Ireland Team Talk X: The Long Hard Road to a Semi. MOD WARNING POSTS #1, #1474, #5707

Clegg

Jump_In_Jack wrote: »

Jordi Murphy is surely ahead of Tommy O'Donnell.
I think it's fair to say that Van der Flier is the best at the moment though, but those two certainly have the potential to get up to a similar intensity.
For what it's worth, I think Scott Penny is an unbelievable talent in the making, just the RWC possibly coming too soon for him.

Penney was our best player in the U20's Six Nations. Just brilliant at everything he does. It's an awful shame he'll miss the Junior World Cup through injury.

Jump_In_Jack

On the bright side, the squad as selected puts a lot of pressure on players to perform.
It's very interesting that in every position there is either a battle for starting spot or a battle for replacement spot.
Even in terms of making it into the training squad and into the final squad there is huge competition on the periphery not to mind at the core.
It all bodes well, just have to hope injuries won't be a big issue this time around, and that the performances start to blossom at the right time.
If things pan out the way I expect them to, our best chance of winning it are if we beat Scotland, top the group, beat South Africa, beat Wales, and beat either England or New Zealand in the final.
Our squad will have to be like a well-oiled machine throughout the campaign to achieve that. Fingers crossed we can do it!

If we don't top the group we could be facing New Zealand, England, Wales to win it, which would be a much harder route I think.
Puts the Scotland match into perspective, it's going to be vital!

Tomtom364

Jump_In_Jack wrote: »

Haley is 6'3" and has had some impressive performances, although the missed tackle against Lowe and subsequently marching off the pitch before the conversion was a low point.

The marching off the pitch thing is nonsense. The lad took Lowe's fingers in the eye in the handoff and walked over to he bench to get a bottle of water to wash his eyes out when the Waterboys didn't come under the posts because the time was done.

He is the closest thing ireland has as a direct replacement to what Rob Kearney gives but I don't think he will make the plane unless maybe if Kearney dosnst make it through the warms ups.

JJJackal

Jump_In_Jack wrote: »

On the bright side, the squad as selected puts a lot of pressure on players to perform.
It's very interesting that in every position there is either a battle for starting spot or a battle for replacement spot.
Even in terms of making it into the training squad and into the final squad there is huge competition on the periphery not to mind at the core.
It all bodes well, just have to hope injuries won't be a big issue this time around, and that the performances start to blossom at the right time.
If things pan out the way I expect them to, our best chance of winning it are if we beat Scotland, top the group, beat South Africa, beat Wales, and beat either England or New Zealand in the final.
Our squad will have to be like a well-oiled machine throughout the campaign to achieve that. Fingers crossed we can do it!

If we don't top the group we could be facing New Zealand, England, Wales to win it, which would be a much harder route I think.
Puts the Scotland match into perspective, it's going to be vital!

If we dont top the group we dont deserve to win a WC IMO

The Lost Sheep

Jump_In_Jack wrote: »

The point is that we shouldn't despair about the subs for Murray and Sexton.
For example Marmion and McGrath both played their part in beating New Zealand last year when Murray was recovering from a neck injury.
Carbery and Carty are both playing well and are first choice for a province, and to be fair to Ross Byrne, though he is behind Sexton at Leinster, he has always looked good when he's played for Leinster, and I would guess that this season all three have better goal-kicking stats than Sexton.

I'd be much more concerned if Furlong, Healy or Van der Flier picked up an injury, but even then it wouldn't be impossible to get to a semi-final.
The current generation are better than we've had before in terms of quality in depth.

Some people are convinced we can only get there if we have all our top players playing at their peak, but I don't think that's necessary, there is a very competent squad there that can do the business.

Basically, enough with the doomsday stuff if we lose someone to injury, every other country to some extent will have the same issues this close to the RWC.

Yes we beat New Zealand without Murray but a world cup without our very best players is different altogether. We've never won a knockout game in world cup doing that against NZ/SA isnt same as doing it in a november test.
Furlong is up with Murray Sexton in importance. Dont think VDF is at that level with those 3 yet tbh. We have a competent squad

Jump_In_Jack wrote: »

Jordi Murphy is surely ahead of Tommy O'Donnell.
I think it's fair to say that Van der Flier is the best at the moment though, but those two certainly have the potential to get up to a similar intensity.
For what it's worth, I think Scott Penny is an unbelievable talent in the making, just the RWC possibly coming too soon for him.

Penny is nowhere near ready for the WC.

JJJackal wrote: »

If we dont top the group we dont deserve to win a WC IMO

Dont agree. We still have to beat NZ or SA in a knock out game so would cert would deserve it

Riskymove

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Dont agree. We still have to beat NZ or SA in a knock out game so would cert would deserve it

??

its a figure of speech

I don't think he is saying that if Ireland beat NZ and England on the way to winning the final that we wouldn't deserve it...lol

JJJackal

Riskymove wrote: »

??

its a figure of speech

I don't think he is saying that if Ireland beat NZ and England on the way to winning the final that we wouldn't deserve it...lol

Obviously if we beat England and New Zealand we deserve to win 😂😂😂😂

Figure of speech ðŸ‘ðŸ»

Plus if we can’t beat Scotland and Jsoan with a healthy squad at start of tournament generating momentum we won’t be beating England and New Zealand (see difference between 6N 2018 and 2019

Shefwedfan

JJJackal wrote: »

If we dont top the group we dont deserve to win a WC IMO

Why?

SO we lose against Scotland but beat every other team and we dont deserve it?



Take SA, they dont care if they top the pool or not. Win or lose to NZ they dont care as they then have a free run to the final where they will potentially meet NZ again



Why would anyone think that not topping a pool means we would not deserve to win the WC???

stephen_n

JJJackal wrote: »

stephen_n wrote: »

This is the same Carberry that didn’t play between February and May? Yet managed to be better than Sexton. That’s an amazing perspective. Also when exactly in the 4 or 5 games he played did he show all this amazing talent? I’d like to have a look at that game.

Now if you said Carthy had played better than Sexton in 2019, then maybe there would be a discussion but saying Carberry has, that’s just a joke really.

According to Wikipedia (dont have time to do a more detailed search for what he has or has not done) - "Carbery scored 14 points, including four penalties and one conversion, in Munster's 26–17 win against his former province Leinster on 29 December 2018. He was Man-of-the-Match and scored 16 points, including one try, four conversions and one penalty, in Munster's 31–24 away win against Connacht on 5 January 2019. Carbery scored 26 points, including two tries, five conversions and two penalties, and was Man-of-the-Match in Munster's 41–15 away win against English side Gloucester in round 5 of the Champions Cup on 11 January 2019. He scored all of Munster's points from penalties in their 9–7 win against Exeter Chiefs in round 6 on the Champions Cup on 19 January 2019, a result that ensured Munster advanced to a record 18th Champions Cup quarter-final"

I accept that the 29/12/2018 is not 2019 :cool:

But I agree that Carty deserves a shot based on 2019 form. However, I am not sure he will be in the 31 - in addition to being the long standing number 2 10 he can play 15 (although not Schmidt preference).

We all agree that Johnny at his best is better than any other Irish 10 at their best. I believe (or hope) that Johnny will be at his best come Japan and guide us to WC final

MOTM awards mean feck all really. Sexton got one in the semi against Toulouse. Made a huge impact against Munster in the semi final, then had a bit of a mare last week in the first half. As I said Carthy has probably been the form outhalf on Ireland in 2019. If we are going to get to a semi at the RWC though we need our world class players on top form, that’s Murray and Sexton. Carthy or Carberry could well do a job, but I’m not sure either can get us through the knock outs.

b.gud

stephen_n wrote: »

MOTM awards mean feck all really. Sexton got one in the semi against Toulouse. Made a huge impact against Munster in the semi final, then had a bit of a mare last week in the first half. As I said Carthy has probably been the form outhalf on Ireland in 2019. If we are going to get to a semi at the RWC though we need our world class players on top form, that’s Murray and Sexton. Carthy or Carberry could well do a job, but I’m not sure either can get us through the knock outs.

I never heard of either Carthy or Carberry. Probably doesn't matter what kind of a job they'd do anyway as I doubt they'd get on the plane ahead of Carty or Carbery

Shefwedfan

What sort of opposition is Carty up against? I mentioned this a few times I know but it is still relevant

I wouldn’t compare a game against Zebre to a final of Pro14 against Glasgow in Glasgow

So far any game against a decent team in 2019 Connacht and Carty have lost, wouldn’t fill you with confidence

How good would Sexton and Carberry form look if they where comparing displays against the same standard as Carty?

PTH2009

Cant wait for the world cup

Worried all the same and have a 2007 feeling in my waters. We need too beat Scotland (could be a different story if South Africa beat the All blacks the day before) but then we have the bloody hosts in our 2nd game

Lots of liquid breakfasts

Shefwedfan

PTH2009 wrote: »

Cant wait for the world cup

Worried all the same and have a 2007 feeling in my waters. We need too beat Scotland (could be a different story if South Africa beat the All blacks the day before) but then we have the bloody hosts in our 2nd game

Lots of liquid breakfasts

I doubt SA will beat NZ, they don’t seem to concerned about beating them, my guess from their comments if they think coming in second might be easier route to final

PTH2009

Shefwedfan wrote: »

I doubt SA will beat NZ, they don’t seem to concerned about beating them, my guess from their comments if they think coming in second might be easier route to final

Cocky but dont blame them with our form after the AB win

We need a much improved performance in the warm up games but cant risk guys getting hurt either. We will never knw was this meh 6N performance part of a grand plan or were we found out ?. Since 2015 we have had some great wins and it would be such a shame if 4 years later at the grand stage it went tits up. Has happened before

nc6000

JJJackal wrote: »

If we dont top the group we dont deserve to win a WC IMO

Yes, if we win the RWC but don't top our group I'll be very disappointed. :P

aloooof

nc6000 wrote: »

Yes, if we win the RWC but don't top our group I'll be very disappointed. :P

It hasn't been ever been done tho, for the obvious reason of making your route to the final all the more difficult. France probably came closest in 2011, having lost 2 games in the group stages.

errlloyd

aloooof wrote: »

nc6000 wrote: »

Yes, if we win the RWC but don't top our group I'll be very disappointed. :P

It hasn't been ever been done tho, for the obvious reason of making your route to the final all the more difficult. France probably came closest in 2011, having lost 2 games in the group stages.

England in 2007 and 1991, also came second in their group and made the final.

EachSmallChime

Shefwedfan wrote: »

What sort of opposition is Carty up against? I mentioned this a few times I know but it is still relevant

I wouldn’t compare a game against Zebre to a final of Pro14 against Glasgow in Glasgow

So far any game against a decent team in 2019 Connacht and Carty have lost, wouldn’t fill you with confidence

How good would Sexton and Carberry form look if they where comparing displays against the same standard as Carty?

They play in the same league so he's up against almost all the same teams? by that logic, you only get judged on your Champions Cup games?

Joey only played 5 champions cup games and won 2. Johnny missed some of the big games too and played 'big' European games where there was no challenge at all.

If you straight swapped Sexton and Carty from Connacht and Leinster, do you think Connacht would have won those big games? or the other way around. I'd say most results would probably have been the same because of the quality of the rest of the players on each team.

Shefwedfan

aloooof wrote: »

It hasn't been ever been done tho, for the obvious reason of making your route to the final all the more difficult. France probably came closest in 2011, having lost 2 games in the group stages.

Ireland always loses at least one game every WC


Normally it is in the quarters.....so this time lets get it out of the way in group stages and keep going


Ireland are slow starters, we always are....even Grand Slam year the France match was terrible.....


Scotland are waiting in the long grass, they seem really confident based on all comments and the new Offtheball WC show which had Scott Hastings on it was interesting.

As they said, they could beat Ireland in first game but then lose to Japan in last game, that would be the Scotland way

aloooof

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Ireland always loses at least one game every WC

Normally it is in the quarters.....so this time lets get it out of the way in group stages and keep going

2015 and 2011 are actually the anomaly; every other RWC, we've lost a group stage game.

But I think that just demonstrates a slowly increasing upward trajectory that hopefully means we can break our previous QF ceiling.

Shefwedfan

aloooof wrote: »

2015 and 2011 are actually the anomaly; every other RWC, we've lost a group stage game.

But I think that just demonstrates a slowly increasing upward trajectory that hopefully means we can break our previous QF ceiling.

That's why I said we always lose at least one game

aloooof

Shefwedfan wrote: »

That's why I said we always lose at least one game

Except for the winners, everybody always lose at least one game!

Apparently the numbers are meant to suggest what numbers they can cover which is horse ****

sydthebeat

who came up with that sh!te ??

MaybeMaybe

sydthebeat wrote: »

who came up with that sh!te ??

Some lad on Reddit that could not accept that Healy can't cover TH nor that Ali can't cover 10

sydthebeat

i dont think aki every wore 10 for counties or chiefs... and certainly not connacht.

Squidgy Black

Ross Byrne apparently able to cover 15 even though he's never played a minute there, not even just at senior level but never played there at schools or underage.

sydthebeat

And Sean cronin is missing a 13 beside his name

Bazzo

sydthebeat wrote: »

And Sean cronin is missing a 13 beside his name

International winger Kieran Marmion too