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Clare GAA Discussion part 2 , No Purple Jumpers Allowed !!
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windy shepard henderson wrote: »to be fair to louis mulqueen his cv is exceptional , i would have preferred him over lohan regardless of who he is loyal to,
as regards the board apologizing no chance , remember the real problem in clare gaa is us keyboard warriors that hide behind our screens :rolleyes:,
but sadly as you touched on yesterday its probably the only place we can have a voice , its not as if clubs can just enter clareabbey and successfully take the board on , there club will most likely suffer as a result , so i cant imagine anyone then one or two standing up to them
i keep saying the same thing about pat fitz and its simple , clubs must approach gaa hq if they want a change in the county , they are the only one's that can change his position . we are basically talking about clares very own frank murphy at the moment
Mulqueen to Galway is quietly gathering momentum I hear. Watch this space...
I 1000% agree with everything you mentioned there windy. On Tuesday, clubs must ask all the serious questions to the top table that I have said repeatedly on boards, throughout the past week or so. I anticipate though, that this type of questioning, will probably be ruled "out of order" by either Mr Cooney or the Runai. It's the way that these men "politician-like" operate, a closed shop, no one held to account at executive level for their actions or misbehavior.
As you mention, if that approach does not work, then all clubs should organize a bus to Croke Park, at the earliest opportunity possible and tell a few home truths about Fitz Snr, to those in big blazers in GAA HQ, that we have lost confidence in the county secretary for all kinds of reasons, many of which I have mentioned in the last few days.
Do clubs want this status quo remain for the foreseeable future? If they are prepared to take on the establishment and want change, then they must be prepared for a war, particularly the clubs with bigger resources must take a lead here big time. The smaller clubs cannot do that, in fear of what PF could retaliate if they did take that "war-type" approach against Mr. Fitzgerald, that could be extremely damaging for the future of that club.
I'm sick of discussing this same issue again and again and again. I know many posters are the same too. But this is an issue that has touched a raw nerve and I cannot allow the same individual get away with all the wrongs he has done and committed.
The biggest of the many types of inappropriate behavior, that he must be held accountable for imo is his manipulative actions against well-known GAA people in the county, in order to get his own agenda-ridden way. His dismissive nature by the concerns of the likes of Anthony Daly, Jamesie O'Connor and Brian Lohan to name but a few, that are genuinely concerned about Clare GAA going forward is truly staggering but not surprising for those that are close to Fitz snr.
To finish I feel that this forum is the best way in expressing my opinions, in relation to this most important of issues. I look forward to what Tuesday brings though and see if clubs are reading my posts on boards!!0 -
AnClar14959713 wrote: »I agree with what Bloody Bill and Letowski have said regarding what type of manager the Clare hurlers need in the future. If we go with the approach of a manager who is far too rigid, in other words its "this way or no way" autocratic approach then I think you don't get the players on side. The current Wexford senior hurling manager is one prime example.
A prime example of what? A manager who is getting the absolutel maximum out of the players available to him and has a panel of plyers who would absolutely die for him and are on record as saying as much? Again your obsession is blinding you.BloodyBill wrote: »Best news I heard since Loughnane took over from Len Gaynor
Len Gaynor did faboulous work in Clare hurling and '95 & '97 would not have happened only for him, a fact that has been recognised by all those invlovled at the time including Loughnane.0 -
Pogue eile wrote: »A prime example of what? A manager who is getting the absolutel maximum out of the players available to him and has a panel of plyers who would absolutely die for him and are on record as saying as much? Again your obsession is blinding you.
Len Gaynor did faboulous work in Clare hurling and '95 & '97 would not have happened only for him, a fact that has been recognised by all those invlovled at the time including Loughnane.
If you speak to any Clare player from 2014 to 2016, regarding Fitz Junior's man-management and his overall approach after winning the All-Ireland in '13, they will tell you a completely different story, to the one that you hear from the Wexford players currently.
Continuous overtraining and flogging of players, most of whom were just out of U-21, Players of the calibre of Conor Ryan and Darach Honan were forced to retire from all levels of GAA, due to DF's crazy training methods.
It doesn't end there. Humiliating 2 members of the Clare hurling panel in March 2015, in front of the whole squad, just after both players issued apologies to our "esteemed" manager for a breach of discipline. It was akin to Saipan in '02, Mick v Roy. His behavior on that night was beyond the usual hairdryer treatment you get from any sane manager.
His constant berating and bad language towards his own players on the sideline during matches, was incredibly nauseating. His behavior throughout matchdays in general made me embarrassed as a Clare man and I don't need to remind you again about it Pogue Eile.
Remember that match v Wexford in 2014, in the AI-qualifier at Ennis. His post-match behavior towards a certain well-known local GAA journalist, I'll get in big trouble if I mention this individual again, was the most toxic behavior during his reign as Clare manager.
After winning Liam McCarthy in '13, there was a real chance that Clare could become a dominate force in hurling for many years, along with our minor and U-21 successes during that period, it was a golden time for Clare hurling.
However DF destroyed all that with all those issues I addressed in the above all under his watch post-2013. His attritional approach with the physical training and the use of the sweeper system's, crowding the middle third etc, destroyed the massive potential that this squad was most capable of. If anyone wasn't happy with this approach, they just had to "suck it up".
He also had issues with his management team. In particular his treatment of Paul Kinnerk, meant that Kinnerk could not continue in his role as coach after 2014 and again in 2016, where he reluctantly returned, despite huge misgivings with DF was another issue that many Clare fans were most unhappy with.
It was well known in Clare GAA circles, that DF hated all the credit of our 2013 success went all with Kinnerk and very few had mentioned DF in the same context. Talk about having such a huge ego. Selfishness is a better word to describe the current Wexford senior hurling manager.
Him and his dad's despicable behavior towards players like many of our 90's warriors, who spoke out against the direction of where Clare GAA was going under Daddy's continued position as co. secretary, both men behaved like bullies.
I hold both men to account and responsible for why Clare hurling has not achieved the multiple All-Irelands that this group of hurlers fully deserves. Imagine if a man like Liam Sheedy was in charge of the Clare hurlers, after 2014, the time that DF should have walked? I can guarantee you that Clare would have further Liam McCarthy triumphs if he was in charge, that is not up for discussion.
The Fitz dynasty is despised in Clare, not just by me, but by many many others in the Banner County. We just don't want the return and second coming of Fitz Junior to Clare senior hurling manager's role once he leaves the Wexicans, for all those reasons that I mentioned in the above.
They are certainly not the angels that they are portrayed in the media and in the public domain. Look at my posts regarding Fitz Senior and his behavior throughout the botched Clare minor and senior hurling manager's positions, in the past few months and you will know what I'm talking about. Just one of many examples of PF's toxic ways he conducts himself about.
Finally do you think that DF should automatically expect to return to the Clare manager's position post-Wexit, despite huge misgivings from players, fans and the general Clare public. It will be a huge surprise if there is less than 7 players from the current Clare panel, that will not be part of any team that DF is manager in 2022 and beyond, no matter what.
I agree with you on that though re Gaynor. IMO Gaynor laid all the foundations for our mid 90's successes. At least that's one Tipp man that I won't give out about!0 -
Pogue eile wrote: »A prime example of what? A manager who is getting the absolutel maximum out of the players available to him and has a panel of plyers who would absolutely die for him and are on record as saying as much? Again your obsession is blinding you.
Len Gaynor did faboulous work in Clare hurling and '95 & '97 would not have happened only for him, a fact that has been recognised by all those invlovled at the time including Loughnane.
5 Points up against Tipp, a man up, and lost because he couldn't adapt on the day.
A few years ago, he had LIT vs UL.. five points down, and a man up and he kept playing a sweeper against all logic.
Next Year KK and Dublin are very likely to be stronger. Question is can Davy put a second year back to back with a good year. He had long enough in Clare and couldn't do it.
Len Gaynor was a great coach and Clare will always be in his debt, I suppose it took Loughnanes lunacy to get Clare past the mental block, and a bit of luck didn't hurt either.0 -
The Fitz dynasty is despised in Clare, not just by me, but by many many others in the Banner County. We just don't want the return and second coming of Fitz Junior to Clare senior hurling manager's role once he leaves the Wexicans, for all those reasons that I mentioned in the above.
'Not just by me'. Why? Are you a person of note in the context of Clare hurling? Massive streams of conscience about the Fitzgerald's in emotive expanses of waffle of this or any other forum is absolutely pointless. You want rid of Pat, and therefore by default Davy? Go to the next county board meeting or contact your club delegate and push them out democratically. Unless you publish a list of their crimes, so to speak, then the status quo will prevail. It's well known by any semi sentient functional human being that Davy is a repugnant vile little scrote with two massive chips on either shoulder and is a horrible entitled so and so. Pat is the embodiment of 'power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely.' Stand up to him. Make your voice heard.0 -
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Howitzer the 5th wrote: »The Fitz dynasty is despised in Clare, not just by me, but by many many others in the Banner County. We just don't want the return and second coming of Fitz Junior to Clare senior hurling manager's role once he leaves the Wexicans, for all those reasons that I mentioned in the above.
'Not just by me'. Why? Are you a person of note in the context of Clare hurling? Massive streams of conscience about the Fitzgerald's in emotive expanses of waffle of this or any other forum is absolutely pointless. You want rid of Pat, and therefore by default Davy? Go to the next county board meeting or contact your club delegate and push them out democratically. Unless you publish a list of their crimes, so to speak, then the status quo will prevail. It's well known by any semi sentient functional human being that Davy is a repugnant vile little scrote with two massive chips on either shoulder and is a horrible entitled so and so. Pat is the embodiment of 'power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely.' Stand up to him. Make your voice heard.
Its probably the only way to get them out. They are a symptom of what's wrong with small time amateur county boards. It's not a huge criticism, it could happen anywhere. The problem we have in Clare is that we know all this but we dont have a groundswell of people to come out and get their delegates to vote them out. In Clare we are in danger of everyone picking a side and staying behind the curtains. So this could rumble on until forever. What we need is a big crisis and only then will people have to put their heads up above the parapet. That's a sad state of affairs.
Poor auld Wexfords pigeons will come home to roost and boy are they in for a land. Theres only one way they are going and that's backwards..like a poster said. 5 points and a man up and lose...and yet they still hold him shoulder high...Please pass me the sick bowl0 -
Howitzer the 5th wrote: »The Fitz dynasty is despised in Clare, not just by me, but by many many others in the Banner County. We just don't want the return and second coming of Fitz Junior to Clare senior hurling manager's role once he leaves the Wexicans, for all those reasons that I mentioned in the above.
'Not just by me'. Why? Are you a person of note in the context of Clare hurling? Massive streams of conscience about the Fitzgerald's in emotive expanses of waffle of this or any other forum is absolutely pointless. You want rid of Pat, and therefore by default Davy? Go to the next county board meeting or contact your club delegate and push them out democratically. Unless you publish a list of their crimes, so to speak, then the status quo will prevail. It's well known by any semi sentient functional human being that Davy is a repugnant vile little scrote with two massive chips on either shoulder and is a horrible entitled so and so. Pat is the embodiment of 'power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely.' Stand up to him. Make your voice heard.
The "not just by me" comment was referring to my reply, to a post send by Pogue eile yesterday.
As I said a few days ago, I'm going through very tough times at the moment personally, so quite simply, I do not have the time to get involved in either GAA administration or being a club delegate for the foreseeable future.
I agree on the rest of your post though, except the "waffle" part you mentioned, for obvious reasons. It will be most interesting to see what tonight's Clare CB meeting will bring. Lets see what both delegates and the county board top table, have to say. We await tonight with great interest.0 -
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Does anyone know about whether the Clare CB meeting is definitely going ahead tonight, to formally ratify the respective Clare inter-county hurling management teams for 2020? Have heard nothing about this important CB meeting, in the local or national media this morning.
That's why I have my doubts about whether we will have any white smoke coming from Clareabbey, by the close of play this evening. Anyone with further clarification as to when this eagerly anticipated CB meeting will take place, would be greatly appreciated by this poster!!0 -
AnClar14959713 wrote: »Does anyone know about whether the Clare CB meeting is definitely going ahead tonight, to formally ratify the respective Clare inter-county hurling management teams for 2020? Have heard nothing about this important CB meeting, in the local or national media this morning.
That's why I have my doubts about whether we will have any white smoke coming from Clareabbey, by the close of play this evening. Anyone with further clarification as to when this eagerly anticipated CB meeting will take place, would be greatly appreciated by this poster!!
Thursday is the now the day for the CB meeting. Me thinks that PF is up to his old tricks yet again along with his CB allies. I have not a good feeling about this. :mad:0 -
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BloodyBill wrote: »Its probably the only way to get them out. They are a symptom of what's wrong with small time amateur county boards. It's not a huge criticism, it could happen anywhere. The problem we have in Clare is that we know all this but we dont have a groundswell of people to come out and get their delegates to vote them out. In Clare we are in danger of everyone picking a side and staying behind the curtains. So this could rumble on until forever. What we need is a big crisis and only then will people have to put their heads up above the parapet. That's a sad state of affairs.
Poor auld Wexfords pigeons will come home to roost and boy are they in for a land. Theres only one way they are going and that's backwards..like a poster said. 5 points and a man up and lose...and yet they still hold him shoulder high...Please pass me the sick bowl
If roles were reversed this year and Liam Sheedy was Wexford manager, I am convinced he would of won the All Ireland with Wexford.
He probably couldn’t believe what played out in front of his own eyes when they lost a man against Wexford. Talking about playing into the opposition hands.0 -
Fitz has won every adult intercounty trophy available without ever having managed any of the big three, an absolutely incredible achievement that no one has or ever will come close to replicating and if you were to believe some on here he hasnt a clue.
I dont like him as a person and I think he is two ends of a bol.. but to dismiss his ability as a manager is just plain silly.0 -
I am leaving boards. Unfortunately the personal issues that I've mentioned over the past few days, has taken a turn for the worst in the past couple of hours or so. For those who are sick of my anti-Fitz rhetoric, then you will probably be relieved by this news, of my departure of boards.ie.
My main priorities are now in dealing with these issues and helping my close family. Thanks in particular to all posters, moderators in boards, especially the Clare posters. Hopefully we will get Lohan and Coffey for the respective Clare senior and minor hurling manager's positions in '20 and get much needed transparency within the CB top table, along with plenty of Clare GAA success on the field come 2020 and beyond.
Thank you and finally I leave with these words, that are famed worldwide and hopefully we will hear a lot of the Banner roar come next year.
HON THE BANNER!!!!!0 -
But what do you think of Pat Fitz?0
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Pogue eile wrote: »Fitz has won every adult intercounty trophy available without ever having managed any of the big three, an absolutely incredible achievement that no one has or ever will come close to replicating and if you were to believe some on here he hasnt a clue.
I dont like him as a person and I think he is two ends of a bol.. but to dismiss his ability as a manager is just plain silly.
He had six goes with Clare,...that's enough.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rblfKREj50o0 -
Brian Lohan ratified tonight with Ken Ralph and James Moran in his backroom team. At least this whole fiasco has been finished anyway. But still not ideal at all. Lohan has no trainer or S&C team in place. The latter is certainly not ideal given how late it is now. Rumours are he is finding it hard to find people to work with. Its so late in the year now alot of people will be tied up with commitments. What an absolute complete joke Joe Cooney waited this long to appoint a manager. This mess is all his doing, I honestly have no idea what they were doing during the summer months.
I wish Lohan and his team well next year. I don't feel so optimistic, I think it will be a tough year, especially being down Duggan.
Good luck to Brian Coffey taking over the minors also.0 -
Hurling and football league fixtures out this week, lohans first fixture is against carlow at the end of January, the two away fixtures will tell more about his style of play and what we can expect, good that it's all leinster teams in the group with no real shadow boxing ahead of the munster championship
The games against carlow and Laois are crucial for squad rotation, no disrespect to either side as they are progressing nicely over the last couple of years but they are the games to see what we have on the fringes of the panel
Footballers have a more favourable league draw this year then last with reverse home fixtures of kildare, armagh and Fermanagh, two tough away assignments against the two relegated division 1 teams, while westmeath will still be smarting from the 1 point defeat in the championship in July
Hurling
Clare v Carlow Jan 26th
Wexford v Clare Feb 2nd
Clare v Laois Feb 16th
Kilkenny v Clare Feb 23rd
Clare v Dublin March 1
Football
Round 1: Westmeath v Clare on
Sunday, January 26 in Cusack
Park, Mullingar at 2pm.
Round 2: Clare v Kildare on
Sunday, February 2 in Cusack
Park at 2pm.
Round 3: Roscommon v Clare
on Sunday, February 9 in Dr
Hyde Park at 2pm.
Round 4: Clare v Laois on
Sunday, February 23 in Cusack
Park at 2pm.
Round 5: Cavan v Clare on Sun-
day, March 1 in Kingspan Breffni
Park at 2pm.
Round 6: Clare v Fermanagh
on Sunday, March 15 in Cusack
Park at 2pm.
Round 7: Clare v Armagh on
Sunday, March 22 in Cusack
Park at 2pm0 -
It's great that Lohan got ratified. The guff from the board about all the abuse they get online is absolutely cloak and daggers type stuff. If they do get abuse then it's bad form. However that shouldn't stop them doing their job or responding to genuine criticism (which they dont accept).
James Moran can do abit of coaching. I wouldnt worry about it so much. This magical coach stuff is another smokescreen. The Clare team can hurl . What they need is a clear style and some vision. This placing of Kinnerk and the Tipperary hurling coach on some pedestal isnt needed. Kinnerk still has Limerick hitting tonnes of wides like he had Clare doing when he was coach and Tipperary were destroyed in the Munster final. Getting the best players in their best positions is the number 1 priority.0 -
What an absolute complete joke Joe Cooney waited this long to appoint a manager. This mess is all his doing, I honestly have no idea what they were doing during the summer months.
I wouldn't put Cooney as the fall guy, it's the whole county board and mainly the Don who is at fault.
Great the hear they aren't talking any criticism and instead are trying to find out who is criticising them, great use of resources /s0 -
Best of luck to him now. Our league draw certainly will give Lohan a chance to try out a few things.0
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Join Date:Posts: 23155
There's been less than 2 months between Donal Moloney deciding to step down and a new manager being appointed, that's not a bad turn around in my opinion.0 -
Donal Moloney didn't step down though, his tenure ended after the Cork win. He withdrew his name for consideration after it became clear he wasn't the preferred choice, he voiced his intention to stay on in July I believe and no-one contacted him to say otherwise? and by all accounts it was expected that he would be ratified but the board dithered. It was a shambles from the start.
Lohan is already playing catch-up at this stage.0 -
Join Date:Posts: 23155
I think the lads had a 2 year agreement with an option for a third year, the third year option wasn't used, also I think the agreements are always for the end of the hurling championship rather than when Clare's envolvment ends.
Lohan has made his bed now, he canvassed through the press and has gotten the gig, best of luck to him but the fact that he doesn't have a full backroom team in place shows me that he wasn't really prepared fully, hopefully he'll catch up quickly.0 -
windy shepard henderson wrote: »Hurling and football league fixtures out this week, lohans first fixture is against carlow at the end of January, the two away fixtures will tell more about his style of play and what we can expect, good that it's all leinster teams in the group with no real shadow boxing ahead of the munster championship
The games against carlow and Laois are crucial for squad rotation, no disrespect to either side as they are progressing nicely over the last couple of years but they are the games to see what we have on the fringes of the panel
Footballers have a more favourable league draw this year then last with reverse home fixtures of kildare, armagh and Fermanagh, two tough away assignments against the two relegated division 1 teams, while westmeath will still be smarting from the 1 point defeat in the championship in July
Hurling
Clare v Carlow Jan 26th
Wexford v Clare Feb 2nd
Clare v Laois Feb 16th
Kilkenny v Clare Feb 23rd
Clare v Dublin March 1
Football
Round 1: Westmeath v Clare on
Sunday, January 26 in Cusack
Park, Mullingar at 2pm.
Round 2: Clare v Kildare on
Sunday, February 2 in Cusack
Park at 2pm.
Round 3: Roscommon v Clare
on Sunday, February 9 in Dr
Hyde Park at 2pm.
Round 4: Clare v Laois on
Sunday, February 23 in Cusack
Park at 2pm.
Round 5: Cavan v Clare on Sun-
day, March 1 in Kingspan Breffni
Park at 2pm.
Round 6: Clare v Fermanagh
on Sunday, March 15 in Cusack
Park at 2pm.
Round 7: Clare v Armagh on
Sunday, March 22 in Cusack
Park at 2pm
Where did you get those fixtures?0 -
I think the lads had a 2 year agreement with an option for a third year, the third year option wasn't used, also I think the agreements are always for the end of the hurling championship rather than when Clare's envolvment ends.
Lohan has made his bed now, he canvassed through the press and has gotten the gig, best of luck to him but the fact that he doesn't have a full backroom team in place shows me that he wasn't really prepared fully, hopefully he'll catch up quickly.
They were in charge from late 2016 so they oversaw the 2017,2018 and 2019 seasons. They had served their time, Moloney expressed interest and was left hanging while the board pulled their flutes waiting for either the return of the prodigal son (never going to happen with this bunch of players) or someone to come out of the ether and rescue them. They would take Moloney now I bet!!0 -
Marty Xavier wrote: »They were in charge from late 2016 so they oversaw the 2017,2018 and 2019 seasons. They had served their time, Moloney expressed interest and was left hanging while the board pulled their flutes waiting for either the return of the prodigal son (never going to happen with this bunch of players) or someone to come out of the ether and rescue them. They would take Moloney now I bet!!
Lohan is going to be great. Wait until he asks for some reasonable transport and meals from the board and they say no. He can go straight to the papers and say 'look at this shower holding us back'. In my view he has just played a blinder. This is all bigger than 2020. It's a battle for the direction of the Clare ship. Hes just dropped a depth charge on the Fitzgerald U Boat but its only shaken the structure...hes got to force them to the surface before turning the howitzers on them .0 -
Well either that or he falls into line and gets on with them, it is always easier being in opposition than in government!0
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Clareman wrote:I think the lads had a 2 year agreement with an option for a third year, the third year option wasn't used, also I think the agreements are always for the end of the hurling championship rather than when Clare's envolvment ends.
Correct, but the third year option was for the 2019 season. They had no fourth year pick up option for the 2020 season.0 -
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I think the lads had a 2 year agreement with an option for a third year, the third year option wasn't used, also I think the agreements are always for the end of the hurling championship rather than when Clare's envolvment ends.
Lohan has made his bed now, he canvassed through the press and has gotten the gig, best of luck to him but the fact that he doesn't have a full backroom team in place shows me that he wasn't really prepared fully, hopefully he'll catch up quickly.
exactly , he talked the talk for a number of years now its time to walk , i really hope he brings to the table what everyone say he will , i wouldnt worry too much about catch up we are in a favourable league division with no munster team so we dont have to go shadow boxing in the snow like we did last march against limerick
for the moment the return of fitz has been shelved in my opinion , why 1 , the clubs stood up to pat fitz , 2 bruiser resigning from the minors and 3, the withdrawal of louis mulqueen
it seems obvious now that mulqueen who in fairness did deserve his shot was asked to put his name forward against lohan, i dont think lynch was too happy in the end with his arrangement with the minors , to be fair i taught he done a good job for his first year in management , but unsure how much freedom he had in regards tactics
however if lohan is a flop it will open the double doors for you know who to return ,0
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