unpleasant for the Brits.

Jizique

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Apparently 99% of people won't be affected by Brexit so yeah, screw the rich 1% and their financial services sector. Its demise certainly wouldn't make life harder or more unpleasant for the Brits.

The tax generated by the sector is massive; all those high paid bankers and lawyers and accountants (many of them international) arranging finance for governments and corporates; no reason this cannot be carried out within the EU

timetogo1

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Apparently 99% of people won't be affected by Brexit so yeah, screw the rich 1% and their financial services sector. Its demise certainly wouldn't make life harder or more unpleasant for the Brits.

Can you link to where you got that number. Or is it a joke? I can't believe anybody would think that statement is true.

Already sterling devalued and 1000s of jobs have gone. That started from day one and is still happening.
The million of so Brits living in the EU are hugely affected. Farmers are hugely affected.
They've spent billions preparing and they're nowhere near prepared.
NHS has 1000s of jobs vacancies and it's more complicated and expensive to hire the EU citizens they used to rely on. And for some reason the number of EU citizens has dropped in their applications.
And that's just random stuff off the top of my head. There are loads of other things that change for British people now. Everybody in the UK is affected by this.
The rich will benefit from this. The rest of the UK just have to pay for it.

Not even a page ago, Aegir said this three times.. "It isn't a big thing for 99% of people and certainly doesn't make life harder or more unpleasant for the Brits"

timetogo1

Deleted User wrote: »

Not even a page ago, Aegir said this three times.. "It isn't a big thing for 99% of people and certainly doesn't make life harder or more unpleasant for the Brits"

Ah, sorry so. I have some users on my ignore list as lifes too short to be reading some of the rubbish some posters come out with.
When I was typing the previous post I was thinking "I thought I saw posts by this guy before and he didn't seem like a nutjob"

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Apparently 99% of people won't be affected by Brexit so yeah, screw the rich 1% and their financial services sector. Its demise certainly wouldn't make life harder or more unpleasant for the Brits.

The financial services sector will be barely affected.

ancapailldorcha

Aegir wrote: »

The financial services sector will be barely affected.

Source?

It seems Aegir is slipping into the trollish denial of consequences we saw in cryptocurrency, where legitimate conversation about Brexit was impossible and it was instead a stream of "There are no negatives to No Deal."

So let's see.. Aegir, what do you think about the lorry park being built outside Dover? Shipping "will be barely affected" and it "won't make life harder or more unpleasant", or.. shipping will be very much affected and this is a significant downside of Brexit that most companies aren't prepared for?

Professor Moriarty

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Source?

This should be interesting. Maybe a comment by Mark Francois. Or a line from the Brexit Party's manifesto.

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

It seems Aegir is slipping into the trollish denial of consequences we saw in cryptocurrency, where legitimate conversation about Brexit was impossible and it was instead a stream of "There are no negatives to No Deal."

So let's see.. Aegir, what do you think about the lorry park being built outside Dover? Shipping "will be barely affected" and it "won't make life harder or more unpleasant", or.. shipping will be very much affected and this is a significant downside of Brexit that most companies aren't prepared for?

I think you meant to write echo chamber, not debate. We’ve all seen the way that posters are hounded as soon as they post out blatant silly posts. I’ve yet to see davedanon explain how selling in line, buying a house abroad and access to healthcare are going to be seriously impacted by brexit.

There will be considerable upheaval and most of it needless and I can’t see any benefits, but I don’t see any major impacts that will make life unbearable for Brits.

That isn’t trolling, it just runs contrary to the echo chamber.

ancapailldorcha

Aegir wrote: »

I think you meant to write echo chamber, not debate. We’ve all seen the way that posters are hounded as soon as they post out blatant silly posts. I’ve yet to see davedanon explain how selling in line, buying a house abroad and access to healthcare are going to be seriously impacted by brexit.

There will be considerable upheaval and most of it needless and I can’t see any benefits, but I don’t see any major impacts that will make life unbearable for Brits.

That isn’t trolling, it just runs contrary to the echo chamber.

It's telling that the Brexiters here feel that questioning their dogma is "hounding".

ancapailldorcha

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Source?

Barely is the wrong phrase. The Impact on the city is going to be nowhere near as sever as originally thought.

Initial predictions were 100,000 jobs moving overseas, that is now expected to be nearer 10,000.

There will be a deal of some sorts though, there is too much pressure on the government for there not to be.

ancapailldorcha

Aegir wrote: »

Barely is the wrong phrase. The Impact on the city is going to be nowhere near as sever as originally thought.

Initial predictions were 100,000 jobs moving overseas, that is now expected to be nearer 10,000.

There will be a deal of some sorts though, there is too much pressure on the government for there not to be.

We're talking about a government that's selected on the basis of love for Brexit and pliance, not competence and skill. Somehow, they're actually going so far as to place Chris Grayling on the chair of the ICS.

If there is a deal, and I'm not saying that that will be impossible, I'd say it's going to be a form of capitulation.

steddyeddy

Aegir wrote: »

The financial services sector will be barely affected.

That depends on whether the British negotiation team secure passporting rights for financial services operating in the UK.

steddyeddy

Aegir wrote: »

Barely is the wrong phrase. The Impact on the city is going to be nowhere near as sever as originally thought.

Initial predictions were 100,000 jobs moving overseas, that is now expected to be nearer 10,000.

There will be a deal of some sorts though, there is too much pressure on the government for there not to be.

Well it doesn't look like there will be. You're forgetting Boris and co are completely incompetent.

"Barnier said Britain would like to make it easy to continue to run EU financial services businesses from London, with minimal operations and staff on the continent.

Many banks and insurers based in Britain have opened hubs in the EU to continue serving customers there irrespective of what deal London seals with Brussels.

“I will be blunt: its proposals are unacceptable. There is no way member states or the European Parliament would accept this,” Barnier told a Eurofi conference.

London and Brussels have an end of June deadline for completing “equivalence” assessments for determining access to each other’s financial markets.

Barnier said Britain has only responded to 4 of 28 questionnaires for assessing if UK financial rules are similar enough to those in the bloc to allow direct market access.

“So we are not there yet,” Barnier said."

Source:https://www.insurancejournal.com/news/international/2020/07/01/573987.htm

Professor Moriarty

The UK exports 61 billion in financial services of which 43% is to the EU. The sector employs over 1 million people in the UK. Decoupling of regulations will hammer banking especially. This will have knock on effects on investment and other industries. A deal is vital for the UK's financial services. Even with a deal, it will take a hit. No deal would be disastrous.

ancapailldorcha

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

The UK exports 61 billion in financial services of which 43% is to the EU. The sector employs over 1 million people in the UK. Decoupling of regulations will hammer banking especially. This will have knock on effects on investment and other industries. A deal is vital for the UK's financial services. Even with a deal, it will take a hit. No deal would be disastrous.

The real issue is pressure in the EU for reform of financial services which would almost certainly entail increased taxation and regulation. The UK could have been their guardian with their veto had they stayed in.

steddyeddy

steddyeddy wrote: »

That depends on whether the British negotiation team secure passporting rights for financial services operating in the UK.

I’d say at this stage, most companies that rely on passporting have already gotten around it.