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Full employment

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    #62
    tomplate
    Closed Accounts Posts: 63 ✭✭tomplate


    cgcsb wrote: »
    Hyperloop? would ya stop. The entire Island of Ireland could comfortably live inside the M50 if planning laws were changed.

    Who would want to,the M50 is fukked already


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    #63
    cgcsb
    Registered Users Posts: 9,326 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    engiweirdo wrote: »
    About 20% extra to the 250,000 on the live register.
    So unemployment is closer to 7% then, and in excess of 10% in various non-Dublin areas, and this ignores those counted as non participants. Still a long long way from full employment.

    I was saying about 2% of the workforce. But yeah ok so let's count that 7%, as the rate of unemployment(incl. activation). That's a great improvement compared to 8 years ago when by the same measure it would've been closer to 25%.

    Large Cities are always going to outperform regions on this measure. That is the nature of the global economy. People don't want to be farm hands so they move to service industry jobs in urban areas.


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    #64
    4068ac1elhodqr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,586 ✭✭✭4068ac1elhodqr


    cgcsb wrote: »
    The entire Island of Ireland could comfortably live inside the M50 if planning laws were changed.

    So you're recommending the abandonment of 95% of the country, interesting economic proposal, sure is different anyway.

    4.784 million (oops, about 6.6m, inc North) crammed in tower blocks, inside city-limits, can't see that requiring any new roads, public service upheaval and such like.

    Commuting times will become 'slightly difficult' to say the least.


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    #65
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    engiweirdo wrote: »
    More to the Netherlands than Amsterdam, they dont seem to have decided to abandon the lesser cities in quite the same manner.

    Even though Ireland is extraordinarily Dublin centric, Cork, Galway and Limerick are going well at the minute. Nothing in comparison to Dublin but there's definitely work available in each.


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    #66
    cgcsb
    Registered Users Posts: 9,326 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    engiweirdo wrote: »
    People CAN'T move to where the jobs are. How many of these jobs would allow someone to comfortably pay €2k a month just for rent?

    The jobs need to disperse more to where people are. Proper spatial deelopment, beyond lets see how much farther we can make West Dublin stretch.

    Economies of scale. Google is never going to plonk it's headquarters in New Ross. Fact is Ireland is an effective City-State like Denmark and the Netherlands. Dublin is the only medium-sized City we have and the only urban area capable of facilitating multinationals on such a scale while batting off relentless competition from more well connected Cities like Amsterdam. The other cities also do well out of our current economic model.


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    #67
    cgcsb
    Registered Users Posts: 9,326 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    engiweirdo wrote: »
    Already knocked it back (gently) but they do check up regularly just to make sure.

    Well that's silly. Why would you rather be moaning on the dole in Wexford than taking up such a fantastic, and close to unheard of in Europe, offer of employment? Some poor decision making on your part there. Unless of course, this offer you speak of is somewhat of a fabrication.


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    #68
    cgcsb
    Registered Users Posts: 9,326 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    tomplate wrote: »
    Who would want to,the M50 is fukked already

    There'd be nobody driving on the M50 if everyone lived on one side of it though :)


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    #69
    cgcsb
    Registered Users Posts: 9,326 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    engiweirdo wrote: »
    More to the Netherlands than Amsterdam, they dont seem to have decided to abandon the lesser cities in quite the same manner.

    Well there is only one Dutch City as they say because they're all joined together and are effectively one market for employment, real estate and office space.


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    #70
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    cgcsb wrote: »
    Well that's silly. Why would you rather be moaning on the dole in Wexford than taking up such a fantastic, and close to unheard of in Europe, offer of employment? Some poor decision making on your part there. Unless of course, this offer you speak of is somewhat of a fabrication.

    That relocation package doesn't sound that unlikely or uncommon, depending on the role and the industry. I know people on similar in Ireland.


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    #71
    4068ac1elhodqr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,586 ✭✭✭4068ac1elhodqr


    cgcsb wrote: »
    Economies of scale. Google is never going to plonk it's headquarters in New Ross. Fact is Ireland is an effective City-State like Denmark and the Netherlands. Dublin is the only medium-sized City we have and the only urban area capable of facilitating multinationals on such a scale while batting off relentless competition from more well connected Cities like Amsterdam. The other cities also do well out of our current economic model.

    Although Belfast is only 17th largest in the UK (1/4m or 1/2m in greater area), it ideally can still trade somewhat with Dublin after brexit.

    The 2nd largest city on the island should ideally have a much better corridor along the east coast to help grow the many large towns (each, all over 30,000) along the route between the two cities.


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    #72
    cgcsb
    Registered Users Posts: 9,326 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    Landon Scrawny Fog wrote: »
    So you're recommending the abandonment of 95% of the country, interesting economic proposal, sure is different anyway.

    4.784 million (oops, about 6.6m, inc North) crammed in tower blocks, inside city-limits, can't see that requiring any new roads, public service upheaval and such like.

    Commuting times will become 'slightly difficult' to say the least.

    Way to miss the point. No I'm not recommending it as a policy. The point is there is still massive potential for development in Dublin while keeping the urban footprint on the landscape very very small. Dublin isn't 'overcrowded', it's poorly managed by an inept City Council and a national government that despises it.


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    #73
    cgcsb
    Registered Users Posts: 9,326 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    Landon Scrawny Fog wrote: »
    Although Belfast is only 17th largest in the UK (1/4m or 1/2m in greater area), it ideally can still trade somewhat with Dublin after brexit.

    The 2nd largest city on the island should ideally have a much better corridor along the east coast to help grow the many large towns (each, all over 30,000) along the route between the two cities.

    Agreed, the current rail and road connections are a joke. However so long as Belfast opts to remain in the UK, there's nothing that can be done to improve the situation.


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    #74
    engiweirdo
    Closed Accounts Posts: 593 ✭✭✭engiweirdo


    cgcsb wrote: »
    engiweirdo wrote: »
    Already knocked it back (gently) but they do check up regularly just to make sure.

    Well that's silly. Why would you rather be moaning on the dole in Wexford than taking up such a fantastic, and close to unheard of in Europe, offer of employment? Some poor decision making on your part there. Unless of course, this offer you speak of is somewhat of a fabrication.
    Nope no fabrication. Our daughter has a medical/developmental condition and is on the autistic spectrum. Completely new language/environment and changing not only school and house could have pretty negative effects and this is guiding our decisions. We also briefly endured homelessness last year which had a bad effect on her, she's very worried now about having to lose her house. Any other Irish city presents the same challenges except for the language tbh.


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    #75
    cgcsb
    Registered Users Posts: 9,326 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    engiweirdo wrote: »
    Nope no fabrication. Our daughter has a medical/developmental condition and is on the autistic spectrum. Completely new language/environment and changing not only school and house could have pretty negative effects and this is guiding our decisions. We also briefly endured homelessness last year which had a bad effect on her, she's very worried now about having to lose her house. Any other Irish city presents the same challenges except for the language tbh.

    Seems like your life in Wexford would be a lot harder for her going forward, compared to adjusting to a new environment. If it were that much of an issue I'd relocated myself to the Netherlands and send money back.


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    #76
    Chips Lovell
    Moderators, Politics Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,269 Mod ✭✭✭✭Chips Lovell


    engiweirdo wrote: »
    So unemployment is closer to 7% then, and in excess of 10% in various non-Dublin areas, and this ignores those counted as non participants. Still a long long way from full employment.

    No. Just because they're not on the Live Register doesn't mean they're not counted as unemployed on the Labour Force Survey. They're two different sets of statistics.

    The 6% is everyone who is: "Persons who, in the week before the survey, were without work and available for work within the next two weeks, and had taken specific steps, in the preceding four weeks, to find work. It should be noted that as per Eurostat’s operational implementation, the upper age limit for classifying a person as unemployed is 74 years."


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    #77
    4068ac1elhodqr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,586 ✭✭✭4068ac1elhodqr


    cgcsb wrote: »
    Way to miss the point. No I'm not recommending it as a policy. The point is there is still massive potential for development in Dublin while keeping the urban footprint on the landscape very very small. Dublin isn't 'overcrowded', it's poorly managed by an inept City Council and a national government that despises it.

    Some enhancement with up-building, but nothing significant. Roads and services will still suffer, unless you lay new inner city road networks or an underground.

    Instead better links to sat' towns and other cities (even 'new towns') for commuters is the cheapest more practical large-scale, long-term option.

    It is afterall an ancient city with poor planning (blame the vikings too). In the New World, cities like Auckland rarely have a traffic jam (even at rush-hour), and Vancouver couldn't be easier to navigate on foot, bike, bus or car.


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    #78
    4068ac1elhodqr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,586 ✭✭✭4068ac1elhodqr


    Back to the topic at hand, this statement was interesting from MDH, earlier in the year:
    some recent developments in the world of employment were nothing less than a return to some of the worst practices of the 19th century.
    https://www.rte.ie/news/2018/0516/964013-forsa-president-higgins-workers/


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    #79
    cgcsb
    Registered Users Posts: 9,326 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    Landon Scrawny Fog wrote: »
    Some enhancement with up-building, but nothing significant. Roads and services will still suffer, unless you lay new inner city road networks or an underground.

    Instead better links to sat' towns and other cities (even 'new towns') for commuters is the cheapest more practical large-scale, long-term option.

    It is afterall an ancient city with poor planning (blame the vikings too). In the New World, cities like Auckland rarely have a traffic jam (even at rush-hour), and Vancouver couldn't be easier to navigate on foot, bike, bus or car.

    Auckland has terrible traffic hence why they went for a new bus system.
    There's loads of scope for increasing Dublin's population density, the Ringsend development has scope for about 3,000 apartments without any high rise. Dublin Industrial Estate is even larger, it has reached the end of it's useful life as an industrial estate and is located at the Luas/DART Broombridge interchange. JFK and Ballymount are MASSIVE industrial areas are also coming to the end of their useful lives and that area is sandwhiched between the proposed Hazelhatch-Grand Canal Dock commuter rail line and the Grand Canal cycle way. Throw in the acres of derelict and under-used land within the canals and there is scope to build hundreds of thousands of new apartments within 10km of O'Connell Bridge.


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    #80
    cgcsb
    Registered Users Posts: 9,326 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    Landon Scrawny Fog wrote: »
    Back to the topic at hand, this statement was interesting from MDH, earlier in the year:


    https://www.rte.ie/news/2018/0516/964013-forsa-president-higgins-workers/

    When someone like M D starts talking about their understanding of 'work' I zone out.


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    #81
    4068ac1elhodqr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,586 ✭✭✭4068ac1elhodqr


    cgcsb wrote: »
    When someone like M D starts talking about their understanding of 'work' I zone out.

    Problem is he's likely not that far wrong.

    A proportion of the workforce on temporary short-term contracts had been growing since 2008, and that 160,000 people endured significant variations in their hours of work from week to week, or month to month.

    Most mid-level folks in cube farms rarely get out most days on time, and any talk of a trade union would be quickly laughed off, along with a requests for full two seqential weeks of holidays.

    Not sure what wealth distribution trends are but 2017 figures indicate 1% owns 33%. 4% own the next 20%. ...And 50% own 1.1%.

    So you've written off DCC, National Government and now MD, who should replace them?


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    #82
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Landon Scrawny Fog wrote: »
    Problem is he's likely not that far wrong.

    A proportion of the workforce on temporary short-term contracts had been growing since 2008, and that 160,000 people endured significant variations in their hours of work from week to week, or month to month.

    Most mid-level folks in cube farms rarely get out most days on time, and any talk of a trade union would be quickly laughed off, along with a requests for full two seqential weeks of holidays.

    Not sure what wealth distribution trends are but 2017 figures indicate 1% owns 33%. 4% own the next 20%. ...And 50% own 1.1%.

    So you've written off DCC, National Government and now MD, who should replace them?

    Absolutely, but again, labour shortage is the time to strike for better conditions, or leave to get better conditions. 4 years ago you had to accept what was out there, now you (we) don't.


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