Currently buying/selling a house? How is it going? READ MOD NOTE POST #1

Bargain_Hound

Zenify wrote: »

Just to clarify, did you get a loan offer on the condition of Covid-19 and then they did not honour it at drawdown? Or did your circumstances change after the loan offer?

Prior to full loan offer being issued 3 weeks ago, we were asking to clarify my partners income was still 100% as per the original application. We issued a payslip and a letter from employer stating this has not changed and the employer would continue to pay employees using the government subsidy and topping up to 100%, and she is still receiving 100% income. My job is unaffected. They accepted both payslip and letter and issued our loan offer and was signed along with house contracts. Our solicitor attempted to drawdown and this was refused today due to my partners payslip listing Covid-19 subsidy topped up by employer to 100%.

So technically, no circumstances stances have changed as per original application but it appears that pre drawdown checks have highlighted they arent comfortable now lending anymore with one income being supported by government subsidy. My partners income at 100% still only accounts for 80% of our combined income. I have also received a small salary increase since loan offer issued but not enough to remove partner from mortgage and reapply on my own.

Pretty frustrating

T83

Bargain_Hound wrote: »

My partners income at 100% still only accounts for 80% of our combined income.

I've been following this thread for a while now, and found your situation fairly alarming.

Just for clarity, are you saying your income is 20% of your combined income, and your partners is 80%? And that your partner is the one who's income is being topped up by government COVID subsidy?

Can I ask if you were asking for an exception, or just 3.5x your combined salaries?

Zenify

Bargain_Hound wrote: »

Prior to full loan offer being issued 3 weeks ago, we were asking to clarify my partners income was still 100% as per the original application. We issued a payslip and a letter from employer stating this has not changed and the employer would continue to pay employees using the government subsidy and topping up to 100%, and she is still receiving 100% income. My job is unaffected. They accepted both payslip and letter and issued our loan offer and was signed along with house contracts. Our solicitor attempted to drawdown and this was refused today due to my partners payslip listing Covid-19 subsidy topped up by employer to 100%.

So technically, no circumstances stances have changed as per original application but it appears that pre drawdown checks have highlighted they arent comfortable now lending anymore with one income being supported by government subsidy. My partners income at 100% still only accounts for 80% of our combined income. I have also received a small salary increase since loan offer issued but not enough to remove partner from mortgage and reapply on my own.

Pretty frustrating

That's very serious for a lot of people. Thanks for the info

Bargain_Hound

T83 wrote: »

I've been following this thread for a while now, and found your situation fairly alarming.

Just for clarity, are you saying your income is 20% of your combined income, and your partners is 80%? And that your partner is the one who's income is being topped up by government COVID subsidy?

Can I ask if you were asking for an exception, or just 3.5x your combined salaries?

Sorry I probably wasn’t very clear.
My income is worth 80% of our combined income. My income is unaffected and my income in fact has increased slightly since loan offer was issued.
My partners income is currently being supplemented by government subsidy and employer topping up to 100%. We had a letter that stated this and bank accepted this and issued full loan offer 3 weeks back.

Looks like they have since reversed on their decision at drawdown, leaving us high and dry last minute after signing contracts and paying deposit.

T83

Bargain_Hound wrote: »

Sorry I probably wasn’t very clear.
My income is worth 80% of our combined income. My income is unaffected and my income in fact has increased slightly since loan offer was issued.
My partners income is currently being supplemented by government subsidy and employer topping up to 100%. We had a letter that stated this and bank accepted this and issued full loan offer 3 weeks back.

Looks like they have since reversed on their decision at drawdown, leaving us high and dry last minute after signing contracts and paying deposit.

Ok, thanks for clearing that up, it did seem the other way around in your other post. Can't understand their decision at all based on what you've just said. Almost sounds like they were looking for any technicality to back out of lending.

dowhatyoulove

We are buying - had signed our mortgage offer etc with our solicitors - we were waiting on the final snag to be finished the next week before lockdown before we drawdown.

Just got an email today from Ulsterbank to ask if we would send updated Payslips from be last two months - nothing has changed in our income thankfully and a bit of an honestly horrid note about how much longer our valuation is valid for. It said if it lapses they will withdraw our loan offer and need to be redone. It’s a first world problem but it’s a nightmare - we’ve paid both booking deposit and a larger deposit for a new build. They’ve even claimed down the Help to buy scheme. No idea where we will stand if this all falls through- I’m hitting the wine

mutley18

Went Sale Agreed on my first home back in February, its still with the solicitors and we are waiting on the contract from the vendor. There was a few buyers bidding on the house and it went 5k over the asking price, would it be cheeky to ask would they accept the original asking price given how the market is going to go?

mutley18

Duplicate post.

mcbert

mutley18 wrote: »

Went Sale Agreed on my first home back in February, its still with the solicitors and we are waiting on the contract from the vendor. There was a few buyers bidding on the house and it went 5k over the asking price, would it be cheeky to ask would they accept the original asking price given how the market is going to go?

Does it matter if they think you cheeky? What matters is if you risk losing the place, and if you care, or is the biggest risk is them simply saying no. If you are worried about being cheeky over 5k, Im going to guess they might call your bluff. What'll you do then? walk away or take it anyway.

JimmiesRustled

dowhatyoulove wrote: »

We are buying - had signed our mortgage offer etc with our solicitors - we were waiting on the final snag to be finished the next week before lockdown before we drawdown.

Just got an email today from Ulsterbank to ask if we would send updated Payslips from be last two months - nothing has changed in our income thankfully and a bit of an honestly horrid note about how much longer our valuation is valid for. It said if it lapses they will withdraw our loan offer and need to be redone. It’s a first world problem but it’s a nightmare - we’ve paid both booking deposit and a larger deposit for a new build. They’ve even claimed down the Help to buy scheme. No idea where we will stand if this all falls through- I’m hitting the wine

Exact same situation for myself and my partner more or less. We snagged the house at the end of February. Apparently the house is good to go we just need to carry out a final snag to make sure we're happy.

My employer has begun to avail of the government subsidy scheme. My last paycheck included some money from this scheme.

From reading this thread, I've contacted our broker and we're being asked to resubmit some information. All contracts have been signed and returned to the bank etc.

We're literally just waiting to be able to get to the house, as it's outside our 2km zone to be able to sign off on it but now it looks like we may be refused draw down completely. We've paid a non refundable deposit on the house of over €30,000. That took years to save.

Won't be getting much sleep until I know one way or the other.

cd76

Up to you. You should walk away if you are ok with potentially losing it. Time to be brave, but market is crashing so walking away is best option.

Zenify

JimmiesRustled wrote: »

We've paid a non refundable deposit on the house of over €30,000. That took years to save.

Won't be getting much sleep until I know one way or the other.

Are these deposits not based on mortgage approvals etc.?

Housebuying

Zenify wrote: »

Are these deposits not based on mortgage approvals etc.?

It's optional for the solicitor to include that in the clause of the contract but its pretty standard now since the housing crash.

Check your contracts. If the bank refuse your mortgage, you may have an optional to pull out of the sale and get your deposit back.

Bargain_Hound

cd76 wrote: »

Up to you. You should walk away if you are ok with potentially losing it. Time to be brave, but market is crashing so walking away is best option.

Who in their right mind are ok with loosing their hard earned savings (30k) which they depend upon to put a roof over their own heads?
This is all simply not fair for those caught in the middle.

ciaranmul

I'm trying to keep an eye on price drops in Dublin as best I can over on www.instagram.com/crazyhouseprices

I'm getting a lot of messages from worried folks who have gone sale agreed but don't know whether to back out and also a lot of folks whose mortgages, like above, have been reduced or even revoked.

I've seen some properties drop as much as 40%, most around 7-8% and some have even gone up in price!

JimmiesRustled

cd76 wrote: »

Up to you. You should walk away if you are ok with potentially losing it. Time to be brave, but market is crashing so walking away is best option.

What does that even mean? If I lose 30 grand, the market can crash all it likes. I won't be able to afford anything.

JimmiesRustled

Housebuying wrote: »

It's optional for the solicitor to include that in the clause of the contract but its pretty standard now since the housing crash.

Check your contracts. If the bank refuse your mortgage, you may have an optional to pull out of the sale and get your deposit back.

Not in the contract unfortunately. Asked about it prior to signing but was advised that it's standard practice now to not include that clause within the contracts.

Ah well have to wait and see what happens.

Pablo_Flox

JimmiesRustled wrote: »

Not in the contract unfortunately. Asked about it prior to signing but was advised that it's standard practice now to not include that clause within the contracts.

Ah well have to wait and see what happens.

That sounds like poor work from your solicitor, I would be very very annoyed with him / her if he didn't put in a clause regarding it being subject to finance. I'm about to sign contract for my own purchase and my solicitor was very clear about not entertaining any contract without the "Law Society-recommended loan clause".

I hope you get it sorted and can make it a happy ending, but it sounds like they dropped the ball big time.

Pablo_Flox

Pablo_Flox wrote: »

That sounds like poor work from your solicitor, I would be very very annoyed with him / her if he didn't put in a clause regarding it being subject to finance. I'm about to sign contract for my own purchase and my solicitor was very clear about not entertaining any contract without the "Law Society-recommended loan clause".

I hope you get it sorted and can make it a happy ending, but it sounds like they dropped the ball big time.

Same here. Mine told me it was a specifically covid-updated clause to ensure that we wouldn't lose out on our deposit if the bank situation changes last minute.

Currently trying to drawdown from AIB - according to their portal all we need is the house insurance sorted, but then the in-branch adviser called us and said we needed to provide payslips last minute. If they decide they're not satisfied with our payslips (we've both had changes to them since the initial approval), we shouldn't lose our deposit.

Pablo_Flox

Here is a link to an Irish Times article from 2017 saying developers were inserting the clause to anyone that asked... so all your solicitor would of had to do is ask for it to be included. It sounds like armature hour.

If it falls through I would be taking legal advice on options you might have to regain you loss from your solicitor.

Bargain_Hound

In our case, we insisted it to be added to our contract, which it was last minute. So our deposit is safe (hopefully).
If I hadn't of asked, it wouldn't have been in the contract. Crazy that this isn't standard practice to protect the buyer against circumstances out of their control.

Graham

Pablo_Flox wrote: »

Here is a link to an Irish Times article from 2017 saying developers were inserting the clause to anyone that asked

That article refers to one property developer.

There were others that refused the clause.

stayback

I will also add.. if your employer banks with the same bank that you are getting your mortgage from that might have a bearing. They will probably know about the company then you’ll ever know. So asking for an updated payslip could a sign that they know something you don’t.

Pablo_Flox

Bargain_Hound wrote: »

In our case, we insisted it to be added to our contract, which it was last minute. So our deposit is safe (hopefully).
If I hadn't of asked, it wouldn't have been in the contract. Crazy that this isn't standard practice to protect the buyer against circumstances out of their control.

It doesn't instill confidence that your solicitor is looking out for your best interests and protecting you...

fliball123

Bargain_Hound wrote: »

Sorry I probably wasn’t very clear.
My income is worth 80% of our combined income. My income is unaffected and my income in fact has increased slightly since loan offer was issued.
My partners income is currently being supplemented by government subsidy and employer topping up to 100%. We had a letter that stated this and bank accepted this and issued full loan offer 3 weeks back.

Looks like they have since reversed on their decision at drawdown, leaving us high and dry last minute after signing contracts and paying deposit.

Just to verify you should get your full deposit back any deal done in law that is subject to 3rd party participation as in your case the bank, there will always be a get out clause if the third party fails on their end, nothing to do with you or the seller. You should contact your solicitor asap and get your full deposit back

Claw Hammer

fliball123 wrote: »

Just to verify you should get your full deposit back any deal done in law that is subject to 3rd party participation as in your case the bank, there will always be a get out clause if the third party fails on their end,

Where are you getting this from? Is it some law?
The loan clause in conveyancing contracts has to be specially inserted and both parties have to agree. Many vendors, particularly developers won't agree to it. In some cases their funding is subject to having unconditional contracts in place.

witnessmenow

Pablo_Flox wrote: »

That sounds like poor work from your solicitor, I would be very very annoyed with him / her if he didn't put in a clause regarding it being subject to finance. I'm about to sign contract for my own purchase and my solicitor was very clear about not entertaining any contract without the "Law Society-recommended loan clause".

I hope you get it sorted and can make it a happy ending, but it sounds like they dropped the ball big time.

Our solicitor got this added to our contacts back in February, on her own accord. First time she even mentioned it was to say I've already got the vendors to agree to add it. Didn't even cross our minds to be honest. Seems crazy that it wouldn't be standard

Pablo_Flox

witnessmenow wrote: »

Our solicitor got this added to our contacts back in February, on her own accord. First time she even mentioned it was to say I've already got the vendors to agree to add it. Didn't even cross our minds to be honest. Seems crazy that it wouldn't be standard

That is what you pay her for!

dowhatyoulove

JimmiesRustled wrote: »

Not in the contract unfortunately. Asked about it prior to signing but was advised that it's standard practice now to not include that clause within the contracts.

Ah well have to wait and see what happens.

We are in pretty much exactly the same position - our solicitor did ask for it to be added but was turned down by the developer. It happens.

Today should give us a better understanding but it’s still a ridiculous carry on.

Housebuying

JimmiesRustled wrote: »

Not in the contract unfortunately. Asked about it prior to signing but was advised that it's standard practice now to not include that clause within the contracts.

Ah well have to wait and see what happens.

I brought a house recently. My solicitor had this cause and the vendor's solicitor pushed back. Our solicitor told me it was standard practice since the crash. That the vendor's solicitor didn't have a clue. We pushed back and they accepted. We brought the house (currently rented).

Sorry, doesn't help you know but I would be raising this with my solicitor