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Holy water?

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    #32
    Roger Hassenforder
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,555 ✭✭✭Roger Hassenforder


    ohnonotgmail wrote: »
    Exactly. As with all things catholic intelligent and highly educated people (mostly men to be fair) have pondered over every aspect.

    https://www.catholic.com/qa/celiac-disease-and-transubstantiation

    "You can call me Doctor Father Tom, I've a doctorate in theology...several papers published on how many angels can dance on the head of a pin, and such pressing matters..."


    So who peer reviews the experts in theology, other theologians...


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    #33
    irishguitarlad
    Registered Users Posts: 2,752 ✭✭✭irishguitarlad


    https://youtu.be/s7srvA1V740


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    #34
    Deebles McBeebles
    Registered Users Posts: 5,754 ✭✭✭Deebles McBeebles


    decky1 wrote: »
    my father always said 'holy water will not boil' don't know why he thought this.?

    If a watched kettle never boils maybe he should walked out of the kitchen for a minute.


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    #35
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,214 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    Roger Hassenforder wrote: »
    "You can call me Doctor Father Tom, I've a doctorate in theology...several papers published on how many angels can dance on the head of a pin, and such pressing matters..."


    So who peer reviews the experts in theology, other theologians...


    well of course. they will be the authors peers.


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    #36
    PlaneSpeeking
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,106 ✭✭✭PlaneSpeeking


    Oh ffs. Take the religion bashing elsewhere eh ? Boring now.


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    #37
    NIMAN
    Registered Users Posts: 33,149 ✭✭✭✭NIMAN


    decky1 wrote: »
    my father always said 'holy water will not boil' don't know why he thought this.?

    Did you ever tell your dad he's a fool?

    Make a bet with him and take the easy money!


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    #38
    nozzferrahhtoo
    Registered Users Posts: 9,338 ✭✭✭nozzferrahhtoo


    wexie wrote: »
    That's mad!! And here was me thinking that transubstantiation was just a load of bollocks :o

    It might be. I have never personally heard it specified which part of this guys body it is meant to be turning into.
    PlaneSpeeking wrote: »
    Oh ffs. Take the religion bashing elsewhere eh ? Boring now.

    That, or we could investigate why most people seem to have the ability to open the threads that interest them, and skip over the ones that do not...... while a small vocal minority do not.


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    #39
    wexie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,480 ✭✭✭wexie


    nozzferrahhtoo wrote: »
    It might be. I have never personally heard it specified which part of this guys body it is meant to be turning into. .

    Gotta be toenails no?


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    #40
    Cee-Jay-Cee
    Registered Users Posts: 12,235 ✭✭✭✭Cee-Jay-Cee


    Deebles McBeebles wrote: »
    If a watched kettle never boils maybe he should walked out of the kitchen for a minute.

    I watched my kettle boil earlier this morning so that saying has been well and truly debunked.


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    #41
    wexie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,480 ✭✭✭wexie


    Cee-Jay-Cee wrote: »
    I watched my kettle boil earlier this morning so that saying has been well and truly debunked.

    was there holy water in it though?

    (and if so.....why?)


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    #42
    sbsquarepants
    Registered Users Posts: 11,812 ✭✭✭✭sbsquarepants


    I was a christening before (or was it a wedding I can't remember) it was in Mount Argus though and they have kegs of holy water stacked up beside the jacks. Kegs!


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    #43
    nozzferrahhtoo
    Registered Users Posts: 9,338 ✭✭✭nozzferrahhtoo


    wexie wrote: »
    Gotta be toenails no?

    The consistency of the last one I ate would certainly suggest this as a possibility.

    Actually I have eaten testicles. Not Human ones. And the texture is certainly comparable to the magic crackers.


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    #44
    Berserker
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,046 ✭✭✭Berserker


    Yawn on the RCC bashing but I'm still intrigued by this. How do you measure the success rate of holy water? If you have gastroenteritis, for example and your symptoms subside a few days after you use it, has the water cured you or has your body remedied the situation naturally? What makes it holy in the first place?
    Roger Hassenforder wrote: »
    So who peer reviews the experts in theology, other theologians...

    Peer reviews are performed in the same manner as pretty much every other academic field out there, I'd imagine. They've put the work into gaining expert level knowledge in their field, so I don't see the issue with it.


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    #45
    nozzferrahhtoo
    Registered Users Posts: 9,338 ✭✭✭nozzferrahhtoo


    Berserker wrote: »
    Yawn on the RCC bashing but I'm still intrigued by this. How do you measure the success rate of holy water? If you have gastroenteritis, for example and your symptoms subside a few days after you use it, has the water cured you or has your body remedied the situation naturally?

    Yea "return to the mean" is an issue for us in epidemiology. When trying to measure the efficacy of a treatment or drug we have to do our best to take into account that a certain % of people will get better anyway, nothing to do with the drug.

    And it is often not easy, and sometimes not even possible, to account for that. However with things like Holy Water and visits to "Knock" and the like there are other ways to do it. One can look at "cures" these things offer and compare it to the % of people you would expect to get better naturally.

    And some things fare worse. For example the cure rate claimed at Lourdes for cancer appears to be markedly less than spontaneous remission. Meaning you have a better chance of dying because of Lourdes than being cured because of it.

    In the University of Vienna they found >85% of holy water held bacteria consistent with fecal matter and that holy water from Lourdes specifically had caused hospital patients to receive infections.

    Visits to there to get your holy water will certainly cure you of your money however. Interestingly in 2008 the pope offered plenary indulgence to anyone who visited Lourdes. Coincidentally, but unconnected I am sure, close to the time when Vatican Airlines was launched to get you there.

    Whatever else you could bash the church with, you have to admire their business model.


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    #46
    topper75
    Registered Users Posts: 5,942 ✭✭✭topper75


    Roger Hassenforder wrote: »
    I think the priests blessed the aquifer.
    All recharge and abstracted water thus of sufficient holiness

    But wouldn't the extra suspended particles make the holy water denser and thus it would never make it to the surface due to gravity? unless maybe there was a spring placed at the bottom of a slope.

    God, being Creator, made all the water on Day 1. So how could he make something without blessing it? This might entail that He made something imperfect, which cannot be the case with Him being perfect.
    So work away folks - it is all holy. Sprinkle it on any orange parade that may pass your way.


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    #47
    wexie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,480 ✭✭✭wexie


    topper75 wrote: »
    But wouldn't the extra suspended particles

    Which particles? the holiness particles?

    I bet the guys at CERN are working really hard to isolate them.


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    #48
    nozzferrahhtoo
    Registered Users Posts: 9,338 ✭✭✭nozzferrahhtoo


    wexie wrote: »
    I bet the guys at CERN are working really hard to isolate them.

    I have always loved the story, though I have not yet checked if it is true, that the "God Particle" the media went a little nutty over for awhile was actually a contraction.

    In fact the Scientists who coined the name actually had called it the "Goddamn particle" due to the difficulty involved in finding it.


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    #49
    mcmoustache
    Registered Users Posts: 7,236 ✭✭✭mcmoustache


    The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »
    Of course not. Homeopathy is a medical science with a long proven track record of improving health and curing illness. It is a taught and regulated profession, requiring in depth study to be able to practice it, by such bodies as The Homeopathy Research Institute, The Irish School of Homeopathy, and the British Institute of Homeopathy.
    Holy Water - is just make believe for the superstitious, the simple minded, and the desperate.

    I wonder if the Catholic could create such institutes to verify the integrity of holy water and bring it up to the standards of Homeopathy?

    They could create a labelling system which could include its holiness factor among other things. A graduated scale from 1 to 10 would allow people to make informed decisions when purchasing their holy water. For example, factor 1 would be good enough to prevent sunburn at night, factor 5 would relieve the pain of ginger hair while factor 10 would cure amputations.

    This way consumers could make informed decisions and avoid the embarrassment of tossing factor 2 holy water on their knob in a sad attempt to get it up because they'd know that you need factor 4 holy water for that.


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    #50
    Roger Hassenforder
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,555 ✭✭✭Roger Hassenforder


    You'd have to have some certification process, maybe even an ISO standard.

    And there'll be rip offs, a knock off offering level 5 efficacy for half the price of an ISO certified level 5, probably only tap water instead of the real thing.


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