Is There Anybody Out There ....?

Stigura

Well?





I'd like to talk about Linux, please?

oscarBravo

\o

28064212

Stigura wrote: »

I'd like to talk about Linux, please?

So... go ahead? Although probably better suited to the Unix forum, unless you specifically talking about the open source aspects of it

Stigura

Cool! Yo! Okay, straight in; I'm old. I'm Not the sharpest tool in the box. On 7 and despise 10 (Had it, for a brief time)

Tonight, I said to my ~ similarly challenged ~ mate that, sod it; I was Finally going to look into this " Linux ". It's our last hope

Googled images, hoping to see what it even looks like? All I got was penguins.

" BIOS " is a word I last heard about twenty years ago. " Command Prompt " terrifies me. I just switch my machine on and type annoying nonsense on a couple of fora.

Boom! And, with that, look, 28064212 comes along, talking right over my head I haven't got a clue. Is there any hope for people like me?

I'm seriously wondering how much longer I can stay on line.

Thanks.

28064212

So you're interested in trying Linux? Then yes, the Unix forum is what you want. Linux and Unix don't have exactly the same meaning, but for your purposes, you can consider them to be the same. Ubuntu is one of the most widely-used flavors of Linux, and a good a place as any to start: https://ubuntu.com/download/desktop. Read the "From Windows" guide at the bottom first

Stigura

Right. Okay. Thank you very much!

It gave me palpitations, even just looking at some of that. But, I see I need a 4GB+ USB Stick? Okay. Cool. I probably have far more GB's available on the couple of sticks I'm using to back stuff up as it is. But, I'd just sooner buy a 5GB, dedicated stick for this.

Believe it or not; This weird little machine of mine doesn't even have a Disc Drive! I haven't played a CD or watched a DVD in a year or two!

See? Ye really are dealing with a cave man here But, yeah; Those links look great. Lots of simple info', in small bites. I'll send for a stick, next week. Then get back to all that. Very much obliged. Thanks

Stigura

Whoah!!! Phew! Okay; I've been a very good and busy Stigura. I now have the complete 'Thing' on a third, sacrificial, usb stick :eek:

That'll do, for now!

I'm, literally, so fried now, I'd love nothing more than to hit that button and see what ever it is ye've led me to. I already have this glorious vision of telling a couple of mates of mine; " Come on in! The water's lovely! "

But; I got a new phone, just Thursday. Imagine how That's been tormenting me. Now? I'm about to a Richard Burton, in Exorcist 2! After umpteen pints?!

Couple of pints of tea, once I regain consciousness? I'll be up for some of this!

Wish me luck!

Stigura

Well ..... That was quite the experience!

Fired it up, off my stick? Actually saw the beaver. But, when I clicked on FireFox (My normal browser, happily) nothing happened

I clicked. Double clicked. Clicked left and right. Nuffn.

Found a search bar. Asked it for " Google "? 'No Results'.

Generally dug about, clicking. Nothing happened.

Tried to leave. Couldn't. Ended up getting the following ~ hope this photo doesn't blow the walls out. I haven't down sized it, lest it make it unreadable:

Absolutely couldn't get off there. Tried Escape. Manically tapped every F button. Ended up having to pull the plug on the machine

For disclosure; I can only cite that I appear to have only exactly half the memory it said I need. Can't do much about that, I imagine? Would that have scuppered me?

In conclusion? I Liked what I saw! It didn't scare me at all. And, I'm sure, I could learn my way around it, just like we all learned things like XP, after what ever the one before was.

So, yeah. I'm up for it Just don't want to go slinging 7 off here, till I know I can at least get this beaver thing to work. I want a fighting chance.

Most eager for further input. (Dear god; Eager beaver? I don't believe I just said that! :rolleyes:)

Johnboy1951

What are the hardware specifications of the PC you are using to boot the USB stick?

CPU, memory, graphics?

Stigura

Is This it, Johnboy? Otherwise, let me know where to find any more and I will. Thanks

Stigura

Ah! If it might help ....? Back in 2017, I got a 'back up' machine. Never plugged it in. Been sat on a shelf in my work room ever since. My power tools don't die, out there. I'd hope this machine is still okay? I'd be willing to get it out and feed it this beaver thing.

Details from the amazon order state:

" HP dc7900 Desktop Computer - Powerful Intel Core 2 Duo 3.0GHz E8400 Processor - 160GB HDD - 4GB Memory (RAM) - DVD MultiPlayer - WiFi Enabled - Windows 7 "

Yes. I know; Your phone probably has more power, and is worth more. But, come on lads; I just read a couple of fora and watch Netflix. I need the big screen to see the sub titles. Too deaf now to hear the dialogue.

Johnboy1951

Stigura wrote: »

Ah! If it might help ....? Back in 2017, I got a 'back up' machine. Never plugged it in. Been sat on a shelf in my work room ever since. My power tools don't die, out there. I'd hope this machine is still okay? I'd be willing to get it out and feed it this beaver thing.

Details from the amazon order state:

" HP dc7900 Desktop Computer - Powerful Intel Core 2 Duo 3.0GHz E8400 Processor - 160GB HDD - 4GB Memory (RAM) - DVD MultiPlayer - WiFi Enabled - Windows 7 "

Yes. I know; Your phone probably has more power, and is worth more. But, come on lads; I just read a couple of fora and watch Netflix. I need the big screen to see the sub titles. Too deaf now to hear the dialogue.

In your position I would try that HP ...... although the link fails the info in the link provided indicates it is well capable of running a LiveUSB Linux session. (not saying the Atom is not - but I have never played with one )

There are hundreds of ISOs for distros out there and it can be difficult at times to find the right fit, out of box, for hardware and personal preferences.

Here is a lightweight ISO that should suit that HP well
http://ftp.nluug.nl/pub/os/Linux/distr/pclinuxos/pclinuxos/live-cd/64bit/pclinuxos64-xfce-mini-2019.10.iso

It should work but will have very few applications built in.
There are larger ISOs which will have more applications buit in.
Here is a sample of some of those ISOs from PCLinuxOS
http://ftp.nluug.nl/pub/os/Linux/distr/pclinuxos/pclinuxos/live-cd/64bit/

If one works then try each in turn to see what you like and do not like.

It is all about the investigation and learning

Stigura

Should I take it so that the one I have on the stick has somehow 'corrupted', and I should wipe it and, maybe start again with, say, the one I'm DLing as I type? The one ye show above.

I'm certainly extremely happy with what little I saw. Not scary at all

Ideally, I'd like to find something that works. Then, I'd happily rip 7 straight out of the HP and live the rest of my life on what ever.

Must say, I've Liked 7. Just never had a problem with it. Never any drama. Ten?! Hateful!

Really looking forward to getting one of these ~ not so scary at all, after all ~ systems running

Stigura

Okay. Sorry to be such a PITA ..... I've formatted my stick and DL'd the above thing. I was just sliding it onto the stick when it occurred to me maybe I should click it first?

I clicked it and a box said I didn't have a disc burner I went and got the first 'Free Disc Burner' on google. Installed / opened. It said I didn't have a disc burner, or some such! Slung That in horror!

Now, I have this " iso " on my desk top and haven't got a clue what to do with it.

I am trying, and I'm willing to keep on trying. I Want this. I'm just out of my depth and need some patient direction, please.

Thanks.

Johnboy1951

Stigura wrote: »

Okay. Sorry to be such a PITA ..... I've formatted my stick and DL'd the above thing. I was just sliding it onto the stick when it occurred to me maybe I should click it first?

I clicked it and a box said I didn't have a disc burner I went and got the first 'Free Disc Burner' on google. Installed / opened. It said I didn't have a disc burner, or some such! Slung That in horror!

Now, I have this " iso " on my desk top and haven't got a clue what to do with it.

I am trying, and I'm willing to keep on trying. I Want this. I'm just out of my depth and need some patient direction, please.

Thanks.

You use a USB 'burner' application ...... similar to burning an ISO to DVD, but for flash sticks.

Rufus for Windows would be one such app that I have heard mentioned (I do not use Windows).

There are a few others also and I am unsure which would be best.

So give Rufus a try!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rufus_(software)

This page might help you

https://mintguide.org/tools/317-make-a-bootable-flash-drive-from-an-iso-image-on-linux-mint.html

and another
https://www.poftut.com/how-to-create-bootable-usb-flash-drive-with-rufus-for-any-os-like-ubuntu-windows/

Of course they might only tend to confuse you

Stigura

I got Rufus (God, it was fast!) No idea what to do with it. So, I tried a d&d of the iso. Now, I'm seeing:






Now, in case ye not familiar with 7? The USB icon, lower left seems to be indicating a DL is taking place. It normally greens from left to right as it progresses. Only, it doesn't look like that green's moving

Would drag and drop do anything? Or, what Am I supposed to do, please? Rufus doesn't seem to come with any instructions.

Thanks!

Okay. I'm reading the Second link. My head's bursting. But, I Think it'll explain what I need to know. (I can't breathe)

Johnboy1951

As I said I do not use Win (of any colour) so I have no idea about Win itself or its applications.

From your pic, I would say you possibly need to either plug in the USB stick or if plugged in to select it in the first box.

Stigura

All hell's letting loose here! LMAO! I've had more pop up boxes than I don't know what!

Rufus seems to know what it's doing though. I'm trying to make the best choices of what to click, and it seemed agreeable thus far.

Oh! It's " Copying iso files: 5.7% " now. That sounds good. It'll clearly be a little time though.

" No idea about windows "? Wow! Ye lucky sod! It's long since been my dream to get the hell away from micky. Guess the specter of losing 7 has given me that shove

Johnboy1951

If that works OK for you, you should d/load a few other flavours to try them also ...... maybe while you are playing with the first one

Stigura

81% It's coming! (I don't know what ~ but it is! )

Actually; I have a friend who I've always badgered about getting a machine of his own. Last week though, I was screaming at him; " Don't Get A F***ing Computer!!! Ye'll be saddled with 10! "

I was panicking, not knowing what the hell I was gonna do next. And, here we are! I'm Really looking forward to cracking this.

Best of all though would be getting sufficiently proficient with it that I could tell Tom to get the same thing. Knowing I could tell him to just ring me, if he got stuck. I could have done that, with 7. He'd only have been watching 'films' anyway!


99.9% and, of course, hanging! Tension mounts!

Johnboy1951

99.9% and, of course, hanging! Tension mounts!

That seems to have taken an inordinately long time to create.

Stigura

Okay! It says " Ready "! What do I do? Is there something on my stick now? :eek:


(Yeah! I really Am too thick to own a computer! LMFAO!)

Johnboy1951

Stigura wrote: »

Okay! It says " Ready "! What do I do? Is there something on my stick now? :eek:


(Yeah! I really Am too thick to own a computer! LMFAO!)

If the burn is complete then you reboot your PC, and select to boot from USB device if that is not the first default.

If not there is usually an 'F' key to press to bring up the boot menu, which should show before Win starts up.
Else select to go into the BIOS and change the boot order to boot the USB first.

That should get it going.

Stigura

:eek: O M G!!!!! I'm in somewhere!!! Freaking Me Out! LOL!

Oh! I was about to get a screen grab and show ye the top bar I'm seeing, so ye could tell me where I am? But, I haven't got a clue how to, in here! There's no " Paint " (Cue; Twilight Zone Music!!!)

Ummm ..... I found FireFox ~ I think? And I used that to get here. Then, couldn't remember my password.

Fortunately, I Do remember my Yahoo mailer one. I've got that open now. Got my fresh password for here.

I see pressing the arrow up key, and tapping the '+' doesn't enlarge pages, in here? Nor could I find a way of shrinking the page, trying to get back to my desktop. Weird!

Any idea where I may be, please? I'm seeing nothing which tells me

Johnboy1951

Stigura wrote: »

:eek: O M G!!!!! I'm in somewhere!!! Freaking Me Out! LOL!

Oh! I was about to get a screen grab and show ye the top bar I'm seeing, so ye could tell me where I am? But, I haven't got a clue how to, in here! There's no " Paint " (Cue; Twilight Zone Music!!!)

Ummm ..... I found FireFox ~ I think? And I used that to get here. Then, couldn't remember my password.

Fortunately, I Do remember my Yahoo mailer one. I've got that open now. Got my fresh password for here.

I see pressing the arrow up key, and tapping the '+' doesn't enlarge pages, in here? Nor could I find a way of shrinking the page, trying to get back to my desktop. Weird!

Any idea where I may be, please? I'm seeing nothing which tells me

Sounds like you got the default desktop for that version.
The top bar is similar to the 'normal' bottom bar, just placed up top.
You can move them arourd to suit youtself should you wish.

If this is what you see then that is the default destop


upload image

Hovering the mouse pointer over the icons on the bar should indicate their usage.
The leftmost icon is the menu button.

Any changes you make to that destop will be lost once you reboot it.

EDIT ..... you should see the top right of the Firefox window for the controls ..... roll-up, minimise, max/normalise and kill (x)

This is what it looks like with the panels moved

Stigura

That's the one! Damn, and I was Literally just about to offload a shot from my camera, to show ye!

Now; Must be honest, Johnboy: What ever That was? I didn't like it at all! Yesterday? That beaver thing I ended up on was great! I felt really at home there. This place scared and freaked me.

Most importantly of all though? Again, when I tried to shut down and get out, back to 7? I hit a black screen with a few words, top left. Green " OK ", top right. And I'm Major Tom. Nothing I can do! I seriously don't fancy powering off the machine many times more! :eek:

Thoughts, please? What was That called? What's the beaver one called? How may I get the beaver one, properly?

So many questions, I know But, just Think of the karma ye getting! Plus; Ye training a disciple here. I'll merrily go forth and tell the people! :cool:

Johnboy1951

If you had clicked on "guest" which was the user name when running the live session it would have provided options for logging out, rebooting and shut down etc.

The reason I suggested you grab a few is that people have different preferences and that is the reason there are lots of different versions about.

I suggest you try the MATE version from the link I provided you next ...... same procedure ..... download it and put it on the USB stick and boot it.

It might suit you better.

The of course there are the KDE ones ..... which are probably more comfortable for ex-Windows users.
KDE stands out because it is the most configurable of all ...... some complain about too configurable

I do hope you have saved the ISOs you downloaded, so that you can view them each for longer periods and get some 'feel' for Linux and how it might work for you.


This is the MATE desktop followed by the KDE desktop






As you can see all these are themed similarly, because they are from the same distribution.

There are major differences in how the desktop works and the user interaction, so that is where the user should experience several before they make up their minds.

Hope that helps a bit.

Johnboy1951

If you like the 'retro look' then maybe TDE would suit better

Stigura

Right. Hands up; We'll stop there, for now!

My neck hurts. My eyes hurt. My brain hurts! I'm just Too bloody old for so much stimulus at once.

Seriously though; I need a rest from all this. And, I'm damn sure, You must have better ways to spend ye Sunday. (I suspect I'll be going for a snuggle and a snooze with my favorite cuddle pup shortly, anyway. Very late night. Ridiculously early start. I'm shot to hell!)

Please don't think for a minute I'm saying " Thank you and goodbye. " No way! I'm seriously looking forward to coming over. It's just that I'm yawning like a chasm and my eyes are watering. I need to step away and digest all this.

Let's both relax and do something else. I'll sleep on what I've learned and shall be back, tomorrow, with more focused thoughts

Deeply grateful for ye patience and understanding. I genuinely do believe ye now have me firmly on the road to flipping the big finger at Bill

Thank you!

Johnboy1951

Enjoy the journey ..... it is the journey that counts not the destination

Stigura

G'day, Johnboy!!!

Wow! Mate; What can I say?! I'm totally smitten!

Yesterday, I googled " Linux Beaver ", or some such. Came up with some long and serious review article, from some geeky sounding kid in a magazine, or something?

Anyway, That told me the proper name for the beaver one. And ye man wrote about it, at length. The more I read? The more I was kissing That idea goodbye!

He basically said that it was a good one for Pro Programmers, down to " Hobbyists ". Like: " Nope! Goodbye!!! "

So; I've had some kip and let the old subconscious do its stuff. Got up, this morning, ready to fight on. Found ye links, again. DL'd " Mate ". Went through that " Rufus " thing like an old hand :cool:

Took me two hours, start to finish, to get the ISO, then process it through Rufus. Ye seemed to find that horrific? Dunno. Maybe this little, old machine's just a heap of shhh!

Did the restart thing ~ Like A Boss! ~ Calmly explored MATE. Touched things. Looked into things. Looked For things?! Absolutely Loved it!!!

It was much like having just got windows 11. It'll need a Lot of customising, to what I'm used to. No doubt I'll hit the brick walls that'll send me crying back here. But, over all? Hell, Yeah!!! :cool:

Right; I'll give this a break, now. I have a few questions I jotted down, last night and today. Maybe we can look at those when you're rested yeself? Nothing too deep. MATE would probably soon lead me to answers anyway

I'm absolutely stoked now though! I'm seeing the light! And, Thank You So Much for NOT just saying: " Try it. See what ye think. " :eek: That's what I've had for the last twenty years! Might as well tell a middle aged non swimmer to just jump in the pool and swim!

Right ..... Stigura? STFU!

Johnboy1951

Glad to read you had a good experience

I am not finished though .... which no doubt you will not really like ....... I believe strongly that you should investigate the other desktop environments also, so that you can make decisions based on your preferences, and not on mine or anyone else's.

Be sure to store the ISOs you download, and only delete them as you determine they are definitely not for you.

I think you should try KDE next ...... there is a KDE5 version in some of those links I provided ........ it is even more Windows like than MATE, with a huge number of tweaks you can apply.

After that you might try TDE (I will get you the link wif required) ..... which is a bit less glitzy but very functional and lightweight on resources.

Remember, whatever you do to the Live running session itself will be gone at the next boot, so there is no need to worry about doing damage to what you have downloaded.
Some versions automatically mount the local harddrive (which I dislike intensely) and so you might inadvertently damage some file there if you are not aware of that potential.
Just a 'head's up' is all ..... not a worry once you watch what you are doing

Ask your questions .... will answer if I can

.

Johnboy1951

Here is another to keep you under pressure

This one is lightweight, fast and does not have all the GUI tweaks of some of the others.
It uses Openbox window manager and not KDE, MATE or othe desktop environment.
The menu is brought up by right clicking on the desktop space.

This is themed differently.

Stigura

Ok: KDE5 has just started DLing. As we've seen, it'll take me an hour or more.

During that time, I'll probably have my dinner. Then, I'll embark on my nightly ration of Jameson! What with that, and the stove playing up a little ~ pushing it up to 80F in here! ~ there's every chance I'll be in no state to be playing in systems tonight!

No matter though. I'm completely at ease with what we're doing now. The water is, indeed, lovely

Questions? Yeppers. I actually, now, suspect most of them are redundant by now. I think I found several answers in MATE. I'll check with you though:

1. I'd noted I'd need a 'Paint' thing. I'm a bugger for wanting to crop pictures. But, I'm sure there are free, online facilities to cover my extremely limited needs.

2. Rather more fiendish: Film Editor? Again; I'm a cropper. I only really ever wish to splice clips out, to show as out takes. Again; I'd guess there's something free, on line?

3. Off loading from my camera? As is, I have a twin usb lead. Plug the camera to the machine and the usual box of options comes up. Choose " Open Files " and I soon have a folder of pix I can drag / cp to my desk top.

Does 'Linux' offer this 'plug and play'?

4. Telegram. Don't know if ye've even ever heard of it? It's a Russian answer to the old Yahoo Messenger, basically. I chat to a friend, in Kiwi, on it. Voices, through our mikes and speakers. Be bloody lost, without that!

5. (See 3 & 4, really) My usb mike? Again; Plug and play. But, may one assume All pap gear will just work, as normal?

And that should about wrap it up, for tonight KDE5's quietly doing its thing. I'm relaxed as a wet rag.

I'll be seeing Tom, tomorrow. This time, I'll be saying " Buy a machine! But; Hold fire, as I don't know if they come cheaper without all the windows crap on them! I'll show ye what to do, once we get a 'Linux Engine' fitted :cool:


Now, all that said? One, final thing: Today, in MATE, I sought out the leave options. I studied them. I purposefully selected the " Power Off " ~ or what ever the command for 'Shut down this thing, and the entire machine, so I can power back up in 7' was.

Screen went black. Top left, I got: " Unmounting file systems. INIT No more processes left in this run level. "

Top right, in green: " (OK) ".

Again; Tried everything. Had to hit the machines power button to get out of Dodge.

That needs sorting, before I ever open another. I lost a lap top to a single power cut. I feel I'm pushing it, here :eek:


The Thanks and Gratitude table is now open. Help yeself. All ye want, ye welcome

Johnboy1951

1. I'd noted I'd need a 'Paint' thing. I'm a bugger for wanting to crop pictures. But, I'm sure there are free, online facilities to cover my extremely limited needs.

I would advise, for a long time to come, to not get anything yourself on line. There are facilities built in that are designed to update all that is presently installed and also to list what is available for installation that has been 'packaged' and tested for the distro you are running.
Explanation of that will be a separate topic.

2. Rather more fiendish: Film Editor? Again; I'm a cropper. I only really ever wish to splice clips out, to show as out takes. Again; I'd guess there's something free, on line?

There are a number available, through the process referred to above, from fairly basic to near professional standard.

3. Off loading from my camera? As is, I have a twin usb lead. Plug the camera to the machine and the usual box of options comes up. Choose " Open Files " and I soon have a folder of pix I can drag / cp to my desk top.

Does 'Linux' offer this 'plug and play'?

Plug and Play - definitely. Of course I cannot comment on specific hardware, but you can try with the expectation that it will work.

4. Telegram. Don't know if ye've even ever heard of it? It's a Russian answer to the old Yahoo Messenger, basically. I chat to a friend, in Kiwi, on it. Voices, through our mikes and speakers. Be bloody lost, without that!

I have heard the name mentioned but never seen it.
Again there are a few options .... I use Pidgin for specific test messages, but also use Linphone for audio/video communications as well as messaging. That would be somewhat similar to Skype, except it is open and the participants do not need to be members of any specific 'walled garden' as with Skype.

5. (See 3 & 4, really) My usb mike? Again; Plug and play. But, may one assume All pap gear will just work, as normal?

Again, use in expectation of it working.
Check the audio section in the menu for controls of audio streams and devices.
I find Pulse Audio Volume Control to do a great job.


On the matter of closing down ....... when running live, traditionally it was from optical media (CD/DVD) so the shut down sequence halted after everything was done to allow the media to be extracted safely which would allow an installed on HDD OS to be booted next.
Usually, hitting the Enter key would be what was required at that point.
That would just kill the power, so you did nothing more than this ..... indication is in the message you saw
"No more processes left in this run level."

You are progressing well ..... you cannot grasp everything quickly ..... there is just too much new stuff to absorb.

Get more and more familiar with the live sessions to give yourself some experience and time to discover what is there.
Treasures to be found!

Stigura

Amen!!!

Johnboy1951

Stigura wrote: »

Amen!!!

Do post back on your progress ... and stumbling blocks.
It is a long time since I was in your shoes so probably cannot appreciate the effort required to make progress.

So I would be interested in reports as you get the chance ..... and ask for info if you need it.
The info is free/libre too!

Stigura

Okay ..... I'm rather up to my neck in distraction, just lately. Waiting for things to resolve. Then, once my head's clear? I'm absolutely happy about waving micky goodbye and simply starting to transfer my world to a 'Linux' system

" Mate " absolutely blew me away and convinced me, beyond any doubt, that I'm coming over.

I have TDE and KDE5 in a folder, on this things desk top. Yet to look at them as I'm so relaxed now about my acceptance of conversion. Couldn't find that last one in a DL to stick ISO form though.

Couple of things came to mind, and I jotted them down. Quieter moment, right now, so:

1/ How do I get my final choice onto my HDD, so it becomes my system, please? As in; I fire up my machine and there I am. In my usual Linux.

2/ Tom will be machine shopping, some time. What should we look for, for him? I don't even want him to ever See a micky system ~ especially 10!!!

Can ye buy Linuxed up machines? Or, would it be a case of getting one, like my stand by one, with 7. Then just replacing that with Linux, before Tom gets to play with it?

Thanks

Johnboy1951

1/ When you run the version you wish to install, you will find on the desktop an icon that will take you through the install process.

If you intend to replace Windows then make sure you have all your personal data backed up somewhere outside of the PC you are doing the install on, as this will be wiped completely. Another alternative is you could manually partition your HDD, using something like Gparted or other partitioning tool.

If you wish you can retain Win and also install Linux .... but to do so you will need to reduce the footprint of Win (best done from within Win and reboot it afterwards) so that sufficient space is left over on the HDD for Linux.

2/ It is a long time since I bought a new machine ..... I generally put together desktop machines from parts for my own use.
Laptops and desktops, in general, are produced in large quantities for Win users, and so have the benefit of large production runs. In addition, the producers are generally 'compensated' for all those 'extras' they include ..... those items that are free trials and such to get the user to buy something.
As Linux systems do not have such 'loss leaders' the price is generally higher than the equivalent Win machine.
So, most often people buy a machine with Win on it and just wipe it by installing over it.
Others might have other views on the above, but that is how I see it.


There are updated ISOs released in the past couple of days, including two with Openbox window manager (which I think is the last one you referred to).
One of those is a minimal version with very few applications included and the other with a fairly standard selection of applications.

The minimal version is linked to here:
https://www.pclinuxos.com/forum/index.php/topic,150715.msg1287820.html#msg1287820

The standard sized one is referred in this thread
https://www.pclinuxos.com/forum/index.php/topic,150706.msg1287730.html#msg1287730

The updated other versions are here
http://ftp.nluug.nl/pub/os/Linux/distr/pclinuxos/pclinuxos/live-cd/64bit/
and see here if you would prefer torrents
https://bit.ly/2TlHOSI

All the latest ISOs will have 2019-11 in their names.
The version named 'Darkstar' is a minimal KDE5 version ... there is also the standard KDE5 version of course.

IMO, KDE5 is easier to accept by ex Win users, as it looks somewhat like it ..... and can be made to look like it even more by changing themes, icons and other visual stuff - for those interested in that kind of stuff.

Having said all the above, I must point out that there are hundres of Linux distros, most of them will have several versions available just like the above linked distro, which is PCLinuxOS.
So if for some reason, you have a problem, your first port of call should be to sign up to the forum of the distro in use, and do a search there to see if your problem is known or previously solved.
If not post a question, and someone will be along to try to assist.

This site should be helpful in addition to the forum for PCLinuxOS
http://pclinuxoshelp.com/index.php/Main_Page

Lots more for you to get your teeth into.

Nobody said it would be easy to grasp it all quickly

Worztron

o/

Stigura

Worztron wrote: »

o/

? I googled " o/ " and got a load of stuff about some circus

Johnboy1951

Stigura wrote: »

? I googled " o/ " and got a load of stuff about some circus

What is O/?
O/ is "High five"

https://www.internetslang.com/O_2F-meaning-definition.asp

Stigura

Riiiiight ..... Okaay ... Sorry, I'm just getting more and more disconnected from todays idea of the net.

As ye here, Johnboy; Cheers, yep, I'll be advising Tom to grab a nice, el cheapo, used machine, from Amazon or where ever. To be gutted and loaded with a Linux OS, before he even gets his hands on it.

I'm figuring he / 'we' won't be needing TB's of everything. Because we won't be getting earth mover loads of micky's schit pushed onto our machines on an almost daily basis?

And, on that line of thought? I'm pondering how much gear I'll (We'll / Tom and I) even need from a Linux OS. Ye talk about 'Lite' versions, and so forth? Believe me, Johnboy; These days? I practically get up. Switch on. Glance at a few fora. Then go to Netflix

I won't have anything to do with " Social Media ". So, I now look at a couple of forum pages, then pass my time watching 'flix. How much what ever can that take?

All the stuff ye've shown me seems to have Firefox, by default? Fine. That's all I really use! I'm sure I'll find what ever else ~ MP4 Clipping, what ever, through there.

Tom will find all the stuff he wants to see the same way. I'll want us on the exact same OS too. So he can ring me and say; " How do I? " And I should know how.

As before: I'm Very 'Distracted' right now. But, I hope to sort schit. Then, back to normal, I'll focus on this Linux issue. Now totally un scary, thanks to ye immensely generous and understanding help!

Thanks!

Johnboy1951

The operating system itself is relatively small.
I have been running mine on a 60GB SSD for quite some time.

Of course that does not include all the sh1t one tends to accumulate in the way of music, videos, PDFs and other assorted personal files, which will need their own storage space.
That space if totally dependent on the user.
The SSD really helps the speed of response of the machine.
The personal files could easily go on a second HDD.
IMO, it is a good idea to keep personal files and operating system separated.

For finding applications not already included in the ISOs, you launch Synaptic and use the search function even if you do not know it by name use 'Name and Description' for the search.

Synaptic is probably the most common Linux application management method (there are several others) and it is also used to keep PCLinuxOS updated.
At times there are daily updates, but advise to users is to update the installed system once per week at least.

By 'LightWeight' version, I mean one that does not require large amounts of RAM and high powered CPU.

The more graphically intensive the Desktop Environment is, the more resources it requires to operate fluidly.
Desktop Environments are such as KDE, MATE, Xfce, Enlightenment etc.

I would not consider running any modern operating system on anything with less than
dual core CPU
2GB RAM

4GB ram would be much better, and a higher spec CPU (with hyperthreading) will also make a difference to how it handles various tasks.

So do not rush out and buy something that is unsuited to running a modern operating system such as Windows, or you will not have the best experience, and will only limit what your PC can do.

Yes, there are Linux distros that are miniscule, and they serve a particular purpose.
I use a media centre Linux that is about 250MB in size for example.
It won't do all the other things I expect from my general purpose desktop.
Bear that in mind

Stigura

" ..... how it handles various tasks ..... will only limit what your PC can do. "

What's that mean, please? My machines sole task is to get me in here. And let me watch stuff on Netflix. Am I missing something?


As an aside; Just looked up " SSD ". Wow! Scary! I see they reckon an average HDD's likely to fart and die at three years old?! Blimey! I don't think we'd better go there, just yet, though. I'm a numb nut and this is already a helluva lot for me to take in.

Johnboy1951

Stigura wrote: »

" ..... how it handles various tasks ..... will only limit what your PC can do. "

What's that mean, please? My machines sole task is to get me in here. And let me watch stuff on Netflix. Am I missing something?

Best I can do is give a comparison .....
You need to buy a car to go from A to B
You have a lot of choice with different specifications such as performance, comfort and ancillaries etc etc.

If you are happy tootling along your journey at max 90 Kph then you have no need to buy a performance car.
If you want performance then something else will suffer .... maybe cost of ownership, or extra space or whatever.

YOU choose the vehicle that suits YOUR purpose.

For instance you want to watch Netflix ..... but at what 'level'?
Do you require 720p video, or 1080p video or maybe 4K video?

You must ensure your PC is capable of producing the results YOU desire.
That is YOUR buying decision.

There is no point in buying a PC with a very low end CPU and low RAM and expecting it to perform like a PC with a high end CPU and lots of RAM.

As an aside; Just looked up " SSD ". Wow! Scary! I see they reckon an average HDD's likely to fart and die at three years old?! Blimey! I don't think we'd better go there, just yet, though. I'm a numb nut and this is already a helluva lot for me to take in.

Stigura

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

For instance you want to watch Netflix ..... but at what 'level'?
Do you require 720p video, or 1080p video or maybe 4K video?

Okay. Just been searching about, in Netflix. Can't find anywhere where it gives me any choices

On Liveleak, I have the option of 700+ or 300+. 700 simply isn't happening! On you tube, given the option, 240 is fine by me.

Presently, I'm watching a serial, on flix? It's annoying that ~ and I'm only really noticing it with this one. Others serials have been fine ~ the action will freeze, while the dialogue - even the sub titles - keep going.

Then, it comes back and someone's crossed a room, chattering away. I heard them. But, I was watching their frozen image.

I'm guessing That has something to do with the guts of this machine? Can't see the stand by machine (the guts of which I listed, much earlier) being incredibly better. But, weighing up an annoyance with flix, against hundreds of yo's on a flashy new machine ....?!

Anyway; I'm starkly aware how this could morph into a thread about all sorts of aspects of machines. I don't want that and , I'm pretty sure, you won't. I'm actually busily googling much of what ye talking about, to save asking. Just trying to get my empty head around where we've got to, thus far.

This may sound like a silly question but; I'm taking it ripping 7 out of my stand by machine will free up a lot of the workings. Space and memory, all that. Cool. Just wondering how one then makes it work, to get Linux on there? Or do I install Linux, using 7. Then rip 7 out?

Tell ye what? I Know I'm a lunatic, where computers are concerned. But, I have the better part of a centuries experience with rat catching. Ever need any advice around that sort of thing? I'll type day and night!

Johnboy1951

You should try the live OS on the back up machine.
Notice how it operates and try to do things like connect to Netflix as that seems to be the thing you want that would use most resources.

This may sound like a silly question but; I'm taking it ripping 7 out of my stand by machine will free up a lot of the workings. Space and memory, all that. Cool. Just wondering how one then makes it work, to get Linux on there? Or do I install Linux, using 7. Then rip 7 out?

You do not install one operating system from within another one, so forget that!

Ripping 7 out will only free up HDD space and do nothing else.
You might well need that space .... or maybe not .... depending on the hardware in that backup PC.
7 will not be in play when running the other OS.

To install Linux you run it 'live' as you have done, and use the 'install' icon to start the install process.
You do need to be sure which install option you want, and to have previously backed up any files you do not wish to lose, to a different storage device such as a USB connected HDD.

When running 'live', launch the application called
"Konsole", or "Terminal" (depends on version which name it goes by)
and type in exactly the following command, followed by hitting the Enter key ...

inxi -Fx

You could then log in here and copy/paste the whole lot of text from that ...... this will provide sufficient info about the machine to estimate its capabilities.

(Note: "Konsole" is available from Menu - More Applications)

Have you tried all those applications in the menu?
If not do so ..... you might be surprised what is available there.

edit: You just reminded me of a young lady I knew many decades ago ..... she was known amongst us as 'the rat catchers daughter'
A nice girl, as I recall.

Stigura

Can't even remember what this is for, now? But, I've got it!

Helluva day ahead of me, tomorrow / Wednesday. Won't have a moment to spare. Obviously appreciate then that you guys too have lives. When ye ready / have a moment

Anyone left here though, still feeling charitable enough to nudge me along through this? As I remember it; Don't I plug an HDMI plug into my 'new' machine. Then, plug the other end of the HDMI into This. And then plug this into the back of my screen?

Great fun! Just checked: My HDMI thing fits one end of this. The other end isn't a USB plug, as I'd suspected. Presumably the other sort of HDMI plug then, which'll go into my screen?

Cool! It's starting to make sense now!

I guess, what I'll need next is some idea of what to expect when I finally get both these machines all set up and plugged in

What will I see on my screen? What will I do about it? Any links for stuff for me to look at, please ~ save you guys time and trouble?

Talk about: " All the gear ~ No idea! "

Thanks!

Johnboy1951

With the two plugged in to the one screen you generally select the screen menu and choose from there which input to use.

In that manner you can change from one to the other machine while both are running.

Stigura

Aahhll Bee Bachh!!!