Ireland Team Talk XI: Team of nervoUS MOD warning Post 1

Mr Tickle

aloooof wrote: »

Can you name even one player who has transitioned from midfield to back-row when ~26 years of age and became an international regular?

Not to engage but didn't that really dim english fella do it a couple of years ago? or did he go the other way? he was a rugby league convert i think. He didn't last long but Eddie Jones gave it a go.

Edit: Sam Burges i think....

kingofthekong

Cork29 wrote: »

I have said it before and i will say it again time to get our best athletes on the pitch.

Stuart McCloskey
Born: August 6, 1992 (age 27 years),
Height: 1.93 m
Weight: 111 kg

Chris Farrell
Born: March 16, 1993 (age 26 years), Belfast, United Kingdom
Height: 1.91 m
Weight: 110 kg

These 2 above players should be switched to the back row. Simple

Jaysus

Mr Tickle

kingofthekong wrote: »

Jaysus

Jesus
Height: 5 feet 5 inches (1.65 m)
Weight: 65kg.

At best a scrum half. His distribution alone (see loaves and fishes) make him a <ahem> nailed-on starter

Dubinusa

It's a pity the Cullen and Lancaster didn't get the job. Those lads certainly would uproot the team. I often hear the word "consistancy" and "continuity". This was the mantra of Schmidt. But, to continue with the same style of play and the same core of players reeks of a continuation of the same. Not knocking Farrell. He's done enough to ease my mind with this selection, but I think we'll see the same drivel against Scotland as we saw the past year. I think the squad will be similar and maybe the game plan similar, so I think no lessons will have been learned.
What's needed, imo , is a complete structural change to the drivel we saw last year. I think Leo and Stu would do a better job implementing change. We will beat Scotland, but Wales will be a tough tilt. Learning on the fly would be advantageous for guys like Doris , JOD and Deegan.
I would select one of them to start at least one of the first 2 matches. The opportunity is here for the taking. I hope Farrell seizes it.

mfceiling

Cork29 wrote: »

Can you name a country that has not won a knockout world cup match?

Liechtenstein?

kilns

Dubinusa wrote: »

It's a pity the Cullen and Lancaster didn't get the job. Those lads certainly would uproot the team. I often hear the word "consistancy" and "continuity". This was the mantra of Schmidt. But, to continue with the same style of play and the same core of players reeks of a continuation of the same. Not knocking Farrell. He's done enough to ease my mind with this selection, but I think we'll see the same drivel against Scotland as we saw the past year. I think the squad will be similar and maybe the game plan similar, so I think no lessons will have been learned.
What's needed, imo , is a complete structural change to the drivel we saw last year. I think Leo and Stu would do a better job implementing change. We will beat Scotland, but Wales will be a tough tilt. Learning on the fly would be advantageous for guys like Doris , JOD and Deegan.
I would select one of them to start at least one of the first 2 matches. The opportunity is here for the taking. I hope Farrell seizes it.

He will live or die by his style of play. If Ireland continue to play the same way then the public will turn on him quickly

errlloyd

aloooof wrote: »

Can you name even one player who has transitioned from midfield to back-row when ~26 years of age and became an international regular?

I dunno about international regulars but obviously Basteraud has played all his Top14 rugby this year in the Backrow. Levani Botia has spent much of his professional career as a backrower in La Rochelle, but plays Centre for Fiji (ROG has him played Centre too).

mfceiling

Cork29 wrote: »

I am not sure on Liechtenstein let me google it and get back to you.

I know for sure Ireland has not so to be safe you can use that, till i confirm Liechtenstein.

Thanks.

Dubinusa

The selection is fine. Despite the controversy around Ruddock and McCloskey. Our focus should be to get the younger lads into the matchday 23.
That said, the main problem will be if Farrell learns nothing from the dependency on Sexton and Murray. It's probably a blessing that Sexton may not start the 1st game. Burns or Byrne getting the nod will be a huge confidence booster for them. It's up to them to then stake a claim.
Cooney has been so far ahead of every other 9. It would be difficult to not see him start. If he gets the nod, I feel we're going to see a different type of play. Uptempo with the backs getting a lot of ball.
Aki v Henshaw is a tough call. If they sit Ringrose , I would be shocked. Neither Aki or Henshaw is as good as him. I reckon Aki will shade it.
Ringrose is due a new contract! Obviously he should get a central contract. I can see him getting a big payday. He certainly deserves it.
Marty Moore must be sick. It must be a bitter pill to swallow.

aloooof

Cork29 wrote: »

Can you name a country that has not won a knockout world cup match?

Presumably all countries that have won a world cup knock-out make are filled to the rafters with midfielders playing in the back-row? #Logic.

aloooof

Mr Tickle wrote: »

Not to engage but didn't that really dim english fella do it a couple of years ago? or did he go the other way? he was a rugby league convert i think. He didn't last long but Eddie Jones gave it a go.

Edit: Sam Burges i think....

Aye, it was Sam Burgess who converted from a league forward to a union centre, but it was under Lancaster at the 2015 RWC. Burgess turned into a bit of a scapegoat for their pool stage exit (the worst performance ever of any host nation), it was generally panned as a terrible decision.

It does happen, but it's few and far between, and the success stories are even more scarce. There's a reason for that.

Bazzo

aloooof wrote: »

Aye, it was Sam Burgess who converted from a league forward to a union centre, but it was under Lancaster at the 2015 RWC. Burgess turned into a bit of a scapegoat for their pool stage exit (the worst performance ever of any host nation), it was generally panned as a terrible decision.

It does happen, but it's few and far between, and the success stories are even more scarce. There's a reason for that.

Burgess was also playing flanker for Bath(?) at the time so he was really given **** all chance of making it as a centre for England.

Yeah_Right

Overall I have to say I'm pretty happy with that squad. I would have made a few different selections (because obviously I know a lot more about rugby than Andy Farrell). Moore over O'Toole, Ruddock over POM, McLoskey over Farrell and JGP over Murray. ****. Just noticed that I want to drop 3 Munster players and I'm a Munster fan

Ruddock is an interesting case. If I remember correctly, he burst on to the scene being called up to the senior team while in the U20s. Over the next 10 years, 3 different coaches have given him a handful of caps. There must be something wrong that we're not seeing.

McCloskey is similar. Despite his club form, he hasn't been able to convince 2 coaching teams that he is worth more than a couple of caps.

Yeah_Right

Cork29 wrote: »

Brad Thorn google him, how did he manage to play in the forwards?

Sorry but what has Brad Thorn got to do with your argument??

Podge_irl

Ah ruddock got called up as an U20 cause the U20s were in the jwc somewhere semi near by I think. Don’t think it was because of any stand out performances. He did alright once called up from what I recall.

AbusesToilets

Podge_irl wrote: »

Ah ruddock got called up as an U20 cause the U20s were in the jwc somewhere semi near by I think. Don’t think it was because of any stand out performances. He did alright once called up from what I recall.

He's been a captain at every level he's played at. Wasn't he MoM on his debut against SA, at 7 I might add. Always been a quality player.

AdamD

Podge_irl wrote: »

Ah ruddock got called up as an U20 cause the U20s were in the jwc somewhere semi near by I think. Don’t think it was because of any stand out performances. He did alright once called up from what I recall.

Ruddock played for the u20s two years in a row, what are you on about?

swiwi_

After glancing through the last few pages, it seems to me the forum needs a team we can all agree on. What I like to call a "unifying" selection. So without further ado

1 Tom Court
2 Richardt Strauss
3 Stephen Archer
4 Leo Cullen ©
5 Tadgh Beirne
6 Peter O'Mahony
7 Jack O'Donoghue
8 Jamie Heaslip
9 Tomas O'Leary
10 Ian Madigan
11 Simon Zebo
12 JJ O'Halloran
13 Keith Earls
14 Dave Kearney
15 Tiernan O'Halloran

prawnsambo

swiwi_ wrote: »

After glancing through the last few pages, it seems to me the forum needs a team we can all agree on. What I like to call a "unifying" selection. So without further ado

1 Tom Court
2 Richardt Strauss
3 Stephen Archer
4 Leo Cullen ©
5 Tadgh Beirne
6 Peter O'Mahony
7 Jack O'Donoghue
8 Jamie Heaslip
9 Tomas O'Leary
10 Ian Madigan
11 Simon Zebo
12 JJ O'Halloran
13 Keith Earls
14 Dave Kearney
15 Tiernan O'Halloran

Almost got there.


And you forgot John Hayes.

aloooof

prawnsambo wrote: »

Almost got there.


And you forgot John Hayes.

A centre playing in the back-row wouldn’t have went astray, either

VayNiice

Pogue eile wrote: »

Ironic post of the year already perhaps?

Hmm apart from not making any sense, it's a bit sad to be digging back into someone's post history.

Dog Botherer

Little late to the discussion but Richie Vernon converted from back row to centre when he was 25 and an established Scottish international.

sydthebeat

Dog Botherer wrote: »

Little late to the discussion but Richie Vernon converted from back row to centre when he was 25 and an established Scottish international.

The claim is players making the conversion the other way

Pogue eile

VayNiice wrote: »

Hmm apart from not making any sense, it's a bit sad to be digging back into someone's post history.

Didn't have to dig too far, your obsession with POM is more than a bit sad

Podge_irl

AdamD wrote: »

Ruddock played for the u20s two years in a row, what are you on about?

Ruddock's first senior cap came when he was called up to the Aus tour but it was mostly just cause he was playing in the U20 championship at the time. He didn't get capped again for 4 years. His first cap wasn't a James Ryan-esque situation, it was just based off geography and timing.

lawrencesummers

The over reaction to POM being selected over the last few pages is embarrassing.

If Ruddock was playing well enough he may have gotten in ahead of players like Jack OD or others.

POM had a great game against racing, there are aspects of his game that are far beyond every other forward in Ireland, and far beyond what ruddock is capable of, his weaknesses are mitigated by the managements game plan to have him outside the wingers in attack, he has plenty of pace and good hands and ensures quick possession when recycling out wide.

Maybe he doesn’t make the team, and maybe he does, but that’s a decision based on striking a balance between what he brings and what he doesn’t and it means the strengths and weaknesses of other players have to be taken into account.

Look at it this way, can Ireland include POM in their team meaning one less dominant ball carrying forward, ie. are there enough other carriers?

OR

If we don’t have POM then what other players offer a defensive lineout capability, and before anyone suggests Toner his defensive lineout work is poor.

Selection is all about balance, so people shouldn’t look at any players inclusion in isolation.

VayNiice

Pogue eile wrote: »

Didn't have to dig too far, your obsession with POM is more than a bit sad

Yeah 4 posts about POM in the past 3 months is a real obsession alright. You do realise it's the rugby forum? Are you digging through everyone's posting history or was my one post a week particularly interesting?