ESB eCars

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118590198#Comment_118590198

There's enough chademo chargers but not enough CCS chargers? Do you have proof of this?

TitianGerm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118590224#Comment_118590224

In 2018 Chademo made up 64% of EV sales.

In 2019 Chademo made up 32% of EV sales.

In 2020 Chademo made up 15% of EV sales.

In 2021 Chademo made up 9% of EV sales.

So far in 2022 Chademo is 20% of EV sales.

The 20% so far this year will drop significantly once Tesla hit the March delivery schedule, VW group increase production again after factories been closed over Christmas and semi conductor issues are eased and the Koreans continue with their steady deliveries. Then you have the eMegane which I'd imagine will be a huge seller if they can hit the year end delivery as promised.

What's clear from those stats is Chademo is on the way out. So I'll ask again why would ESB continue to expand the Chademo connections here in Ireland? Especially at the same rate as CCS connection?

PaulJoseph22

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118590137#Comment_118590137

He’s driving around all winter in a Tesla with no heating on to try and retain the charge.

TitianGerm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118590347#Comment_118590347

That's the very first time I've ever heard anyone complain about range in a Tesla.

PaulJoseph22

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118590357#Comment_118590357

Well there you go, we are away from home all week as we are co owners of Company and on the road all week, so there you go.

Some of the blame lies with him, he clearly didn’t do enough research.

at the end of the day, the car needs charging regardless of the range and if you pull up to one and it’s in use, broken and there isn’t one for 20 miles….

TitianGerm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118590417#Comment_118590417

So where is he based and where does most of his travel involve? I thought Telsa had good supercharger coverage across most of Ireland?

PaulJoseph22

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118590430#Comment_118590430

As I said we do business all over the 32 Counties, not much in Antrim though, maybe you don’t include us as being in Ireland?but there needs to be more up this part of our island, one’s that work, or have some enforcement where people just use them as car parks. I’ve read people on here giving tips to others so they can get their full days free parking, it’s that attitude that is putting people off bev.

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118590277#Comment_118590277

That's annual sales figures. I'm talking about right now, today, the Nissan leaf (chademo) represents more than half of all cars on the road, why would ecars want to say no to profit from half the cars on the road? Considering the only difference is an extra cable they'd be nuts

Black_Knight

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118589907#Comment_118589907

I wouldn't say that. More units is usually because there is more demand, and having more units would have people aim towards that "hub" rather than single units because they expect more availability. Rare though, since we've flip all sites to compare. Urlingford (single unit) and ballacolla(2 units) is the best example I can see. 4 times more likely to meet a car charging at ballacolla ESB units. If they were busier sites urlingford could be the better option. Less chance of having to wait, so may as well use the 50kW there immediately.

https://ecars-stats.com/

slave1

24kw Leaf not suitable for long run inter town trips, should be discounted to reflect the reality it does not warrant DC charging in a similar fashion to say an ID3 which is a whole of Ireland trip EV

kanuseeme

Funny, here buy my leaf its fantastic, Im buying an ID3, now get rid of chademo.

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118590747#Comment_118590747

24kWh leaf has 100km range? You could go from Killarney to Dublin if you fast charged at ncw, birdhill and portlaoise I'd say

innrain

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118590707#Comment_118590707

Data stolen from CHA vs CCS thread and updated with the last month sales. It is less than half and dropping fast.

or better in % values

I wouldn't touch the existing CHAdeMO but I wouldn't add them to HPCs. No point really. Easygo said they will keep adding CHA but their 75kW can load balance and in the future they can change the plugs if CHAdeMO is not needed.

wassie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118590347#Comment_118590347

I did near on 40K kms in a Tesla last year travelling all around the country for work including Donegal and not once did I ever consider not putting heating off. If range becomes an issue slowing down will be far more effective.

It does take a little more planning on the more challenging routes, but time wise Im talking an extra 5-10 mins to consider my trip. I find the navigation system brilliant for planning my charging and I make a Plan B if Im overly reliant upon a single ESB charger. I make longer charges work in my favour as to get a quick powernap especially if I am on the road for 4+ hours.

ESB network needs serious improvement no doubt, but between ESB, Ionity & Tesla its easy enough to get a charge. ESB sometimes means a wait if its occupied and no other option within range. The north can require a bit more planning, but the only time I found a bit challenging was the peak summer holidays season.

Doesnt suit everyone but for me it works. We also have a PHEV - we needed a tow vehicle and range is definately an issue when it comes to towing with EVs. I only got a PHEV over a HEV/ICE as I think resale will be better in a few years when its time to trade up than if I went with an oil burner.

Laviski

For as long as leaf is being sold, each hub will always have 1 chademo.

Eventually it will stop, but to stop now is premature. What they should be doing is increase the ratio of ccs vs chademo.

However if esb just continue to dish out the 50kw points, it will remain 1:1 ratio. 4 car hubs is a one off so far.

markpb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118590707#Comment_118590707

Infrastructure should never be planned based on todays requirements, it should always be planned for the future. It takes a long time to get each site planned, funded and installed and it will be operational with that hardware for many years. If you go to all that effort and the infrastructure is under-capacity or mismatched with the actual need, it’s a lot of money wasted.

If ESBN installed transmission capacity in a new area and it couldn’t handle a well-flagged increase in population, everyone would be quick to complain. This is the same.

eCars started off rolling out 20kW charge points with a smattering of 50kW. By the time they had a decent coverage, the 20kW were over-spec’d for most cars and the 50kW points were under-spec’d. Then they had a massive amount of old hardware to support and replace while the market was expecting them to install 150kW points. Being first mover isn’t easy by any means but eCars have been consistently wrong.

Black_Knight

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587498#Comment_118587498

That you on Facebook giving it to them? Simon Acton (ievoa chair) really doesn't like a bad word being said about ESB. Attacked the poster, not the post. Bad form from him.

AndyBoBandy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118592718#Comment_118592718

Yeah, that’s me all right….

Just fairly tired of their blind acceptance that everything that eCars do and have done is holier than thou and you cannot dare question them.

he had a go at me before on Twitter I think as I was probably moaning again about eCars….. and he advise I should pay my €20 and join his club so I could have a say… I just don’t think my thoughts would be well received so I shall save my €20

i get that they have to stay cozy with eCars otherwise eCars will stop attending their annual YouTube events to say how great eCars are, but FFS, would they not dare ask a half tough question? Or pull them up on their fudged numbers…..

DrPhilG

You should try being a member of the NI version of the Association.

Negativity, post declined.

Excessive criticism of eCars, post declined.

Complain about charger hogging (the single biggest EV issue in NI), post declined.

liamog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118590707#Comment_118590707

Sorry, but the Nissan Leaf does not represent 50% of the EVs on the road. Assuming 0 Leafs have been exported or taken off the road, only 30% of new or used EV imports were Nissan Leafs (compiled from data on motorstats.ie covering 2010 to year end 2021)

AndyBoBandy

As has been repeatedly mentioned, no one is calling for the removal of the (currently installed) CHAdeMO plugs, but rather saying there is no need to install any more of them. Upgrade them to newer units yes (single unit sites), fix them yes.

If an old 50kW unit is being upgraded, yes of course, the new unit should have a CHAdeMO plug on it.

But if a site is changing to a '''''''hub'''''''', as in getting a 150kW unit in beside a 50kW unit, then the 50kW unit of course should still have a CHAdeMO, but on the 150kW unit, no, I'm sorry but there should be no CHAdeMO on it.

eCars claim they have 16 high powered hubs, so outside of Mayfield they have 15 sites with more than 1 unit (16 if you count Dublin Ports's 2x 50kW units), so why at each of those multi unit sites have they given a 50/50 split between CHAdeMO and CCS when the numbers simply don't warrant it!

Its 2022 and they have 1 site on the island where more than 2 CCS cars can charge simultaneously. (Ionity have 5, Tesla have 5 (soon to be 8)).

Laviski

Agree to an extent

Mayfield should be esbs blueprint going forward. But if esb are deploying 50kw stations it will have Chademo. In 10/15 years they can go about changing cables to duel ccs.

As for 150kw stations where there is 50kw beside it.. the 150 kw should be duel ccs and th 50kw duel chademo

But that won't happen. If a ccs car is using the 50kw then of course the chademo driver is entitled to use the150kw however wrong you see it get over it.

slave1

Rather that see it as a negative, work around it

Tesla also brought in a CHAdeMO adapter in the US for the Model 3 in 2019, shame not rolled out over here

ELM327

Just to note, that's not a chademo to CCS adapter, that's an adapter for legacy chademo to the proposed new combined GBT and Chademo 3.0

AndyBoBandy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118593850#Comment_118593850

Interestingly enough, I was looking at a 2nd hand Model 3 in Lithuania for €33k, and it was a U.S. import, so no CCS and only the Tesla connector, so for any fast charging, I'd have needed one of those US style CHAdeMO adaptors... not to mention the tesla connector/adaptor for Type 2 AC charging!!

In summary, a bit of a nightmare, having a Tesla Model 3 and no access to SuC's!

slave1

AFAIK Tesla will NOT look at Grey Market imports at their Service Centres should there ever be an issue

kaahooters

really odd mentality in this thread.

"im not using it, get rid of it", people will still be using chadmo for 10 - 15 years on 2nd 3rd 4th hand leafs, and thats from the end of lif of the current chadmo leaf, that market will still need to be catered for, just because some here want to change there car every 4 years, to a more sustainable and eco friendly higher capasity battery car.

iphone mentality in this place is getting less and less vailed.

ELM327

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118593910#Comment_118593910

Plenty of aftermarket ways around it. You can even charge at CCS stations.

TitianGerm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118593929#Comment_118593929

No one said get rid of it.

What's been said is that the Chademo network should not be extended to reflect the lower sales and falling market share of that connector type.

Maintain what's there but double CCS should be the standard install going forward at a minimum seeing as that's the standard going forward and will see a huge surge in ownership in the next few years.

markpb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118593929#Comment_118593929

Exactly zero people here have said that Chademo plugs should be removed. Several people have said that with the diminishing market share held by Chademo vehicles, fewer or no new Chademo plugs should be installed. Someone even when as far as to suggest that the 150kW units should not have chademo plugs since they can't benefit from the higher charge rate. That's hardly controversial, it's just suggesting that eCars make efficient use of expensive infrastructure.