When They See Us (Netflix)

Slydice

Just finished episode 1. Can't remember seeing anything about this. Based/Inspired on the true story of the Central Park 5.
It's got an 8.2/10 on IMDB and a 93% on Rotten Tomatoes (critics only, too soon for audience score I guess)

So many faces I recognise in the cast. Like:

• Michael K. Williams - Omar from The Wire!
• Vera Farmiga - Lots like Source Code and The Boy in the Striped Pyjamas. I just saw her in Godzilla: King of the Monsters.
• Famke Janssen - X-Men!
• John Leguizamo - Lots like John Wick, Repo Men, Super Mario Bros. etc
• William Sadler - Lots like The Shawshank Redemption, the Grim Reaper in Bill & Ted's Bogus Journey etc

There's probably more I'm just not remembering.

You can go into it blind but I just had to check the wiki which says:

The series was inspired by the Central Park jogger case from 1989 in which a 28-year-old female jogger was attacked and raped in Central Park in New York City, leaving her in a coma for 12 days. Five juvenile males – four African-American and one Hispanic – were convicted of the crimes by juries in two separate trials in 1990. The convictions were subsequently vacated in 2002

So like I haven't spoiled myself on

how they get convicted yet but like .. I'm not seeing an obvious path to it with so many holes in the story.

Obviously I'm expecting it though.

Just watched the trailer. Looks like it gives away a chunk of the story:

TheSheriff

Watched this on a flight home tonight, thought it was excellent.

Didn't see it advertised much by Netflix so it was a good surprise.

Worth a watch ! Excellent cast.

Slydice

2: Damn that got heavy at the end.

Korey

in that scene where he was being questioned.. looked like maybe he couldn't read. Maybe that will come back later.

. Just noticed the actor is yer man from the film Moonlight:
https://www.imdb.com/name/nm7851611/

BobbyBobberson

Just finished it there, so good. Really heavy at times but def worth a watch.

Slydice

3: You know for a bit at the start, it looked to me like

Raymond might start doing better than the others.. with the contrasting scene of him getting on well with the girl while Kevin was taking getting trashed by the other girl. Not to be.

Generally the episode felt like

the System is stacked against them and it's luck of the draw about whether there'll be a social structure (like family) around to give support.

fin12

I’m watching episode 4 now, it’s awful what happening to Cory and feel like it’s the hardest episode to watch.

Dav13579

Just watched it. Loved it

finished it, very good....agreed with episode 4 being the toughest to watch

eagle eye

Watched all of this yesterday. Top five miniseries for me.
It's based on a true story and from what I've read it's very close to the facts in the parts where they are not disputed.

I recommend to all as a must watch, story, cast, the way it's shot are all perfect.

corkie

^^^ Learn to search before starting a New Thread?

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=110334219

threads merged

eagle eye

corkie wrote:

^^^ Learn to search before starting a New Thread?

I must have made an error in my search.

pixelburp

Mod: threads merged

whomitconcerns

It hardly needs spoilers as it's a true story with widely available facts...

fin12

I wish the show would have confirmed whether they were involved in other crimes that were committed that night.

theteal

fin12 wrote: »

I’m watching episode 4 now, it’s awful what happening to Cory and feel like it’s the hardest episode to watch.

I'm cracking on to ep 4 tonight

theteal

fin12 wrote: »

I wish the show would have confirmed whether they were involved in other crimes that were committed that night.

Actually, that's a point, it didn't show any crimes (apart from the guy getting punched out) really, the people on the bikes were nearly knocked over by kids sauntering by, that's about it.


Also, one thing that kind of irked me, the court case. I know it's probably done for dramatic effect but as the facts are presented to the viewer, that case is a slam dunk acquittal, the guilty verdict comes from nowhere.

fin12

I don’t know is it as black and white as the show is showing, they didn’t rape that woman as confirmed by DNA but what were they doing in the park?

fin12

fin12 wrote: »

I don’t know is it as black and white as the show is showing, they didn’t rape that woman as confirmed by DNA but what were they doing in the park?

https://www.frontpagemag.com/fpm/238071/central-park-five-still-guilty-jack-kerwick

theteal

fin12 wrote: »

https://www.frontpagemag.com/fpm/238071/central-park-five-still-guilty-jack-kerwick

Thanks for that but even that's very one sided in the other direction. No mention of blood on the suspects in the show? A lot of facts omitted for drama?

fin12

Well I don’t think we will ever know so as I read something else interesting about Corey wise and Reyes Meynes.

fin12

https://townhall.com/columnists/anncoulter/2018/07/25/central-park-rapists-trump-was-right-n2503894

I know this article is very one sided but on reflection the show is very one sided also.

https://townhall.com/columnists/anncoulter/2018/07/25/central-park-rapists-trump-was-right-n2503894

fin12

I know this article is very one sided but on reflection the show is very one sided also.

https://townhall.com/columnists/anncoulter/2018/07/25/central-park-rapists-trump-was-right-n2503894[/quote]

theteal

fin12 wrote: »

https://townhall.com/columnists/anncoulter/2018/07/25/central-park-rapists-trump-was-right-n2503894

I know this article is very one sided but on reflection the show is very one sided also.

https://townhall.com/columnists/anncoulter/2018/07/25/central-park-rapists-trump-was-right-n2503894

If some of those quotes are in fact true, it rubbishes this show completely.

fin12

fin12 wrote: »

https://townhall.com/columnists/anncoulter/2018/07/25/central-park-rapists-trump-was-right-n2503894

I know this article is very one sided but on reflection the show is very one sided also.

https://townhall.com/columnists/anncoulter/2018/07/25/central-park-rapists-trump-was-right-n2503894

Flicking through that website is telling. I don't think it can be trusted tbh.

Just finished the 2nd episode. Really picks up. I thought the first episode was ridiculous to be honest. The boys are so squeaky clean and the cops are pure evil. Maybe it happened like that but it doesn't feel real at all. Feels like propaganda.

theteal

Deleted User wrote: »

Just finished the 2nd episode. Really picks up. I thought the first episode was ridiculous to be honest. The boys are so squeaky clean and the cops are pure evil. Maybe it happened like that but it doesn't feel real at all. Feels like propaganda.

That's what I didn't warm to. Hence the trail verdict is completely at odds with what the viewer has been presented. It's just a bit too one-sided and somewhat difficult to believe.

Shelga

theteal wrote: »

That's what I didn't warm to. Hence the trail verdict is completely at odds with what the viewer has been presented. It's just a bit too one-sided and somewhat difficult to believe.

Agreed, I don’t know how the jury found them guilty based on what we saw? There wasn’t a shred of evidence apart from coerced confessions.

Slydice

Just finished.

Awe jeez I'm gonna need some recovery time after that last episode

During episode 3, I had thought it was a bit odd that we were told about

Korey but didn't see him much.

That was so sad and messed up. Everything went bad

Jeez he got it hard. F*CK Though! When that last parole hearing came about I was saying F%ck the Parole but for a second it looked like he might have confessed. Then he hadn't and I was like YEAH! F*CK THEM ALL!

Excellent well made series. Heartbreaking.

TheManthatsDan

There were about 40 of them in the park that night, a number of joggers and such were beaten unconscious and robbed, one person got smashed up with a metal pipe and nearly killed. But...they're not rapists, and had to deal with the stigma of that and probably still do. As well as Corey spending his youth in prison, that wasnt justice for the crimes that they were at least accessories to.

Irish Guitarist

I thought it was weird how the guard gave Korey a chance but suddenly turned against him because he got into a fight. There was just something off about it, like it was trying to prove some kind of point about how even the nicest of white people will turn their back on black people at the first sign of trouble.

The whole thing seems like propaganda. Another example is the way they tried to make the female cyclist look a whiny crybaby. Stupid woman with your white privilege. Just take your beating and stop complaining.

listermint

Let's just clarify things here the websites linked here are Ann Coulter articles. Yes that Ann Coulter darling of the far right . Promoter of trump the very same trump who took out articles in the 80s to call for the death sentence on these teenagers.

I wouldn't take a word in them as fact nor the poster that posted them. It's gas when even the TV section of the forum gets polluted with this opinion nonsense. Or is it gas..... No let's go with Sad.

Irish Guitarist

I'd be more inclined to believe this if it didn't paint the teens as being so pure and naive.

There's really no explanation for why they were there at that time of night. Surely they knew the park had a reputation? I find it hard to believe that the cops picked five random teenagers that didn't know each other, and these just happened to be the only ones out of the dozens of teens there that weren't causing any kind of trouble.

They may not have raped the woman but I doubt they were in the park to just innocently frolic around among the flowers.

Mantis Toboggan

Great show, quality TV.

Greyfox

Superb TV series, 10/10 and one of the best things on netflix. its terrible that more people arent watching this. Regardless of how its portrayed in the series what the cops did at the time was disgusting

Lucas Hood

The actor who played Korey Wise was brilliant i thought.

SusieBlue

Probably the best Netflix Original series I've seen in a long time, if ever.

They were vulnerable disadvantaged children who didn't know their rights, some were questioned without their parents and iirc none even had legal representation.
The well educated "professional" adults in charge of their fate took full advantage of this and exploited it to assert their guilt. They were duped into believing that if they were agreeable with what the police wanted them to say, they'd be allowed go home.
Poor Korey couldn't even read the sworn written confession he had allegedly written, ffs.

It was so hard to watch. I've since watched interviews and

you can tell poor Korey is still so messed up from what happened to him. Its not something you recover from I imagine, just something you learn to live with.

Boom_Bap

Lucas Hood wrote: »

The actor who played Korey Wise was brilliant i thought.

He was f*cking amazing, best/freshest bit of acting I've seen in a long long time.


The follow up interview with Oprah is now on Netflix which should be worth watching.


I've known of this case for years now and watched whatever documentaries I could find on it. The way the TV show has brought it to life and added nuances that are not covered in documentaries is astounding. Excellent cast as well.

Hazys

Great show but it did seem too biased towards that the kids were complete angels. I was trying to look for some more balanced info but it was hard to find. The only articles i could find were too biased in the opposite direction. Basically all the articles were right wing nuts only calling the kids guilty so they could defend Trump's actions during the time :rolleyes:.

I did find an interesting reddit thread: https://www.reddit.com/r/WhenTheySeeUs/comments/bwsbjf/how_biased_was_the_show_lets_look_at_the_real/

Dial Hard

Shelga wrote: »

Agreed, I don’t know how the jury found them guilty based on what we saw? There wasn’t a shred of evidence apart from coerced confessions.

According to Wiki:

Jurors who were interviewed after the trials said that they were not convinced by the youths' confessions, but were impressed by the physical evidence introduced by the prosecutors: semen (although none of the defendants' DNA matched the two samples in the evidence, both noted as belonging to another, unidentified man), grass, dirt, and two hairs described as "consistent with" the victim's hair[4]:6 that were recovered from Richardson's underpants.[53] (Note: More advanced DNA testing in 2002 established that, in fact, these hairs in Richardson's clothes did not come from the victim.)[54]

But with DNA evidence still comprising a new kind of testimony at most trials, the jurors did not seem to understand the most important evidence: the fact that each of the five defendants' DNA was conclusively excluded from matching that found in two samples, both of which belonged to another, unidentified male. The FBI witness testified that in fact, the DNA of a total of 14 men was tested, including Meili's former boyfriend, and in each case was excluded as not matching those samples collected from the victim and a sock at the scene

Irish Guitarist wrote: »

The whole thing seems like propaganda. Another example is the way they tried to make the female cyclist look a whiny crybaby. Stupid woman with your white privilege. Just take your beating and stop complaining.

I didn't receive it that way at all, I thought they portrayed her as very dignified and literally just laying out the facts of what she could remember and how she had been physically affected.

letowski

Finished watching the episodes, very surprised this hasn't been getting more attention in Ireland, its an excellent series.

I haven't followed the case in detail, so I'm not sure how biased it is, but its still riveting tv. I thought the way they protray the struggles of the boys after prison was really eye opening and moving. It reminded me, just a little, of Shawshank Redemption, how hard it is for former prisoners to re integrate into society.

I must admit, I found episide 4 very heavy viewing emotionally. The actor who played Korey Wise did an outstanding job and the musical score in the background further added to the episode.

Overall it was excellent tv.

Azatadine

Yeah, I remember putting the last episode on pause momentarily a few times to check how long was left Thinking how much more could he take.

El Duda

This is an incredible series. Such raw emotion, from anger to sadness.

I think the people questioning the squeaky clean portrayal of the 5 lads need to give their head a shake. This is a heartbreaking case of injustice. I don't see how anyone could have anything but the deepst sympathy for them.

American police are terrifying.

yourdeadwright

I watched this and really enjoyed it and had always an eye on the story in the past so I knew it quite well,

One thing that I found odd the guy who played Korey Wise seemed to play him as a normal kid at the beginning and only really got across that Korey was a slow learner from when it went to court onwards ,

That actor is in the Oscar winning movie Moonlight and also Mr Mercedes , he is a great young actor,

Boom_Bap

You should watch the Oprah interview thing after finishing the series.


There's some heartbreaking stuff in it.

Enzokk

Hazys wrote: »

Great show but it did seem too biased towards that the kids were complete angels. I was trying to look for some more balanced info but it was hard to find. The only articles i could find were too biased in the opposite direction. Basically all the articles were right wing nuts only calling the kids guilty so they could defend Trump's actions during the time :rolleyes:.

I did find an interesting reddit thread: https://www.reddit.com/r/WhenTheySeeUs/comments/bwsbjf/how_biased_was_the_show_lets_look_at_the_real/

I think the reason this story will seem biased is because the reporting of the facts will make it seem biased. If you want facts you can watch the documentary, The Central Park 5, by Ken Burns. If you watch that you will, in hindsight, be baffled how anyone could have thought these kids were involved.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9GNptTI9Gmc

Here is a NY Times story about it as well, The True Story of How a City in Fear Brutalized the Central Park Five, and here is a few quotes that I find just as disturbing about what we know now.

After months of investigation, Manhattan district attorney Robert M. Morgenthau concluded Mr. Reyes knew what he was talking about, and that the five boys had not. Their confessions were a mash of error. Mr. Morgenthau moved to vacate the verdicts his office had won. The original story dissolved in a meticulous 58-page report, written by two senior assistants, Nancy Ryan and Peter Casolaro.

It documented how Mr. Reyes hunted and hurt women on his own. Investigators found no connections between him and the five, or to other teens in the park that night. Two days before the attack on Ms. Meili, he had raped another woman in the park. In the three months after, he raped four others, murdering one. He always acted alone. His admissions in 2002 about the 1989 park rapes came while he was serving time for the other crimes.

So we know the group the kids was with that day was causing trouble, nobody has denied this. But seeing that it was nothing to get worked up about in a city that had 5 murders a day and almost 9 rape incidents in 1989, you have to wonder why people keep bringing this up. I am fairly certain why.

What we do have is the police botching the case and ruining the lives of 5 innocent kids and another 4 lives, one of whom was murdered. And still today those responsible for this will not take responsibility.

Zero-Cool

Amazing, just amazing. Especial ep 4 and the guy who played Korey. I never have an interest in award shows but looked up the emmys and saw this has a rake of em but is going up against Chernobyl in its category so should be an interesting one.

Completely lost interest in the middle of episode 3. Need to give it another go.

Zero-Cool

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Completely lost interest in the middle of episode 3. Need to give it another go.

3 did dip a bit but 4 is some of the best telly in a long time, well worth your time.

cjmcork

ok so I've been recommended this and I've a general gist of the story - but can anyone advise as to whether the rape scene is actually shown (I'd rather not watch that particular scene)

Slydice

I honestly can't remember. I don't think they show it directly. I remember the show being focused around the investigation and there are flashbacks to the night but I can't remember a specific scene for it.

Just checked commonsensemedia:
https://www.commonsensemedia.org/tv-reviews/when-they-see-us

Common Sense says age 15+
Parents say age 14+ Based on 6 reviews
Kids say age 14+ Based on 6 reviews

What parents need to know
...
but the central crime isn't shown on-screen
...

Pat_bottom

cjmcork wrote: »

ok so I've been recommended this and I've a general gist of the story - but can anyone advise as to whether the rape scene is actually shown (I'd rather not watch that particular scene)

No its not your safe enough. Its an excellent watch.