Can we talk about AH?

dulpit

Hey all,

I know there have been a number of threads raised on the topic over the past few months, but I feel that something needs to be done about AH, it has been getting worse and worse with regards to the usual rubbish that is dealt out about travellers, feminists, social welfare, etc. The place is becoming an extremely nasty place to read, and the moderation is either slow, ineffectual or non-existent.

I understand that you can simply ignore the forum as a whole, but it can be hard to do so, due to the traffic it attracts the posts there are always popping up on home page.

I also understand that people will say that the mods are overwhelmed with the amount of posts that AH gets, but this thread - https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057949890 - has been active since yesterday with limited/no moderation that I can see. The same sorts of comments from the same sorts of posters are always appearing.

What the solution is - I don't know. I personally feel that either the site needs to go down the route of allowing anything to be said, and be the worse for it, or else clean up it's moderation. Properly ban people, zero tolerance, stuff like that.

I don't know what else to say, but I will say that AH makes me sad these days, and is pushing me away from using boards in general. I can't be alone in this opinion?

Ultimate Seduction

Censoring views because you don't agree is never a good idea. Please don't .

Tom Mann Centuria

Not much joy in AH anymore, I agree, but plenty outside of there on boards that's still good imo.

I think there should be stricter moderation, or at the very least, rules that have been set are followed, but that seems to be the minority opinion when it's been raised before. Boards is aping every other site to try and remain relevant, whereas I think it's usp is the moderation. But, as I said, not what people want apparently.

TheValeyard

Ban the threads I don't like?

I dont see the problem, keeps AH alive and active as a healthy mix of things.

Change name of AH if you like, but keep the wide and varied dynamic going.

dulpit

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

Ban the threads I don't like?

I dont see the problem, keeps AH alive and active as a healthy mix of things.

Change name of AH if you like, but keep the wide and varied dynamic going.

This argument annoys me. It assumes that a disagreement over say a movie being good is as valid as whether travellers have rights, or if feminists should be completely ignored, or if everyone who claims social welfare should be removed from the planet (if AH is to be believed).

Ultimate Seduction

dulpit wrote: »

This argument annoys me. It assumes that a disagreement over say a movie being good is as valid as whether travellers have rights, or if feminists should be completely ignored, or if everyone who claims social welfare should be removed from the planet (if AH is to be believed).

You don't have to follow a thread if you don't like its content. You'd know by the thread title weather its going to be a thread you'd like to read or not.

Travellers should have the same rights as everyone else, no special rights.

Most feminists should be ignored.

I've never heard anyone say remove social welfare recipients from the planet, but I think it should be capped to 6 months in good times like now..

You may not agree with anything I said there, but you'd want me banned or my posts deleted?

Pa8301

Off topic from the OP but seeing as AH is being discussed, does anyone else reckon there has been a big increase in the number of re-reg's lately? And most coming with the same inane posts.

TheValeyard

dulpit wrote: »

This argument annoys me. It assumes that a disagreement over say a movie being good is as valid as whether travellers have rights, or if feminists should be completely ignored, or if everyone who claims social welfare should be removed from the planet (if AH is to be believed).

Im sure there is a point in here somewhere?

I remember the good old days of,

"No such thing as free speech on boards."

Seems we can't say, "No, we're not having that" anymore.

Really got worse since the original admins left. They had a conscience and were pretty open about believing in a society based on tolerance.

I barely post anymore as the ganging up against posters of left leaning persuasions is really ugly to watch, and very rarely anything is done about it.

Edited to add:
We used to have a very strong rule, no flaming, trolling etc. No Racism, sexism etc.
Yet here we have a thread on racism with posters quite literally boasting about racist actions. I reported it, nothing got done. It's still there. How is that allowed?

Whats Up?

Whats Up? wrote: »

How about ignoring the threads that upset you instead of calling for censorship?

We had censorship on boards for years, and it was a much nicer place to relax in.

lawred2

[Deleted User] wrote: »

We had censorship on boards for years, and it was a much nicer place to relax in.

Who were the censors?

em_cat

I very rarely post in AH, but TBH I don’t think the answer is introduce censorship. Once it begins, where does it end?

Another thing is to realise that everyone has the right to an opinion, whether it’s informed or not, or whether you agree or not.

If all else fails & you feel it’s too much there’s always

https://touch.boards.ie/forum/1292

TheValeyard

em_cat wrote: »

I very rarely post in AH, but TBH I don’t think the answer is introduce censorship. Once it begins, where does it end?

Another thing is to realise that everyone has the right to an opinion, whether it’s informed or not, or whether you agree or not.

If all else fails & you feel it’s too much there’s always

https://touch.boards.ie/forum/1292

Ive never heard of that forum!

osarusan

I stopped posting in AH over a year ago. Just got tired of the endless moaning.

After I stopped, I realised that so much of what people were getting so wound up over (me included, absolutely) is massively exaggerated and barely exists at all outside of AH and similar whine-filled corners of the internet.

Whenever I land on the 'Latest Posts' page I can see some from AH, and no doubt the same posters are saying the same things about the same topics they were talking about weeks, months, years ago.

Hurrache

I don't think it's a censorship issue, rather than backing up your claims.

For example I can start a thread saying we should ban all people from country X because they only come here to rape our chickens. I don't need evidence for that statement, but my thread will attract like minded idiots only too willing to perpetuate my opinion, no matter how much evidence to the contrary.

AH is an incubator for certain individuals and their agendas because they know they can do so unhindered.

lawred2

lawred2 wrote: »

Who were the censors?

The mods and admin

Cookie_Monster

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

Ban the threads I don't like?

Sure why not, lots of other stuff already banned in AH.... Political threads for example, even if it's major news. All get shunted tot he cafe to die because that is still a totally broken forum.

lawred2

Deleted User wrote: »

The mods and admin

kinda open to group think then really

OldMrBrennan83

Not much wrong with AH at all apart from a little consistency in moderation. There are too many cases of there being an opinion you're allowed to have and one you're not allowed to have.

But yeah really, if a thread offends you then just unsubscribe and move on to the next one.

anewme

There is a small core of mysogonostic posters in AH. Some of their comments are downright disgusting. The recent thread on the poor woman raped while incapacitated is an example. Its the same rhetoric, any man who dares disagrees with their nasty comments is lablled a white knight and a male feminist. Theres no debate, its just sheer venom. Id actually like to meet them in real life.

They really bring down the quality of threads as its the same stuff over and over. Thought it was just me but clearly not.

andekwarhola

I'd agree that a lot of the content these days is sometimes execrable but mostly boring to me.

The consensus in a forum, however, just represents either the majority of people or the most active posters. Censoring views isn't the answer.

In every one of those threads, there's an equal amount of people on both sides arguing to the death.

Maybe people need to opt out of those threads and put more energy into the type of alternative content they want to see instead of what they don't want to see.

TheValeyard

Meh,

If both side are angry. And both sides seem very hate filled ( and resort to name calling, claiming victim status very quickly)

Then probably mods are doing a good job. If both sides complain, then a neutral balance might have been achieved.

Anyway, why would anyone want to Mod AH, all you get is grief, targeted harassment and your posts picked apart.

anewme

anewme wrote: »

There is a small core of mysogonostic posters in AH. Some of their comments are downright disgusting. The recent thread on the poor woman raped while incapacitated is an example. Its the same rhetoric, any man who dares disagrees with their nasty comments is lablled a white knight and a male feminist. Theres no debate, its just sheer venom. Id actually like to meet them in real life.

They really bring down the quality of threads as its the same stuff over and over. Thought it was just me but clearly not.

Same posters are then usually on about banning Muslims because the way they treat their women.

Look most of them probably weren't breast fed by mam or daddy never told them that they loved them. Also ah is a safe space as they wouldn't have the balls to come out with the same stuff in public because they would have their head punched in.
In short their sad little people who can't find anyone else to listen to them in real life, so I don't really get offended by them I just think their cowards.

Now on the other hand people who get offended by everything annoy the crap out of me also. They need to pay attention to the important things out there such as what the future affect of AI could have.

As for the conservatives constantly on about social welfare etc, I'm reminded of a stock broker who hired my dad to renovate their house. One of the apprentices asked him for tips on how to make money and was told to take his tools and throw them in the river as he'd never make money working with his hands.
Not sure what happened to the apprentice but the broker ended up in the river when he was wiped out in the late 80s.
If your lucky enough to make money especially if not handed to you by your parents fair play to you but your taxes aren't going to be any lower if social welfare is done away with.

lawred2

lawred2 wrote: »

kinda open to group think then really

Which was the point of boards originally. A group of like minded individuals that wanted to disuss stuff.

Dial Hard

Ultimate Seduction wrote:

Censoring views because you don't agree is never a good idea. Please don't .

There's a huge middle ground between moderation and censorship.

anewme wrote:

There is a small core of mysogonostic posters in AH. Some of their comments are downright disgusting. The recent thread on the poor woman raped while incapacitated is an example. Its the same rhetoric, any man who dares disagrees with their nasty comments is lablled a white knight and a male feminist. Theres no debate, its just sheer venom. Id actually like to meet them in real life.

This, this and a thousand times this. I reported a load of posts within the first couple of hours of that thread and, in fairness, a few posters were threadbanned. But when I went back in a day or so later a few people were still expressing shock at some of the posts and there was a mod warning basically saying "Ok, we get it, you're all heroes for getting offended, get over it" and honestly, it was *so* tone-deaf that I was actually left gobsmasked. Compare that to the tone of the moderation in the thread on the child who fell down the well in Spain and tell me with a straight face that there isn't an issue with misogyny in AH.

I've been told to my face by Freshpopcorn that I'm imagining it but I've had PM conversations with plenty of long-time, prolific female Boardsies, none of whom are particularly strident on the topic but we all agree that there is a vicious anti-woman streak a mile wide in AH and that the mods genuinely don't notice it. You desperately need a few women on the mod team there. There is literally no balance whatsoever.

anewme

Dial Hard wrote: »

There's a huge middle ground between moderation and censorship.



This, this and a thousand times this. I reported a load of posts within the first couple of hours of that thread and, in fairness, a few posters were threadbanned. But when I went back in a day or so later a few people were still expressing shock at some of the posts and there was a mod warning basically saying "Ok, we get it, you're all heroes for getting offended, get over it" and honestly, it was *so* tone-deaf that I was actually left gobsmasked. Compare that to the tone of the moderation in the thread on the child who fell down the well in Spain and tell me with a straight face that there isn't an issue with misogyny in AH.

I've been told to my face by Freshpopcorn that I'm essentially imagining it but I've had PM conversations with plenty of long-time, prolific female Boardsies, none of whom are particularly strident on the topic but we all agree that there is a vicious anti-woman streak a mile wide in AH and that the mods genuinely don't notice it. You desperately need a few women on the mod team there. There is literally no balance whatsoever.

It's very obvious. The same ones back each other up and are pretty nasty when someone disagrees with them. Ive often wondered why it is not raised more.. I feel sorry for Mods in AH, its pretty thankless, but the imbalance is very clear.

Pa8301

Learn To Code wrote: »

Why should a thread be closed just because you are offended?

The right wingers may be annoying but at least they don't call for censorship. Some of you left wing people are cancerous.

And here's one of the re-reg's I was on about...

Learn To Code

Learn To Code wrote: »

Why should a thread be closed just because you are offended?

The right wingers may be annoying but at least they don't call for censorship. Some of you left wing people are cancerous.

It's not that I'm offended, its that it goes against the rules of the site.

We used to believe that if you don't like the way the site is run, there's lots of other internet space out there for you, off you pop.

Nowadays, its more you don't like that thread? SUCK IT UP BUTTERCUP.

And that's a load of balls.

Never was and never should be free speech on boards. Plenty of other spaces to espouse dickish views

pleas advice

Dial Hard wrote: »

There's a huge middle ground between moderation and censorship.



This, this and a thousand times this. I reported a load of posts within the first couple of hours of that thread and, in fairness, a few posters were threadbanned. But when I went back in a day or so later a few people were still expressing shock at some of the posts and there was a mod warning basically saying "Ok, we get it, you're all heroes for getting offended, get over it" and honestly, it was *so* tone-deaf that I was actually left gobsmasked..

there was an awful lot of outrage over the choice of words some posters inadvertently used, fair play that mod

anewme

pleas advice wrote: »

there was an awful lot of outrage over the choice of words some posters inadvertently used, fair play that mod

Was it not the fact they were confusing sex with rape.?

Anyone "inadvertently" making that mistake in real life could be looking at a 10 year stretch.

pleas advice

anewme wrote: »

Was it not the fact they were confusing sex with rape.?.

no, not at all. it was implicit in what was said that it was rape, no-one ever said it wasn't.
but this arguments been had, no need to go over it again

Dravokivich

Twenty Grand wrote: »

Even threads that start off well usually get hijacked by the same people throwing an "off colour" remark that offends some other fool and derails the whole thread.

It's turning into thejournal, where the same d*ckheads turn up to every story and start mouthing off about Leo, travellers, public sector, lefties, right wing etc etc.

Just ignore them. They keep up that crap, because people get enraged and respond to it.

anewme

pleas advice wrote: »

no, not at all. it was implicit in what was said that it was rape, no-one ever said it wasn't.
but this arguments been had, no need to go over it again

Disagree about sex vs. Rape, she was "rode" was the word used, but agree about not going over it again.

Its just one of many examples of anti women sentiment on AH.

Ultimate Seduction

[Deleted User] wrote: »

It's not that I'm offended, its that it goes against the rules of the site.

We used to believe that if you don't like the way the site is run, there's lots of other internet space out there for you, off you pop.

Nowadays, its more you don't like that thread? SUCK IT UP BUTTERCUP.

And that's a load of balls.

Never was and never should be free speech on boards. Plenty of other spaces to espouse dickish views

"Dickish views" are just views you personally don't agree with yeah?

Twenty Grand

Dravokivich wrote: »

Just ignore them. They keep up that crap, because people get enraged and respond to it.

I do, but eventually the thread is ruined and mods have to step in.

The people who shout the loudest get the most attention, while those who have meaningful things to say are ignored.

Ultimate Seduction

Twenty Grand wrote: »

I do, but eventually the thread is ruined and mods have to step in.

The people who shout the loudest get the most attention, while those who have meaningful things to say are ignored.

Or maybe, just maybe the people who have the most popular opinion get the most attention and those in the minority are ignored?

1800_Ladladlad

Deleted User wrote: »

It's not that I'm offended, its that it goes against the rules of the site.

We used to believe that if you don't like the way the site is run, there's lots of other internet space out there for you, off you pop.

Nowadays, its more you don't like that thread? SUCK IT UP BUTTERCUP.

And that's a load of balls.

Never was and never should be free speech on boards. Plenty of other spaces to espouse dickish views

This sounds to me like you want a 'safe space'! Your posts come across as someone who is/was un willing to accept change and that there are people who have different opinions to you but you somehow seem to think that your opinions are morally acceptable and are superior to the opinions of other users. Times have changed dramatically over the past decade or so, so have peoples opinions. I have my issues with mods and how they tend to be subjective in there reasoning for closing threads and how they act in general. For example, a mod fcuking with the thread title of a thread topic because they didnt agree with it and thought it was funny. Behaviour of both mods and users on AH have gone to the dogs tbh

Twenty Grand

Ultimate Seduction wrote: »

Or maybe, just maybe the people who have the most popular opinion get the most attention and those in the minority are ignored?

Nope.
You see the same people pop up again and again across the site pushing the same old tired agenda. It's like they've never had a day of joy in their lives.
Once a thread gets past 3 or 4 pages, it just goes downhill.

Also I get the people post in AH as it has the most traffic, but it's become more a dumping ground for threads that are unwanted elsewhere, especially for political stuff.

Dial Hard

Dial Hard wrote: »

There's a huge middle ground between moderation and censorship.



This, this and a thousand times this. I reported a load of posts within the first couple of hours of that thread and, in fairness, a few posters were threadbanned. But when I went back in a day or so later a few people were still expressing shock at some of the posts and there was a mod warning basically saying "Ok, we get it, you're all heroes for getting offended, get over it" and honestly, it was *so* tone-deaf that I was actually left gobsmasked. Compare that to the tone of the moderation in the thread on the child who fell down the well in Spain and tell me with a straight face that there isn't an issue with misogyny in AH.

I've been told to my face by Freshpopcorn that I'm essentially imagining it but I've had PM conversations with plenty of long-time, prolific female Boardsies, none of whom are particularly strident on the topic but we all agree that there is a vicious anti-woman streak a mile wide in AH and that the mods genuinely don't notice it. You desperately need a few women on the mod team there. There is literally no balance whatsoever.

Mods are just people and as such some are of the same opinion as the posters your talking about, others will be of the same opinion as you.
It's an unpaid position and that takes a specific type(s) of person to want to do it.

At the back of things the site is a business. If it ends up with a bad reputation such as just being a sounding board for such crap being discussed and nothing else it'll fail.

Gimme A Pound

anewme wrote: »

Disagree about sex vs. Rape, she was "rode" was the word used, but agree about not going over it again.

Its just one of many examples of anti women sentiment on AH.

I actually didn't view that thread as misogynistic. I think those posting bad taste comments would have done so on any thread about anyone.

But the thread about the French guy who said he prefers younger women - god that really brought them out (and the issue wasn't with the man fancying younger women despite the insistence that it was; the issue was with the reams and reams of insults towards women who posted on the thread). Also the thread about paternity testing and the Amazon guy's divorce. A glut of them at the same time. There is serious issue taken with one of the 6.00 news presenters on RTE also. For what, I have no idea, but apparently it makes her (totally inoffensive) looks fair game.

khaldrogo

Snowflakes everywhere.....

pleas advice

Weather Forum that way

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>

splinter65

Boards allows posters to ensure that they enjoy browsing the forums by providing a button that means you can put a poster on “ignore” so you don’t have to be offended by that posters opinions.
You can also “unfollow” a thread and even a whole forum with another equally accessible button.
You can report a post that you think is breaking the rules.
But that’s not enough for some people, is it?

Twenty Grand

splinter65 wrote: »

Boards allows posters to ensure that they enjoy browsing the forums by providing a button that means you can put a poster on “ignore” so you don’t have to be offended by that posters opinions.
You can also “unfollow” a thread and even a whole forum with another equally accessible button.
You can report a post that you think is breaking the rules.
But that’s not enough for some people, is it?

You can ignore a poster but all their quoted posts are visible.
You can unfollow threads and forums but they're still visible when browsing.
You should be able to hide forums and threads if they're annoying you. Boards and AH in particular is full of traveller, dole, government and Brexit threads I'd hide if I could.
That Margaret Cash thing is still going strong.
Personally I'd hide all the fitness update threads and sports I don't follow, maybe some of the legal stuff too for instance.

My biggest problem is the quality of discussion has become far more polarised and predicable, and its usually the same posters.
You can have a decent thread going with some intelligent discussion, then some fool comes in with some opinion that was shown wrong on page 1 and the whole thread goes back to square one.

You also have those smart arses who are first on the scene with "religion of peace" comments and the like.

Gimme A Pound

splinter65 wrote: »

Boards allows posters to ensure that they enjoy browsing the forums by providing a button that means you can put a poster on “ignore” so you don’t have to be offended by that posters opinions.
You can also “unfollow” a thread and even a whole forum with another equally accessible button.
You can report a post that you think is breaking the rules.
But that’s not enough for some people, is it?

I agree when posters wind you up because of incessant drivel (and I'm not talking about just disagreeing with them) but don't think people should be able to just throw insults and ad hominems, do you? E.g. there is one poster whose m.o. is just that (particularly on the Mary Queen of Scots movie thread) and it's annoying what he appears to get away with.

anewme

Arely Dazzling Sidecar wrote: »

I actually didn't view that thread as misogynistic. I think those posting bad taste comments would have done so on any thread about anyone.

But the thread about the French guy who said he prefers younger women - god that really brought them out (and the issue wasn't with the man fancying younger women despite the insistence that it was; the issue was with the reams and reams of insults towards women who posted on the thread). Also the thread about paternity testing and the Amazon guy's divorce. A glut of them at the same time. There is serious issue taken with one of the 6.00 news presenters on RTE also. For what, I have no idea, but apparently it makes her (totally inoffensive) looks fair game.

Ahh yeah, all womenn of 50 and over are past-it "harpies"

I should gave renembered that as im in that bracket, maybe I"m just getting a touch of senility. Or maybe II fiorgot as these peoples opinions are not on my radar.

But they dont mind older men, all the sympathy for the poor 65 year old man in the brothel.

They dont like negative feedback either, as is the case here.

hullaballoo

Admin: thread cleaned up. Membership of at least 3 months is required to post on this forum.

LuckyLloyd

Deleted User wrote: »

I remember the good old days of,

"No such thing as free speech on boards."

Seems we can't say, "No, we're not having that" anymore.

Really got worse since the original admins left. They had a conscience and were pretty open about believing in a society based on tolerance.

I barely post anymore as the ganging up against posters of left leaning persuasions is really ugly to watch, and very rarely anything is done about it.

Edited to add:
We used to have a very strong rule, no flaming, trolling etc. No Racism, sexism etc.
Yet here we have a thread on racism with posters quite literally boasting about racist actions. I reported it, nothing got done. It's still there. How is that allowed?

Unfortunately time moves on. DeVore isn't going to sort this out like the good old days. However it's not just about the way the site is run and essential capability drain (allied to financial incentives that didn't exist 12 year's ago) in terms of administration of the site. The Internet is a more extreme place, the culture of how people interact and what they expect they're able to say has changed.

Twenty Grand

The AH charter:

What is After Hours?
After hours is the place to come on boards where general discussion can be light-hearted. The aim here is to have a bit of a laugh and not to piss anybody off while doing so.

This is literally the opposite of what AH has become.

mirrorwall14

I try to avoid after hours myself if I can at this stage and I’ve been on boards for years. It’s not light hearted anymore. What I would love is to be able to hide the whole forum from the latest posts. Is this even possible?

AndrewJRenko

Deleted User wrote: »

I remember the good old days of,

"No such thing as free speech on boards."

Seems we can't say, "No, we're not having that" anymore.

Really got worse since the original admins left. They had a conscience and were pretty open about believing in a society based on tolerance.

I barely post anymore as the ganging up against posters of left leaning persuasions is really ugly to watch, and very rarely anything is done about it.

Edited to add:
We used to have a very strong rule, no flaming, trolling etc. No Racism, sexism etc.
Yet here we have a thread on racism with posters quite literally boasting about racist actions. I reported it, nothing got done. It's still there. How is that allowed?

The most obvious manifestation of the hard push to the extreme right was the Presidential election poll, where Casey ended up with more than 50% of the vote, more than double what he got in the real world. So in broad terms, boards.ie has twice as many extreme right posters as the national average. Boards.ie is a good 44% more racist than Tipperary - Casey's best performing constituency.

It seems that the powers that be are happy for Boards to turn into gammon-central. Personally, I'm not sure it bodes well, given the ageing demographic. It's probably not a hugely attractive market for advertisers either.