Spiral out - keep going

Treviso

I decided to start this log whilst I'm near the start of training for DCM19, my first proper marathon attempt.

Background
Whilst I've always been sporty and active in my life, the past number of years saw a decline in how active I was - because of advancing years and constant injuries. So I went from playing 11aside soccer 3 times a week to 5 a side astro once a week. Even then, the impact injuries on ankles & feet caused me to rethink my strategy. I've always been a slim person but noticed I was packing on unwanted pounds. Things had to change and its was either cycling or running. Cycling on our roads is too dangerous in my head so running it was and I fully committed. My wife is a brilliant runner who has run numerous marathons so I had a ready made coach

I started running properly in Sept 18 - running too fast and not often enough but it was a start. Started building up my weekly mileage going from 2 to 3 runs a week, going to 20 miles a week. By Jan2019 I was up to 25 miles a week. I was finding the tempo/interval/speedwork all fairly easy, due to my soccer background but my endurance was terrible. Longer runs were tough.

Then the then biggest moment in my running career, my wife couldn't run the Dungarvan 10 so we transferred her entry over to me (legitimately!). My first race - I was so nervous. I travelled down by myself, felt so nervous being surrounded by these serious runners. I did, however, achieve my target of sub 80 and get 78.24. I was delighted and probably hooked. Decided to run Cork Half and DCM full and set about picking a training plan.

For Cork Half, I followed a P&D faster road running plan which peaked at 30 miles a week which introduced me to progression longer runs (which I love!). Set myself a target of 1.40 for the race and despite struggling at the end, finished in 1.39.17.

My PBs are as follows:

5k -- 20.51 -- June -- GT 5k Cork
10m -- 74.31 -- March -- Mallow10
Half -- 1.39.17 -- June -- Cork Half
25k -- 2.05.17 -- April -- The Great Railway Run

I am a member of the Novices thread but I'm following a more advanced training plan (P&D Advanced plan that peaks at 57miles). Some will say that I'm crazy to follow such an advanced plan but for me its the natural progression to the half plan I followed. The paces are similar than the half plan but its giving me the extra miles I need. I'm 6 weeks in and it's going great

So my dream target for DCM is 3.30 but I realise that it being my first marathon that I may not have the endurance for that. I'd be happy if I go under 3.40 but we'll see how training goes. I'll try to be honest in this log and welcome all feedback - except negative

skyblue46

Welcome to the logs. I had to laugh at your "advancing years" comment...you're only a baby! I started following you on Strava today and must say I like how you are keeping easy as it should be...not that I'd do it barefoot! Best of luck with the log and DCM.

Mr. Guappa

Welcome to logs and best of luck with the training. We finished within seconds of each other in Dungarvan.

skyblue46

Mr. Guappa wrote: »

Welcome to logs and best of luck with the training. We finished within seconds of each other in Dungarvan.

So you're going for 3:30 too! :eek:

Mr. Guappa

skyblue46 wrote: »

So you're going for 3:30 too! :eek:

I am in my hoop. Maybe next year, or the year after....

Treviso

Training progress so far:

GA pace - 9.18min/mile
Recovery - 10min/mile
MP - 7.45min/mile (I am training this pace to give me a buffer for finishing under 3.30)
LT - 7.15min/mile
V02 - 6.45min/mile
MLR - Progress from 9.18 (MP+20%), 8.56 (MP+15%), 8.32 (MP+10%)

DCM TRAINING - WEEK 1

Plan|Monday|Tuesday|Wednesday|Thursday|Friday|Saturday|Sunday
P&D|GA10M|Rest|8m w 4m LT|Rest|Recovery 6m|Rest|MLR 12m
Pace|9.16avg|-|GT 5k race (20.50)|-|9.56avg|-|8.46avg


DCM TRAINING - WEEK 2

Plan|Monday|Tuesday|Wednesday|Thursday|Friday|Saturday|Sunday
P&D|Rest|GA 8m|Rest|GA 10m|Recovery 5m|Rest|MPR 13m 8m @MP
Pace|-|9.04avg|-|9.17avg|9.51avg|-|MP miles 7.49,.45,.51,.44,.48,.44,.39,.21


DCM TRAINING - WEEK 3

Plan|Monday|Tuesday|Wednesday|Thursday|Friday|Saturday|Sunday
P&D|Rest|GA 10m|Recovery 4m|7m LT 4m|Recovery 5m|MLR 14m|Rest
Pace|-|9.18avg|9.57avg|LT miles - 7.19,.23,.35,.27|9.54avg|8.53avg|-


DCM TRAINING - WEEK 4

Plan|Monday|Tuesday|Wednesday|Thursday|Friday|Saturday|Sunday
P&D|GA 9m|Recovery 5m 10x100|GA 10m|-|MLR 15m|Hols|Hols
Pace|9.09avg|9.56avg|9.12avg|-|9.01avg|-|-

Treviso

2 weeks in France on holidays meant I split one weeks training plan over the 2 weeks and added some extra "easy" hilly miles

DCM TRAINING - WEEK 5a

Plan|Monday|Tuesday|Wednesday|Thursday|Friday|Saturday|Sunday
P&D|GA 5m|Rest|10m 5m LT|Recovery 5m|Rest|GA 3m|MLR 16m
Pace|9.23avg|-|8.41avg|9.53avg|-|9.21avg|9.03avg


DCM TRAINING - WEEK 5b

Plan|Monday|Tuesday|Wednesday|Thursday|Friday|Saturday|Sunday
P&D|Rest|Recovery 6m|10m GA|Recovery 6m|Home|Home|MPR 16m 10m MP
Pace|-|9.43avg|9.12avg|10.09avg|-|-| MP miles - 7.53,.45,.51,.44,.54,.50,.40,.41,.47,.33

Fusitive

skyblue46 wrote: »

Welcome to the logs. I had to laugh at your "advancing years" comment...you're only a baby! I started following you on Strava today and must say I like how you are keeping easy as it should be...not that I'd do it barefoot! Best of luck with the log and DCM.

Barefoot is the way forward!! Strong and flexible feet, mobile ankles, less injuries and there's something satisfying in the way it feels and the power it generates. I remember back in my old juvenile running days, any training or races we done was all barefoot on grass.

Best of luck with the log and the training Treviso. Good progress so far and a lot more potential there I'd say.

ReeReeG

Fusitive wrote:

Barefoot is the way forward!! Strong and flexible feet, mobile ankles, less injuries and there's something satisfying in the way it feels and the power it generates. I remember back in my old juvenile running days, any training or races we done was all barefoot on grass.

Really?!? I admit that I thought he was stone mad when I saw it on Strava

Fusitive

ReeReeG wrote: »

Really?!? I admit that I thought he was stone mad when I saw it on Strava

Yep, you'll still see it to this day if you ever go to juvenile XC or the community games. I wouldn't do it on the road but one of my favourite things is running on grass barefoot, even all my cooldowns after XC races are done barefoot.

Treviso

My OH went to a talk in CIT by Dr Peter Francis who recommended doing some barefoot running to help strengthen your foot muscles. He said it helped him in his running days when he suffered from plantar fasciitis. I don't have that condition but have minor orthotic insoles while running that I want to stop using. Its only a few miles a week but I can feel the benefit already

Can remember way back in my primary school days for the 100m City Sports in Pairc Ui Chaoimh where everyone ran in their bare feet!!

Murph_D

Best of luck with it all.

As you know, 3:30 marathon is 8:00/mile. One thing I’d strongly suggest is to lose this 7:45/m MP approach - the ‘buffer’ you are describing is far more likely to become a blow up, and a painful experience in the second half of the race. This is even more likely given it’s your debut.

7:45 is closer to your HM pace than your M pace. This is a mistake you’d be better off correcting sooner rather than later.

All the best with it.

Treviso

Thanks Murph_D

The 7.45 is just the training pace I'm training to in the plan, I plan on sticking to 8min/mile for the race if I decide to go for 3.30

Murph_D

Treviso wrote: »

Thanks Murph_D

The 7.45 is just the training pace I'm training to in the plan, I plan on sticking to 8min/mile for the race if I decide to go for 3.30

I understand that. However it’s not the correct M training pace for you. You’ll likely end up training too hard, overtaxed from your MP workouts (15s per mile is a big difference) and underdeveloped in the endurance department as a result, and possibly more likely to get injured. You’re taking a risk - it might work out, but more likely it won’t.

Treviso

80 euro spent on 2 boxes of maurten gels which arrived today. Plus spent 126 euro on another pair of Brooks Adrenaline GTS19 too!

I've had to give up drinking to fund my running habit. Soon I'll be selling any valuables in the house to buy some extra running gear

Treviso

A stepback week for me this week. After 2 weeks running in the hills and heat of France, I reckon my legs could do with it. Mentally, however, I couldn't help but feel meh about the week's training. Maybe it was a case of the post holidays blues too

DCM Training Week 6

Monday 22nd
Rest

Tuesday 23rd - 8 miles at 9.11min/mile avg 10x100m
Boy how did I miss running on grass! Went out to my usual running place, UCC Farm, to do this run. Noticed that they're hard at work building foundations for a new dental hospital out there. Not good news. New wireless headphones were a disaster - going to back to my previous brand (which I broke when I left them on top of my car after a LT run!!). GA miles were fine, legs were a bit tired after the weekend's MPR. Strides were great - tried to improve my form and could feel it working straight away. Hard not to go into my old soccer ways and do a full sprint for them.

Wednesday 24th - 5 miles at 10.01avg
UCC Farm run again. HR was higher than usual as it was very humid. Ran last mile in barefeet. I've built this up gently from the start of the plan - from a quarter mile to a mile.

Thursday 25th - 8 miles at 9.15avg
Farm again. Tested out a new pair of Brooks Adrenaline GTS19. Went a half size smaller and they fit really well.

Friday 26th
Rest

Saturday 27th - 4 miles at 9.51avg
Guess where, the farm. Legs really wanted to go faster for this run but managed to restrain myself somehow. Soccer match was just starting as I was running around - kept thinking how I would love to play. Those days are gone!

Sunday 28th - 12 miles at 8.53avg
Ran towards Passage and back, and then around the Mahon loop. Lovely day for a run. In my head it was "only" 12 miles so it had to be easy right! First 4 miles done at MP+20%, next 4 at +15% and last 4 at +10%. Hit all the paces easily, tried to keep myself back for Tuesday's LT run.

Weekly miles - 38.7
Miles so far this year - 840

So onwards onto to week 7 plan. I might be pining for my stepback week after this one :eek:

DCM TRAINING - WEEK 7

Plan|Monday|Tuesday|Wednesday|Thursday|Friday|Saturday|Sunday|Total
P&D|Rest|10m - 5m@LT|Recovery 4m|MLR 11m|Rest|7m GA 8x100m|Long run 18m|50m

Treviso

Tuesday 30th - 10 miles - 5 @ LT

Had been feeling apprehensive about this run since the weekend but turned out to be a successful run. I carefully planned my 5 LT miles so 2 were against the wind and 3 were with it. Turned out to be one of those days were the wind seemed to be against me no matter what direction I went! Started off with 3 miles warmup and then switched my music to 180bpm extreme metal and off I went.

LT miles were 7.22, 7.11, 7.13, 7.09 & 7.11 so were on target. Felt the pace on the 4th mile but it was because I was going too fast - slowed it down and felt ok again. Had the legs for another LT mile so that bodes well for next weeks 6m LT.

First fast training session where my legs haven't felt heavy half way through it, seems that my endurance has improved somewhat. Feel great after the run, legs still feel fresh. Kudos from Skyblue on Strava - what more could you ask for!

Treviso

DCM Training Week 7 continued

Wednesday 31st - Recovery 4m at 9.49avg
Glad of the recovery run after the previous day's LT run. Ran in UCC Farm on grass. Last mile in bare feet - I do feel this is benefitting me in so many ways

Thursday 1st - MLR 11m at 8.50avg
First midweek MLR run and it felt strange running it on a weekday. 3 miles at MP+20%, 4 at MP+15% and 4 at MP+10%. Felt very strong for the whole thing. Tested out a new marathon belt as well - forgot I was wearing it half way round.

Friday 2nd - Rest
Was tempted to run Saturday's run today but knew that run was on that day for a reason.

Saturday 3rd - 7m GA with 8x100m
The plan now starts to put some decent miles the day before my weekend long run, so I run the long run on more tired legs. Got soaked which wasn't a pleasant thing. Strides were fine. Did 6 miles on grass, strides and then 1 mile on bare feet.

Sunday 4th - 18m MLR
Yesterday's run had me feeling worried that my legs would feel lethargic earlier than normal. Was expecting rain but manage to avoid it. Had a route planned out where I would loop past the car twice - so I could gather a small bottle of water.

I had a Maurten gel at mile 5 and 11. I can't recommend these enough, don't need to have water with them and don't upset my stomach. Pricey enough. Fit perfectly into the new marathon belt. Need to trim the edges as they were sticking into me at times

Plan was to do 6 miles at MP+20%, 6 at MP+15% and 6 at MP+10%. I felt so strong at the end that I did the last 2 at MP for a confidence boost - in hindsight it probably wasn't the best idea. No real benefit in doing it. Delighted, though, with how that run went - longest ever!

Overall, a good week with my longest ever run and my highest ever weekly mileage.

Weekly mileage - 50
Miles so far this year - 890

Week 8 has a similar theme to it to this week except the LT run is only 2 days before a 20 mile MLR - more unknown territory.

DCM TRAINING - WEEK 8

Plan|Monday|Tuesday|Wednesday|Thursday|Friday|Saturday|Sunday|Total
P&D|Rest|Recovery 7m 6x100m|MLR 12m|Rest|10m 6m@LT|Recovery 5m|Long run 20m|54m

Treviso

DCM Training Week 8

Another week down and another with my longest run and weekly mileage

Tuesday 6th - 7m Recovery 6x100m, 9.38avg
UCC Farm. This run was more of a struggle than I anticipated. Went orienteering the previous day with the OH & kids so it added a fair few miles to the 18 I ran on Sunday. Strides were probably too fast given how tender the legs were. Ran last mile in bare feet.

Wednesday 7th - 12m MLR, 8.49avg
I've been trying to run every so often without orthotic foam insoles in my running shoes - this was the first run that I felt a bit of pain in my left foot but wasn't too bad. Started to think it may not be a good idea to stop using them, more to come on that. Run was fine, hit all target paces with no trouble.

Friday 9th - 10 miles with 6@ LT pace, 8.02avg
Tough run on paper and it turned out that way too. LT miles were 7.17, .19, .15, .16, .16, .07 which were on target. I've never run a 10k race before, with my 10K PB coming from Duhallow 10 mile in March - which was mainly downhill with the wind. So the OCD in me kept the LT pace going for another .2mile and hit a 10k PB of 45.04. Need to run a proper 10k soon

Saturday 10th - 5 miles, 9.48avg
UCC Farm, fairly boring routine run

Sunday 11th - 20 mile MLR, 8.49avg
The big one. Again was nervous for this one, longest ever run and with a LT run just 2 days previous. My legs felt creaky in the morning. Breakfast of jam & toast and a banana on the drive down. Decided not to wear insoles in shoes.

Planned the route that I would pass the car twice to collect water & change shoes if needed. First 6 miles at MP+20% went ok, increased pace to MP+15% for next 7 miles and legs started to feel it. At mile 12 my left foot started to really hurt, decided to change shoes when I reached the car at mile 14. Changed from Adrenalines to Ravennas (with insoles), some difference in the support cushion, Ravenna felt like they didn't have any sole whatsoever!!

Last 7 miles at MP+10% and things improved a bit, my body probably felt it was the home stretch and I was homeward bound (even though I was running away from the car again). Was hitting the paces ok and decided to do the last mile at MP to give myself a confidence boost. Had 3 Maurten gels at 5, 10 and 15 miles - no side effects. The fact I can take gels without worrying about water is such a relief.

Another good week, sometimes it doesn't even register that I've run this much in a week. I'm trying to focus on 1-2 runs at a time. I feel like I've made really big improvements in my running since I started this plan.

Going to keep running with insoles in shoes - big risk trying to change this before the marathon. Might try again after the race.

Weekly mileage 55 miles
Year to date Strava is saying 940

Next week is some easy running, midweek "only" 14m MLR, and then the dreaded MPR run, 16 miles with 12 at MP :eek::eek::eek:

DCM TRAINING - WEEK 9

Plan|Monday|Tuesday|Wednesday|Thursday|Friday|Saturday|Sunday|Total
P&D|Rest|Recovery 6m|MLR 14m|Recovery 6m|Rest|Recovery 6m|16m MPR 12m@MP|48m

ReeReeG

That was an impressive long run, but I have to agree with what was posted above. I saw in the comments on the long run that you're using a faster MP for your training runs than you think you'll set out at in October. I think there is high risk of you leaving your marathon in training if you continue this? Looking at your PBs, 3.30 seems a possible target alright but heading out at faster than that in the upcoming PMP runs could ruin that target.
I don't like raining on the parade or the buzz you likely have after the week's running, but I just don't want to see anyone do things to jeopardize their first marathon!

If you need anymore convincing, Huzzah! reminded me of a training log on here where an experienced runner ran a lot of MP miles faster than their then-current level of fitness suggested, and it didn't end well.. link here and I hope the runner in question doesn't mind!

Treviso

DCM TRAINING - WEEK 9

Another week down and half way through the marathon plan. This week had a number of recovery runs, a 14m midweek MLR and a 16m MPR

Tuesday 13th - 5m Recovery, 9.45avg
Ran on grass. For some reason I misread the plan and did 5 miles instead of 6. Ran the last mile barefoot

Wednesday 14th - 14m MLR, 8.52avg
Longest midweek run to date and I think I underestimated it. Tougher than expected but hit the paces required, 4m @MP+20%;, 5m @MP+15% and 5m @MP+10%. Overall happy with the run

Thursday 15th - 7m Recovery, 9.49avg
Added an extra mile to make up for Tuesday's missed mile. Last mile barefoot

Saturday 17th - 6m recovery, 6x100m, 9.36avg
Ran 5 miles, then strides and final mile barefoot. I'm making progress with the strides, improving my form to go faster with the same effort.

Sunday 18th - 16m MPR w 12@MP, 8.01avg
Was waiting all week for this one but strangely felt quite confident about it. Picked the route and the MP miles would go out and back a flat 3 mile course twice. 2 miles warmup and cool down

First 3 MP miles were into the wind but felt great for them, took 1st gel on the turn - 7.47, 7.54, 7.43.

Next 3 with the wind, grabbed a bottle of water off my car as I passed it. Used half it and placed it on a bench to collect on the way back - 7.50, 7.37, 7.47.

Next 3 against the wind, was feeling good and probably put extra effort into these 3. Took 2nd gel and got to the bench to find someone had drank the rest of my water (who would do that!!), had to carry the empty bottle back to the car cursing the person who did it - 7.42, 7.49, 7.32.

Last 3 with the wind and was too fast. I was feeling good though so subconsciously kept the same effort as the previous 3 miles. There was quite a lot of runners on the narrow path so had to do a lot of weaving around them. When overtaking other runners, you can't help but to speed up I find - 7.35, 7.26, 7.22

Feel great after the run, legs tired but its a good tired feeling. Its the last MPR of the plan as I'm substituting the 14m@MP with the Charleville Half marathon.

Weekly mileage - 49 miles
Year to date - 989 miles

Stepback week next week, but with the first VO2 max session. Have a couple of races coming up in September which will give me a chance to improve current PBs and gauge current fitness. It definitely has improved dramatically since I started this plan

DCM TRAINING - WEEK 10

Plan|Monday|Tuesday|Wednesday|Thursday|Friday|Saturday|Sunday|Total
P&D|Rest|8m GA|8m VO2 Max, 5x800m(2min recovery)|Recovery 5m|Rest|8m GA, 8x100m|14m MLR|43m

Kellygirl

I saw your run on Strava and wondered why you ran back and forward on that path rather than continuing round the Blackrock loop. The wind was strong today heading in towards Rochestown.

Treviso

Yea it does seem bizarre alright but there are a numbers of reasons really

- That 3 mile path is really flat and in general is sheltered from the wind
- The Blackrock loop has a number of elevations and in certain points, tree cover can distort the pace you're going at.
- I do find the path by the coast is really exposed to the elements so the wind was probably worse there this morning
- I like to loop past the car to get some water

I would only do these repetition runs for MP or LT runs where pacing needs to be accurate. Will probable use the same place for my VO2 sessions too

Kellygirl

Treviso wrote: »

Yea it does seem bizarre alright but there are a numbers of reasons really

- That 3 mile path is really flat and in general is sheltered from the wind
- The Blackrock loop has a number of elevations and in certain points, tree cover can distort the pace you're going at.
- I do find the path by the coast is really exposed to the elements so the wind was probably worse there this morning
- I like to loop past the car to get some water

I would only do these repetition runs for MP or LT runs where pacing needs to be accurate. Will probable use the same place for my VO2 sessions too

Good to know it’s sheltered - I deliberately didn’t go near it today as assumed with the wind direction that it would be very exposed. Agree with the gps issues. I noticed it on the marina and on the line quite a bit today. Yep, by Jacobs Island as far as the bridge had very strong winds. I might venture towards passage more so in future.

Treviso

DCM Training - Week 10

Step back week of 43 miles with first VO2 Max session

Tuesday 20th - 8m GA, 9.14 avg
Was expecting a recovery run so soon after the MPR but 8m GA it was. Ran this on grass. Legs were creaky at the start but soon loosened out. Did 4 loops of the fields and can't remember much about it. Near the end of the run, a few elite runners, including an Olympian, started their easy runs there too. When I say easy, it was more my LT pace I reckon! They make it look so effortless. Spoke to a regular runner in the UCC farm afterwards for the first time, he ran in the first DCM - sound bloke.

Wednesday 21st - 8m VO2Max 5x800m, 2min recovery jog
I brought out my secret weapon for the DCM - Vapourfly 4% - for the first time. It was to ensure that they fitted ok & had no ill effects before I start using them for races. My OH bought them for my birthday in June, at the time I felt a bit meh about them.

I did 3 miles warmup in my Brooks Adrenalines and my legs felt dead for the whole 3 miles. No number of knee lifts, legs kicks or strides could wake them up. I felt it was going to be a disaster of a session as I got to the car to change shoes. The minute I put on the Vapourflys all that changed. Now I know why everyone wears them for races. I felt like I was running on springs. Definite game changer

Started off for the VO2 reps, I didn't know what pace to aim for as it's been a while since I done one of these sessions and I've improve a lot since then. I decided I would aim for 6.20min/mile to see if a sub 20 5k is on the cards. My 5 reps average paces were 6.07, 6.17, 6.07, 6.11 and 6.01 - was delighted with them.

i didn't feel that uncomfortable during the reps, legs didn't feel heavy like they used to do. These sessions suit me as they're exactly the type of training I used to do for soccer and I reckon I have more fast twitch muscles than slow. The question is if I could keep that up for 5k straight.

I have an upcoming 5k race in two weeks as part of the training plan so I might attempt sub 20, see how it goes. It would be a full 45 seconds off my PB since June but I do believe I've improved that much since then

Kellygirl

Amazing the difference the Vapourfly made. Will you just keep them for races to make them last or use them for sessions too?

Treviso

Kellygirl wrote: »

Amazing the difference the Vapourfly made. Will you just keep them for races to make them last or use them for sessions too?

They'll just be used for races from now onwards, today was just breaking them in I suppose

Treviso

DCM Training - Week 10 continued

Thursday 22nd - 5m recovery, 9.40avg
Felt ok the day before immediately after the VO2 session but today the legs felt a bit stiff. Was glad of the recovery run. Ran at the UCC farm on grass, with the last barefoot

Saturday 24th - 8m GA, 8x100m, 9.06avg
Ran on grass again. Saw all the race results from the FD10 come through on Strava and was jealous of everyone that ran in it. No motivation for this run because of it. Weather was extremely humid. There was some tag rugby training going on at the same time, Cork trials I think. Brought me back to glory days of playing it. Was wondering how long I could join in for before I got injured trying to sprint! Strides were a bit leggy but was happy with them.

Sunday 25th - 14m MLR, 8.47avg
Always the way that I underestimate this type of run on stepback week. On reflection, the 8miles & strides yesterday meant I started this run with legs more tired than normal.

Found a car key on the pathway during the second mile so spent the next 2 miles asking other people if they lost it. Couldn't find the owner unfortunately. Could only imagine that person getting to their car after a run or cycle to find they had no car key! Hopefully they weren't out on their own.

At the 10 mile mark, my legs were struggling a bit but found it handy to keep the paces. For the last 2 miles, felt like I needed a toilet break so it slowed my pace down. First time having that experience in a run

Hit the 1000 mile mark during the week, didn't even realise it until Friday. Big milestone for me and thankful that I've reached that stage without any sign of injury (yet!)

Weekly mileage - 44.5
Year to date - 1034

So next week according to OH is the toughest overall week on the plan. Highest mileage of the plan too so hopefully the step back week will have me raring to go for my 7m LT run :eek::eek:

DCM TRAINING - WEEK 11

Plan|Monday|Tuesday|Wednesday|Thursday|Friday|Saturday|Sunday|Total
P&D|Rest|7m Recovery, 6x100m|11m w 7m@LT|Rest|12m MLR|5m Recovery|20m MLR|55m

fatboyfin

Treviso wrote: »

DCM Training - Week 10 continued

Thursday 22nd - 5m recovery, 9.40avg
Felt ok the day before immediately after the VO2 session but today the legs felt a bit stiff. Was glad of the recovery run. Ran at the UCC farm on grass, with the last barefoot

Saturday 24th - 8m GA, 8x100m, 9.06avg
Ran on grass again. Saw all the race results from the FD10 come through on Strava and was jealous of everyone that ran in it. No motivation for this run because of it. Weather was extremely humid. There was some tag rugby training going on at the same time, Cork trials I think. Brought me back to glory days of playing it. Was wondering how long I could join in for before I got injured trying to sprint! Strides were a bit leggy but was happy with them.

Sunday 25th - 14m MLR, 8.47avg
Always the way that I underestimate this type of run on stepback week. On reflection, the 8miles & strides yesterday meant I started this run with legs more tired than normal.

Found a car key on the pathway during the second mile so spent the next 2 miles asking other people if they lost it. Couldn't find the owner unfortunately. Could only imagine that person getting to their car after a run or cycle to find they had no car key! Hopefully they weren't out on their own.

At the 10 mile mark, my legs were struggling a bit but found it handy to keep the paces. For the last 2 miles, felt like I needed a toilet break so it slowed my pace down. First time having that experience in a run

Hit the 1000 mile mark during the week, didn't even realise it until Friday. Big milestone for me and thankful that I've reached that stage without any sign of injury (yet!)

Weekly mileage - 44.5
Year to date - 1034

So next week according to OH is the toughest overall week on the plan. Highest mileage of the plan too so hopefully the step back week will have me raring to go for my 7m LT run :eek::eek:

DCM TRAINING - WEEK 11

Plan|Monday|Tuesday|Wednesday|Thursday|Friday|Saturday|Sunday|Total
P&D|Rest|7m Recovery, 6x100m|11m w 7m@LT|Rest|12m MLR|5m Recovery|20m MLR|55m

Good luck for the week ahead - that looks brutal!

Treviso

fatboyfin wrote: »

Good luck for the week ahead - that looks brutal!

Cheers B. Yep it does look brutal but I'll take it one run at a time and try to survive

Treviso

DCM TRAINING - WEEK 11

Tuesday 27th - 7m recovery, 6x100m - 9.32avg
After stepback week, my legs felt more tired than a normal training week but this recovery run definitely loosened them up completely. Ran the 6 miles in UCC farm, then the strides and the last mile barefoot. Was raining for most of the run and running barefoot was such a relief on the wet soft grass.

Wednesday 28th - 11m with 7@LT pace - 8.04avg
Last LT pace run on the plan thankfully. Decided to do 3 miles warmup, 7 LT miles and 1 mile cool down. It was a really hot humid morning with a bit of a breeze. From reading all the FD10 reports over the weekend, I decided it best to dial the paces back a bit starting off.

Started the first 3 LT miles with the wind. Amazing after doing the V02 session, the LT pace seemed slow at the start!! That didn't last long. Was monitoring my HR a lot for these miles, knowing that my previous LT runs were normally in the 170s. I don't normally look at HR but it really helped today. 7.24, 7.24, 7.27

Next 3 miles were against the wind. Decided to up the HR to the mid to high 170s and put more effort in to compensate. Was really feeling the pace so decided to turn back with the wind at 2.5 miles to get an extra half mile with it (is that cheating?)
7.17, 7.14, 7.23

Last mile I only had 1 pace, couldn't go slower and couldn't go faster or else I would've stopped. 7.05

Overall happy with the run and how I sensibly started off slower and relied on HR a bit more. My HR seems to be a lot higher than most running but I think I can see trends now in terms of effort.

Turning my thoughts to upcoming races, 5k next week and Charleville HM mid Sept, I'm finding it difficult to decide target times for each one. Outside of weather factors, not sure whether to be optimistic or cautious with them.

skyblue46

Is there much difference between optimistic and cautious times?

Treviso

Not for the 5k i suppose - Was thinking of heading out at 6.20 pace and see if I can hang on.

For the HM, the optimistic time is head out with the 1.35 pacers and see if I can stay with them. Cautious is go with 1.40 pacers and push on depending on how I'm feeling

skyblue46

Treviso wrote: »

Not for the 5k i suppose - Was thinking of heading out at 6.20 pace and see if I can hang on.

For the HM, the optimistic time is head out with the 1.35 pacers and see if I can stay with them. Cautious is go with 1.40 pacers and push on depending on how I'm feeling

What time half do your training paces equate to...the tempos etc? I'd say to make it comparable to your marathon target. If you are targeting an aggressive full marathon time then go for the aggressive half. It's the only way to see if you are on track...

Treviso

My LT paces have been run at 7.15 pace and I did 7 miles of that this week. Doubts would be if I could maintain that for another 6 plus miles. If I was trying to hit a 3.30 marathon time, then I guess i should be aiming for around the 1.35-1.36 mark though.

skyblue46

Treviso wrote: »

My LT paces have been run at 7.15 pace and I did 7 miles of that this week. Doubts would be if I could maintain that for another 6 plus miles. If I was trying to hit a 3.30 marathon time, then I guess i should be aiming for around the 1.35-1.36 mark though.

There's your answer so!

Treviso

Eek! Thanks S

skyblue46

Treviso wrote: »

Eek! Thanks S

You have a free shot at it.... Charleville by all accounts is about the fastest HM course in the country which should help. Also it doesn't matter if you fail. It doesn't necessarily mean the 3:30 is a non runner. I failed in an attempt for a sub 1:30 half last year that I felt I needed to indicate a 3:20 marathon was possible. I got sub 3:20 despite the HM flop...

Murph_D

How do you understand LT pace? For most of us (non-elites) it’s certainly not HM pace. Dial back.

Part of your issue with choosing race pace is the decision to train for a time different from what you are actually targeting. 5k is irrelevant. The Half will tell you stuff, but only if you approach it properly. Good luck!

Comic Book Guy

You are on the same plan as myself and you are a week ahead of me, will definitely be following this log in detail to give me a preview of what's coming my way!
Best of luck with the HM next month. I'm looking forward to reading how the new Nike's go for you in race conditions and what you think of them.

Treviso

Murph_D wrote: »

How do you understand LT pace? For most of us (non-elites) it’s certainly not HM pace. Dial back.

Part of your issue with choosing race pace is the decision to train for a time different from what you are actually targeting. 5k is irrelevant. The Half will tell you stuff, but only if you approach it properly. Good luck!

I suppose I have the terminology wrong with LT, maybe it's more tempo. HR stays reasonable constant for them. For the Cork half plan, I trained at 7.30 for this LT/tempo pace and only reached 4 miles at this pace. I did Cork Half at 7.29avg, 1.39.x.

Improvements have been made since then and I've been doing these runs at 7.15, reaching 7 miles at this pace during training. So I'm hoping the trend will continue for Charleville.

Murph_D

Pfitzinger and Douglas define 'tempo' as the pace you can run for about one hour - so if you're a 1:39 hm runner this equates to about 7:20. You're a bit under that - how did you find that 7 miles? It's a brutally difficult session from what I remember of it.

Your race times posted at beginning of thread (like most of us) show a performance drop off with distance - that 25k time you posted is quite a long way off even your HM time - could be a warning sign. Anyway Charleville will tell you whether 3:30 is a realistic goal alright.

By the way that Railway Run sounds great. I love the part of the line that's on the Cork Marathon route.

Treviso

Comic Book Guy wrote: »

You are on the same plan as myself and you are a week ahead of me, will definitely be following this log in detail to give me a preview of what's coming my way!
Best of luck with the HM next month. I'm looking forward to reading how the new Nike's go for you in race conditions and what you think of them.

Thanks CBG, was just trawling through your Strava logs already trying to see how you're getting on with the plan. Good to see you starting a log too - will follow with interest.

Treviso

Murph_D wrote: »

Pfitzinger and Douglas define 'tempo' as the pace you can run for about one hour - so if you're a 1:39 hm runner this equates to about 7:20. You're a bit under that - how did you find that 7 miles? It's a brutally difficult session from what I remember of it.

Your race times posted at beginning of thread (like most of us) show a performance drop off with distance - that 25k time you posted is quite a long way off even your HM time - could be a warning sign. Anyway Charleville will tell you whether 3:30 is a realistic goal alright.

By the way that Railway Run sounds great. I love the part of the line that's on the Cork Marathon route.

Yes my endurance is my weak point but I do feel it improving. Whether or not it improves in time for DCM is another story.

That railway run is a great run - Goes all the way past Monkstown on similar paths to the Cork Marathon route. Its why I do most of my training when not running on grass

Treviso

DCM TRAINING - WEEK 11 - continued

After a good start to the week, attention turned to the 37 miles I needed to run over 3 days. The plan switches it's attention to running the long runs on tired legs - it worked well this week!

Friday 30th - 12m MLR, 8.56avg
With the 20 mile due on Sunday, I decided to run this MLR on grass to save on wear and tear for my legs. They were stiff during the run because of the LT run but they soon loosened up with the faster pace.

Saturday 31st - 5m Recovery, 9.50avg
Ran on grass again first thing Saturday morning. I normally don't run this early and it showed. My legs were asleep for the first 2 miles. New found respect for all those that run before 7am, don't think it's something I would like to do again. Last mile barefoot.

Sunday 1st - 20m MLR, 8.52avg
Was dreading this one and wasn't really in the form for it. Legs felt tired the previous day and because I stupidly stayed up to watch the boxing, I didn't really get a good nights sleep. Planned to use 2 gels for this run and go with 6@MP+20%, 7@MP+15%, 6@MP+10% & last mile @MP if I could. Same route as previous 20m

Started off and could tell my legs were feeling it already, braced myself for the next 3 hours of possible hurt. The pace was slow for MP+20% and started to get into some sort of rhythm. Took first gel at mile 7. Miles 8 to 13 were a slog, an out & back section which seemed to go on forever. Took 2nd gel at mile 13.5 just before I passed my car to collect some water.

My quads were burning & back of hamstrings were too. Took advice my OH gave me when using water to cool you down. Most people poor it over their heads but its not the most effective. Pour water over the back of your neck, base of back and front of both quads. I also splashed some on my hamstrings. It really did did the job and my legs were instantly cooled as I started the last 6 miles

Got some energy from somewhere to up the pace to MP+10%. Then I experienced my first emergency pitstop situation. I looked around in panic to find a suitable location, which was down a steep incline off the running path (I now understand how runners always discover dead bodies). The sensation of the whole world wanting to fly out of my a$$ as I went into some matrix style crab position, only to produce the smallest amount of liquid. I'm guessing most experienced runners will be laughing at me on this, I'm sure it'll happen a lot more times.

Anyway, it did the job (sorry!!). I had 3 miles left and was able to run with a bit more form. Was able to finish with the last mile at MP. If these practice runs are to replicate the final 20 miles of the marathon, I hope to be able to run the last mile like that one. All in all a good week, glad to get the highest week mileage of the plan out of the way.

Weekly Miles - 56 (highest ever again)
Yearly mileage - 1090

Sitting here tonight and legs are very tired. Hopefully will be able to rest them up tomorrow before going again. Plan calls for a race this week, 8-15k, but can only do a 5k on Thursday evening. This will be followed the next evening by a 17m MLR - again a MLR on super tired legs!. I had to re-adjust the weekly plan for the 5k and will replace a VO2 session with a GA run. VO2 session two days before the race would not have been a great idea.

DCM TRAINING - WEEK 12

Plan|Monday|Tuesday|Wednesday|Thursday|Friday|Saturday|Sunday|Total
P&D|Rest|GA 8m|Recovery 5m, 6x100m|5k Race|17m MLR|Rest|12m MLR|48m

Dealerz2.0

That’s some week T-great mileage- I’m not looking forward to it already!

Treviso

Dealerz2.0 wrote: »

That’s some week T-great mileage- I’m not looking forward to it already!

Just take each run at a time F and you'll get through it. Soon enough it'll be next week and it'll all be behind you. I've seen loads of experienced runners state that running on tired legs is a great way to improve your running so I'm hoping that is the case

Treviso

DCM Training Week 12

First race of the plan this week with the 5k on Thursday. Had some easyish runs before then

Tuesday 3rd - 8m GA, 9.17avg
On the plan, this was meant to be a VO2 session, 5x600m, but having to race on the Thursday instead of the Saturday I decided to change this to a GA run. Legs were groggy on the run, with the remnants of the Sunday's 20 miles still remaining.

Wednesday 4th - 5m Recovery, 6x100m
Did 4 miles recovery, then the strides and 1 mile barefoot. Legs were still feeling it so was unsure about doing the strides. Got through them at medium pace

Thursday 5th - St Lukes 5k
Chip Time - 19.26
I'm still in disbelief about this time but will try to go through the race description as best I can. It's the first race i've run with my OH and we kinda spurred each other on (well maybe just me being spurred on)

Arrived at the car park near the finishing line and went to collect our numbers from reception of St Lukes home. Did an initial 1.5m warmup in my Brooks near the finishing line. Noticed there will be a head wind for a lot of the last mile. Changed into the Vaporflys & jogged the half mile to the start line. Sun was starting to disappear too.

Start line was a bit chaotic, lot of delays closing the road so you had half the road full of runners with cars & buses trying to squeeze through. With no start pens or chip platform at the start, everyone was vying for the front. It was one of those 3-2-1 go starts. My OH was going to pace us at 6.20 so I didn't need to worry about it

Mile 1
Good start to the race, I felt the pace was a bit slow as lots of people were passing us but glancing at the watch and we were bang on 6.20. I settled into that pace. Sure enough after the first half mile, we started to go past the eager beavers who went too fast initially. Went from the road to the railway line walkway. Bit of a slip on the turn but I deserved it for trying to take the corner too tight and using the grass verge. It was difficult to pass other runners, check your pace and also watch out for walkers coming the opposite direction. 6.20 mile

Mile 2
There is a footbridge that crosses over the South Link and is quite steep. I attacked the initial incline but then held off in case I gassed myself near the top. The rest of race was along the same walkway that goes all around the coast. Again, myself & my OH were going strong at the same pace constantly overtaking other runners. At 1.5 miles in I started to feel it (which is good for me). My breathing was ok but the legs were asking me what the hell I was doing 6.20 mile

Mile 3
Most of my long runs are along this route so I knew how far I had to go to get to the finishing line. My OH tells me early in this mile that we've got sub 20 in the bag - Im thinking yes but only if I can keep this pace up and don't crash and burn. We come up to a group of runners that seem to be running a LSR to me, in my infinite wisdom I choose to push past them at a greater pace and regret it immediately - I felt shattered. Half a mile left and I said to OH that I've nothing left. Just get to the last bend and it'll be over soon 6.10 mile

Last bit
Turned the corner and the finishing line seems ages away. I tried to speed up and pretend its just a stride that I'm doing, no chance. I see the clock in the distance saying x.55, that can't be right i say - realise as I get closer that it was 18.55. I was struggling to understand it but gave it all I could crossing the line in 19.26 5.29 pace

To say I chuffed with this result is an understatement. Thought I could get sub 20 but didn't expect to get that far under it. Obviously the training plan is helping me loads but for this race, my OH pacing me was a great help. And the Vaporflys too, but we won't mention the magic shoes. Calves are a bit tender after the race

Oh now I just have to run 17 miles tomorrow evening - damn you marathon plan!!

Kellygirl

Congrats. Great racing. Nice evening too for it. Temperatures dropped nicely.

Laineyfrecks

Well done! Great time

fatboyfin

Brilliant running - trust in the plan, eh! The morning after the night before, how does this performance impact your targets for DCM? I ask because I ran a PB 5k recently and it has hardened my resolve to push for 3.30 in Dublin - but some of my more experienced running friends are suggesting that I should / could be pushing for something better based on that result and tempo / intervals pace. I remain doubtful and don't want to jeopardise what only 3 months ago seemed like a dream time.

Of course, a validating run will the Belfast or Dublin half marathon, but would be interested in your thoughts (or it could be too early for that!)