Property Market 2019

ZX7R

ZX7R wrote: »

The main reason there is not much talk about this is because they will be introducing more grants along side exciting grants.
It sounds worse in the article .
3 weeks ago I got my house ber rated got a c1 to bring it up to b3 rating all I need is a new oil burner condenser change the vent covers on the walls and get a new hot water tank.
If you really want to improve your rating get rid of your bath and install one solar panel doing this to my house would jump ber upto a b1
House is 35 years old

Makes sense to announce the grants with the statement

I was looking at buying a small house 90sq meters and was looking at adding up to 40 to 50 sq meters in a side extension wrapping around the back. Would think twice now as to bring the house to a B2 is a fair stretch as the house was recently renovated to a C2 and the actual interior of the house is decent and i wouldnt want to go ripping it up.

ZX7R

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Makes sense to announce the grants with the statement

I was looking at buying a small house 90sq meters and was looking at adding up to 40 to 50 sq meters in a side extension wrapping around the back. Would think twice now as to bring the house to a B2 is a fair stretch as the house was recently renovated to a C2 and the actual interior of the house is decent and i wouldnt want to go ripping it up.

Look into external insulation quite a number of polish companies doing it in Ireland a 2 story semi d costs between €5000 and €8000 depending on finish.
Fully supplied and fitted.
Even if it a terraced house no need for planning as finished coat will be done to exciting finish.

It's really starting to become very popular now

ml100

ZX7R wrote: »

beauf wrote: »

The main reason is people are starting to realise all this expense will take a lifetime to pay for itself. So aren't doing it. So they have to force people to do it. Carrot and stick.

6 years ago I installed a solid fuel buner that runs on renewable wood stocks , with in 3 year's I had reduced my fuel bill enough to pay for it and labor and materials and installation of it.
The profit made since has been put back into my house and has made much progress on my ber rating.

Aren't they talking about banning those stoves as they produce too much air pollution in cities, remind you of something else the greens pushed around 2008?

https://www.independent.ie/life/health-wellbeing/the-burning-question-is-your-woodburning-stove-harmful-37711582.html

Mad_maxx

Paul_Mc1988 wrote: »

Rex Disgusting Tariff wrote: »

Planning docs don't reference it and no price does not come into it. The only thing that comes into it is development size. You don't need planning permission when the houses are the exact same.

Price does come into it. If a developer has two estates, one with 30 houses for sale for 300k and the other with 30 houses for 800k they will do a deal with the council and give them 6 houses in the 300K development and 0 in the 800K development. It's a win for both as the developer makes more and the council saves more. The only loser is people who actually pay for the cheaper houses which are now 20% council.

Is this happening outside of Dublin?

Cyrus

Mad_maxx wrote: »

Is this happening outside of Dublin?

Less likely for obvious reasons re prices

cruizer101

On the amount of social housing the planning won't tell all. In a new house estate near me 25% was sold to ires reit who rumour has it have already agreed with council to let all the houses to them as social housing.
That is on top of the mandatory 10%.

Re the new building regs, if there is to be new grants why no details of them

ZX7R

ml100 wrote: »

Aren't they talking about banning those stoves as they produce too much air pollution in cities, remind you of something else the greens pushed around 2008?

https://www.independent.ie/life/health-wellbeing/the-burning-question-is-your-woodburning-stove-harmful-37711582.html

Could not be sure to be honest

The_Conductor

Qrt wrote: »

You realise tallaght is massive yeah? And half of it is pretty much identical to the likes of rathfarnham?

Social housing is great, provided the income limits are high.

Now, it is.
Back in 1979-1982- it wasn't.
Tallaght was an artificial construct- built on the premise that facilities, services and amenities would follow the provision of residential accommodation. A few large estates overwhelmed Tallaght village- and the promised services, facilities and amenities were drip fed into the area over the next quarter of a century- when the need for them was there decades ahead of the actual deliveries.

Tallaght is an entirely different place now- than it was 30 odd years ago. Sure there are still a few dodgy areas- but you'll find dodgy areas anywhere- but the hallmark of deprivation which branded much of Tallaght in the late 70s/early 80s- has thankfully, by and large, been banished to people's memories.

The whole- build a couple of thousand houses- and services, facilities and amenities will magically appear lark- has been forgotten- in the rush to deliver a new town, Clonburris, which will be constructed largely free from the prying eyes of the planning system, under the SDZ umbrella. This is a travesty- and is going to result in large estates- with few facilities for children/teenagers/families- other than the pre-existing facilities for South Lucan- which are already swamped in demand. Suggesting we'll pop up a few new schools- and sure it'll be grand- is simply wallpapering over the issue- so a few politicians can pat themselves on the back and tell us all how great they are- sure they're delvering 22,000 social and affordable housing units (over an 8 year period in the area).

Lucan, and indeed West Dublin in general, is already swamped- its difficult to get in or out of- and the services, facilities and amenities in the area were never designed to meet the levels of demand they now service.

Somethings got to give- and instead of fixing pre-existing problems- we're simply adding to it.

This is why many of us refer to it as Tallaght Mark II- as-in Tallaght before the housing explosion happened (without the provision of services/facilities/amenities).

I'm old enough to remember the original mess- and went to school with many kids from the area, and often played there as a kid. I amn't being mean about Tallaght, but I don't have rose tinted glasses about how it was either.

combat14

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/irish-property-shares-shorted-by-uk-investors-38535110.html

interesting article about uk investors starting to short irish property reits

OwlsZat

combat14 wrote: »

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/irish-property-shares-shorted-by-uk-investors-38535110.html

interesting article about uk investors starting to short irish property reits

Interesting. Very interesting. McWilliams was predicting a commercial property crash such was the speed of smart money exiting. I wonder whats the logic of a 5M short on the residential market?

hmmm

Clonburris was the last hurrah of SF on that council, and the decent councillors voted against it. A very disappointing planning decision in my view, another quick-fix which will cost us a fortune in the long-run.

Re short selling - it's pretty normal that most shares have some short interest against them, I wouldn't read too much into it.

Too much has been made of Brexit impacting property prices in my view - it's going to have a fairly large impact on the economy, and very large impacts in farming and border communities, but I don't see why that would cause a huge impact on (for example) Dublin house prices. The recent prices decreases look purely down to supply increasing, and that's something that the market itself will manage - developers won't build if they won't get the prices they want.

combat14

https://m.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/value-of-most-homes-frozen-or-falling-as-supply-rises-38546217.html

interesting read from indo on increase in time to sell

Reversal

combat14 wrote: »

https://m.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/value-of-most-homes-frozen-or-falling-as-supply-rises-38546217.html

interesting read from indo on increase in time to sell

The continuing decrease in cash buyers is also interesting.

After years of low transaction rates, more cash built up. This cash may have allowed prices to rise above the CB induced 'affordability ceiling'.

So perhaps were are not at the the affordability ceiling, we are beyond it. If so, instead of stabilising, prices have some way to settle back to wherever the real ceiling is.

beauf

None of this new. You can see the houses for sale, you can talk to estate agents they will all tell you the same thing. Has been pretty obvious since the start of the year.

The market will fall back to what people can borrow since that what mainly caps it. There will be exceptions, like cash buyers and investors. But they are flickle.

Bluefoam

Theres allot going on between Brexit, the iminent world recession, Saudi threats to Iran (whilch is a real problem), Russia threatening Crimea... While some of these things aren't weighing on the minds of the general public, they are by the world banks and have a huge effect on the markets...

On the other hand, theres lots of new houses being build, mostly in the 'new' west of Dublin & outskirts of Cork. Quality houses in built up established areas are rare, anyone in a half decent house is staying put, so theres little stock of desireable houses in traditionally sought after areas.

Theres allot of crap hitting the market that needs allot of work... many from landlords getting out of the bussiness. These are disrtorting the market... while they may be similar in size & have value in location, they are genersally in ****e condition and need a huge amount of money spent to bring them up to standard. These houses are not reaching the same selling prices as good housing stock & are having the effect of lowering the average value of property. This is because the values are averaged and do not account for quality.

The million + houses in south Dublin did overheat a bit & are settling down in price & there is a rationalisation in the south Dublin market in general, but thats because as an area, the prices accelerated faster than other parts of the country.

Good houses are still selling for reasonable money, particularly in settled areas.

The lending rules are also having a significant effect... I can vouch for that & it's a complex situation... don't want to realease a huge amount of capital onto the market either, because that could just increase prices in the short term.

The_Conductor

Bluefoam wrote: »

Good houses are still selling for reasonable money, particularly in settled areas.

I'd argue that there is damn all difference in what houses are making- irrespective of where they are. In the context of South Dublin- some properties that need to be demolished are making similar money to houses that are turn-key. Appalling property appears to be as appealing as any other property, and depending on location- sometimes even more appealing.

Bluefoam

The_Conductor wrote: »

I'd argue that there is damn all difference in what houses are making- irrespective of where they are. In the context of South Dublin- some properties that need to be demolished are making similar money to houses that are turn-key. Appalling property appears to be as appealing as any other property, and depending on location- sometimes even more appealing.

Can't agree with you there... I was bidding on a house in Drimnagh, it was a two bed and eventually sold for a large whack more than anything else in the area... I looked at dozens of houses areound Kimmage, Crumlin, Drimnagh, Inchicore... Good quality houses were rare and when they hit the market they went sale agreed quickly and for good money. The ****ty stock stayed on the market and sold eventually. I personally bid on a couple of crappier houses based on the fact I would have to spend more money on them. I set my spend low on them & they went for only a couple of grand more than my limits.

beauf

The_Conductor wrote: »

I'd argue that there is damn all difference in what houses are making- irrespective of where they are. In the context of South Dublin- some properties that need to be demolished are making similar money to houses that are turn-key. Appalling property appears to be as appealing as any other property, and depending on location- sometimes even more appealing.

Location, location, location

smurgen

combat14 wrote: »

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/irish-property-shares-shorted-by-uk-investors-38535110.html

interesting article about uk investors starting to short irish property reits

So people betting that rents will drop essentially.wait til this kicks in rents and house prices down in the next 6 months .

DodoLurker

I have heard (anecdotally I admit) that some developers are exercising more caution now going ahead with financing and building new developments because of the economic uncertainty on our horizon. With the news of property prices falling nationally in the news today, could there come a point where it costs more to build them than they sell for?

Has anyone seen evidence of this? E.g. houses and apartments in new developments not selling? Developers cancelling next phases of a development, etc?

Bluefoam

DodoLurker wrote: »

I have heard (anecdotally I admit) that some developers are exercising more caution now going ahead with financing and building new developments because of the economic uncertainty on our horizon. With the news of property prices falling nationally in the news today, could there come a point where it costs more to build them than they sell for?

Has anyone seen evidence of this? E.g. houses and apartments in new developments not selling? Developers cancelling next phases of a development, etc?

Developers have changed tak since the last recession. Instead of investing a lump sum... they borrow based on small allocations of about 30 houses and sell them in phases. On some developments the land is owned by Nama or the local authority and only released to the developer on a staged basis... means less risk for the developer... so yes, the developer can stop a developement at any stage and pick it up again as the demand increases, they can also choose to produce more while the market is good.

riclad

The decrease in cash buyers make,s sense,
any cash buyer who wants to buy a house has probably bought one,or is waiting for prices to fall in the future .
Also people are cautious because it may be 6-12 months before we see
the results of brexit .
How much will it effect the economy ?
Some irish companys depend on the uk for exports .
The experts say it will effect rural area,s and towns alot more than dublin and other citys.

HailSatan

DodoLurker wrote: »

I have heard (anecdotally I admit) that some developers are exercising more caution now going ahead with financing and building new developments because of the economic uncertainty on our horizon. With the news of property prices falling nationally in the news today, could there come a point where it costs more to build them than they sell for?

Has anyone seen evidence of this? E.g. houses and apartments in new developments not selling? Developers cancelling next phases of a development, etc?

Limerick is cancelled until further notice afaik

youwhoglue

Sheeps wrote: »

Department of Housing heard you liked expensive property, so they've introduced new building regs from November that will tack about 7k (2%) onto the price of a €350k home.

Also, I'd you planned on getting a fixer upper making any changes to the existing structure of the house, you'll also be required to get the house up to an energy rating of B2.

As if renovating a home wasn't hard enough, it renders then completely useless to first time buyers.

Surely this should bring the price down?

youwhoglue

DodoLurker wrote: »

I have heard (anecdotally I admit) that some developers are exercising more caution now going ahead with financing and building new developments because of the economic uncertainty on our horizon. With the news of property prices falling nationally in the news today, could there come a point where it costs more to build them than they sell for?

Has anyone seen evidence of this? E.g. houses and apartments in new developments not selling? Developers cancelling next phases of a development, etc?

Anecdotally also; builders are very busy but don't have a long order book at all. They are looking for future work but not much is planned until Brexit washes through.

JJJackal

Will increase price of B2 plus houses though?

Maybe decrease below B2? If you were renovating a house surely you would be aiming for B2 anyway with all the grants available?

0gac3yjefb5sv7

Anyone find a serious lack of property coming online for sale? In the area I'm searching, it's about 1/2 a week.

Seems strange as surely buyers would be trying to ditch at a high price given the slowdown...

mcbert

I'm see the same

Kamili

Pheonix10 wrote: »

Anyone find a serious lack of property coming online for sale? In the area I'm searching, it's about 1/2 a week.

Seems strange as surely buyers would be trying to ditch at a high price given the slowdown...

absolutely, and what is coming online in the areas I am looking is not in great knick, and not selling either months after I have viewed.

One house I looked at was withdrawn due to a miriad of horrendous complications and was way overpriced for what it was to begin with.

ELM327

We've decided not to sell now and to stay where we are and see what the next 12 months bring.
I suspect we're not the only ones.