Brexit discussion thread X (Please read OP before posting)

woohoo!!!

Itssoeasy wrote: »

woohoo!!! wrote: »

Fascinating to read the heavily redacted info on yellow hammer. Of course they've resisted releasing communications, it would identify a lot of important folk of conspiring to lie to the public, parliament and the queen to get parliament suspended. Her maj must be considering invoking full monarchy powers to run the country, temporarily, considering the utter hames the current shower are making of it. Along with the Scottish court ruling and the poll on NI re Irish reunification, it's fair to say we're watching the UKs political authority crumbling. And of course the various factions are too focused on their cunning wheezes and counter-wheezes, to realise the danger.

Heavily reacted ? There's one paragraph redacted.

Quite correct, I should have said the full document not being made available, not the executive summary which a small redacted portion. As has been pointed out, it's not a worst case scenario but rather a likely one.

Mefistofelino

L1011 wrote: »

I thought Whitegate was slightly above 50% of road fuels? Still "slightly" is not a reassuring position!

I think 60-70% of our refined products come from the UK

embraer170

I spent some time working in a department of a public administration that was responsible for writing documents such as crisis plans. I am shocked at the Yellohammer doc is: poorly written, low on detail, and proposes nothing.

Itssoeasy

woohoo!!! wrote: »

Quite correct, I should have said the full document not being made available, not the executive summary which a small redacted portion. As has been pointed out, it's not a worst case scenario but rather a likely one.

Well okay that’s fair enough. We could say instead of redacted, that the document is not the full document so it was withheld not redacted.

BonnieSituation

embraer170 wrote: »

I spent some time working in a department of a public administration that was responsible for writing documents such as crisis plans. I am shocked at the Yellohammer doc is: poorly written, low on detail, and proposes nothing.

Given it is a UK Govt document I would not be shocked.

ElectronVolt

dublinjock wrote: »

I understand what your saying about the President being like a head od state. But its an important role and they get to have say more than any other head of state would on matters.
Im a firm believer any head of state should stand for an election and be voted in by the people.

I actually said that the president in those contexts is *NOT* the head of state. Perhaps you were confused? I was actually making the completely opposite point.

The US president is elected by an electoral college using a formula that distorts representation very heavily in favour of low-population and rural areas and away from the places that people actually live.

The Taoiseach is elected by the Dáil and in the UK the PM is appointed by the Queen on the notional idea that they are believed to be likely to be able to command a majority in parliament, they don't even have to stand for election there - Boris Johnson is case and point.

The EU doesn't have a head of state nor is it a state. My whole point was the term "President" in the EU's context does not mean head of state and was never intended to.

BorneTobyWilde

Everyone knew Boris was lying to the Queen. Even the Queen knew it, but she has to fill her role and allow his request for a Queens speech.
5 weeks off is a joke, 5 days, okay that would be normal.

Enzokk

In no surprise whatsoever The Daily Telegraph didn't touch the verdict or the Yellowhammer papers in their front page for tomorrow and The Daily Mail went with a story about cancer survival in the UK. There is a snapshot of why the UK is in the position it is.

ElectronVolt

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

Everyone knew Boris was lying to the Queen. Even the Queen knew it, but she has to fill her role and allow his request for a Queens speech.
5 weeks off is a joke, 5 days, okay that would be normal.

The question that will decide the stability of the UK long term is whether there are any consequences to lying ot the Queen about the prorogation. If not, then the UK constitution is basically not worth the paper it isn't written on.

Enzokk

The poor will suffer the most with the rise in food and fuel prices, and these are the winners.

https://twitter.com/carolecadwalla/status/1171903096965992449?s=20

And still you have people eating up what they have to sell them. People buying ice in the middle of the arctic winter and being upset when someone points out they can get it for free and they should stop and think a little.

Professor Moriarty

Enzokk wrote: »

The poor will suffer the most with the rise in food and fuel prices, and these are the winners.

https://twitter.com/carolecadwalla/status/1171903096965992449?s=20

And still you have people eating up what they have to sell them. People buying ice in the middle of the arctic winter and being upset when someone points out they can get it for free and they should stop and think a little.

I wouldn't be a fan of Corbyn but he nailed it with this tweet:

Official government documents confirm Boris Johnson is prepared to punish those who can least afford it with a No Deal Brexit to benefit his wealthy friends.

devnull

Lewis Goodall has posted a good thread here about Yellowhammer
https://twitter.com/lewis_goodall/status/1171857956935294977

Click the tweet to see the long thread about all the issues as he's posted a series of them with excerts and also some analysis.

Very scary stuff, but the leavers seem to be saying it's worth it or it's project fear!

devnull

Also it's very noticeable that The Sun and the Daily Mail have nothing at all about Brexit on the front page on Thursday, the first day I can remember it being the case for many weeks.

I guess they decided since events happened which don't support their agenda, they'll pretend they never happened and try and hide them from their readership rather than be honest with them.

A damning indictment of the British Press.

J Mysterio

UK are in a long standing political, economic and social union with the EU and the European countries it represents. Ultimately Europeans share the common values of the Enlightenment etc. The events surrounding the UK suddenly deciding to leave the union- 'Brexit' - are so big, the ramifications so far reaching, and the scandals involved so huge, the mechanisms of government and its supposed safeguards just can't react quickly enough to deal with it. Communities, politicians, people, familes, friends are all effected and find it hard to comprehend or digest all of this to a certain extent, and that's probably intentional. A majority want it 'over', but don't take the time to understand how this can 'end'.

With shocking news every other day, there becomes a creeping normality to it, Brexit is like a daily soap: we have the joke about what 'series' it is (must be series 3). The thing about this is when there is so much shocking news, it becomes hard to isolate any one item and concentrate on it, as the news cycle just constantly moves on to a new scandal. This leaves one society somewhat punchdrunk and allows bad actors to do some really nefarious sh1t.

Why has there still been no proper investigation into Vote Leave etc? This is being left till afterward, but it needs to happen now.

There are 'dead cats' everywhere to occupy us. Well, the UK really need to snap out of it and be shook from this paralysis, or metaphorically slapped in the face. This stuff needs to be tackled immediately. Some of the worst villains in this tragedy are are complaining the judiciary are political, well, I say they should be in fear of them as these men are criminals. Of course they discredit the judiciary. The police have work to do - some of this is white collar crime of the worst sort. The police must also be careful not to be politicised. Johnson jokes he doesn't even know his rights.

Yellowhammer now anticipates protests and counterprotests. A rise in disorder and community tensions. At first this is surely angry remainers against angry leavers as things unravel. Then it is just general disorder once wider society reases it has been duped.

Unreal how this keeps degenerating and these bastards continue to get away with it, many of them priviliged sh1ts who were born with a silver spoon in their mouths. They are hoping to make money out of this. Out of yanking the UK out of our union, and so recklessly and in such a brazen and shameful manner.

I mentioned the Shock Doctrine just recently and now we have the Cadwalladr revelation. This is all scary stuff, terrifying to witness really, and hard to stomach.

Capt'n Midnight

J Mysterio wrote: »

Sunday Times journalist believes she has the scoop on the redacted element of Yellowhammer

twitter.com/RosamundUrwin/status/1171873763295682560

Some scoop

Even the BBC had that one a couple of weeks ago. With numbers.
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-49405270

There are six major petroleum refineries in the UK, supporting around 120,000 jobs directly and contributing about £8.6bn to the economy.
...
The current tariff on fuel imports from non-EU countries is 4.7%.
...
At the same time, the EU has said it will apply a tariff, under WTO rules, of 4.7% to UK exports, making the trade with, for example, Ireland "uneconomical", according to insiders.

£8.2bn is roughly the nett cost of UK contributions to the EU.
That alone is pure Brexit.




Worst case for us is we get more of our refined fuel from Rotterdam which means it takes a day longer to arrive.

Strazdas

Enzokk wrote: »

In no surprise whatsoever The Daily Telegraph didn't touch the verdict or the Yellowhammer papers in their front page for tomorrow and The Daily Mail went with a story about cancer survival in the UK. There is a snapshot of why the UK is in the position it is.

Keep in mind too that those two rags were acting as cheerleaders for prorogation and the Queen been misled, a potentially illegal act.....this is quite awkward for them

SeaBreezes

Enzokk wrote: »

In no surprise whatsoever The Daily Telegraph didn't touch the verdict or the Yellowhammer papers in their front page for tomorrow and The Daily Mail went with a story about cancer survival in the UK. There is a snapshot of why the UK is in the position it is.

I guess it also answers who benefits from the hedge fund gamble...

prawnsambo

SeaBreezes wrote: »

I guess it also answers who benefits from the hedge fund gamble...

For this reason alone, I would hope nothing happens on 31st October and they lose a packet.

Infini

Mefistofelino wrote: »

This has significant consequences for Ireland - the majority of our petroleum products come from UK refineries

I believe plans were set in motion a while back to move those supplies out of the UK back to Ireland it was mentioned in one of the previous threads.

J Mysterio

Strazdas wrote: »

Keep in mind too that those two rags were acting as cheerleaders for prorogation and the Queen been misled, a potentially illegal act.....this is quite awkward for them

Im sure they can ride the akwardness. Im sure also that people involved with these newspapers stand to make a lot of money from Brexit. They are pushing an editorial line, not printing the reality, facts. They need to be held to account, and government needs to see to it.

jm08

woohoo!!! wrote: »

Including some of our reserves or at least that was the case.

I seem to recall reading somewhere that the 3 month reserve was moved from the UK to the EU (France? I think) about 18 months ago.

Water John

The population of yellow buntings must be at risk, considering their seems a push to shoot the messenger.

road_high

Looks like back to square one and Groundhog Day- no Reg divergence whatsoever from the DUP and Johnson statement I see online
'That simply doesn’t work for the UK' - Boris Johnson rules out Northern Ireland-only backstop

Itssoeasy

Are the DUP that bloody petty that they'll risk hurting the NI economy and the people in it just because of the "precious union" ?

ElectronVolt

Itssoeasy wrote: »

Are the DUP that bloody petty that they'll risk hurting the NI economy and the people in it just because of the "precious union" ?

I know one word replies aren't liked on this forum, but I the answer to that is a most definite "YES".

Itssoeasy

Also, whatever else you can say about the British monarchy and the head of that monarchy is Queen Elizabeth II, she herself is very popular and the royal family are popular and somehow the sitting PM either was at best economical with the truth about why he wanted to prorogue parliament and at worst flat out lied, to a person the British people on the whole see as a steadying force.

Are the people in charge that dense ? I'm not even British and I've no loyalty to the British royal family but even I know that that doing that is stupid.

lola85

Itssoeasy wrote: »

Also, whatever else you can say about the British monarchy and the head of that monarchy is Queen Elizabeth II, she herself is very popular and the royal family are popular and somehow the sitting PM either was at best economical with the truth about why he wanted to prorogue parliament and at worst flat out lied, to a person the British people on the whole see as a steadying force.

Are the people in charge that dense ? I'm not even British and I've no loyalty to the British royal family but even I know that that doing that is stupid.

So the queen isn’t in charge???

road_high

Itssoeasy wrote: »

Are the DUP that bloody petty that they'll risk hurting the NI economy and the people in it just because of the "precious union" ?

Yes- of course! They could all be in the poorhouse so long as the curtains were still draped in Union flags. Their one and only aim is to maintain the Union like a cult pretty much like Brexit itself

J Mysterio

Itssoeasy wrote: »

Also, whatever else you can say about the British monarchy and the head of that monarchy is Queen Elizabeth II, she herself is very popular and the royal family are popular and somehow the sitting PM either was at best economical with the truth about why he wanted to prorogue parliament and at worst flat out lied, to a person the British people on the whole see as a steadying force.

Are the people in charge that dense ? I'm not even British and I've no loyalty to the British royal family but even I know that that doing that is stupid.

This is the cover of the Mirror. It's quite striking.

https://twitter.com/BBCNews/status/1171901664883814403

I think I need a lie down.

trellheim

Oh dearie me