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Connacht Team Talk Thread V - The Friend Zone

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    #9302
    Burkie1203
    Registered Users Posts: 11,240 ✭✭✭✭Burkie1203


    Mul, it's over
    connachta wrote: »
    the player was going downward FFS.
    That's logical to sanction, not to put heavy bans on unintionnal moves
    Think most agree with me and hope the panel too
    6 weeks will be very harsh already

    No the Zebre player was not going downwards. He is almost bolt upright bar a slight bend of the knees

    Papaili is leaning forward head first and is driving upwards. Look at his feet.

    I think he may get longer then 6 weeks


    https://twitter.com/eirSport/status/1330540517340422145?s=19


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    #9303
    Bazzo
    Registered Users Posts: 7,047 ✭✭✭Bazzo


    Mul, it's over
    Reilly got man of the match. Very good performance from the young fella.


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    #9304
    connachta
    Registered Users Posts: 7,965 ✭✭✭connachta


    There was nothing intentional in it
    Read the severe rules you like so much, it can't lead further than those harsh 6 weeks without this intentionaly on a simple had collision

    FFS you're just anti-Connacht and especialy against Papa, you admited you did not even watch the game.
    Ignore list was the best option, back into it


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    #9305
    connemara man
    Moderators, Sports Moderators, Regional West Moderators Posts: 6,773 Mod ✭✭✭✭connemara man


    The Friend Zone
    Bazzo wrote: »
    Reilly got man of the match. Very good performance from the young fella.

    Thought it might go to Wootton but Reilly had a good game


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    #9306
    Burkie1203
    Registered Users Posts: 11,240 ✭✭✭✭Burkie1203


    Mul, it's over
    connachta wrote: »
    There was nothing intentional in it
    Read the severe rules you like so much, it can't lead further than those harsh 6 weeks without this intentionaly on a simple had collision

    FFS you're just anti-Connacht and especialy against Papa, you admited you did not even watch the game.
    Ignore list was the best option, back into it


    I watched the first half. I then put the Scotland game on.

    Intent does not come into it.


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    #9307
    freyners
    Registered Users Posts: 4,300 ✭✭✭freyners


    The Friend Zone
    Burkie1203 wrote: »
    No the Zebre player was not going downwards. He is almost bolt upright bar a slight bend of the knees

    Papaili is leaning forward head first and is driving upwards. Look at his feet.

    I think he may get longer then 6 weeks


    https://twitter.com/eirSport/status/1330540517340422145?s=19

    With that angle I can see where your coming from, there's another angle from the back where it looks from my viewing that he's trying to recover from the zebre player running inside of him

    Not disputing the red, but this is a case of poor timing and body position than him driving up to try to hurt the player or a dominant hit gone wrong


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    #9308
    JohnniDrama
    Closed Accounts Posts: 97 ✭✭JohnniDrama


    Did we win?

    Anyone with a quick summary of main takeaways?


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    #9309
    Burkie1203
    Registered Users Posts: 11,240 ✭✭✭✭Burkie1203


    Mul, it's over
    freyners wrote: »
    With that angle I can see where your coming from, there's another angle from the back where it looks from my viewing that he's trying to recover from the zebre player running inside of him

    Not disputing the red, but this is a case of poor timing and body position than him driving up to try to hurt the player or a dominant hit gone wrong

    I never said he was doing anything intentional. That doesn't come into it anyway. If you don't go low you take the risk. Papaili has the raw power but he needs to use it positively.

    Just for some context.

    https://twitter.com/DrHermanoPTPhD/status/1330485611103399940?s=19


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    #9310
    thomond2006
    Registered Users Posts: 45,433 ✭✭✭✭thomond2006


    Some Like It TOH
    That's a red card. There's nothing else the ref can do in that situation.

    Papali'i now has an extended break on the way to get his conditioning in order, otherwise his stay at Connacht will be done in the summer.


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    #9311
    Burkie1203
    Registered Users Posts: 11,240 ✭✭✭✭Burkie1203


    Mul, it's over
    JohnniDrama wrote: »
    Did we win?

    Anyone with a quick summary of main takeaways?

    Bad start
    Good recovery
    One bad looking injury
    Papaili red card


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    #9312
    connachta
    Registered Users Posts: 7,965 ✭✭✭connachta


    JohnniDrama wrote: »
    Did we win?

    Anyone with a quick summary of main takeaways?




    1) Daly, masterclass in his simplicity, same for Porch


    2) Reilly, TBC against better opposition, Scarlets last week..


    3) Farrell knee-injury


    4) We're messy but talented


    5) Dillane has to start IMO, he brings the "go-forward' we need


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    #9313
    Bazzo
    Registered Users Posts: 7,047 ✭✭✭Bazzo


    Mul, it's over
    Burkie1203 wrote: »
    Bad start
    Good recovery
    One bad looking injury
    Papaili red card

    Didn't you just say you only watched the first half?


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    #9314
    Burkie1203
    Registered Users Posts: 11,240 ✭✭✭✭Burkie1203


    Mul, it's over
    Bazzo wrote: »
    Didn't you just say you only watched the first half?

    There is this thing called Twitter. And video clips


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    #9315
    Bazzo
    Registered Users Posts: 7,047 ✭✭✭Bazzo


    Mul, it's over
    Burkie1203 wrote: »
    There is this thing called Twitter. And video clips

    Thanks, must look them up.


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    #9316
    sydthebeat
    Subscribers Posts: 41,227 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    The Friend Zone
    thats bloody awful tackle technique from papalii ... he can have no argument now against a lengthy ban... and i hope he spends it all learning how to bend in his tackle. He is not playing rugby league any more.


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    #9317
    CowboyTed
    Registered Users Posts: 783 ✭✭✭CowboyTed


    Burkie1203 wrote: »
    It was head on head


    I wasnt watching the game, have only seen the incident on social media but I'm assuming the Zebre player was stretchered off given the amount of medics around him in that clip?


    I politely suggest you read this

    https://twitter.com/BrianODriscoll/status/1330422083940179969?s=19

    Even that is only a yellow...

    There is mitigation... Papaili was in position and the player jinked to the left... The tackle was not high and the ref did not pull for being high..
    Papaili was sent off for leading with the head.

    Now if we look at even the video given on twitter you can see the Italian is pushing off his right leg 0:07 and the heads clash in crossing...

    Now the question is, did Paps lead with the head into the Italian Player or is the Italian player (who was running and jinked) who clashed into Papaili...

    Personally I think it was an accident and not everything on a rugby pitch has an angel and a villain...


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    #9318
    ElisaAtWar
    Registered Users Posts: 1,026 ✭✭✭ElisaAtWar


    sydthebeat wrote: »
    thats bloody awful tackle technique from papalii ... he can have no argument now against a lengthy ban... and i hope he spends it all learning how to bend in his tackle. He is not playing rugby league any more.

    Not the first time for him to show inaccurate tackling. On the positives Tom Daly is developing nicely at Connacht. Conor Fitzgerald really added when he came on and Reilly looks really promising.

    Negatives were Tom Farrell's injury. Looks like a bad knee ligament issue which could have him out for an extended period. And the other negative is that Zebre really are rubbish and are only making up numbers in this league.

    I guess you can only play what is put in front of you and overall the performance was good. Offloads were made when offloads were the right choice and going into contact when the offload wasn't the right choice. So that's promising. Arnold is a very solid unit. So overall a decent result with most players playing well.

    And of course great Sean O'Brien back. It's good to see he is has not lost his hunger. A pure beast of a man


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    #9319
    CowboyTed
    Registered Users Posts: 783 ✭✭✭CowboyTed


    freyners wrote: »
    With that angle I can see where your coming from, there's another angle from the back where it looks from my viewing that he's trying to recover from the zebre player running inside of him

    Not disputing the red, but this is a case of poor timing and body position than him driving up to try to hurt the player or a dominant hit gone wrong

    At full speed the Italian just ducks to left in the very last second and there heads clash as they are crossing...

    We could look at it as bad technique but then we should at least penalize bad technique but what is the right technique in this situation? He could be lower but his own head would have been hit and he would have still been leading with his head...

    I actually don't know how Papaili can't but lead with his head in this position when a player ducks late across you from one shoulder to another...


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    #9320
    Burkie1203
    Registered Users Posts: 11,240 ✭✭✭✭Burkie1203


    Mul, it's over
    CowboyTed wrote: »
    Even that is only a yellow...

    There is mitigation... Papaili was in position and the player jinked to the left... The tackle was not high and the ref did not pull for being high..
    Papaili was sent off for leading with the head.

    Now if we look at even the video given on twitter you can see the Italian is pushing off his right leg 0:07 and the heads clash in crossing...

    Now the question is, did Paps lead with the head into the Italian Player or is the Italian player (who was running and jinked) who clashed into Papaili...

    Personally I think it was an accident and not everything on a rugby pitch has an angel and a villain...

    The Zebre player moved left and Papaili pushed off his feet (at point of contact AP is leading with his head into the head of the Zebre player with his toes touching the ground as he is pushing forward and upwards)

    Did AP intend to do that. I don't think so. But intent doesnt come into it.

    But he has terrible technique. If you lead with your head and are going high, your asking for trouble. AP is the one trying to tackle. The onus is on him to ensure he tackles legally. He didn't.

    The Zebre player is practically fully upright bar a minor bend of the knees. There is no mitigation.


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    #9321
    sydthebeat
    Subscribers Posts: 41,227 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    The Friend Zone
    CowboyTed wrote: »
    At full speed the Italian just ducks to left in the very last second and there heads clash as they are crossing...

    We could look at it as bad technique but then we should at least penalize bad technique but what is the right technique in this situation? He could be lower but his own head would have been hit and he would have still been leading with his head...

    I actually don't know how Papaili can't but lead with his head in this position when a player ducks late across you from one shoulder to another...

    Sorry but if you can't see what the right technique is, and how Papali'i can do a lot more than lead with his head, then there's really no point trying to explain is there?

    Papali'i sets his feet, drives forward and up.
    His eyes never leave the players face, so he never had inclination to make a body tackle. Basic tackle technique tells you to eye your target.


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    #9322
    its_phil
    Registered Users Posts: 5,442 ✭✭✭its_phil


    Mul, it's over
    How is this even a discussion? A blow like that to the head is a red card. Papalli's technique was awful, regardless of Zebre player stepping.


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    #9323
    connachta
    Registered Users Posts: 7,965 ✭✭✭connachta


    So Ulster shoulder was just a yellow?


    The tendency seems just about anytime, anything happens above this shoulder line is red whatever it is, intentional or not. It was on purpose in Ulster case.
    Stupid tendency, but a least make it consistant...


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    #9324
    Burkie1203
    Registered Users Posts: 11,240 ✭✭✭✭Burkie1203


    Mul, it's over
    connachta wrote: »
    So Ulster shoulder was just a yellow?


    The tendency seems just about anytime, anything happen above this shoulder line is red whatever intentional or not. It was on purpose in Ulster case.
    Stupid tendency, but a least make it consistant...

    The general consensus is the card in the Ulster game is the wrong colour.


    INTENT DOES NOT COME INTO IT


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    #9325
    connachta
    Registered Users Posts: 7,965 ✭✭✭connachta


    With the tendency the yellow card (made for dangerous play) is useless, everything should be red.
    Utterly stupid. Of course the appreciation of intention have to come into it.

    Touching a player in the air was (unwisely) tolerated. Now it's a pen. Good. According to the way a player made nothing to avoid it, it's a yellow. Good. If he made this tackle to harm, it's red. Great.
    That's called refereeing. Not automatically butchering games


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    #9326
    Burkie1203
    Registered Users Posts: 11,240 ✭✭✭✭Burkie1203


    Mul, it's over
    connachta wrote: »
    With the tendency the yellow card (made for dangerous play) is useless, everything should be red.
    Utterly stupid. Of course the appreciation of intention have to come into it.

    Touching a player in the air was (unwisely) tolerated. Now it's a pen. Good. According to the way a player made nothing to avoid it, it's a yellow. Good. If he made this tackle to harm, it's red. Great.
    That's called refereeing. Not automatically butchering games

    If professional athletes who train daily cannot improve their technique, they are either thick, or poorly coached, or both

    Intention does not come into it. And rightly so. Player welfare is far more important but you obviously don't give a sh1t about that


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    #9327
    sydthebeat
    Subscribers Posts: 41,227 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    The Friend Zone
    connachta wrote: »
    ......
    Of course the appreciation of intention have to come into it.

    But it doesn't.

    If you comprehended that it would be easier understand the outcomes of these incidents.

    Intent does not factor into the decision


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    #9328
    connachta
    Registered Users Posts: 7,965 ✭✭✭connachta


    sydthebeat wrote: »
    But it doesn't.




    And the yellow was yellow tonight.
    When it suits your read it's ok. When it does not, wrong call


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    #9329
    sydthebeat
    Subscribers Posts: 41,227 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    The Friend Zone
    connachta wrote: »
    And the yellow was yellow tonight.
    When it suits your read it's ok. When it does not, wrong call

    ???
    What are you on about??

    The reason it was reduced from a red (as per the refs first option) was very well explained by the TMO ie there was reduced force.

    The reason Papali'i got a red was also very well explained by the ref.

    Just because you don't understand the decisions does not mean they are incorrect decisions


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    #9330
    ElisaAtWar
    Registered Users Posts: 1,026 ✭✭✭ElisaAtWar


    connachta wrote: »
    And the yellow was yellow tonight.
    When it suits your read it's ok. When it does not, wrong call

    While I may agree this is not to say that every such call is right. There are some very bizarre calls out there which makes it frustrating.


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    #9331
    Burkie1203
    Registered Users Posts: 11,240 ✭✭✭✭Burkie1203


    Mul, it's over
    sydthebeat wrote: »
    ???
    What are you on about??

    The reason it was reduced from a red (as per the refs first option) was very well explained by the TMO ie there was reduced force.

    The reason Papali'i got a red was also very well explained by the ref.

    Just because you don't understand the decisions does not mean they are incorrect decisions

    Treadwell should have got a red. Look at Cipriani red in Thomond a few years ago.


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