Help Help - ATM Fraud - Ripped off 6000 euros

vsonigara

Dear Members,
I recently landed in Dublin 20 days back for employment. I had opened an account and got advance credited from my employer to pay for my house. The bank had sent my ATM card and PIN into my given address. Unfortunately I never received the card and the PIN. Someone (either from my building or the postman or someone else) managed to collect both and then withdrew ~6000 euros from my account over last 9-10 days (700 each day from various ATMs across the city).
I happen to just my statement online and have now blocked by card.

I have called up the bank and they mentioned that they will open up a Fraud case for investigation. It only been 20 days for me being in Ireland. I did not even see my debit card and I have lost ~6K euros. I am also complaining to Garda about the same.

What are the chances that I will get my money back upon investigation by bank?

Regards
VS

Henry Ford III

Proof is the issue here. How can they be satisfied a 3rd party used your card?

Gooser14

Perhaps CCTV images from the ATMs where the funds were withdrawn.

Atlantic Dawn

What could be problematic is this happened over 10 days on a new bank account, there would be an expectation you would log in to check any strange transactions on your account while awaiting the card.

limnam

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

What could be problematic is this happened over 10 days on a new bank account, there would be an expectation you would log in to check any strange transactions on your account while awaiting the card.

You open an account.

You're awaiting your card

You spend the time waiting checking to see if you're been robbed?

Who does this.

vsonigara

I last logged in on 22nd and then on 31st (when I blocked my card). Unfortunately all the transactions happened between these days.

Infernal Racket

Once you report it to the guards you will get your money back. Cctv will show the culprit buy you could be waiting a while...

vsonigara

limnam wrote: »

You open an account.

You're awaiting your card

You spend the time waiting checking to see if you're been robbed?

Who does this.

Well I just landed in this country 20 days back. The bank said it takes 10 working days for card to arrive. If you in a new country I did not expect to be robbed this way. The bank never sent any card or PiN by registered post.
I not easy to know the system in a new country.

_Brian

What way is your address set up that someone can intercept your post so easily ?

vsonigara

The post box is well within the main door. The postman would not have put the letter in the post box. He may have simply kept it on top of all post boxes. Also, it could be the postman himself who can be mischievous.
I dont have an answer to this. However all I can say is that I checked it everyday morning 7:30 am and evening 5:30 pm and there was nothing I could see. Whoever did it knew the letter contained the PIN and after a few days the card would come.

jelutong

Your comment of the postman being mischievous is bizarre to say the least.

_Brian

jelutong wrote: »

Your comment of the postman being mischievous is bizarre to say the least.

I would agree with that.
The least likely option.

_Brian

CCTV of the atm will tell the story now.

It would be very unlikely that the postman would leave post lying around if there is a postbox there to use. And less likely that the postman is involved in this theft, not impossible but unlikely.

afkasurfjunkie

Also, don’t the card and pin be sent on separate days too decrease the likelihood of the above happening?

Johnny Sausage

call me sceptical but this may be a wind up

Living Off The Splash

Everybody knows you get your card, then you get your PIN. What is to stop anyone keeping watch out for the PIN after they have taken your card. It's not as if the card is disguised/hidden in any way when the bank posts it out. They might as well write "card enclosed" on the envelope.

Maybe card or PIN should be collected from your bank?

vsonigara

I agree on all of the above and I am not not blaming anyone outright. However reality for me is that things have happened and someone has played the mischief.
As I said it was a shocker for me in a new country. I had taken that advance from my company to pay for rent and deposit for my new house since my wife and 2 small kids are coming over next week.
I have raised this with bank's fraud team. They said they will investigate.
I have raised with Garda. They said they will investigate.
At this stage I stay helpless and dejected and just want to know what all options can I have to get my money back

GBX

Surely if your employer was advancing money, you would have checked online banking to see if the funds were there and transferred this money to your landlord electronically - no atm card needed? As you would have limits on withdraw amounts per 24 hours via ATM. Something not right with this.

GBX

Not sure of the time frame of getting accounts set up bank depending I suppose. Do banks set accounts up for people with no previous billing address in country - only here for 20 days? Surely there is fraud protection standards that would not allow for this. More to this or the OP is telling porkies. I'm going with the latter.

vsonigara

I had all the references from my employer and hence the bank account was opened in 3 days of my landing. I landed in Ireland on 7th and had an account opened on 10th. Banks did that and I am sure that found all my documents in place and hence opened the account.

vsonigara

Thats correct. The limit is 700 per day. The fraud happened over few days as mentioned above

Jim2007

limnam wrote: »

You open an account.

You're awaiting your card

You spend the time waiting checking to see if you're been robbed?

Who does this.

Ridiculous, you are making way to many assumptions with absolutely no justification for them.

It's the end of the month, the OP logged on to his account (probably like most people to check if they've been paid) and noticed the issue.

Jim2007

vsonigara wrote: »

Dear Members,
What are the chances that I will get my money back upon investigation by bank?

Very high, the banks know this is a weak point in their system, but it is cheaper to just pay off people who suffer a loss as a result. Probably in a few weeks you'll be asked to sign some kind of legal document and your account will be credit with the missing amount.

mlem123

GBX wrote: »

Surely if your employer was advancing money, you would have checked online banking to see if the funds were there and transferred this money to your landlord electronically - no atm card needed? As you would have limits on withdraw amounts per 24 hours via ATM. Something not right with this.

Even so, he would've still needed an ATM to live life in Ireland? I don't see how you find it strange for someone to get an ATM card after they open up a new account..

GerardKeating

GBX wrote: »

Surely if your employer was advancing money, you would have checked online banking to see if the funds were there and transferred this money to your landlord electronically - no atm card needed? As you would have limits on withdraw amounts per 24 hours via ATM. Something not right with this.

Actually if the OP was with AIB, they would need the ATM card and card reader to set up new benificaries with online banking...

GBX

Nothing wrong with needing an atm card. But if this money was needed to pay for accommodation, as the OP has said, I'd assume this would need to be paid beforehand and they wouldn't necessarily be going back and forth withdrawing this cash with an atm card as the daily limit would delay things - transferring of this money to the LL would be logical. I have some scepticism about it all.

pointywalnut

Hi Op

A similar thing happened to me in mid 1980's, after an investigation by the garda, the bank refunded the withdrawals.

FionnB

jelutong wrote: »

Your comment of the postman being mischievous is bizarre to say the least.

Don't find this bizarre at all. Several postmen have been jailed for stealing post, both here and in the UK so I would guess it happens quite a lot!

maxsmum

I'm sure that CCTV will sort this out easily, in the meantime, is anyone else loving the word mischief in this thread?

km79

maxsmum wrote: »

I'm sure that CCTV will sort this out easily, in the meantime, is anyone else loving the word mischief in this thread?

Yes
I think it’s the mischievous postman myself
He would have gotten away with it too if it wasn’t for those pesky kids

dave1982

maxsmum wrote: »

I'm sure that CCTV will sort this out easily, in the meantime, is anyone else loving the word mischief in this thread?

Yeah this whole thread is mischievous

Dawido

very weak security system form the bank.. simple anti-fraud measure would be requirement to first activate your card by phone message conformation... what bank is this?

Wheety

The rush to declare everything BS is one of the worst things about this site these days.

What is unbelievable about this story?

OP, you should get your money back but they'll have to investigate first.

GBX

Perhaps. But do you believe everything on the internet these days?
Anyway, if its legit, I hope the OP gets their money back.

billybonkers

I don't think you will get the answer here OP that you are looking for.

Speaking with the bank/Garda is the best option.

Call them everyday to check in

Del2005

Gooser14 wrote: »

Perhaps CCTV images from the ATMs where the funds were withdrawn.

Very easy to give the card you claim you never received to a friend.

inforfun

Dawido wrote: »

very weak security system form the bank.. simple anti-fraud measure would be requirement to first activate your card by phone message conformation... what bank is this?

Calculated risk from the bank.

What is cheaper?
Reimburse someone every once in a while when something like this happen of have enough branches open long enough to have people pick up their pincodes in person with id?

padyjoe

If it had been me, known that a big sum coming into my account and my life depends on it, I'd be checking that account every hour. Knowing that the card is on the way, I'd check when the postman is at my address and keep watching it. I'd be on fire for sure.

Questions:
1. The card and pin arrives within 10 working days but each one on a different one, it takes 9 days to withdraw 6k from the account with a limit being 6-700 a day. Sitting calm for those days without checking takes a very patient person.
2. If the money is intended for rent why not the company transfers the amount to the landlord? (Maybe this one could be argued on.) Ok, company money into account, @rse on fire due to rent and family coming, one would go straight to the bank to get cash or make the transfer in the branch to the landlord, why would want you sit around for a card?

These are my twocents though.

afkasurfjunkie

vsonigara wrote: »

The post box is well within the main door. The postman would not have put the letter in the post box. He may have simply kept it on top of all post boxes. Also, it could be the postman himself who can be mischievous.
I dont have an answer to this. However all I can say is that I checked it everyday morning 7:30 am and evening 5:30 pm and there was nothing I could see. Whoever did it knew the letter contained the PIN and after a few days the card would come.

Why wouldn’t the postman put your post in the intended post box? If everyone’s post is being left on top of the postboxes I’d be complaining about that fairly sharpish.

Wheety

GBX wrote: »

Perhaps. But do you believe everything on the internet these days?
Anyway, if its legit, I hope the OP gets their money back.

Not everything. But there's nothing outrageous about this. I've heard of it happening before. I would have been checking my account if I hadn't received my card but if i was new to the country and it was a new account I wouldn't be sure of postage times so would probably just be more trusting.

The bank's system should perhaps have flagged €700 a day (the max allowed) being withdrawn every day as a red flag.

_Brian

Del2005 wrote: »

Very easy to give the card you claim you never received to a friend.

Ok so I’m not the only one that thought of that.

caff

afkasurfjunkie wrote: »

Why wouldn’t the postman put your post in the intended post box? If everyone’s post is being left on top of the postboxes I’d be complaining about that fairly sharpish.

Having lived in apartments it happens, the post boxes get stuffed full of junk mail so the post gets left on top. Also some post boxes are easy enough to reach into and grab letter with your fingers.

ForestFire

Del2005 wrote: »

Very easy to give the card you claim you never received to a friend.

_Brian wrote: »

Ok so I’m not the only one that thought of that.

Okay but I pretty sure if/when your friend is caught they are going to put 2 and 2 together and you would both end up in more serious trouble, as it was a planned deliberate attempt to rob the bank and then knowingly to defraud the bank for the refunds.

Del2005

ForestFire wrote: »

Okay but I pretty sure if/when your friend is caught they are going to put 2 and 2 together and you would both end up in more serious trouble, as it was a planned deliberate attempt to rob the bank and then knowingly to defraud the bank for the refunds.

Most criminals aren't the smartest people.

silver2020

Del2005 wrote: »

Most criminals aren't the smartest people.

Most posters with strange stories aren't too smart either.

Initially poster says he landed here 20 days ago, then says 7th Oct is when he went to the bank.
Moot point, but 2 days difference.

Bank will absolutely insist on something official with your current address on it. Did the OP get this on the morning of arriving here finding an apartment and getting an official document with his name and address on it?

Claims account open, pin number sent and card arrived all in 3 days. That is as likely as me winning the lotto without buying a ticket.

Says €6k taken out over 9-10 days. New account, maximum daily withdrawal all within a few days? Even with banks the way they are, this raises an automatic red flag immediately.

Could the OP not have used his bank account from where he has come from - unless from some unregulated country, all bank cards work here and no issues making transfers.

Then look at how the poster writes.

Certain words are added quite purposely to throw you off, but grammar, punctuation, spelling and style all suggest a native paddy

and finally... despite not being from here (yeah right), losing 6k (yeah right), the poster posts here BEFORE going to the gardai! (yeah right!)

Codswallop I suggest. Total codswallop.


(yep, its my first posts, can't remember my previous login as its been months since I was on boards due to working outside of the country - where I used my Irish bank account at all times and never needed a local account for anything)

Mezzotint

If you've had that kind of serious fraud on your account you need to immediately make a report to the Gardai (Police) as well as the bank.

That's a lot more than a minor issue and should be followed up with proper investigation, not just the bank's fraud department.

Atlantic Dawn

limnam wrote: »

You open an account.

You're awaiting your card

You spend the time waiting checking to see if you're been robbed?

Who does this.

It takes circa 2 minutes or less to log in to your bank account online and check the balance, it was not as if he had to take a flight to Monaco to make an appointment with the bank.

_Brian

So how was op managing for day to day cash with no card and not logging on to transfer money etc ?

vsonigara

Guys it would really help if comments or suggestions are made on what options do I have now
Just FYI - both Garda and bank are investigating the issue. It has been reported to both as soon as I had detected.

Everyone has the right to have an opinion, but at this juncture I would appreciate genuine help rather than considering my post as not genuine.

silver2020

vsonigara wrote: »

Guys it would really help if comments or suggestions are made on what options do I have now
Just FYI - both Garda and bank are investigating the issue. It has been reported to both as soon as I had detected.

Everyone has the right to have an opinion, but at this juncture I would appreciate genuine help rather than considering my post as not genuine.

your timelines are simply unbelievable as is the fact you went on boards before going to the gardai.
So, sorry, you story is simply unbelievable. there is no bank that can do all the checks, get the regulatory required information, process the account, get a pin number to you and get a card to you all within 3 days.

ZERO chance, Hence codswallop.

vsonigara

Not loosing my time and energy to defend myself mate.
All the best and I genuinely pray that you never have such a situation if your life.