Replay: All Ireland SFC Final Dublin v Kerry Saturday 14/09/2019 @ 6pm

The_Honeybadger

Well folks. As this match will hopefully take on a life of its own I thought I’d start a fresh thread.

Common view seems to be that Kerry poked the bear in the first game and their chance is gone. I hope that is not the case but fear it may be.

What changes do ye see on either side? I think Kerry will make at least one change but they got most things right the first day and just didn’t execute as they would have wished. They will need to do something with McCaffery at the very least.

Dublin still strong favourites with the bookies and after a good look at Kerry they will be feeling confident I’d imagine.

Mod Edit: Couldn't be bothered writing another mod note. Suffice to say, same rules apply to this thread as the last one here.

Poor_old_gill

Let me just start by saying that, in advance of the match, the ref has robbed one of the teams.

That is all.

Dr. Bre

Up the dubs

Slattsy

I only see one winner here.

giveitholly

Slattsy wrote: »

I only see one winner here.

In fairness only one team can win!!!

Slattsy

Someone put up the McBain gif.

Ta.

Chalk McHugh

I predicted Dublin by two in the drawn game. Always gaveKerry a good chance and i'm even more worried for the replay so i'll give Dublin the nod by one point with no nails left to bite as they wont be grown back since last Sunday so might get cracking on the toes.

Bonniedog

I'd say it might be a bit of an anti climax.


Probably give ticket away and bring the dogs rat hunting.

kala85

Think Dublin will win by 6 at least or maybe more. Back to normal service again with 15 vs 15.

Dublin management will be prepared this time.

Any chance the OP could put up a poll?

The_Honeybadger

kala85 wrote: »

Think Dublin will win by 6 at least or maybe more. Back to normal service again with 15 vs 15.

Dublin management will be prepared this time.

Any chance the OP could put up a poll?

Good idea, poll added

Fr Tod Umptious

The_Honeybadger wrote: »

Good idea, poll added

No Draw option in the poll ?

The_Honeybadger

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

No Draw option in the poll ?

Thought there was ET this time?

Edit: I thought there had to be a winner on the day but it looks like another replay after ET if they finish level, as unlikely as that is. My mistake. I can’t edit poll now but perhaps a Mod can?

RiseToMe

Do folk reckon that there will be tickets to be had outside the ground on the day? Haven't had the chance to go to many matches at all this season with an 18 month old and newborn at home but I'd chance cashing in my brownie points and heading in to see if I could pick something up

jr86

Probably be similar enough to 2015 (hopefully not weather wise!). Dublin always in control but only win by a few in the end. i'd doubt it'll be a full on tanking, but you'd never know either

The last day was Mayo/Dublin in 2016 all over again - a gigantic missed chance for Kerry. The positive thing is they'll be in plenty more finals in the coming years to redeem themselves but this one is too early for me

The_Honeybadger

RiseToMe wrote: »

Do folk reckon that there will be tickets to be had outside the ground on the day? Haven't had the chance to go to many matches at all this season with an 18 month old and newborn at home but I'd chance cashing in my brownie points and heading in to see if I could pick something up

I’d be surprised if there wasn’t plenty of tickets floating around on the day. There is no minor match and the 6pm throw in means a lot of the Kerry day trippers won’t travel.

Bonniedog

Kerry and Dublin clubs will get something like an extra 10,000 between them. Number of neutrals and overseas will be way down on last week,

Mr. Incognito

Kerry take their first half goal chances this time.

Kerry by 5

C__MC

Its imperative Kerry take the goal chances
Dublin no matter what the opposition are cough up chances, this cannot be denied. Even this year the rossies opened them up a few times. We cant be suprised by Kerry's two ten minute spells last week, Dublin gave this to teams.

What Kerry did really well was curb the midfield sector and block space for mannion and con. Very shrewd. Kickouts also very good. They will need this again but I really think Dublin will click. A few changes will help. I'm expecting it to be tight but the full 15 to see off Kerry by 3,5 points

kala85

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

No Draw option in the poll ?

Could you put up a poll on what the winning margin will be I wonder.

That's what I was thinking.

kala85

The_Honeybadger wrote: »

I’d be surprised if there wasn’t plenty of tickets floating around on the day. There is no minor match and the 6pm throw in means a lot of the Kerry day trippers won’t travel.

Will all the extra tickets be taken by the dubs.

I didn't expect as much demand for the first day. Was there many tickets floating around after on the first day.

I think there will be more demand from neutrals for this one since the first game was so tight but the 6pm throw in makes it difficult to travel to and get home from.

Also sometimes people can only afford one day out so they might not travel the second day.

Sometimes replays don't live up to the first game. Difficult to know but I think Dublin with 15nvs 15 will be a different game completely.


The contrast for me is if kerry only had 14 for a full second half, Dublin would have walloped them

Forge83

There’s a massive assumption that the replay will be 15 v 15 and Dublin will win easily.
Dublin have had a red card in the last 3 finals, 2017,2018 and 2019. This logically would mean a higher than normal chance of another in the replay.
You can be sure that Kerry will put pressure on Cooper and Small again to draw cards. The Dublin defense has cracks in it that will be exploited in the replay. Kerry missed 2-2 in the first half, they won’t do that again if they are given the chances.

sallins13

funny how Dublin have a great displinary record bar finals. 3 finals in a row a player sent off. Seems from the outisde like a plan but despite this they are going for 5 in a row. Hopefully next Saturday the ref wont have his anyone but Dublin glasses on and the game will be fair to both with the best team winning

Bonniedog

Any team that is geared up to leave it on the field for a final runs the risk of lads not seeing it out. Dublin teams have always played like that. Even when not great/

Bonniedog

you think that's what he will be remembered for? Really....


BTW, Freud had a whole category for people like you who are obsessed with other people's defecatory habits/

The_Honeybadger

sallins13 wrote: »

funny how Dublin have a great displinary record bar finals. 3 finals in a row a player sent off. Seems from the outisde like a plan but despite this they are going for 5 in a row. Hopefully next Saturday the ref wont have his anyone but Dublin glasses on and the game will be fair to both with the best team winning

Are you saying that there has been a conspiracy to dethrone Dublin? I can’t remember any of those red cards being particularly controversial.

Dr. Bre

better not be another up for the match ! Awful tv

castletownman

sallins13 wrote: »

funny how Dublin have a great displinary record bar finals. 3 finals in a row a player sent off. Seems from the outisde like a plan but despite this they are going for 5 in a row. Hopefully next Saturday the ref wont have his anyone but Dublin glasses on and the game will be fair to both with the best team winning

It's strange. In the history of All-Ireland finals, there has been 21 red cards dished out. Seven have been to Dublin, which is 33% of all red cards. Kerry have had four, Meath three.

It's the first time in history there has been three straight years of dismissals too- twice has there been back-to-back years of red cards (Charlie Nelligan in 1978, Paidi O'Se in 1979 and Charlie Redmond in 1995, Liam McHale and Colm Coyle in 1996).

Record breakers in more ways than one

awaywithyou

Tomas o Se reckons Kerry for Sam..... while we do have grounds for optimism in Kerry i think we need to realise that we played against 14 for 40mins and didnt even have a shot on goal in last 12 mins when we should b dominant given that the Dubs had a player less and should have been out on there feet....

blinding

If the Dubs don’t get away with the persistent fouling then Kerry obviously have a chance . If the Dubs get away with their persistent fouling then Kerry have no chance . It takes a strong referee to stand up against the Dubs .

Fr Tod Umptious

Forge83 wrote: »

There’s a massive assumption that the replay will be 15 v 15 and Dublin will win easily.
Dublin have had a red card in the last 3 finals, 2017,2018 and 2019. This logically would mean a higher than normal chance of another in the replay.
You can be sure that Kerry will put pressure on Cooper and Small again to draw cards. The Dublin defense has cracks in it that will be exploited in the replay. Kerry missed 2-2 in the first half, they won’t do that again if they are given the chances.

But will they not ?

Going back to the dontfould preview article of the first match the stats was brought up that Kerry's "inside" shooting percentage is 59% (0 – 23 from 39) in the games sampled.

This is much lower than Dublin's "inside" shooting percentage of 74%

Now you would need to read the whole article for more context, but on the face of it Kerry have not been converting the goal chances that they have been making and thus to suggest that they will not leave 2-2 behind them again is not necessarily the case.

corny

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

But will they not ?

Going back to the dontfould preview article of the first match the stats was brought up that Kerry's "inside" shooting percentage is 59% (0 – 23 from 39) in the games sampled.

This is much lower than Dublin's "inside" shooting percentage of 74%

Now you would need to read the whole article for more context, but on the face of it Kerry have not been converting the goal chances that they have been making and thus to suggest that they will not leave 2-2 behind them again is not necessarily the case.

It also ignores the fact that Dublin wasted their own goal chances and will be confident of creating more with 3 inside forwards for the whole game.

Am i right in saying Dublin created more scoreable chances on the day?

Sultan of Bling

awaywithyou wrote:

Tomas o Se reckons Kerry for Sam..... while we do have grounds for optimism in Kerry i think we need to realise that we played against 14 for 40mins and didnt even have a shot on goal in last 12 mins when we should b dominant given that the Dubs had a player less and should have been out on there feet....

Yeah, it's funny how the build up to the replay differs from the drawn game.

The confidence amongst a lot of kerry fans and particularly kerry pundits seems bullish.

Personally I fear kerry are in for the mother of all backlashes.

The_Kew_Tour

blinding wrote: »

If the Dubs don’t get away with the persistent fouling then Kerry obviously have a chance . If the Dubs get away with their persistent fouling then Kerry have no chance . It takes a strong referee to stand up against the Dubs .

In fairness ye have that with Lane in charge.

Let's not pretend Kerry are all Saints either.

C__MC

Went through the Kerry V Dublin rivalry since Gavin took over
Dublin of course have owned it but Kerry have been right on their heels.
Bar a couple of lousy league games in CP where Dublin trounced Kerry, its always been close. Kerry have done quite well when they have been huge underdogs, 13, 16 & 19. On paper yes Dublin have a superior team but Kerry's natural ability and wide lenses of talent always make it close. They also took a league title in 2017 at Dublin expense. The only time Kerry didn't feature that well was the 15 final yet killian young could have a snatched a draw and the 16 league final where a red card gave Dublin the advantage late on.

The big worry for Kerry is Dublin always finish stronger
13 semi final
16 semi final
17 league game
17 league final
19 league game
19 final

Weather Kerry are mentally fragile or lacking fitness late on, it seems to be advantage Dublin here.

Back to Saturday, Dublin wont hammer Kerry, its never been like this. Kerry have the footballers to make a game of it, even at their low ebb with Fitzmaurice this was always the case. Look at clones last year & mayo v Kerry 2017.



It will go to wire Saturday but maybe Dublin experience and ability to finish stronger will see them home

Don't be surprised though if Kerry pip Dublin, Dublin never hammer Kerry!

gormdubhgorm

I was worried before the first game
But I can't see Dublin losing this after the last day.
It was a nice kick in arse for Dublin to cop themselves on.

What new tricks have Kerry to offer?
Dublin have plenty of options to shake things up - Murchan, McMahon, Brogan, Connolly.
Kerry's only real alternative option is to start Walsh or take him on and put him back on again..

davegilly

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

I was worried before the first game
But I can't see Dublin losing this after the last day.
It was a nice kick in arse for Dublin to cop themselves on.

What new tricks have Kerry to offer?
Dublin have plenty of options to shake things up - Murchan, McMahon, Brogan, Connolly.
Kerry's only real alternative option is to start Walsh or take him on and put him back on again..

Are you serious? If Dublin had plenty of options then why didn't they use them the last day? They waited until the 67th minute to introduce subs, after leaving Connolly warming up for 5 or 6 minutes on the sideline. Brogan isn't even on the matchday panel for Christ sake?

Kerry's only alternative is to put on and take off Walsh? Mother of God man, what have you been drinking? You do realise Killian Spillane scored 1-1 when he came on?

Kerry have scope for massive improvement, absolutely massive. Dublin haven't. Their experience brought them through the last day - and it very well might again but I'm not so sure it will be enough this time.

gormdubhgorm

davegilly wrote: »

Are you serious? If Dublin had plenty of options then why didn't they use them the last day? They waited until the 67th minute to introduce subs, after leaving Connolly warming up for 5 or 6 minutes on the sideline. Brogan isn't even on the matchday panel for Christ sake?

Kerry's only alternative is to put on and take off Walsh? Mother of God man, what have you been drinking? You do realise Killian Spillane scored 1-1 when he came on?

Kerry have scope for massive improvement, absolutely massive. Dublin haven't. Their experience brought them through the last day - and it very well might again but I'm not so sure it will be enough this time.

I said 'real' alternative. Killian Spillane will be well planned for the next day.

Why did Dublin not use the subs?

1) They were down to 14 men for half of the game and did not want to go using subs left right and centre - in fact Dublin only used four subs

2) Jim Gavin had a bit of nightmare on the line line, and got his match ups wrong as well - before the game and during it



I just feel that Kerry have played thier hand and have nothing new to offer for the next day
They blew thier chance and should of had 2/3 more goals

I don't think Dublin will be as bad again overall the mistakes will be analysed and ironed out
And I think Dublin will be fully prepared this time. It could be more cagey affair.

castletownman

I know he isn't the same player he once was, and injuries are a recurring theme with him, but does anyone else not think that a fit James O'Donoghue could be a big impact sub to bring in? Spillane mightn't be as effective off the bench or from the start again, but O'Donoghue potentially could be.

Bonniedog

I think holding off on the subs was a shrewd move. Takes players a while to get to the pace of a game like that, and you can't afford lapses with 14.

The lads on the filed were doing well, apart from the goal blip and really the more you think of that you have to think that had Byrne retained the ball rather than losing his feet, that Kerry would have been in panic stations very quickly.

That would have been the time to throw in fresh minds and legs, and as it was it almost worked as Murch, Costello and Connolly were brilliant when they came on and the missed shots were ones that on other days (or in pre Hawkeye days) would have won the day.

the idea of Gavin making several bad calls doesn't add up.

wazzer1

davegilly wrote: »

Are you serious? If Dublin had plenty of options then why didn't they use them the last day? They waited until the 67th minute to introduce subs, after leaving Connolly warming up for 5 or 6 minutes on the sideline. Brogan isn't even on the matchday panel for Christ sake?

Kerry's only alternative is to put on and take off Walsh? Mother of God man, what have you been drinking? You do realise Killian Spillane scored 1-1 when he came on?

Kerry have scope for massive improvement, absolutely massive. Dublin haven't. Their experience brought them through the last day - and it very well might again but I'm not so sure it will be enough this time.

A fully fit Fenton, Con and Mannion have room for massive improvement. A long with a few others their performance wasnt what it has been for the last few years, so to say Dublin havent room for improvement is laughable.

eigrod

Brolly’s got the chop for Saturday https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/gaa/john-fogarty/rochford-to-replace-brolly-on-rtes-live-tv-panel-for-all-ireland-final-replay-949758.html

Pineapple1

eigrod wrote:

Brolly’s got the chop for Saturday

Replaced by Rochford.

corny

Will Kerry continue the press off the kickout or will they be spooked by the scores they conceded on the break?

I always like the aggressive option but you can't argue that it doesn't leave you vulnerable or that it doesn't exact a physical toll. Friend of mine reckons Kerry will go 180 and concede the kickout to the corner back.

Can't see Dublin changing their approach much.

blanch152

corny wrote: »

Will Kerry continue the press off the kickout or will they be spooked by the scores they conceded on the break?

I always like the aggressive option but you can't argue that it doesn't leave you vulnerable or that it doesn't exact a physical toll. Friend of mine reckons Kerry will go 180 and concede the kickout to the corner back.

Can't see Dublin changing their approach much.

The only way to beat Dublin is to press the kickout. Giving the ball to the corner-back ends up with death by a thousand Ciaran Kilkenny passes. If you concede the kick-out to the corner back, Dublin will work the ball until they have an opening, and they will score.

Press the kickout, and some day Dublin won't score on the break. That day, they will lose.

Chalk McHugh

eigrod wrote: »

Brolly’s got the chop for Saturday https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/gaa/john-fogarty/rochford-to-replace-brolly-on-rtes-live-tv-panel-for-all-ireland-final-replay-949758.html

Proper order. He was an embarrassment at ht of the drawn game.

Tombo2001

blanch152 wrote: »

The only way to beat Dublin is to press the kickout. Giving the ball to the corner-back ends up with death by a thousand Ciaran Kilkenny passes. If you concede the kick-out to the corner back, Dublin will work the ball until they have an opening, and they will score.

Press the kickout, and some day Dublin won't score on the break. That day, they will lose.

Funny enough - balls.ie ran a great article showing how Kerry set their press up to make the 'weakest link' the easiest option for Kick Outs and then pressing hard for a turn over once that link was hit, citing consecutive turnovers on Cooper and Fitzsimons.

Poor_old_gill

eigrod wrote: »

Brolly’s got the chop for Saturday https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/gaa/john-fogarty/rochford-to-replace-brolly-on-rtes-live-tv-panel-for-all-ireland-final-replay-949758.html

I really hope that this is the beginning of the end for all the oul whinge bags on the Sunday Game.

Guys like Brolly & Spillane are not analysts - the former just makes pointless attention seeking statements in a shock jock approach while the latter offers practically nothing these days.

I'd add Whelan to that aswell - a terrible addition while Sean Cavanagh is muck too.

They really need to get guys on who can analyse a game and not just make statements of fact.

The Sunday Game analysis consists of Player A scored 4 points in the first half so he's playing great while his fellow forward Player B hasnt scored yet so he should be taken off.
They completely neglect to analyse why is Player A getting the ball in certain positions, are they isolating him , what runs is he making, what runs are other making - essentially they dont/cant analyse what is going on in a game.

Just An Opinion

Funny how some elements of the media are claiming this is the first time this Gavin-era Dublin have questions and cracks about time and are there for the taking. Simply not true, the 2015 semi-final replay, Mayo go 4 points up in the 2nd half Keegan’s effort to go 5 up drops short, at a time when momentum was swinging in their favour after Cillian O’Connors goal was on the ropes type stuff, this followed a nervy finish to the drawn game where a vital late McCaffrey block prevented a Mayo winner.

The 2016 semi final Dublin have a pre-half time meltdown with kick outs/defense and concede 2 goals going in at the break 5 points down with the game level on 70 minutes, drawn final was and still is IMO Dublin’s worst performance in the championship during Gavin’s reign. 2 freak own goals getting us out of trouble that day (30 mins before we put our first score on the board og’s excluded)

2017 final 2 points down with 7 minutes left and certainly there for the taking until Connolly comes on to settle and take control of matters.

So this narrative is incorrect, there have been numerous times previous where we’ve appeared vulnerable and disjointed. Another set of questions to be answered from 6pm Saturday.

chief orman

Poor_old_gill wrote: »

I really hope that this is the beginning of the end for all the oul whinge bags on the Sunday Game.

Guys like Brolly & Spillane are not analysts - the former just makes pointless attention seeking statements in a shock jock approach while the latter offers practically nothing these days.

I'd add Whelan to that aswell - a terrible addition while Sean Cavanagh is muck too.

They really need to get guys on who can analyse a game and not just make statements of fact.

The Sunday Game analysis consists of Player A scored 4 points in the first half so he's playing great while his fellow forward Player B hasnt scored yet so he should be taken off.
They completely neglect to analyse why is Player A getting the ball in certain positions, are they isolating him , what runs is he making, what runs are other making - essentially they dont/cant analyse what is going on in a game.

I agree that the analysis is diabolical. I would'nt put Brolly & Spillane in the same bracket though. Brolly is constantly biased. He has an agenda and fits his analysis around the bias. Spillane is rough around the edges but is honest enough in his analysis though his years are probably numbered alright. Whelan is a total waste of space and should get the chop immediately. It is probably about time to get recently retired players in there as the game has changed totally over the past 20 years. And even better again get a former manager who has been there and done that.

Gael85

Poor_old_gill wrote: »

I really hope that this is the beginning of the end for all the oul whinge bags on the Sunday Game.

Guys like Brolly & Spillane are not analysts - the former just makes pointless attention seeking statements in a shock jock approach while the latter offers practically nothing these days.

I'd add Whelan to that aswell - a terrible addition while Sean Cavanagh is muck too.

They really need to get guys on who can analyse a game and not just make statements of fact.

The Sunday Game analysis consists of Player A scored 4 points in the first half so he's playing great while his fellow forward Player B hasnt scored yet so he should be taken off.
They completely neglect to analyse why is Player A getting the ball in certain positions, are they isolating him , what runs is he making, what runs are other making - essentially they dont/cant analyse what is going on in a game.

Whelan is usually decent on the analysis and good knowledge of modern game. Haven't seen his take on cooper red cars as was at game. Malachy O'Rourke was very good when on TSG a couple weeks ago. Impressed with Rochford too.

conor05

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

I was worried before the first game
But I can't see Dublin losing this after the last day.
It was a nice kick in arse for Dublin to cop themselves on.

What new tricks have Kerry to offer?
Dublin have plenty of options to shake things up - Murchan, McMahon, Brogan, Connolly.
Kerry's only real alternative option is to start Walsh or take him on and put him back on again..

As a Kerry fan, I would be absolutely delighted to see Philly McMahon, Brogan and Connolly start.