Galway traffic

31-03-2021 7:48pm

zell12 wrote: »

September 2023?

It should come together quickly enough, tricky bit will be keeping the roads open throughout the works. They've been doing groundworks and loading the centre of the roundabout for over a year now.

02-04-2021 6:14pm

https://twitter.com/GalwayCycling/status/1377558516811108354?s=20

05-04-2021 2:32am

The Journal have done a deep dive into the proposed ring road https://www.thejournal.ie/dead-end-n6-ring-road-5397513-Apr2021/

Bobeagleburger · 05-04-2021 8:02am

I think some sort of road is needed to divert traffic away from the city.

I also need they should really try to minimise traffic in the city centre. Add a charge to enter the city by vehicle. Exemptions if you've a disability. Parking outside the city, and either bus in (on dedicated bus corridors), walk or cycle. Could help people lose some weight too and benefit their health.

Galway is a beautiful city and it could be enhanced with some proper planning.

05-04-2021 9:44am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

The Journal have done a deep dive into the proposed ring road https://www.thejournal.ie/dead-end-n6-ring-road-5397513-Apr2021/

Good article. Didn't realise the decision was coming up this month! Its going to be a contentious one either way.

Arup's responses seem very strained - they've been tasked to evaluate the demand and admittedly found that through traffic or by-passable traffic is “not the major component of the problem”. Yet they also have huge invested interest to design the ring road so also having to defend that. There should have been an independent assessment of all options and projected future impacts.

Mrs OBumble · 05-04-2021 9:54am

6 wrote: »

I think some sort of road is needed to divert traffic away from the city.

I also need they should really try to minimise traffic in the city centre. Add a charge to enter the city by vehicle. Exemptions if you've a disability. Parking outside the city, and either bus in (on dedicated bus corridors), walk or cycle. Could help people lose some weight too and benefit their health.

What's your definition of "city centre"?

05-04-2021 11:27am

The Galway Advertiser has an article too - future dated for this Thursday, may have been released early since the Journal published theirs;

https://www.advertiser.ie/galway/article/120768/commuters-business-and-environmentally-friendly-transport-modes-will-benefit-from-the-ring-road-says-larkin

06-04-2021 11:12am

Can’t stand the fact that this isn’t being discussed as an access for Connemara as well as city road. No one is talking to towns downstream-Moycullen, Oughterard, An Spideal. It’s chicken and egg. There’s no traffic from there because there’s o one set up there. There’s no one set up there because there’s no access!

zell12 · 06-04-2021 11:42am

Deleted User wrote: »

Can’t stand the fact that this isn’t being discussed as an access for Connemara as well as city road. No one is talking to towns downstream-Moycullen, Oughterard, An Spideal. It’s chicken and egg. There’s no traffic from there because there’s o one set up there. There’s no one set up there because there’s no access!

It is mainly to allow city traffic, also to 'open up land for development' along route, as Leo Varadkar let slip a few years ago

06-04-2021 12:06pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Can’t stand the fact that this isn’t being discussed as an access for Connemara as well as city road. No one is talking to towns downstream-Moycullen, Oughterard, An Spideal. It’s chicken and egg. There’s no traffic from there because there’s o one set up there. There’s no one set up there because there’s no access!

What you're talking about is increased future traffic through Galway City due to the new road; induced demand. I don't think they'd want to use that as a selling point...

what_traffic · 06-04-2021 12:31pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Can’t stand the fact that this isn’t being discussed as an access for Connemara as well as city road. No one is talking to towns downstream-Moycullen, Oughterard, An Spideal. It’s chicken and egg. There’s no traffic from there because there’s o one set up there. There’s no one set up there because there’s no access!

This just does not stand up at all, Moycullen is getting a "bypass" as there is so much car traffic going through it. (Same should have be done for Claregalway a few decades ago) There is lot of car traffic from those towns and hinterland going into Galway City - the vast majority are going to Galway City though not beyond it. ARUP stats show this clearly

serfboard · 06-04-2021 4:11pm

what_traffic wrote: »

This just does not stand up at all, Moycullen is getting a "bypass" as there is so much car traffic going through it ... There is lot of car traffic from those towns and hinterland going into Galway City - the vast majority are going to Galway City though not beyond it.

The thing is though, it depends what you mean by into the City. People who work in NUIG, for instance, are sorted with a massive private Park n' Ride in Dangan.

However, if you have to cross the river, there is (effectively) only one bridge. What public transport option is being planned for anyone living in Moycullen and working in Mervue/Parkmore/Ballybrit? Bus to the city centre, and second bus to the east side? Are there plans for Bus Lanes on Newcastle Road or the Thomas Hynes Road? (Genuinely asking) Any further out, (for example from Bushy Park inwards) and buses will have to mix with regular traffic, reducing the attractiveness of that option.

what_traffic · 06-04-2021 4:59pm

serfboard wrote: »

What public transport option is being planned for anyone living in Moycullen and working in Mervue/Parkmore/Ballybrit? Bus to the city centre, and second bus to the east side? Are there plans for Bus Lanes on Newcastle Road or the Thomas Hynes Road? (Genuinely asking) Any further out, (for example from Bushy Park inwards) and buses will have to mix with regular traffic, reducing the attractiveness of that option.

The points you raise are important for all the towns near the Galway City area.
No major plans that I am aware of for the Thomas Hynes Road.

06-04-2021 6:07pm

Deleted User wrote: »

What you're talking about is increased future traffic through Galway City due to the new road; induced demand. I don't think they'd want to use that as a selling point...

“Induced demand” is to infrastructure what Andrew Wakefield is to vaccine science. False equivalence.

If we’re on about stopping demand, let’s Stop Demand. Put a population cap in place, licence car ownership, tighten immigration laws up so that it’s exceptionally difficult to enter the “protected” place as a newcomer. (None of these things I’m advocating BTW.)

If we need to stop demand, we need to Stop Growth.

06-04-2021 6:20pm

Deleted User wrote: »

“Induced demand” is to infrastructure what Andrew Wakefield is to vaccine science. False equivalence.

If we’re on about stopping demand, let’s Stop Demand. Put a population cap in place, licence car ownership, tighten immigration laws up so that it’s exceptionally difficult to enter the “protected” place as a newcomer. (None of these things I’m advocating BTW.)

If we need to stop demand, we need to Stop Growth.

Your extremist policies aside, no need to be so reactionary about it lol

Just invert the priority of modes of transport so that private cars are given the lowest priority rather than the highest and anything is achievable. Thankfully this has already happened within the CC with the GTS

We will see this gaining further traction with the GTS review and updating, the release by the Dept of Transport of the updated National Cycle Policy Framework and their Sustainable Mobility Policy Framework. Both of which will need to be adhered to by any council expecting funding from the Dept.

Its been said time and time again on this thread, but it needs to be repeated every now and again......Galways roads are already at capacity already and its population is planned to grow by 50% by 2040. If you want these people to be able to move around the city, regards of origin or destination, you need to prioritise pedestrians, bikes & buses in that order. After that comes logistics and taxis and finally comes private car access.

There is no other logical option that withstands serious scrutiny

06-04-2021 6:23pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Your extremist policies aside, no need to be so reactionary about it lol

Just invert the priority of modes of transport so that private cars are given the lowest priority rather than the highest and anything is achievable. Thankfully this has already happened within the CC with the GTS

We will see this gaining further traction with the GTS review and updating, the release by the Dept of Transport of the updated National Cycle Policy Framework and their Sustainable Mobility Policy Framework. Both of which will need to be adhered to by any council expecting funding from the Dept.

Its been said time and time again on this thread, but it needs to be repeated every now and again......Galways roads are already at capacity already and its population is planned to grow by 50% by 2040. If you want these people to be able to move around the city, regards of origin or destination, you need to prioritise pedestrians, bikes & buses in that order. After that comes logistics and taxis and finally comes private car access.

There is no other logical option that withstands serious scrutiny

tl;dr

If the road goes in, I can build my home, my family & my business in Connemara.

If it does not, I can’t, and will probably emigrate to Canada.

Greenest thing I can do is not pollute Galway city with my partner and children’s upkeep.

biko · 06-04-2021 6:40pm

Bicker removed.
Don't make me get the wooden spoon.

06-04-2021 6:53pm

Deleted User wrote: »

tl;dr

If the road goes in, I can build my home, my family & my business in Connemara.

If it does not, I can’t, and will probably emigrate to Canada.

Greenest thing I can do is not pollute Galway city with my partner and children’s upkeep.

Seeing as our "bickering" has been removed, allow me to try again considering our PM's too

I understand why you want the ring road, and it may well get approved this month....or it may not. The only certainty I will point to is regardless of what the ABP ruling is, it will be appealed leading to additional years added on to the time frame. Keep in mind the previous road got shot down in 2013 and its taken 8 years just to get to this point.

Absolute best case that I can see, is this road finally gets approved some time around 2027, with it finally opening 2034/2035. I may be wrong, but I really don't think so based on the previous stab they had at this. Thats also my guess at the absolute best case as the courts are seriously backed up due to covid.

I have no idea what your proposed business is, but if its reliant on the ring road being built to start it, then that adds a large amount of uncertainty to it

06-04-2021 7:10pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Seeing as our "bickering" has been removed, allow me to try again considering our PM's too

I understand why you want the ring road, and it may well get approved this month....or it may not. The only certainty I will point to is regardless of what the ABP ruling is, it will be appealed leading to additional years added on to the time frame. Keep in mind the previous road got shot down in 2013 and its taken 8 years just to get to this point.

Absolute best case that I can see, is this road finally gets approved some time around 2027, with it finally opening 2034/2035. I may be wrong, but I really don't think so based on the previous stab they had at this. Thats also my guess at the absolute best case as the courts are seriously backed up due to covid.

I have no idea what your proposed business is, but if its reliant on the ring road being built to start it, then that adds a large amount of uncertainty to it

Fact is, anything that involves manufacturing is kiboshed by the lack of freight transport options, and towns need at least one such business to allow those with that skillset to become prt of the community. I wish the focus was on disincentivising car usage on good roads rather than using roads as the disincentiviser.

Anyways, I’ve said mine. If I can, then I will, if I can’t, then I won’t. And my guess is I’m not the only one.

06-04-2021 7:34pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

“Induced demand” is to infrastructure what Andrew Wakefield is to vaccine science. False equivalence.

If we’re on about stopping demand, let’s Stop Demand. Put a population cap in place, licence car ownership, tighten immigration laws up so that it’s exceptionally difficult to enter the “protected” place as a newcomer. (None of these things I’m advocating BTW.)

If we need to stop demand, we need to Stop Growth.

We can't just keep increasing road space linearly with population growth. What's the next step once you and others fill up the new road and it ends up in gridlock?

06-04-2021 8:03pm

Deleted User wrote: »

We can't just keep increasing road space linearly with population growth. What's the next step once you and others fill up the new road and it ends up in gridlock?

I’m taking it, because we’re effectively there. Move away. Cap population. Greenest thing I can do is move from where there’s no space to where there’s space.

06-04-2021 8:25pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I’m taking it, because we’re effectively there. Move away. Cap population. Greenest thing I can do is move from where there’s no space to where there’s space.

I'm not asking the next step for you, the next step for Galway? What do we do after we build this additional road space and it becomes gridlocked? What then for those that moved to Furbo/Spiddal and work in Parkmore (a short commute before the road filled)? Move them all to Canada?

06-04-2021 8:41pm

Deleted User wrote: »

I'm not asking the next step for you, the next step for Galway? What do we do after we build this additional road space and it becomes gridlocked? What then for those that moved to Furbo/Spiddal and work in Parkmore (a short commute before the road filled)? Move them all to Canada?

Yes. But where they move isn’t Galway’s problem. As long as they get out of a place that does not want them.

06-04-2021 8:47pm

Why do you think Galway wouldn't want them??

You deny induced demand and you're pushing for additional road space to keep meeting demand. So I'm wondering what happens when we follow that approach and run out of options for more roads across or around the city?

06-04-2021 8:59pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Why do you think Galway wouldn't want them??

You deny induced demand and you're pushing for additional road space to keep meeting demand. So I'm wondering what happens when we follow that approach and run out of options for more roads across or around the city?

Not interested in your false assumption that I’m car-exclusive, that roads are car only, and that access drives demand. Induced Demand is Andrew Wakefield science applied to infrastructure planning, it’s an insistence on The Chicken or The Egg driving chicken production, when it’s a complicated both.

If demand is the problem, then reduce demand. If you welcome demand, provide for it.

Whatever, I want to start a manuafacturer someday. I can f*ck off somewhere else with my trucks, electric or not. There’s no space for them.

06-04-2021 9:11pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

If demand is the problem, then reduce demand. If you welcome demand, provide for it.

People are welcome! We can't keep providing more roads and more bridges over the Corrib. The growth of a city shouldn't be limited by it's ability to provide surface area for the movement and storage of vehicles.

Anyway, you're avoiding questions with silly Andrew Wakefield references and not offering solutions so no point discussing further. All the best in Canada.

06-04-2021 9:23pm

Deleted User wrote: »

People are welcome! We can't keep providing more roads and more bridges over the Corrib.

Slum landlords would *love* to cram 30 people into a room, but if there’s no beds, and no food in the fridge, then no one’s coming.

Landlords would *love* to fill west Galway with people, but if they can’t get there, they’ll go somewhere else.

Also- if more people meant more votes for roads, would they *really* be welcome?

Think about it.
-The anti-road crowd wins out
-Galway grows despite that
-More people move into places without adequate access
-These people feel the pressure of a crumbling infrastructure network (it ain’t getting any younger y’know)
-Some tragedy, say, of hospital access or a road accident brings it to a head, or a clamour of microaggressions on thousands of people does the same thing
Some upandcoming politico latches on to this issue and Everyone Wants A Road as far as he’s concerned.

Are you *really* welcoming pro-road voters?

06-04-2021 9:45pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Are you *really* welcoming pro-road voters?

You're still not answering what happens next.

Say they build the new road, more people build homes and businesses out beyond the new road infrastructure and are dependent on that road for access. Their commute gets slower and takes longer until the road fills.

What next?
Real question so real answer please, not crying about not being wanted. Anyone bridge and another ring road? Where? And when that fills?

06-04-2021 9:51pm

Deleted User wrote: »

You're still not answering what happens next.

Say they build the new road, more people build homes and businesses out beyond the new road infrastructure and are dependent on that road for access. Their commute gets slower and takes longer until the road fills.

What next?
Real question so real answer please, not crying about not being wanted. Anyone bridge and another ring road? Where? And when that fills?

Real answer-stop people moving in. By your standards, you’re full. No more space.

06-04-2021 9:59pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Real answer-stop people moving in. By your standards, you’re full. No more space.

So exhaust all available space with roads then Galway is done?

Certainly not by my standards, I think we should be aiming to accommodate for the movement of much more people than private cars can be accommodated for on our current roads or finite space for future roads.

Those living and working in and around the city should be able to get around quicker and easier on public transport, freeing up road space for those passing through. We should be focused on that as the top priority as the alternative is to drive Galway towards closure, as you say.

Galway traffic

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