Say something nice about AGS

Mad_maxx

youcantakethat wrote: »

Same as in all English speaking countries, most are sound enough and if you behave within the law and do not give cheek they are fine. I have been to a few African and Asian countries though where I would not have full confidence in their forces.

It's not a good idea to benchmark police or tap water to the developing world

Then again we have always held our police force to a remarkably low standard of ethics

Stephen15

Iris Tiny Sewer wrote: »

Oh you know, police forces throughout Latin America, Africa, Asia, Eastern Europe.

But those are countries which are widely regarded by most as being poorer and with more corruption than our own. We should expect a police force that's on a par with other Western European countries. I fail to see how the Gardai are a better police force than police forces in other developed nations.

We should be looking the countries with the lowest crime rates and seeing how their police force operates.

What people are able to do though is distinguish the non crooked ones (the vast majority) from the crooked minority. I know there shouldn't be any crooked minority at all, of course, but I think it's grossly unfair the way people happily smear the whole lot of them.

And the title of the thread is "say something nice about AGS" not "say something nice about members of AGS" it's the same difference between "say something nice about the HSE" and "say something nice about Nurses/Doctors". Yes there may be good Gardai out there that may do a good job but the thread title infers that we're talking about AGS as a whole rather than members of AGS.

Gimme A Pound

Stephen15 wrote: »

And the title of the thread is "say something nice about AGS" not "say something nice about members of AGS" it's the same difference between "say something nice about the HSE" and "say something nice about Nurses/Doctors". Yes there may be good Gardai out there that may do a good job but the thread title infers that we're talking about AGS as a whole rather than members of AGS.

But exactly - the whole are not corrupt and abusive.

Heckler

Deal with the Guards every so often at the station just to renew firearms licences. Always found them them professional and courteous. Don't like my current station where its like a doctors waiting room. In front of me is some fella signing on re parole and its obvious the guy behind me is doing the same. With this guy right behind me the guard is reciting my name, address and what firearms I have as he fills out forms.

And if you're about to ask how its obvious just stop.

Stopped at a few checkpoints and breathalysed. Found them very friendly.

My interactions were all with younger (25yrs-40yrs) Guards. The one bad experience was with an older guy but I guess I'll keep that for the bad experience of AGS thread !

So mostly positive !

Rosie Rant

In my experience, they deal with extremely tragic and difficult circumstances with amazing sensitivity, respect and kindness. I am grateful for the work that they do. It can't be an easy job.

pah

Mad_maxx wrote: »

The vast majority are clock punchers, in it for a solid wage and great early pension, a minority are vocational in their desire to serve and a minority are out and out scumbags, most will do you no harm but have little interest in inconveniencing themselves in anyway

I had two uncles in the guards and one grandfather, I've no time for the org as its riddled with corruption, how willing they are to help depends on who is doing the complaining and who is being complained about, find yourself in dispute with someone who has friends high up in AGS and your life gets made very uncomfortable and your eyes are opened to the level of politics which riddles the force

Would you like some sort of dip to go with that?

Mad_maxx

Heckler wrote: »

Deal with the Guards every so often at the station just to renew firearms licences. Always found them them professional and courteous. Don't like my current station where its like a doctors waiting room. In front of me is some fella signing on re parole and its obvious the guy behind me is doing the same. With this guy right behind me the guard is reciting my name, address and what firearms I have as he fills out forms.

And if you're about to ask how its obvious just stop.

Stopped at a few checkpoints and breathalysed. Found them very friendly.

My interactions were all with younger (25yrs-40yrs) Guards. The one bad experience was with an older guy but I guess I'll keep that for the bad experience of AGS thread !

So mostly positive !

Those are mostly vanilla administration duties

I've had no bother with guards at checkpoints either, tells us nothing as those are nothing experiences

Mad_maxx

pah wrote: »

Would you like some sort of dip to go with that?

No idea what you're on about

Stephen15

Iris Tiny Sewer wrote: »

But exactly - the whole are not corrupt and abusive.

I know that and I never said they were. The problem is with senior and middle management not ordinary Gardai but the thread is about AGS as an organisation. It's like saying we have a good health service because the nurses are good at their jobs while ignoring the fact of how badly managed and organised the HSE is.

archer22

Mad_maxx wrote: »

If the vast majority were not crooked, Maurice mccabe would not have had to plough a lonely furrow for years, the vast majority get in line and support the culture of the force

Exactly, what they done to Maurice McCabe was beyond scummy...I can't imagine another Police force anywhere in the world who would sink that low.

Heckler

Mad_maxx wrote: »

Those are mostly vanilla administration duties

I've had no bother with guards at checkpoints either, tells us nothing as those are nothing experiences

Ok. Thread title is "Say something nice about the AGS"

The Guards are great.

Happy now ?

Mad_maxx

archer22 wrote: »

Exactly, what they done to Maurice McCabe was beyond scummy...I can't imagine another Police force anywhere in the world who would sink that low.

Many of mccabes colleagues kicked him on the ground, bar Wilson, who went against the mob boss?

Heckler

Mad_maxx wrote: »

Many of mccabes colleagues kicked him on the ground, bar Wilson, who went against the mob boss?

How is anyone expected to form a personal opinion about the Guards other than their personal experiences with them ?

PeteEd

omerin wrote: »

They're not the RUC

I see your RUC

And raise you Black n Tans

Dante7

They haven't done me yet.

Gimme A Pound

archer22 wrote: »

Exactly, what they done to Maurice McCabe was beyond scummy...I can't imagine another Police force anywhere in the world who would sink that low.

Ah here - horrifically scummy as it was, of course there are other police forces in the world that would sink that low.

Gimme A Pound

Stephen15 wrote: »

But those are countries which are widely regarded by most as being poorer and with more corruption than our own.

I know, but you asked for elaboration when someone said they are better than other police forces. That's what they meant. While of course the wrongdoings here were appalling and deserve all the condemnation they get, and more, overall there are still far worse police forces. It doesn't make the wrongdoings here ok of course, but it's true. It doesn't mean that there shouldn't be hard work to make improvements here of course.

Mad_maxx

Heckler wrote: »

How is anyone expected to form a personal opinion about the Guards other than their personal experiences with them ?

Your interactions were akin to dealing with the local authority for administrative issues, not real enforcement hard stuff

Pure vanilla

hatrickpatrick

The local Gardaí out my direction (Dun Laoghaire) are unbelievably sound, good at their jobs, very quick to respond to calls and very relaxed about giving people a bit of leeway in terms of public order, crowds gathering to have cans in the sun etc, before intervening only if a situation gets out of hand. They keep a regular presence down at Sandycove beach on sunny days with a few vans parked around the place, but I've only ever seen them break up an outdoor sesh or rave if people start fighting. Most of the time they just chill and keep a very visible eye.

Lived here since the mid-90s and can't think of a single instance of publicised heavy handedness or failure to respond to a call - and things tend to go around in this town so I imagine if these things happened, we'd be hearing about them.

The night of the Blood Moon a few weeks ago, I woke up late for it and raced out of the gaff without bothering to put on my shoes to make sure I didn't miss it (just as well, as I got a clear view of it but would have seen nothing but cloud cover if I'd arrived ten minutes later) - a squad car drove past and they stopped to make sure I was ok considering how odd it is for a lad to be wandering the streets in his dressing down and barefoot They weren't unpleasant about it at all, seemed genuinely concerned that I might be disoriented or off my head on something. Had a good laugh at my explanation of my predicament and drove on.

In all the time I've lived here I've never heard a word against our local lads, which seems to be somewhat unusual in the Dublin area generally so that's pretty cool.

RWCNT

One of them was very nice to my Ma and called her up to check on her/offer support years ago when she was having bother with a fella harassing her.

Another one was really sound to me as a teen after I got into trouble with a local scumbag who was threatening to stab me after I'd bet him up one night.

I'm not a great fan of the institution itself but never been in any doubt that some guards are grand people who genuinely want to help their communities. AACABBNAOT.

Edgware

archer22 wrote: »

Exactly, what they done to Maurice McCabe was beyond scummy...I can't imagine another Police force anywhere in the world who would sink that low.

You dont get out much.

archer22

Edgware wrote: »

You dont get out much.

I get out a lot (perhaps you don't)

Now show me another case anywhere in the world where a police force tried to frame one of it's officers for child sex abuse because he highlighted unprofessional behaviour in the organisation.

_Kaiser_

pah wrote: »

Would you like some sort of dip to go with that?

This is the attitude I hate when it comes to AGS...

There are good individual members most certainly, who take the role and the responsibility and consequences it has for people with the seriousness and respect it deserves and these people deserve every recognition and support.

But there are a lot who range from lazy and disinterested to outright corrupt and incompetent. Recognising that and demanding change is a GOOD thing and something we should all be demanding. As above, given the effects these people can have on others lives and livelihoods, it's just not good enough to say "Ah but it's only some of them! They have a tough job sure!" - that's just nonsense.

Just because they're Gardai doesn't make them infallible or immediately deserving of respect, and it CERTAINLY doesn't make them above criticism and scrutiny. AGS as an organisation badly needs this latter part and significant reform/restructuring if it's to actually be a modern, effective police force for the country.

randd1

I know a bangarda, she's local to us. She's a traffic guard, known as a bit of a stickler for the rules, will do anyone for anything if she has the chance, a grand out of the uniform/a bit of a tyrant in it type.

We were on to her messing one night at a club do, all in good spirits, why she' s so tough on people, would you not let lads go driving after a pint, that sort of thing.

She simply said "have any of ye had to pick up a limb off the road after a car accident? I have. I don't want to do it again". We went a bit quiet after that.

Always struck me that she'd prefer people to despise her than not be alive. Can't imagine having to walk in to work knowing that every day people are going to hate you for doing your job of trying to keep them alive by enforcing the laws.

Mad_maxx

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

This is the attitude I hate when it comes to AGS...

There are good individual members most certainly, who take the role and the responsibility and consequences it has for people with the seriousness and respect it deserves and these people deserve every recognition and support.

But there are a lot who range from lazy and disinterested to outright corrupt and incompetent. Recognising that and demanding change is a GOOD thing and something we should all be demanding. As above, given the effects these people can have on others lives and livelihoods, it's just not good enough to say "Ah but it's only some of them! They have a tough job sure!" - that's just nonsense.

Just because they're Gardai doesn't make them infallible or immediately deserving of respect, and it CERTAINLY doesn't make them above criticism and scrutiny. AGS as an organisation badly needs this latter part and significant reform/restructuring if it's to actually be a modern, effective police force for the country.

Usual self satisfied comments from those too gormless to question someone in authority

Not you, post you replied to

Mad_maxx

randd1 wrote: »

I know a bangarda, she's local to us. She's a traffic guard, known as a bit of a stickler for the rules, will do anyone for anything if she has the chance, a grand out of the uniform/a bit of a tyrant in it type.

We were on to her messing one night at a club do, all in good spirits, why she' s so tough on people, would you not let lads go driving after a pint, that sort of thing.

She simply said "have any of ye had to pick up a limb off the road after a car accident? I have. I don't want to do it again". We went a bit quiet after that.

Always struck me that she'd prefer people to despise her than not be alive. Can't imagine having to walk in to work knowing that every day people are going to hate you for doing your job of trying to keep them alive by enforcing the laws.

She sounds like a top cop, I've no quarell with that kind of enforcement and having to pay a fine is hardly victimisation, Maurice mc cabe was hated by locals in Cavan for enforcing the law, where I live now, the local copper allows the pubs remain open until 1 am, he is universally loved despite being a useless gob****e

Hoboo

Not our brightest or best. Nicest thing I can think of.

Gimme A Pound

Mad_maxx wrote: »

Usual self satisfied comments from those too gormless to question someone in authority

Not you, post you replied to

With a comment like that though, you're being as bad as people who say those who are highly critical of the guards are likely to be scumbags.

It's not a case of one or the other. You can be someone who sees that most guards are not corrupt and also someone who questions wrongdoing by those in authority.

El_Bee

I'd tell you if I saw one, they're like unicorns around here.

Gimme A Pound

archer22 wrote: »

I get out a lot (perhaps you don't)

Now show me another case anywhere in the world where a police force tried to frame one of it's officers for child sex abuse because he highlighted unprofessional behaviour in the organisation.

You said you can't imagine it anywhere else in the world, I think they're implying that they could imagine it happening elsewhere in the world (although the wording was unhelpful). Seeing as there are awful people everywhere and much much more corrupt police forces elsewhere, it could easily happen.