No toilets in Iarnród Éireann stations: legal?

Stephen15

1874 wrote: »

I avoid using private businesses facilities if out because you need to purchase something to use them or get that response, so unless you're really stuck, but I thought it was a requirement for private businesses, yet it isnt for public services that could cater to a lot of people? I should be surprised but Im not. Essential services and infrastructure should be owned by the state but run privately to set standards, neither on their own seems to work.

Most shops don't provide toilets only those serving food and drink are required to.

Guy:Incognito

1874 wrote: »

.

Dont know why its not considered that toilet facilities aren't a basic essential on a public transport network in a civilised modern society, so if someone is just caught short and needs to go? or if a person has a bowel disorder, what do they do they do, on the side of the platform/road? .

What are all these people doing now? I rarely see people ****ting in the streets.

AndrewJRenko

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

What are all these people doing now? I rarely see people ****ting in the streets.

So we don't need the SnapCrap app over here then?


https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/world/snapcrap-app-steps-in-to-take-on-public-poop-in-san-francisco-10854360

punisher5112

The council have let us down as these facilities should be across the city of Dublin at the very least.

We had many public toilets but we're all shut.

There were some train stations that had them but were constantly destroyed so they shut them.

mloc123

I was shocked this week... waiting for a Dublin Bus I discovered there was no toilet at the bus stop, my situation was made even worse when I boarded the bus only to find there was no toilet on it also...

Signore Fancy Pants

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Now, there's somebody thinking outside the box. A win-win situation, rather than the miserable "suck it up" attitude from some people.

Well what have you done to rectify the situation?

Post on boards?

Well done.

AlekSmart

mloc123 wrote: »

I was shocked this week... waiting for a Dublin Bus I discovered there was no toilet at the bus stop, my situation was made even worse when I boarded the bus only to find there was no toilet on it also...

Did you spare a thought (penny) for the Busdriver....

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-london-43048596

Imagine upwards of 4 hours per shift spent bumping and rattling around on a rainy day....

AlekSmart

Grab All Association wrote: »

Jcdecaux type toilets could be installed in most stations. They pay for themselves.

They could indeed....I wonder why a thoroughly innovative and profit centred company such as JCD has'nt erected these self-financing revenue earning items all over the place....?

All over the place like......

https://www.eveningexpress.co.uk/fp/news/local/police-appeal-after-vandals-smash-up-public-toilets-in-north-east-village/

https://lincolnshirereporter.co.uk/2018/10/12500-public-toilet-spend-to-stop-council-loo-sing-out-to-vandalism/

https://www.westerntelegraph.co.uk/news/15770801.crack-down-on-vandalism-following-toilet-smash/

https://jerseyeveningpost.com/news/2018/06/11/cottagers-blamed-after-vandalism-of-public-loos/

....and thats the dastardly Brits :eek:

We also do have a bit of an issue...

https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/it-costs-council-euro12-when-someone-spends-a-penny-in-cork-682491.html

https://www.dublininquirer.com/2016/01/13/will-dublin-see-the-return-of-the-public-toilet

Most worthy publication I could find is.....

http://eprints.maynoothuniversity.ie/3906/1/RK_socio-spatial_construction.pdf

Del.Monte

@ AlekSmart

I think this one https://www.dublininquirer.com/2016/01/13/will-dublin-see-the-return-of-the-public-toilet from all your links says enough. The cost would be massive - so I guess CIE will install them everywhere now if they read this thread.

Losty Dublin

mloc123 wrote: »

I was shocked this week... waiting for a Dublin Bus I discovered there was no toilet at the bus stop, my situation was made even worse when I boarded the bus only to find there was no toilet on it also...

Ah here; next thing you'll be wanting a greenway there and back to your bus stop!

punisher5112

AlekSmart wrote: »

Did you spare a thought (penny) for the Busdriver....

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-london-43048596

Imagine upwards of 4 hours per shift spent bumping and rattling around on a rainy day....

Shifts in db are a lot longer then that.

Depends on duty and where it starts but I would have to go without a toilet for 6 or more hours on some duties. Worst case was 7½hours.

Normal shifts with breaks could be 5⅓ hours at least before getting to a toilet.

It's not healthy at all.

magicbastarder

Deleted User wrote: »

This is a really crap attitude. I don't use most of the privately owned restaurants in Ireland but I expect they'll have toilets, even special toilets for disabled people, as part of their remit for that business. Refusing to put toilets in train stations, where people are waiting around, is inexcusable.

you're comparing a permanently manned business whose very source of income is providing, eh, an 'input' to 'output' we're talking about.
how many other businesses are required to provide toilets?

if you go to your average takeaway even, they don't have publically accessible toilets - only establishments where the food or drink is actually consumed on the premises usually has facilities.

also, it's not just the cost of the loo roll we're talking about here. installing a public loo would be in the five figure range in immediate costs

Del2005

magicbastarder wrote: »

also, it's not just the cost of the loo roll we're talking about here. installing a public loo would be in the five figure range in immediate costs

Then you'd have the claims from people falling on the water they put on the floor.

AlekSmart

Del2005 wrote: »

Then you'd have the claims from people falling on the water they put on the floor.

Indeed,and we have a comprehensive account of such activities direct from the front line....here....

http://blackdwarfireland.blogspot.com/2015/06/supermacs-fastfood-restaurant-pat.html

gctest50

[Deleted User] wrote: »

This is a really crap attitude. I don't use most of the privately owned restaurants in Ireland but I expect they'll have toilets, even special toilets for disabled people, as part of their remit for that business. Refusing to put toilets in train stations, where people are waiting around, is inexcusable. The DART, as with Iarnród Éireann generally, is a monopoly service so it should be forced by the same legislature which bestows that privileged status upon it to provide such basics. As said above, in continental Europe providing essentials like toilets is the norm. It would be a nice break if a politician in the Department of Transport could draw inspiration from France or the Netherlands rather than from the failed system

created by Thatcher's Britain

and force Iarnród Éireann to raise its service to the level of 'Basic'.

What sort of a post is that ?

The English invented trains, so next time you step on one, you may as well give a verse of "God save the Queen" in your head.

Eric Cartman

Grab All Association wrote: »

Jcdecaux type toilets could be installed in most stations. They pay for themselves.

Chris_5339762 wrote: »

I'm not surprised the DART stations don't have toilets, but as a whole we in Ireland are dreadful at providing public toilets of any form. There are almost none.

Too expensive to buy and maintain , you're talking about also getting a schedule around of people to clean them etc... like have you seen the state of toilets on commuter trains , they're always disgusting, could you imagine the ones at the stations themselves would be worse.

Then theres the drug problem, realistically Dublin had a choice when heroin came on the scene, get rid of all the public toilets or get rid of all the junkies. I think they made the wrong choice.

AndrewJRenko

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

How many people would use a loo at Booterstown each day? Maybe 10 people, so €20 a day income? It wouldn't pay for soap and bog roll.

Well, the car park is usually full Monday to Friday so I'd imagine there would be a use for it. There is also a good number of students from several large local schools getting the DART there.

RandomName2

RandomName2 wrote: »

Saw this thread. Saw the OP...

Stalking yet another Boards' poster? You need to get over the OCD of hunting down a poster across the entire website when they don't accept your view in a discussion. Do you not find it just a tad creepy? Anyway, congratulations on finding another forum to bring your issues into. Any views on the actual topic?

dartboardio

Public toilets in this country for the most are a joke. You’d be scared going into most toilets in a train station, most are filthy, smelly and nearly dangerous!

What about the toilets they have in many European cities main train stations, kept clean, you pay 20c in.

There is one (!) public toilet on the streets of Waterford city, I’ve never used it, seems to be a place homeless find shelter or junkies find somewhere to take drugs.

gctest50

gctest50 wrote: »

What sort of a post is that ?

The English invented trains, so next time you step on one, you may as well give a verse of "God save the Queen" in your head.

What a strange post in several respects. Most people could deduce it's a reference to the privatisation of railways, as a result of Thatcher's Tory ideology of privatisation, which undermined services there.

gctest50

[Deleted User] wrote: »

What a strange post in several respects.

Most people could deduce it's a reference to the privatisation of railways, as a result of Thatcher's Tory ideology of privatisation, which undermined services there.

It's not rocket surgery to deduce what that post was about

DART is privatised.

British Rail was privatised in 1997

OMG the English tuk our toilets

Alf Veedersane

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Well, the car park is usually full Monday to Friday so I'd imagine there would be a use for it. There is also a good number of students from several large local schools getting the DART there.

People getting the DART from there are unlikely to need to use a toilet there. The number of those who would have travelled a distance that they would need the use a toilet when they get there would be pretty small.

bobbyss

GerardKeating wrote:

Or just a coin lock, 2 euro a "go".

2 Euro? For a go? You'd want to make sure you had a good go at that price.

Noble Korhedron

Anthracite wrote: »

What a weird answer, but it sums up the CIE attitude perfectly, and demonstrates everything that is wrong with the mentality.

"Why should our service be any good if more people don't use it" - can you imagine if you stood up in a meeting in a real company and said that?

I can; I can also imagine being laughed out of said meeting as a result, and/or fired... :rolleyes:

Del.Monte

bobbyss wrote: »

2 Euro? For a go? You'd want to make sure you had a good go at that price.

At €20 a go in a location like Booterstown station it wouldn't pay for the installation alone in 500 years not to mention maintenance.

AndrewJRenko

Anthracite wrote: »

What a weird answer, but it sums up the CIE attitude perfectly, and demonstrates everything that is wrong with the mentality.

"Why should our service be any good if more people don't use it" - can you imagine if you stood up in a meeting in a real company and said that?

Can you imagine if you stood up in a meeting in a 'real' company and said: Let's build a new product that will bring in about €20 per day. It will cost of tens of thousands of Euro to build it, and certainly thousands in staff costs to maintain it.

AllForIt

Del.Monte wrote: »

Perhaps if you used the train more frequently there would be a better level of facilities available. This is the typical reaction of people who never use the service but expect everything to be in place on the rare occasion that they do. In a quiet station like Booterstown the toilets would soon be a no-go area.

This must be the most thanked stupidest comment I have ever read.

The idea that if one expects to have have toilet facilities then one must perpetually use every station in the country to have one is just bonkers.

Also if the station is not particularly busy I can't see how you think it would become a no-go area. I lived in Booterstown for years - there is no riff-raff in that area in stark contrast to most of the rest of Dublin so if any station could maintain a low maintenance toilet facility it would be Booterstown Dart station.

I'm appalled by ppl who would argue against the most basic of facilities.

Toilets are not supposed to be money making, they are a service you provide to the customer.

However, attaching a marginal cost, 0.20 eur to each use is sufficient to prevent misuse. This has been shown to work in other examples such as shopping trollies with theft issues practically eliminated once the coin locks were added.

There are many of these such units (self-contained, self-cleaning, non-slip flooring) throughout the country already. Maintenance is required on a weekly basis to restock toilet paper and soap only.

A smarter option would be to make it 0.20 eur per use when used with a leap card or 0.50 eur if paying by coin, thereby increasing the number of benefits of owning a card.

Heart Break Kid

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Well, the car park is usually full Monday to Friday so I'd imagine there would be a use for it. There is also a good number of students from several large local schools getting the DART there.

I’d suspect most people have some control over their movements and capable of waiting till they get to work or school or go before they leave the house.

EdgeCase

gctest50 wrote: »

It's not rocket surgery to deduce what that post was about

DART is privatised.

British Rail was privatised in 1997

OMG the English tuk our toilets

The DART is absolutely not privatised. It's owned and operated by Irish Rail / Iarnrod Éireann which is a state-owned company.