Ana Kriegel - Boys A & B found guilty [Mod: Do NOT post identifying information]

ohnonotgmail

Jupiter Mulligan wrote: »

What their experienced legal advisers told them too.

but they dont have to do what their lawyers tell them to do. that is the point.

iamwhoiam

Wombatman wrote: »

.... and that's enough for a murder conviction?

He lied about everything . Read the evidence .

Grayson

The jury were excused from ever having to do duty again. It generally happens after a nasty trial. In this case it's well deserved. It has to be horrible having to be on that jury.

sbsquarepants

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

I have the complete opposite opinion of Boy B. If he was easily led, he would have cried like a baby in his first interview and owned up. To me he’s a psychopath and pathological lier who could have easily been the mastermind behind the whole thing.

How two sick individuals managed to be in the same school at the same time is scary.

Exactly my view of him. A sick and dangerous individual - I sincerely hope they both get what they deserve in prison!

El_Bee

With the good news that Justice was served will come the bad news of the lenient sentences they receive, we're in desperate need of judicial/sentencing reform in Ireland.

Small Wonder

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

Read my post slowly and repeatedly if necessary

I've read both of your posts on the topic and neither of them answer my question.

MrFresh

Great news. Dampened only be the idea they'll spend the next four years in the summer camp known as Oberstown before they face any real punishment.

c68zapdsm5i1ru

Amalgam wrote: »

I'm glad the proper verdict has come about.

I couldn't watch TV at all while this trial was on, the coverage was quite salacious at times and it affected me whenever it would come on. This really was a case that seeped into your mind and lurked in your thoughts, for no good reason.

I guarantee you we'll here from one or both of the guilty as they grow up into adulthood.

Visions of the James Bulger accused, spring to mind..

The only thing that was a ''positive' for me was the noticeable lack of hand wringing on behalf of A & B.

One of those boys, Robert Thompson, has gone on to lead a blameless life. The other has repeatedly come to the attention of the police. So it seems that it can be possible to rehabilitate child killers, but that it's not always the case.

Tomw86

Priscilla Mushy Banner wrote: »

You speak as if you think parents would always behave rationally in these situations. Can you imagine the sheer horror of hearing your child, who you'd loved since they were a baby, had done something like this? Because I can't and I haven't a clue how I'd behave or react.

No, I can't imagine what that is like. But I am rational enough that after hearing the evidence, and being convinced they were guilty, I would make sure they took their punishment in the right way - pleading guilty.

Faugheen

Wombatman wrote: »

.... and that's enough for a murder conviction?

When you lied and said you weren’t there and left them at the park, then with every Garda interview you keep lying but start to place yourself more and more towards the scene to the point you admit to watching her start to die, then yes it is.

ohnonotgmail

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

perhaps they did advise them to plead guilty but the kids were free to ignore that advice. If you ask a kid to plead guilty and tell them they will definitely do time if they do or they can plead not guilty and take their chances what do you think a kid would do?

If that were the case and honestly, I don’t think it was..... a teenager being able to make the very grown up decision of whether to plead guilty or not guilty should be treated in every other area of their lives as an adult. Including naming of them.

If anyone deserved anonymity it was Ana but this started as a missing persons case so she didn’t get afforded that.

c68zapdsm5i1ru

Tomw86 wrote: »

No, I can't imagine what that is like. But I am rational enough that after hearing the evidence, and being convinced they were guilty, I would make sure they took their punishment in the right way - pleading guilty.

I was talking about the parents, and how they behaved.

shesty

When you read that RTE report of how the interviews with Boy B played out, I can see how the jury found him guilty.Fair play to the gardai.

Wombatman

iamwhoiam wrote: »

He lied about everything . Read the evidence .

So he murdered her then?

Is there proof that he led Ana to her death in the full knowledge of what Boy A was about to do? Text messages, emails, recordings maybe?

MrFresh

Wombatman wrote: »

.... and that's enough for a murder conviction?

He led her to the location, provided the tape and lied about it afterwards. It proves participation in the murder.

Amalgam

Priscilla Mushy Banner wrote: »

One of those boys, Robert Thompson, has gone on to lead a blameless life. The other has repeatedly come to the attention of the police. So it seems that it can be possible to rehabilitate child killers, but that it's not always the case.

Mary Bell springs to mind. She is a mother/grandmother at this point. That doesn't stop the tabloid articles where family members of her victims voice recriminations about her having children of her own, having killed theirs..

sbsquarepants

Priscilla Mushy Banner wrote: »

One of those boys, Robert Thompson, has gone on to lead a blameless life. The other has repeatedly come to the attention of the police. So it seems that it can be possible to rehabilitate child killers, but that it's not always the case.

You're concept of what constitutes a blameless life is a tad askew.

Torturing and killing a toddler renders you far outside my definition of blameless!

Keyzer

Jupiter Mulligan wrote: »

No, obviously I don't.

Let me repeat that, in case you're intellectually challenged OBVIOUSLY I DON'T.


However, that doesn't stop me being of the opinion that, for a number of reasons, the taxpayer-funded defence lawyers should have advised their clients to plead guilty.

Now, away with you. Go and annoy someone else with your nonsense.

You should really educate yourself on how the legal system works before turning this thread into a platform for you to argue with other people.

It's amazing how a thread about a girl who was callously murdered turns into a fiasco so soon.

God love Ana and her parents, may she rest in peace...

Nerdlingr

Wombatman wrote: »

.... and that's enough for a murder conviction?

You stated there was no DNA evidence that put Boy B at the scene.
There didn't need to be. As I said, he put himself there. He stated he led her to the house and saw the attack take place.
The jury obviously took all evidence presented to them into consideration to reach their verdict, and not just whether Boy B's DNA was at the scene or not.

Damien360

Dublin Spur wrote: »

great day for justice system
now don't ruin it with soft sentencing

I fail to see why the sentencing would suddenly be harsh. Day in and day out sees very soft sentencing for very serious matters. As minors, can the judge apply adult sentencing at all ? Or has the internet decided this is how it should be done ?

c68zapdsm5i1ru

Amalgam wrote: »

Mary Bell springs to mind. She is a mother/grandmother at this point. That doesn't stop the tabloid articles where family members of her victims voice recriminations about her having children of her own, having killed theirs..

I think Mary Bell and Robert Thompson both had horrific childhoods. Perhaps being taken away from their parents and sent to reform institutions was the saving of them. Whereas children who come from stable homes and still commit vicious crimes may not be as easy to rehabilitate.

shesty

Wombatman wrote: »

So he murdered her then?

Is there proof that he led Ana to her death in the full knowledge of what Boy A was about to do? Text messages, emails, recordings maybe?

Wombatman wrote: »

So he murdered her then?

Is there proof that he led Ana to her death in the full knowledge of what Boy A was about to do? Text messages, emails, recordings maybe?

Read the report.The judge instructed they could find him guilty if they thought he knew that Boy B was going to do this.The entire case against him was based on the evidence he gave himself about what happened.They decided to show the interviews, rather than read transcripts, to let the jury see body language, tone etc, most likely because they knew that was the only way they would get a true picture of what the boy was at.

c68zapdsm5i1ru

sbsquarepants wrote: »

You're concept of what constitutes a blameless life is a tad askew.

Torturing and killing a toddler renders you far outside my definition of blameless!

I said 'went on to live a blameless life'. I think it was perfectly clear what I meant.

El_Bee

Priscilla Mushy Banner wrote: »

One of those boys, Robert Thompson, has gone on to lead a blameless life. The other has repeatedly come to the attention of the police. So it seems that it can be possible to rehabilitate child killers, but that it's not always the case.

It baffles me how the steps in his rehabilitation is not public knowledge and made more widely known, because they obviously got it very right with him, yet the other one should have never seen the outside of a cell again.

yourdeadwright

The big question is as a society what do we do with kids like this ?

Should they be cast away and locked up forever or can they be reformed ?

Iv no idea what the answer is ,

I hope Ana's family feel some kind of justice In this although its impossible for them to ever feel whole again ,

Iv no idea what kind of families the boys came from but they have also lost there children to this whole horrific case,

Please god its the last time we see anything like this in the country for another hundred or so years ,

Amalgam

If one of the accused is found to have an incurable pathology, could he be held at the CMH, at some point, after prison.

Wasn't that the case for Malcolm MacArthur?

Tomw86

Priscilla Mushy Banner wrote: »

I was talking about the parents, and how they behaved.

So was I - I cannot honestly see how they think they behaved anything but in a poor manner.

Small Wonder

Priscilla Mushy Banner wrote: »

I said 'went on to live a blameless life'. I think it was perfectly clear what I meant.

It was perfectly clear. The level of reading comprehension in After Hours leaves a lot to be desired.

Faugheen

Wombatman wrote: »

So he murdered her then?

Is there proof that he led Ana to her death in the full knowledge of what Boy A was about to do? Text messages, emails, recordings maybe?

He gave Boy A the builders tape - therefore proving participation.

You don’t need hard evidence for every single case. This was all about what came it if his own mouth.

sbsquarepants

Priscilla Mushy Banner wrote: »

I said 'went on to live a blameless life'. I think it was perfectly clear what I meant.

You were, and so was I.

Some crimes are unforgiveable - Thompson is anything but blameless, he should die in a cell.