Do we really need to build the Metrolink?

cluane

This noddy train which has been called 'Metrolink' is in the news today again:

rte.ie/news/dublin/2019/0221/1031984-metrolink/

It's useless. It is said to provide a brilliant service to the airport, but as it's public sector won't start for the first wave of departures and probably will be on strike 75% of the time.

What we need to do is extend the DART to Drogheda, Kilcock and Navan, complete the DART Underground so that it would run on to Kildare station, have the Luas interconnect at Connolly, extend the Red Line to Rathcoole and Leixlip where it'll interconnect with the DART at Confey and extend the Green Line to Bray where it would interconnect with the DART there. We also need to massively improve bus services and I don't mean this BusConnects or Go Ahead plan.

That is what we need to do for the Dublin region transport system and not build the fu**ing Metrolink.

Hedgelayer

There will be a Traintrack from Limerick to Shannon before that one takes off.

TheValeyard

You really are determined to have a Public Sector bashing thread OP, last one didn't work for ya?

Franz Von Peppercorn

cluane wrote: »

This noddy train which has been called 'Metrolink' is in the news today again:

rte.ie/news/dublin/2019/0221/1031984-metrolink/

It's useless. It is said to provide a brilliant service to the airport, but as it's public sector won't start for the first wave of departures and probably will be on strike 75% of the time.

What we need to do is extend the DART to Drogheda, Kilcock and Navan, complete the DART Underground so that it would run on to Kildare station, have the Luas interconnect at Connolly, extend the Red Line to Rathcoole and Leixlip where it'll interconnect with the DART at Confey and extend the Green Line to Bray where it would interconnect with the DART there. We also need to massively improve bus services and I don't mean this BusConnects or Go Ahead plan.

That is what we need to do for the Dublin region transport system and not build the fu**ing Metrolink.

The dart and luas are still very limited i their coverage. Why should bray get two ways of getting to the centre and Blanch none?

I don’t like the metro either.

Ubbquittious

Twould be great if they actually built it instead of talking about it

JupiterKid

I disagree. We need most of the public transport imrovements you suggested AND the Metro to the Airport.

Dublin is one of the few capital cities in the developed world that does not have a direct high capacity rail service from its city centre to its airport and it is shameful.

Public transport is woefully poor in Ireland. Urgent backlog priorities ate the Metro line, full DART to Maynooth, the DART underground inner city connector and expansion of the LUAS system, coupled with increased denisty housing along the aforementioned systems.

cluane

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

You really are determined to have a Public Sector bashing thread OP, last one didn't work for ya?

No, I think that public operated transport is the best way forward - but it needs RADICAL changes in efficiency. Which is why I think that the buses, DART and Luas should be prioritised over this Metro shíte.

yabadabado

Poor effort OP ,must try harder.

cluane

The airport is 5km inland from the DART line. Passengers at the airport won't use the Metro because it won't start until 7 so they won't be able to use it for the first departures and it'll close at 11 so they won't be able to use it for the final departures/arrivals. Plus the current plans propose completely fúcking up the Luas Green Line when they have a million and one alternative routes on the South line.

Cookie_Monster

it's been planned for 50 years, every 5-10 years they dust off the last set of plans, amend them slightly, spend a fortune and put them back on the shelf. It'll never happen

Your Face

Build and progress

Pinch Flat

No, dublin is city perfectly suited to 20% full vehicles all trying to get to the city together. 100,000 is not enough and given the thought our Georgian forefathers in planning for the motor car another 50,000 could easily be accommodated.

cluane

What we need to do is:
1. Extend the DART to Drogheda, Kilcock and Navan, complete the DART Underground so that it would run on to Kildare station, have the Luas interconnect at Connolly, extend the Red Line to Rathcoole and Leixlip where it'll interconnect with the DART at Confey and extend the Green Line to Bray where it would interconnect with the DART there. We also need to massively improve bus services and I don't mean this BusConnects or Go Ahead plan.
2. Widen the M50 to 4 lanes and complete the eastern bypass. M2, M3 and M4 should be upgraded to motorway standard from the M50 junctions, not being the N2, N3 and N4 for a few exits and then becoming motorways.
3. Extend the M2 to past Ashbourne to join with the N33 at Ardee so that HGVs can bypass the deathtrap bridge in Slane.
4. Extend the M7 motorway from Naas to Junction 8 M50 in FULL motorway standard.
5. Build an outer Dublin ring-road from Drogheda to Newbridge.
6. Have public transport start at 5am and end at 1am.
7. Bring Dublin Bus back into full state ownership and buy buses from THE ONLY IRISH VEHICLE MANUFACTURER(!), Wrightbus. Renew the fleet with brand new models every year.
8. Give public transport workers SUFFICEINT PAY!
9. Build Terminal 3 at Dublin Airport.

Doing all of the above will improve the quality of living in Dublin, make it environmentally cleaner by taking millions of vehicles off the road each her due to public transport usage and increase Dublin's population. But of course the government are too fu**ed up to realise that.

cluane

If we are going to build the Metro, have it like the London Underground - numerous lines reaching out in all directions to different suburbs. It also needs to run from 4 in the morning until half midnight.

cluane

While my above proposals will doubtless cost 10-12 billion, it will end up in the long-term being the most worthwhile investment the government could ever possibly make

salmocab

cluane wrote: »

The airport is 5km inland from the DART line. Passengers at the airport won't use the Metro because it won't start until 7 so they won't be able to use it for the first departures and it'll close at 11 so they won't be able to use it for the final departures/arrivals. Plus the current plans propose completely fúcking up the Luas Green Line when they have a million and one alternative routes on the South line.

What makes you think the metro will start at 7? The luas starts before 6 and it has drivers which the metro is unlikely to have. You seem to have decided something based on absolutely nothing.

chosen1

https://www.newstalk.com/newstalk-breakfast/group-unveils-plan-for-sixline-dublin-metro-system-by-2025-491038
How come this privately funded expanded metro is never even discussed?

Only heard about it on one or two media outlets. Wouldn't it be worthwhile for the government to at least meet him and see what he has to say.

4068ac1elhodqr

Hyperloop is the future, but it will take someone else, somewhere else, to prove its effectiveness.

Last Stop

So what the OP is suggesting that Kildare gets a massive increase in public transport as well as new roads while the airport which carried 30 MILLION people last year and Swords with approx. 30,000 people don’t get anything?
Makes perfect sense.

Last Stop

cluane wrote: »

If we are going to build the Metro, have it like the London Underground - numerous lines reaching out in all directions to different suburbs. It also needs to run from 4 in the morning until half midnight.

Yes because the London Undergorund was built as numerous lines overnight.

cluane

Last Stop wrote: »

So what the OP is suggesting that Kildare gets a massive increase in public transport as well as new roads while the airport which carried 30 MILLION people last year and Swords with approx. 30,000 people don’t get anything?
Makes perfect sense.

What doesn't make any sense is a Metro that'll serve the airport but not be available for the first and last wave of flights.

salmocab

cluane wrote: »

What doesn't make any sense is a Metro that'll serve the airport but not be available for the first and last wave of flights.

Why are you repeating this nonsense?

cluane

salmocab wrote: »

Why are you repeating this nonsense?

How is it nonsense?

questionmark?

cluane wrote: »

Last Stop wrote: »

So what the OP is suggesting that Kildare gets a massive increase in public transport as well as new roads while the airport which carried 30 MILLION people last year and Swords with approx. 30,000 people don’t get anything?
Makes perfect sense.

What doesn't make any sense is a Metro that'll serve the airport but not be available for the first and last wave of flights.

Your just making that up as you have no idea if this would happen.
Airport needs rail connected transport now and even more so with the expansion plans.

salmocab

cluane wrote: »

How is it nonsense?

Because you don’t know the operating hours of something that hasn’t been built.

JohnC.

cluane wrote: »

What doesn't make any sense is a Metro that'll serve the airport but not be available for the first and last wave of flights.

What is your source for this?

L1011

chosen1 wrote: »

https://www.newstalk.com/newstalk-breakfast/group-unveils-plan-for-sixline-dublin-metro-system-by-2025-491038
How come this privately funded expanded metro is never even discussed?

Only heard about it on one or two media outlets. Wouldn't it be worthwhile for the government to at least meet him and see what he has to say.

It has been discussed here. It's a worthless fantasy

cluane wrote: »

What doesn't make any sense is a Metro that'll serve the airport but not be available for the first and last wave of flights.

This is untrue and you have been told this already

an_fathach

cluane wrote: »

The airport is 5km inland from the DART line. Passengers at the airport won't use the Metro because it won't start until 7 so they won't be able to use it for the first departures and it'll close at 11 so they won't be able to use it for the final departures/arrivals. Plus the current plans propose completely fúcking up the Luas Green Line when they have a million and one alternative routes on the South line.

Sure isn't the Luas operation privatised? Privatisation is great, as long as you can get investors. I think self driving Metrolink is still on the cards too.

cluane

If they could expand it to London underground style and self driving that would be good.

Numerous lines?

defrule

You could give us the best public transport system overnight and we would still find a way to run it to the ground and get lines closed etc...

selassie

The Metro will have to cater for the 5-6 am transatlantic flights arriving so a starting time of 5 would be about right.

salmocab

cluane wrote: »

If they could expand it to London underground style and self driving that would be good.

Numerous lines?

You didn’t want it a couple of days ago now you want multiple lines.

thomasj

While a metro is badly needed and sooner the better it comes, let's not take away from the fact that it is cheaper to get from cork or Galway to Dublin airport than it is to get from parts of Dublin , and in most cases , will likely remain the same even when the metro comes unless people get their acts together with regards to 24 hour bus services.

lawred2

cluane wrote: »

This noddy train which has been called 'Metrolink' is in the news today again:

rte.ie/news/dublin/2019/0221/1031984-metrolink/

It's useless. It is said to provide a brilliant service to the airport, but as it's public sector won't start for the first wave of departures and probably will be on strike 75% of the time.

What we need to do is extend the DART to Drogheda, Kilcock and Navan, complete the DART Underground so that it would run on to Kildare station, have the Luas interconnect at Connolly, extend the Red Line to Rathcoole and Leixlip where it'll interconnect with the DART at Confey and extend the Green Line to Bray where it would interconnect with the DART there. We also need to massively improve bus services and I don't mean this BusConnects or Go Ahead plan.

That is what we need to do for the Dublin region transport system and not build the fu**ing Metrolink.

Without quad tracking between Connolly and Howth Jnctn any investment in dart is money wasted

maninasia

JupiterKid wrote: »

I disagree. We need most of the public transport imrovements you suggested AND the Metro to the Airport.

Dublin is one of the few capital cities in the developed world that does not have a direct high capacity rail service from its city centre to its airport and it is shameful.

Public transport is woefully poor in Ireland. Urgent backlog priorities ate the Metro line, full DART to Maynooth, the DART underground inner city connector and expansion of the LUAS system, coupled with increased denisty housing along the aforementioned systems.

Not only developed countries, lots of countries in South East Asia have airport rail links now or building them..

GSBellew

cluane wrote: »

THE ONLY IRISH VEHICLE MANUFACTURER(!), Wrightbus.

You're wrong there, there are other vehicles designed and built in Ireland.

GSBellew

There is a simple solution, taking the JFK air train as inspiration, all that is required is a circular line, airport to Swords back to airport via long term car parks / car rental zones.

The trains run in constant loops, want to go to Dublin, get the air train to Swords and catch a train from there to Connley, want to go to Belfast, catch that train instead.

There is no point routing everyone to Dublin and figuring it out after, route them to a transit hub.

salmocab

GSBellew wrote: »

There is a simple solution, taking the JFK air train as inspiration, all that is required is a circular line, airport to Swords back to airport via long term car parks / car rental zones.

The trains run in constant loops, want to go to Dublin, get the air train to Swords and catch a train from there to Connley, want to go to Belfast, catch that train instead.

There is no point routing everyone to Dublin and figuring it out after, route them to a transit hub.

You know there is no train in swords at the moment?

an_fathach

maninasia wrote: »

Not only developed countries, lots of countries in South East Asia have airport rail links now or building them..

The airport bus services are excellent but I think on the grounds of connecting north Dublin and Swords, boosting fall for to places like the botanic gardens etc it is an exciting plan and could take a lot of vehicles off the roads. Anyone know how long it will take to make a profit?

salmocab

an_fathach wrote: »

The airport bus services are excellent but I think on the grounds of connecting north Dublin and Swords, boosting fall for to places like the botanic gardens etc it is an exciting plan and could take a lot of vehicles off the roads. Anyone know how long it will take to make a profit?

Profits aren’t really an issue in PT we generally pay for them through taxes. They benefit the economy indirectly though.

kravmaga

Last Stop wrote: »

So what the OP is suggesting that Kildare gets a massive increase in public transport as well as new roads while the airport which carried 30 MILLION people last year and Swords with approx. 30,000 people don’t get anything?
Makes perfect sense.

Swords is 40,000 approx in latest census of population for 2016

D.L.R.

the luas is a noddy traintrack.

metrolink is proper urban mass transit.

get a grip

cgcsb

cluane wrote: »

This noddy train which has been called 'Metrolink' is in the news today again:

rte.ie/news/dublin/2019/0221/1031984-metrolink/

It's useless. It is said to provide a brilliant service to the airport, but as it's public sector won't start for the first wave of departures and probably will be on strike 75% of the time.

What we need to do is extend the DART to Drogheda, Kilcock and Navan, complete the DART Underground so that it would run on to Kildare station, have the Luas interconnect at Connolly, extend the Red Line to Rathcoole and Leixlip where it'll interconnect with the DART at Confey and extend the Green Line to Bray where it would interconnect with the DART there. We also need to massively improve bus services and I don't mean this BusConnects or Go Ahead plan.

That is what we need to do for the Dublin region transport system and not build the fu**ing Metrolink.

You reckon metro would be frequently subject to strike action and not start early enough, ignoring that it's proposed to be driverless, run 24 hours and be operated by private company. Then you start talking about a fantasy dart expansion, to be run by CIE whom you've just admonished as inefficient

cgcsb

chosen1 wrote: »

https://www.newstalk.com/newstalk-breakfast/group-unveils-plan-for-sixline-dublin-metro-system-by-2025-491038
How come this privately funded expanded metro is never even discussed?

Only heard about it on one or two media outlets. Wouldn't it be worthwhile for the government to at least meet him and see what he has to say.

Because it's fantasy

Sam Russell

Mod: Changed title as Metrolink has no link to Noddy. Please do not belittle major infrastructure projects - we have enough of this from elected politicians and self appointed economists - all of whom should know better - and they should read the published information regarding Metrolink.

Sam Russell

an_fathach wrote: »

The airport bus services are excellent but I think on the grounds of connecting north Dublin and Swords, boosting fall for to places like the botanic gardens etc it is an exciting plan and could take a lot of vehicles off the roads. Anyone know how long it will take to make a profit?

Airport buses do not run every few minutes, as is expected with Metrolink. Also, buses are subject to traffic delays which Metrolink will not as it will be completely segregated.

Please read the published data re Metrolink to check the facts before posting.

L1011

GSBellew wrote: »

You're wrong there, there are other vehicles designed and built in Ireland.

Mostly actually in ROI too, rather than a firm owned by a virulent Unionist which has severe lack of diversity issues amongst its staff (they don't hire non-protestants as a general rule)

an_fathach

Sam Russell wrote: »

Airport buses do not run every few minutes, as is expected with Metrolink. Also, buses are subject to traffic delays which Metrolink will not as it will be completely segregated.

Please read the published data re Metrolink to check the facts before posting.

And buses can very cramped. Although they rarely get delays, delays are possible. The link had nothing on profitability. For everyone in SW and W Dublin buses will be quicker.

salmocab

an_fathach wrote: »

And buses can very cramped. Although they rarely get delays, delays are possible. The link had nothing on profitability. For everyone in SW and W Dublin buses will be quicker.

There’s not going to be profit, if you mean how long before we get 3 or 4 billion back.

Sam Russell

an_fathach wrote: »

And buses can very cramped. Although they rarely get delays, delays are possible. The link had nothing on profitability. For everyone in SW and W Dublin buses will be quicker.

If you live or travel SW to the Airport, you would be quicker to use the Metrolink for part of your journey, as CC to the Airport will be quickest be Metrolink.

Metrolink connects to most PT somewhere.

an_fathach

Sam Russell wrote: »

If you live or travel SW to the Airport, you would be quicker to use the Metrolink for part of your journey, as CC to the Airport will be quickest be Metrolink.

Metrolink connects to most PT somewhere.

Depends. Dublin Coach is pretty ace for SW and Metrolink is very unlikely to be useful there but it doesnt have to be.