Ana Kriegel - Boys A & B found guilty [Mod: Do NOT post identifying information]

blackwhite

BattleCorp wrote: »

Thanks for your insight.

So, no guarantee of a life sentence for the boys. It's an option but not a certainty.

Exactly.

Given sentencing in the past for juvenile murder convictions has tended towards imposing life sentences, and the sexual element involved as an aggravating factor, I'd be surprised (and disgusted) if Justice McDermott deviated from the maximum.

Worth remembering that, given our parole laws, any sentence for 14 years or longer is effectively the same a life sentence.
Sentences of 8-14 years are eligible for parole after half the sentence is served. 14 years or longer (including life) then eligibility for parole starts at 7 years.

MrFresh

I'm pretty sure the only sentence for murder is life.

yourdeadwright

El_Bee wrote: »

It baffles me how the steps in his rehabilitation is not public knowledge and made more widely known, because they obviously got it very right with him, yet the other one should have never seen the outside of a cell again.

I read he still gets help and its one of the reason's they don't disclose how his rehabilitation went as he gets it and be easy for someone to track him down or figure out who he is ,

Small Wonder

El_Bee wrote: »

It baffles me how the steps in his rehabilitation is not public knowledge and made more widely known, because they obviously got it very right with him, yet the other one should have never seen the outside of a cell again.

Especially as the police made it quite clear that they thought Thompson was the ring-leader. "Pure evil" is how he was described.

Dial Hard

Tomw86 wrote: »

So was I - I cannot honestly see how they think they behaved anything but in a poor manner.

Boy B's father certainly behaved in a less than stellar manner after the verdicts were read.

"When the judge had finished he began to verbally abuse the gardai,

“You bunch of scumbags, you f***ing pricks. Innocent boy,” he was heard to say."

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/conor-feehan-heavy-emotion-in-courtroom-as-guilty-verdicts-returned-38230456.html

NuttyMcNutty

Gerianam wrote: »

The sad fact is that there are children today, now, as we speak subjected to the same level of cruel and horrendous bullying that poor Ana endured.

Exactly, time for parents to be parents and start teaching their kids about standing up for others when this sh1t starts in their circles.

MrFresh

MrFresh wrote: »

I'm pretty sure the only sentence for murder is life.

Life never really means life though, does it?

Wombatman

shesty wrote: »

Read the report.The judge instructed they could find him guilty if they thought he knew that Boy B was going to do this.The entire case against him was based on the evidence he gave himself about what happened.They decided to show the interviews, rather than read transcripts, to let the jury see body language, tone etc, most likely because they knew that was the only way they would get a true picture of what the boy was at.

So you are saying Boy B's conviction was down to lay people interpreting body language, tone etc.

Is there evidence he laid a finger on Ana?
Is there evidence he acted in the full knowledge of what Boy A was about to do?

c68zapdsm5i1ru

El_Bee wrote: »

It baffles me how the steps in his rehabilitation is not public knowledge and made more widely known, because they obviously got it very right with him, yet the other one should have never seen the outside of a cell again.

I think they probably both received the same treatment, but I suppose how effective it is depends on what motivated them from the start.

Robert Thompson, as I said, had a pretty horrific and violent childhood and being removed from that environment may have been what was chiefly needed to give him a chance of rehabilitation.

Jon Venebles background, while not perfect, didn't seem to be anywhere as bad so maybe there were more complex issues at play with him.

Hurrache

Dial Hard wrote: »

Boy B's father certainly behaved in a less than stellar manner after the verdicts were read.

"When the judge had finished he began to verbally abuse the gardai,

“You bunch of scumbags, you f***ing pricks. Innocent boy,” he was heard to say."

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/conor-feehan-heavy-emotion-in-courtroom-as-guilty-verdicts-returned-38230456.html

Wow, if that's true, that's just astounding.

El_Bee

yourdeadwright wrote: »

The big question is as a society what do we do with kids like this ?

Should they be cast away and locked up forever or can they be reformed ?

Iv no idea what the answer is ,

I hope Ana's family feel some kind of justice In this although its impossible for them to ever feel whole again ,

Iv no idea what kind of families the boys came from but they have also lost there children to this whole horrific case,

Please god its the last time we see anything like this in the country for another hundred or so years ,

That's the question in a (thankfully) unique case like this, as mentioned already, the Bulger case, one was reformed successfully, the other wasn't. What I do know is, society definitely needs a long break from them while it's figured out what to do with them.

blackwhite

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

there has been an instance where a kid was not sentenced to life for murder and the sentence was upheld by the appeal court.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/children-charged-with-serious-crimes-face-different-criminal-justice-process-to-adults-1.3508849

In that case a life sentence was imposed - albeit with provision for review after 10 years.

Judges can sentence a child to life imprisonment but it is not required. For example, in 2005 Mr Justice Barry White sentenced a 15-year-old boy to life imprisonment for murder, but ordered the sentence be brought before him again in a decade for review.

AFAIK the DPP were appealing the legality of the review after 10 years element.

castletownman

Not a parent myself, but I consider this the most harrowing murder trial I have ever followed.

I find it frightening how they are labelled as "Boy A" and "Boy B", and are children, but could be capable of something so callous and downright evil.

In fact, I don't possibly see how they could be rehabilitated, particularly knowing our rather lenient justice system. Capital punishment should be set aside for extenuating circumstances- these two lads are a danger to society. F*ck human rights lawyers- it wasn't like Ana's human rights were respected that evening.

retro:electro

The eight men and four women on the jury, could not take their eyes off the screens as Boy B spoke. Even during breaks in the interviews, when no questions were being asked, everyone remained transfixed by the screens situated around the courtroom, as the boy on the videos, stretched, yawned, folded and unfolded his arms or fiddled with his shoe.

He is not normal.

Tacitus Kilgore

Wombatman wrote: »

So you are saying Boy B's conviction was down to lay people interpreting body language, tone etc.

Is there evidence he laid a finger on Ana?
Is there evidence he acted in the full knowledge of what Boy A was about to do?

There's obviously enough there to convict.

Stheno

Hurrache wrote: »

Wow, if that's true, that's just astounding.

Seems to be.

Boy A had more than 12000 images on his phone with the majority pornographic

Tomw86

Dial Hard wrote: »

Boy B's father certainly behaved in a less than stellar manner after the verdicts were read.

"When the judge had finished he began to verbally abuse the gardai,

“You bunch of scumbags, you f***ing pricks. Innocent boy,” he was heard to say."

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/conor-feehan-heavy-emotion-in-courtroom-as-guilty-verdicts-returned-38230456.html

Didn't see this - no wonder they stood by them and not guilty pleas went in.

Small Wonder

Dial Hard wrote: »

Boy B's father certainly behaved in a less than stellar manner after the verdicts were read.

"When the judge had finished he began to verbally abuse the gardai,

“You bunch of scumbags, you f***ing pricks. Innocent boy,” he was heard to say."

It's hard to condone that type of behaviour. But I don't have children and cannot even imagine what it's like to see your child being convicted of participating in such brutality. I'd say the cognitive dissonance kicks in hard and fast at that point.

Scotty #

...

jester77

Dial Hard wrote: »

Boy B's father certainly behaved in a less than stellar manner after the verdicts were read.

"When the judge had finished he began to verbally abuse the gardai,

“You bunch of scumbags, you f***ing pricks. Innocent boy,” he was heard to say."

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/conor-feehan-heavy-emotion-in-courtroom-as-guilty-verdicts-returned-38230456.html

It appears the apple didn't fall far from the tree then. Poor girl, sickened reading what they did. Their anonymity should be lifted, her poor family have been subjected to media scrutiny, while these 2 lads get to hide behind their actions. Disgusting.

RIP Anna

Faugheen

Wombatman wrote: »

So you are saying Boy B's conviction was down to lay people interpreting body language, tone etc.

Is there evidence he laid a finger on Ana?
Is there evidence he acted in the full knowledge of what Boy A was about to do?

There’s always one fool who thinks an evil bastard sold have been found not guilty.

https://www.rte.ie/news/courts/2019/0618/1056046-boy-b-ana-kriegal-trial/

Read that. ^

iamwhoiam

Wombatman wrote: »

So you are saying Boy B's conviction was down to lay people interpreting body language, tone etc.

Is there evidence he laid a finger on Ana?
Is there evidence he acted in the full knowledge of what Boy A was about to do?

The judge seemed to think so . He heard all the evidence , as did the jury

Hal3000

This sentence will be intresting considering some of the ridiculous suspended sentences handed out in this country. The usual suspects will be on soon saying rehab works, harsh sentencing is bad for society etc. Harsh crime, harsh sentence tough sh*t... That's my opinion but that won't happen here.

El_Bee

Priscilla Mushy Banner wrote: »

I think they probably both received the same treatment, but I suppose how effective it is depends on what motivated them from the start.

I'm not sure I'd agree, they were separated immediately so they could have been on two very different paths rehabilitation wise.

blackwhite

Dial Hard wrote: »

Boy B's father certainly behaved in a less than stellar manner after the verdicts were read.

"When the judge had finished he began to verbally abuse the gardai,

“You bunch of scumbags, you f***ing pricks. Innocent boy,” he was heard to say."

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/conor-feehan-heavy-emotion-in-courtroom-as-guilty-verdicts-returned-38230456.html

I'm more than a bit disappointed that he didn't find himself up on contempt of court charges for that.

OneEightSeven

Two 13 year old boys kill a 14 year old girl and this peice of gutter trash is blaming capitalism:

https://twitter.com/RuthCoppingerTD/status/1140983710772162560

Gerianam

Nerdlingr wrote: »

You stated there was no DNA evidence that put Boy B at the scene.
There didn't need to be. As I said, he put himself there. He stated he led her to the house and saw the attack take place.
The jury obviously took all evidence presented to them into consideration to reach their verdict, and not just whether Boy B's DNA was at the scene or not.

Boy B was too clever to leave DNA...chilling...

c68zapdsm5i1ru

I would love to see the stellar way some posters on here would obviously behave if they found themselves in the same situation as the boys' parents.

Look, I'm not defending them. But I'm not condoning them either. I don't know enough about them. But none of us has a clue how we'd behave if one of our children did something as horrific as this, and was facing a life sentence.

People do all kinds of things when they're in shock. They react with disbelief, or anger or go into complete denial. It's easy to look at this case when you're not personally involved and say 'I would do this..... I would do that'. But the circumstances are so unimaginable that no one knows how they would react or behave if they were thrown into them.

Strazdas

Faugheen wrote: »

There’s always one fool who thinks an evil bastard sold have been found not guilty.

https://www.rte.ie/news/courts/2019/0618/1056046-boy-b-ana-kriegal-trial/

Read that. ^

It sounds like his demeanour as much as anything landed him a guilty verdict (and his demeanour was most peculiar for a supposedly innocent person).

.......

Dial Hard wrote: »

Boy B's father certainly behaved in a less than stellar manner after the verdicts were read.

"When the judge had finished he began to verbally abuse the gardai,

“You bunch of scumbags, you f***ing pricks. Innocent boy,” he was heard to say."

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/conor-feehan-heavy-emotion-in-courtroom-as-guilty-verdicts-returned-38230456.html

This is awful. He should have been held in contempt of court for this.