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Water charges for excessive usage

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    #212
    liatroimabu
    Registered Users Posts: 61 ✭✭liatroimabu


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    Dude providing services to a large population centred in one location is incredibly cheap compared to servicing one off gaffs miles apart.

    Not disagreeing on that, and if you read back you'll see I said if it came to it then fair enough I'd pay more if required maintenance etc. was specifically for me or a few houses that were being serviced by one line, one road, whatever it may be.

    You conveniently either ignored or disregarded my point about the whole everything for nothing argument.

    You want water but you don't want to pay for it? Is that not the definition of getting something for nothing?


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    #213
    BarryD2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,732 ✭✭✭BarryD2


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    What's has multiple ensuites got to do with anything?

    Well what do you think multiple ensuites has got to do with the excessive use of water?? Like I say, most people of public water supplies have little clue about moderate use.

    I'm sure the lucky few with swimming pools too regard their usage as reasonable as if you've got one, well it's reasonable to change the water in it every now & then.


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    #214
    Spanish Eyes
    Registered Users Posts: 15,913 ✭✭✭✭Spanish Eyes


    BarryD2 wrote: »
    That's a silly excuse, plainly a meter should be installed for the 'fecker' with his lawn sprinkler. And if he refuses, cut him off. His better half won't be long clipping him about the ears and telling to grow up and stop being such a pain in the arse.

    Come on now. Installing meters in areas where they were opposed to by the Paul Murphy types will NEVER be metered unless mayhem is factored in again. They know this, we know this.

    But as usual, those who were law abiding and agreed to the installation of meters will bear the brunt.

    I think the Government need to watch this. Those who pay for everything will rise up very soon I think. Well I will. I am sick of it now.


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    #215
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    liatroimabu wrote:
    You conveniently either ignored or disregarded my point about the whole everything for nothing argument.


    I didn't ignore it I said it was bs.


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    #216
    blackcard
    Registered Users Posts: 3,901 ✭✭✭blackcard


    Boggles wrote: »
    blackcard wrote: »
    I think you would be looking at something in the region of 40 billion to bring the network up to scratch or to "fix the leaky pipes" as some people call it.

    I appreciate the answer, but where did your 40 billion figure come from?
    blackcard wrote: »
    That excludes the cost of disruption to businesses and the general public as the roads are dug up in our cities and towns.

    In my town they have been at this constantly for a decade, no one even complains about it anymore.
    100,000 ķm @ €400/m to include design, site investigation, construction, supervision etc.


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    #217
    Benedict
    Registered Users Posts: 684 ✭✭✭Benedict


    BarryD2 wrote: »
    That's a silly excuse, plainly a meter should be installed for the 'fecker' with his lawn sprinkler. And if he refuses, cut him off. His better half won't be long clipping him about the ears and telling to grow up and stop being such a pain in the arse.


    The question is, would you be happy paying a fine while others were doing the same thing but weren't getting fined? It sounds like you would be happy?


    So is it "yes" or "no"?


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    #218
    liatroimabu
    Registered Users Posts: 61 ✭✭liatroimabu


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    I didn't ignore it I said it was bs.

    But once again I ask, you want water, but you don't want to pay water charges, is that not wanting something for nothing? i.e. making my point valid and not bs as you call it


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    #219
    Brendan Bendar
    Registered Users Posts: 19,169 ✭✭✭✭Brendan Bendar


    Benedict wrote: »
    The question is, would you be happy paying a fine while others were doing the same thing but weren't getting fined? It sounds like you would be happy?


    So is it "yes" or "no"?

    There’s whether this stuff will either fail or succeed.

    Here’s my position.

    I will pay no fine while a certain coterie are not metered.

    Must be a level playing field for the Brenner, otherwise this ‘strategy’ is complete and utter bull crap.

    Must. Be. A. Level. Playing. Field.


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    #220
    Boggles
    Registered Users Posts: 39,747 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    blackcard wrote: »
    100,000 ķm @ €400/m to include design, site investigation, construction, supervision etc.

    Okay then, where did you get those figures from?


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    #221
    Brendan Bendar
    Registered Users Posts: 19,169 ✭✭✭✭Brendan Bendar


    Spanish Eyes wrote: »
    Come on now. Installing meters in areas where they were opposed to by the Paul Murphy types will NEVER be metered unless mayhem is factored in again. They know this, we know this.

    But as usual, those who were law abiding and agreed to the installation of meters will bear the brunt.

    I think the Government need to watch this. Those who pay for everything will rise up very soon I think. Well I will. I am sick of it now.

    Goddamn right, amigo,goddamn right.


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    #222
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    zimmermania wrote: »
    What about all the apartment dwellers who do not have meters?

    One meter on the main pipe into the complex, bill the OMC. Same as is currently done for common areas with the ESB bill.


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    #223
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    liatroimabu wrote:
    But once again I ask, you want water, but you don't want to pay water charges, is that not wanting something for nothing? i.e. making my point valid and not bs as you call it


    My LPT, my motor tax goes towards water provision as I'm sure some of my income tax ,USC , excise , vat I also pay. Hell I'm sure some the taxes I pay even make there way to people like you claiming grants for wells and farm related grants. So yeah your claim about something for nothing is bs unless you can't see the hypocrisy of claiming a grant yourself which is by definition 'FREE'.


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    #224
    ChikiChiki
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,950 ✭✭✭ChikiChiki


    The main reason for the water charge protests from a few years ago was the blatant corruption and cronyism that was going on. People were not going to pay for that.

    It was never about paying for water for the majority of the protesters most of whom would have no issue paying for usage. I was proud that day over 100,000 people walked through the city centre.

    Feels a bit like the last sting of a dying wasp from FG. The timing of this hitting the news is interesting.


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    #225
    liatroimabu
    Registered Users Posts: 61 ✭✭liatroimabu


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    My LPT, my motor tax goes towards water provision as I'm sure some of my income tax ,USC , excise , vat I also pay. Hell I'm sure some the taxes I pay even make there way to people like you claiming grants for wells and farm related grants. So yeah your claim about something for nothing is bs unless you can't see the hypocrisy of claiming a grant yourself which is by definition 'FREE'.

    Ok so I pay all those things as well but had to pay for some of the installation of filtration system and such. In addition to that , this tax also pays for healthcare, roads, civil service, government and other public areas not just your water.

    Get over yourself, put the hand in your pocket and pay up like every other person in the EU instead of cribbing and crying over 1.60 a week.


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    #226
    liatroimabu
    Registered Users Posts: 61 ✭✭liatroimabu


    ChikiChiki wrote: »
    The main reason for the water charge protests from a few years ago was the blatant corruption and cronyism that was going on. People were not going to pay for that.

    It was never about paying for water for the majority of the protesters most of whom would have no issue paying for usage. I was proud that day over 100,000 people walked through the city centre

    If they were brought back in the morning with a system that was beyond perfect, no corruption or anything of the like, you'd still have thousands protesting because they just simply want it for free.


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    #227
    odyssey06
    Registered Users Posts: 28,474 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    liatroimabu wrote: »
    If they were brought back in the morning with a system that was beyond perfect, no corruption or anything of the like, you'd still have thousands protesting because they just simply want it for free.

    Maybe, but the reason why the government capitulated was that hundreds of thousands rejected Irish Water for the reasons above i.e. the corruption and gombeenism AND the Paul Murphy types... that's why the protest reached critical mass.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



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    #228
    ChikiChiki
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,950 ✭✭✭ChikiChiki


    liatroimabu wrote: »
    ChikiChiki wrote: »
    The main reason for the water charge protests from a few years ago was the blatant corruption and cronyism that was going on. People were not going to pay for that.

    It was never about paying for water for the majority of the protesters most of whom would have no issue paying for usage. I was proud that day over 100,000 people walked through the city centre

    If they were brought back in the morning with a system that was beyond perfect, no corruption or anything of the like, you'd still have thousands protesting because they just simply want it for free.

    No doubt, You'll always get the professional protest class. But it would be far far less.

    Office workers were spending their lunch breaks outside Leinster house at rallys against IW and for very good reason. The movement was made up of normal hard working people. They could see right through the scam.


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    #229
    odyssey06
    Registered Users Posts: 28,474 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    My LPT, my motor tax goes towards water provision as I'm sure some of my income tax ,USC , excise , vat I also pay...

    Not just that.

    Commercial water is charged per metered use.
    So any time you are using a service that uses the mains water, you are paying too.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



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    #230
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    BarryD2 wrote:
    Well what do you think multiple ensuites has got to do with the excessive use of water?? Like I say, most people of public water supplies have little clue about moderate use.


    Again multiple ensuites is a stupid agrument. Two people in a house want to use the only toilet, one waits but still it's flushed twice, likewise for a shower bath etc. Same house two people but an ensuite as well as a bathroom. No waiting but the same water usage. Silly analogy tbh.


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    #231
    decky1
    Registered Users Posts: 975 ✭✭✭decky1


    1.85 for a thousand litre's not bad, look at the price of it in the shops and it's flying off the shelves. people were only fooling themselves if they thought this issue was going away, this is only the start, Brace yourselves.


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    #232
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    Spanish Eyes wrote:
    I think the Government need to watch this. Those who pay for everything will rise up very soon I think. Well I will. I am sick of it now.


    No they won't, they just post here whinging about those that are willing to rise up.


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    #233
    Boggles
    Registered Users Posts: 39,747 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    liatroimabu wrote: »
    No I had to spend 3.2k, the state paying 1.5k, the €1700 I paid is more than the majority of people will ever pay in their lives for water because they pay nothing and expect it for free for some reason.

    Can be close to 5 grand for Irish Water to connect someone up to the mains.

    No grant is available.


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    #234
    liatroimabu
    Registered Users Posts: 61 ✭✭liatroimabu


    Boggles wrote: »
    Can be close to 5 grand for Irish Water to connect someone up to the mains.

    No grant is available.

    Then fair enough one should be available if required connection costs this and the person isn't so affluent that 5k would be a nothing to them (so for 99% of people basically).

    My problem is with people who want to make absolutely no contribution to anything but still want to receive the same benefits or services as people who do.


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    #235
    Spanish Eyes
    Registered Users Posts: 15,913 ✭✭✭✭Spanish Eyes


    odyssey06 wrote: »
    Maybe, but the reason why the government capitulated was that hundreds of thousands rejected Irish Water for the reasons above i.e. the corruption and gombeenism AND the Paul Murphy types... that's why the protest reached critical mass.

    And yet here we are, those of us who complied and allowed meters to be installed can be monitored to within a cubic metre or so. Whilst those who refused cannot be monitored correctly, if at all. Daft.

    Time for the middle ground to fight back I say. Our time might come soon now :P


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    #236
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    liatroimabu wrote:
    Get over yourself, put the hand in your pocket and pay up like every other person in the EU instead of cribbing and crying over 1.60 a week.

    The irony of a farmer telling me to pay up. I went to college with the kids of farmers all on grants I the son of a paye worker had to work my way through college.You pay your own way without the hand out looking for grants off the state and EU then you have the right to lecture me.


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    #237
    InTheShadows
    Closed Accounts Posts: 727 ✭✭✭InTheShadows


    Berserker wrote: »
    They didn't. The looked at the results of the last election, told the electorate that they "got the message" and are using that change in the voting pattern to implement these changes. They've been waiting for an opportunity to implement these charges and the green vote has given them that chance.

    The Green vote? They got less than 8% of those who voted. But hey the green wave what


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    #238
    InTheShadows
    Closed Accounts Posts: 727 ✭✭✭InTheShadows


    liatroimabu wrote: »
    If they were brought back in the morning with a system that was beyond perfect, no corruption or anything of the like, you'd still have thousands protesting because they just simply want it for free.

    Its not free. We already pay for it through our taxes.


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    #239
    Spanish Eyes
    Registered Users Posts: 15,913 ✭✭✭✭Spanish Eyes


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    No they won't, they just post here whinging about those that are willing to rise up.

    I think they will though, the time is right and it's about time those who pay for everything get a voice.

    I am one of them mark my words. I will be very angry if my meter outside on the path, legally installed with no issue is used to charge me, whereas those with no meters will not have the same accuracy of usage, if at all.


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    #240
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    Spanish Eyes wrote:
    I think they will though, the time is right and it's about time those who pay for everything get a voice.

    They won't, they didn't when the USC was introduced they didn't when all the other measures were introduced. They'll just whinge like you are now.
    Spanish Eyes wrote:
    I am one of them mark my words. I will be very angry if my meter outside on the path, legally installed with no issue is used to charge me, whereas those with no meters will not have the same accuracy of usage, if at all.
    Why did you think the meter was installed if not to charge you?

    You're annoyed because others said enough was enough and to hell with the consequences. They had a back bone you didn't.


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    #241
    Boggles
    Registered Users Posts: 39,747 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    liatroimabu wrote: »
    Then fair enough one should be available if required connection costs this and the person isn't so affluent that 5k would be a nothing to them (so for 99% of people basically).

    Why would you base it on the affluence of a person, were you means tested to get your private well grant?

    Also what water source do you use to service your farm?


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