DCM 2019 Graduates: the rest of your life that happens after the marathon

Treviso

Worst run was a 17m long run the day after I PB'd a 5k race. It was part of the P&D plan to run this following a race. I was delighted to do the 5k in 19.24 but was brought back to earth the following day. Legs felt wrecked from the start of the long run and it was an enormous slog to get through it, even had to miss the last half mile. It was the first run in the dark after the clock changes so that didn't help either.

Thinking back it did help me prepare mentally for DCM, even though I didn't feel anyway like that during the marathon itself!

The OH also did the marathon so guess we need to spoil the kids a bit more. Got them loads of present from a trip to the US last week so that's a start

passinginterest

Worst run?

There’s been a few. I’ve a dodgy enough tummy so there’s been some fairly horrific toilet related incidents.

Worst overall though is without a doubt the Athlone 3/4 marathon in 2014. I’ve mentioned it before, but i has been in Romania on a work thing in the days leading up to it. My foot pain had flared up for the first time on the way home and I’d developed a dodgy tummy. I planned to run with the 3.40 marathon pacers. I couldn’t eat in the morning, I was wrecked, my foot was sore, I should have just pulled out. I didn’t. I didn’t even have the sense to change my pace plans.

Went with the pacers and was relatively ok for 14 very hilly miles. Then the elastic started to stretch and somewhere around the 15 mile mark I lost them. I couldn’t stomach gels so wasn’t taking on fuel and I just slammed into the wall. That Athlone course was very quiet and isolated so I was very quickly alone and struggling to jog. Had a few stop starts and made to about 18 miles relatively ok. The I couldn’t even jog. I couldn’t really think. I was debating how long it would take someone to come and rescue me if I just lay down in the ditch. I couldn’t imagine getting to the end at all. I was just about moving forwards. Around the 19 mile point someone noticed I was obviously in a pretty bad way and started chatting to me and got me moving a bit. With his encouragement I managed to get to the finish. I look like death (while stopping my watch of course) in the pic of me crossing the line. My wife had come along with me because she was worried that morning that I wasn’t feeling 100%. Was so glad she did, she had to help me back into the hotel and I managed to just about nibble a few bits and drink some lucozade. She eventually had to help me on the longest walk ever back to the car. It was only once we got nearly back to Dublin that I started coming around.

Not an experience I’d ever want to repeat. I’d also told my wife I was probably dead if I didn’t get back under 3 hours (expecting to be well under). Needless to say she was extremely worried when the race clock had tipped past 3hrs (although to be fair my official time was 2.59.21!). I don’t joke about the possibility of dying on runs anymore!!!

Just back from a trip to Rome so the treat is sorted.

roosterman71

Q. What’s the worst run you’ve ever done?
Training run of 32k last year. Got to 25k and fell apart. Walked/jogged/walked/stretched. Contemplated stepping in front of traffic to end it all. 1k from home, my watch died. I was even more distraught then

akenno

Worst run I have ever done?

Luckily I don't have too many to choose from but a few come to mind. The worst one I had was a run in summer 2018. It was during the real hot weather. I left it late in the evening to go for the run as it was too warm. My stubbornness got the better of me and instead of letting the run go I took off. I felt ok for the first couple of km, then I started to have stomach cramps. I lasted for another km or 2 and had to ring my wife to pick me up and bring me back home. Needless to say my late evening runs have not been repeated.

eabha19

Worst runs: I have had a few tummy issues in the past, seemed to be triggered by long runs on hot days and especially in the evenings after eating during the day. Have had nettle stings everywhere from ducking into ditches and mooning at cows!! TMI alert!! Thankfully I had none of that for DCM training but it's always a bit of a worry. My worst race was the rock n roll half when I died a death in the phoenix park. I remember seeing a man lying at the side of the road being treated for a leg injury and almost crying wishing I could just lie beside him. It was a PB in the end but I took no joy in it whatsoever!

Will have to think of some way to thank the OH now but he'll have to wait til pay day!!

Fraggle07

Thanks Singer for taking this on. Looking forward to the months ahead!

Worst run: was out for a late evening run under street lights last year and on mile 12 tripped over a loose pavement stone. I had to walk home balling crying (with the pain) and with blood dripping from my face. I gave my poor husband some shock when I walked in!! Ended up spending the night in A&E waiting to be seen. I had broken my hand and had to have chin stitched.

As a treat we headed away for a post marathon family break at Halloween.

Karlos80

Sorry I'm so late to the party. Cheers Singer, great job already and good question. I haven't got back running yet as still in recovery mode, letting both achilles heal (no pun intended) fully before I start again. Hoping I'm not back to square one when I do get back, as it may take 6 to 12 weeks. Even then I'll be building back up very slowly, so races and plans are still up in the air for me. 2020 will just be a couple of 10k and 10m races at the minute. As for your question Singer, worst run? It involved a training run, dodgy tummy, speeding up, and not being fast enough in the end. Enough said.

Charliebull

Worst run was half marathon in 2015, all kids had been sick at various stages the week before, oh got the bug on the Thursday before, I woke up Saturday morning feeling fine but at mile 6 I was far from fine, I’ll never forget that feeling of getting sick while running, had to be rescued ,

Charliebull

Tried the 45 mins easy yesterday, ran it at the suggested slower pace, enjoyed the run, nice to be back out there, trying to stick to slower pace was hard at first, thighs a bit stiff
Not sure if I will get all runs in this week as kids have the bug doing the rounds hence the mad hour posting , hope to get 4 in

marathon19

Feeling like it's time to return to roads. Had a post marathon chest infection the last week so I will start slower than I wanted. Still coughing but no chest pain.

Tomorrow I'm going to try 2 mile, then a 5k on Saturday,

I've 60 miles to my 1000 mile for the year so more than likely just tap away at that for the next 3 weeks

Once I have that boxed off I will start some easy 5k and 10k programs to keep me busy till end of spring. Nothing too hard

Did a 5k in 21.29 a few years ago so want to beat that and would like a 45 to 47 minute 10k by early summer.

Singer

Hallo graduates!

It's been a little quiet around here... I hope you've been too busy running and making plans to be nice to the people who supported you

Any exciting running plans for the weekend? The legs should be mostly recovered from the marathon by now, it might be a good time to think about doing something fast. I was going to have a proper go at a parkrun this weekend, but it looks like life is getting in the way so I'll probably just do a session at some stage on Saturday

Charliebull

our house was something akin to a doctors surgery this week with one child after another getting sick, so the plans went out the window

got 2 easy 45min runs and a lunchtime spinning class in, legs feel like i have been dragging 2 concrete blocks around after 7 a side soccer last night

think ill just wait till monday now to start plan

Treviso

After 2 weeks of no running after DCM (away with work last week), I'm trying to build up the mileage again. I've three runs done already this week (5,7,5) so plan to do something longer this weekend. Might do 10 miles on the Sunday and see if I can do it as a bit of a progress run.

All going well, I might hit my plan fully next week. Would it be ok to go from 27 miles this week to 40 miles next week, seeing as I should still have the fitness built up from DCM?

Singer

Treviso wrote: »

After 2 weeks of no running after DCM (away with work last week), I'm trying to build up the mileage again. I've three runs done already this week (5,7,5) so plan to do something longer this weekend. Might do 10 miles on the Sunday and see if I can do it as a bit of a progress run.

All going well, I might hit my plan fully next week. Would it be ok to go from 27 miles this week to 40 miles next week, seeing as I should still have the fitness built up from DCM?

That sounds quite sensible! 2 weeks off is prescribed by lots of people including the author of the plan that I mostly followed for DCM this year. I of course completely ignored this. As long as you're feeling good (which you should be!) then that's a perfectly fine step up in milage. Don't feel like you have to push too hard while you're getting back into things though, getting time on feet and back into regular running is all you need to do initially.

Laineyfrecks

Happy to be back doing some regular runs this week. 45mins easy mon, weds & just back now! Was extremely cold & dark:eek: but i enjoyed it! I'm gonna head out for a 90min easy run in the morning & hopefully run more regularly next week with some sessions
I did some strides after my run on Wednesday & absolutely loved them! God how much i have missed speed

marathon19

Since the marathon I've done a 2k at about 10 min/mile and a 2 mile at about 9.30 min per mile so nothing of note.

I was happy to take your advice singer; went out this morning to shake the cobwebs of especially with it being such nice weather

Planned on a 5k to see how much I could push it.
Slow first k but steady after
5.51
4.57
4.58
4.57
4.56

Then a warm at 6.30

Hard going but that's my starting point

Happy days

DeepBlue

Singer wrote: »

1. Do you have any goals over the next few months? What are they and why?

2. What would you like to get out of this thread?

I'm a bit late to the party but hope to kick off the 6 week base plan next week. I've only pulled on the running shoes twice since DCM.

What's my goal?
19.59 or less for the 5K. It will take a bit of work but I hope to hit it by March/April next year (assuming I do the proper training). I had to put this target aside this year while training for DCM.

What would I like to get out of the thread?
Hopefully I'd pick up enough knowledge as to why I need to do something training related instead of just knowing I need to do it because it's expected to work. If, along the way, I learned enough to tweak plans for my needs and benefit rather than just following them rigidly even if they don't suit then I'd think I'd have gotten an awful lot out of this thread.

I've a 4 mile road race entered for next weekend, a 5K road race on St Stephen's Day, an IMRA night time half marathon in early January (my introduction to trail running and perhaps a bit mad to do this).
All the training and events have to allow for about 400KM of cycling a month so if I could figure out how to marry both together that would be a real bonus.

Oh, and I'm sure to ask a few stupid questions along the way.

My first stupid question is why is there a need to do a six week base plan if we're after coming off the bones of 5 months marathon training?

The Black Oil

DeepBlue wrote: »

My first stupid question is why is there a need to do a six week base plan if we're after coming off the bones of 5 months marathon training?

Marathon's in the rear view mirror. Base plan lays the ground work for what's next. Probably something about aerobic base - I stand to be corrected.

Unknownability

HI all, first time posting here but have read the whole thread I lost my login details and kept putting off reseting.

Thanks to singer for taking this on.

Since the marathon I haven't done too much running but have been busy enough preparing for the next challenge.

Running wise I've done maybe 20/30 miles mainly made up of refereeing, one 8 mile run out around poolbeg which was stunning and one intense session which culminated in a 1k time trail which I did in 3.28 which strava tells me is a PB.

The Wednesday after the marathon I finally went to see a physio therapist to look at my hamstring, 4mths after initially complained I can't believe I left it that long. Another benefit of the beginners thread was I could pinpoint when it happened. It's responding well to me the recovery program I'm on, in particular the continuous dull ache is gone.

I also ordered the book advanced marathoning, which has been mentioned a few times. I will most likely use this as the basis for a training plan for the next marathon which will be most likely Berlin, Chicago or New York. If its Chicago or New York I may also do Edinburgh first.

I'm in NY next weekend so will put off going back to a structured plan until I return but I do hope to run the last 10 miles of the marathon while there.

It's been great seeing on Strava and Reading here that people are back out running it's certainly given me the push I needed to get out the door once or twice.

skyblue46

The Black Oil wrote: »

Marathon's in the rear view mirror. Base plan lays the ground work for what's next. Probably something about aerobic base - I stand to be corrected.

Yes it is to prepare for what's ahead. It slowly reintroduces some faster running into the legs. It prevents people jumping into pace work off what should have been a very relaxed 3 weeks. The aerobic base should be there for most after DCM but you really can never have too much aerobic capacity. One marathon training block doesn't get you there!

Singer

skyblue46 wrote: »

Yes it is to prepare for what's ahead. It slowly reintroduces some faster running into the legs. It prevents people jumping into pace work off what should have been a very relaxed 3 weeks. The aerobic base should be there for most after DCM but you really can never have too much aerobic capacity. One marathon training block doesn't get you there!

Most running plans will begin with a base phase anyway, it's just more explicit in this set of plans and reusable across multiple distances.

Singer

Ok grads, this week is the first week of the rest of your lives... sorry, I'm still trying to sound all motivational and stuff, not sure it's working.
By now you may or may not have figured out what's next for you and getting back into structured training. If you haven't done this yet, start it now! The prescribed plan as mentioned on the first post is as good a place to start as any.

By the sounds of it we might have had a bit of running go on this week, so do update us all with how things went

Question of the week: What’s your bucket list race? Is there any race in the world that you'd particularly love to do before you hang up your running boots? Maybe it's the Boston Marathon, or the speedy Armagh 5k? What about the incredible London Marathon, cheesy DisneyWorld Marathon or challenging Comrades Marathon? Or maybe it's just to make it out to Rivervalley parkrun and tackle the famous hill twice!

Challenge of the week: Another non-running one - read a book about running. Well, maybe that's a bit too ambitious. How about get a book about running, and start it? Bonus points for writing a book report here

There's been some great threads over the years on boards with suggestions about books about running, this one has plenty of great suggestions:
https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin//showthread.php?t=2056326122

Why read about running? Well, it's something we're all somewhat committed to, and getting an insight into other experiences can help you grow and improve as a runner, obviously more so mentally than physically but that's most of the battle really. There's plenty of great books out there. You could go with Murakami's classic and sound pseudo-intellectual when you casually drop your fave Japanese author into conversation, or go all in as a science nerd with Magness's Science of Running, or maybe just get some insight into why Sonia O'Sullivan is such a legend by reading her biography. If you're already a fiend for books about running, then post some recommendations in the thread!

py

Singer wrote: »

Question of the week: What’s your bucket list race? Is there any race in the world that you'd particularly love to do before you hang up your running boots? Maybe it's the Boston Marathon, or the speedy Armagh 5k? What about the incredible London Marathon, cheesy DisneyWorld Marathon or challenging Comrades Marathon? Or maybe it's just to make it out to Rivervalley parkrun and tackle the famous hill twice!

I'd like to go back to where it all began for Pheidippides and run the Athens marathon. I think the Spartathlon is probably out of reach for me :pac:

Singer wrote: »

Challenge of the week: Another non-running one - read a book about running. Well, maybe that's a bit too ambitious. How about get a book about running, and start it? Bonus points for writing a book report here

There's been some great threads over the years on boards with suggestions about books about running, this one has plenty of great suggestions:
https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin//showthread.php?t=2056326122

Murakami's book was worth the read. Finally picked up Born to Run so looking forward to getting stuck in to that. Phil Knight's book on the origins of Nike was pretty interesting (though recent controversies may put you off it). Vassos' (of Parkrun podcast fame) books are worth a read too, have been inspiring for me anyway. This is another thread (have requested it be merged) which I've put a few recommendations in before.

passinginterest

Not sure I have a bucket list run now. Just running a marathon was the bucket list!

As for running books. I read 'What I talk about when I talk about running' years ago. It's a lovely read, pretty sure it's at home somewhere so I might give it a reread.

Recently finished 80/20 running, and if you need any assurance about the slow down and make the easy runs really easy it's all there. Nothing too heavy, sets out the ideas and the principles really clearly. Worth a read.

KSU

DeepBlue wrote: »

My first stupid question is why is there a need to do a six week base plan if we're after coming off the bones of 5 months marathon training?

The Black Oil wrote: »

Marathon's in the rear view mirror. Base plan lays the ground work for what's next. Probably something about aerobic base - I stand to be corrected.

Sadly base is something you can't get away from and even though there are plenty of miles ran in marathon block the fact is that very few of us are fully aerobically developed.

It takes years and years of heavy mileage to do so most runners do a base phase coming off the back of any break. The one here is designed to prep you for the demands going forward. jumping straight into specific phase is a shock to the system and one that not too many bodies tend to like and increases the risk of injury etc. It also acts as a perfect time to practice the little things.

- Running with good mechanics
- a bit of light turnover work to improve form and turn people into gazelles floating through the air
- make sure that the body has a chance to absorb all the previous training
- build in good habits around running.

With a half step back it allows people to take massive leaps forward long term, in my experience there can be a tendency to jump from plan to plan with a consistent mentality of pushing forward full speed that ultimately leads people to plateau somewhat or get into a vicious cycle or injury/recovery.

That other benefit is that this allows people who might not be coming off marathon to build up enough to join in on the plan as it brings everyone to the appropriate base level.

Doc76

Bucket list race? I’d love to try Marathon du Medoc someday where you drink wine along the course... not sure it would be a PB race but sounds intriguing and I, too, would love to do the Athens Marathon. It’s one of my favourite spots to visit and of course where it all began

Running book? I have the Murakami book so will try to crack it open someday soon. On a lower brow note, I also would love to see the movie Brittany Runs a Marathon.

I’m still following Hal Higdons post marathon recovery program but do you think I should switch over to the grads plan now? I feel fine and totally recovered from marathon just getting over a nasty cough/cold.

KSU

Doc76 wrote: »

Bucket list race? I’d love to try Marathon du Medoc someday where you drink wine along the course... not sure it would be a PB race but sounds intriguing and I, too, would love to do the Athens Marathon. It’s one of my favourite spots to visit and of course where it all began

Running book? I have the Murakami book so will try to crack it open someday soon. On a lower brow note, I also would love to see the movie Brittany Runs a Marathon.

I’m still following Hal Higdons post marathon recovery program but do you think I should switch over to the grads plan now? I feel fine and totally recovered from marathon just getting over a nasty cough/cold.

At this stage no harm in switching your body should be over the acute stage of recovery and the training load is light in base phase so as long as you keep things easy on the easy days should be no issues.

Doc76

KSU wrote: »

At this stage no harm in switching your body should be over the acute stage of recovery and the training load is light in base phase so as long as you keep things easy on the easy days should be no issues.

Thanks and a refresher about strides (I didn’t include them in my marathon training per se)... would sprinting for 1 minute and recovering for 2 minutes be about right if the stride is meant to be 100m? Or is it more like 30 seconds sprint and recover for 60 seconds? I’m not around a track usually! Thanks

KSU

Doc76 wrote: »

Thanks and a refresher about strides (I didn’t include them in my marathon training per se)... would sprinting for 1 minute and recovering for 2 minutes be about right if the stride is meant to be 100m? Or is it more like 30 seconds sprint and recover for 60 seconds? I’m not around a track usually! Thanks

Would be roughly 20 seconds with 1-2 min. These should never feel hard you should just feel smooth with good form.

Doc76

KSU wrote: »

Would be roughly 20 seconds with 1-2 min. These should never feel hard you should just feel smooth with good form.

Thanks so much and also for putting the plan together itself.