Drew Harris appointed Garda commissioner.

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AlekSmart wrote: »

It's hard to believe it's four years ago now,but I hope this particular Sergeant has been promoted or recognised in some way for maintaining his composure and professionalism in the face of ignorance.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WSn-9zzMxIU

Here here, so many little angels thinking they can have an a la carte version of the law
Seen similar images to these myself , as soon as camera turned off , the real abuse and intimidation of guards starts.

I fully agree with everyone having the right to "peaceful" protest and to vote for whatever party they want from "looney we want everything for free left" to "far right give them nothing" . I mightn't agree with either sides position but hey that's democracy at work.

The law is there to prevent anarchy simple as that, the problem is that everybody now through social media takes offence to everything and make rash populist reactions without full possession of the facts.

By God ( hope I didn't offend anyone using the "G" word) life was so much simpler just a few years back that seems like a lifetime ago

end of the road

suicide_circus wrote: »

is this harris throwing the lads under the bus at the first sight of trouble?

no . far from it.

Potential-Monke

end of the road wrote: »

the equipment is for protection from people throwing dangerous things at their faces. it's not to protect their identity. if the commissioner says they weren't supposed to wear the equipment in that situation, or if they needed to wear it, wear the full equipment, then that is the rule and it is non-negotiable. they weren't wearing the helmet as required, therefore clearly there was no danger from people throwing potentially firey things at their faces, therefore they should not have been covering their faces.
the water protests are irrelevant, whether the commissioner was around or not for those protests is irrelevant. he is the boss.

Again, you're missing my point. The protestors in the property were not the problem, the ones outside were. They covered their faces to prevent any attacks on them when off-duty, which has happened previously due to the water protests. No one wants that, they were still identifiable if required. The same faces show at these protests, and if there was no need for them, they would not have been there and the 3 Gardaí that went with the Sheriff would be the only ones needed, but that wasn't the case.

You obviously are not a Garda, so you've no idea what it's like on the other side. I fully support my ex-colleagues in covering their faces in these social media fueled protests. And Harris is throwing them under the bus. AGS has been waiting for a Commissioner to make the hard changes and go against the politicians, it's too early to state if he is the one, but off to a bad start imo. He should have been behind his colleagues and cite the examples as a reason why, instead he went by the only bit of information he has at the moment on the uniform.

If they did wear the helmets there'd be even more uproar. You can't win. You're going with the line that the code says uniform x, y and z, but you're ok with a court order being needed to remove trespassers, and trespassing is a crime in itself so it should never have gone this far. Experience and intelligence shows that there are people at all of these social protests who only go to give hassle or 'catch' the Gardaí doing something, but it's usually a clip of what is happening, rather than what led to it, what happened and the aftermath. They're dead right to cover their faces, and it should be made the norm in these social protests.

alaimacerc

Potential-Monke wrote: »

AGS has been waiting for a Commissioner to make the hard changes and go against the politicians, it's too early to state if he is the one, but off to a bad start imo.

AGS seems to have had no shortage of commissioners willing to "go against the politicians" -- by changing absolutely nothing. Exactly what changes were you hoping he'd carry out, that aren't subject to -- indeed, seemingly are directly contrary to -- democratic accountability?

alaimacerc

Potential-Monke wrote: »

an angry mob who like to dish out social justice

Thing you might be crossing the beams on those axes you're grinding there.

Potential-Monke

alaimacerc wrote: »

AGS seems to have had no shortage of commissioners willing to "go against the politicians" -- by changing absolutely nothing. Exactly what changes were you hoping he'd carry out, that aren't subject to -- indeed, seemingly are directly contrary to -- democratic accountability?

Every commissioner since 2007 (when I joined, so can't talk about the ones before then) has been a political puppet, pandering to what the politicians wants rather than what the force needs. What would I like to see? A commissioner who tells the truth, who gives the public a proper insight into the issues AGS face. That last one, Noirin, said there was no issue with a lack of Gardai, when it's plainly obvious there was. Granted, anytime a big wig came to visit our station, every office Garda and even the sub-district members were brought in to show numbers. But that's still a management decision from the Chief.

I want a commissioner who will properly equip the Gardai. Bodycams are a necessity now, as are tasers, but none of the commissioners ever tried to bring them in. The bodycams will be of public benefit, as everything will be recorded. The tasers are less lethal than the ASPs, but they won't bring them in, most likely due to cost.

I want a commissioner that gives properly equipped purpose built patrol cars, not Hyundai i30's with the radio removed and some stickers and radio put in. I want a commissioner that will protect it's force, rather than the coffers. It's not much to ask, but every commissioner for as long as I was a Garda was useless. I thought someone from the outside might be different, but it's too early to make that call just yet.

alaimacerc wrote: »

Thing you might be crossing the beams on those axes you're grinding there.

I don't follow. Are you saying there are no people attending these protests with the only intention of causing trouble? Because if you are, you're naive. But that's ok, you wouldn't know that if you were never a Garda. But I guarantee you 100% that there is at least 1 or 2 at every protest who have the only agenda of causing trouble, or 'catching out' the Gardai there. Thing is, they're well known. I could give you the names of them from the area I worked, but the Official Secrets Act and Garda Code prevent me from doing so (and that little law, what was it... Data protection, that's it).

Like every Garda bashing thread, this is only going to end up in circles. I've said my bit, I'm not repeating it. People have agendas, people have opinions and they won't charge, regardless, so no point in trying too hard.

Potential-Monke

And this is why they were covering their faces. And why I fully support them covering their faces at any of these social protests. Simply doing his job (regardless of circumstances, he was directed to the protest to prevent a breach of the peace, not by the occupiers, but by a crowd that gathered afterwards) and now has death threats (bullet to the head, tie wrap around his neck), daily movements given on social media, where he eats, what station he's in, etc.

Regardless of your stance on the protest or how it was handled, this is why their faces were covered. The same happened with the water protests, innocent Gardaí having their pictures and private information plastered all over social media by someone with no actual interest in the reason for the protest, but only there to add to the hate campaign against the Gardaí. I hope all threats are fully investigated and those involved are prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law, even if they are only keyboard warriors.

blanch152

Potential-Monke wrote: »

Every commissioner since 2007 (when I joined, so can't talk about the ones before then) has been a political puppet, pandering to what the politicians wants rather than what the force needs. What would I like to see? A commissioner who tells the truth, who gives the public a proper insight into the issues AGS face. That last one, Noirin, said there was no issue with a lack of Gardai, when it's plainly obvious there was. Granted, anytime a big wig came to visit our station, every office Garda and even the sub-district members were brought in to show numbers. But that's still a management decision from the Chief.

I want a commissioner who will properly equip the Gardai. Bodycams are a necessity now, as are tasers, but none of the commissioners ever tried to bring them in. The bodycams will be of public benefit, as everything will be recorded. The tasers are less lethal than the ASPs, but they won't bring them in, most likely due to cost.

I want a commissioner that gives properly equipped purpose built patrol cars, not Hyundai i30's with the radio removed and some stickers and radio put in. I want a commissioner that will protect it's force, rather than the coffers. It's not much to ask, but every commissioner for as long as I was a Garda was useless. I thought someone from the outside might be different, but it's too early to make that call just yet.



I don't follow. Are you saying there are no people attending these protests with the only intention of causing trouble? Because if you are, you're naive. But that's ok, you wouldn't know that if you were never a Garda. But I guarantee you 100% that there is at least 1 or 2 at every protest who have the only agenda of causing trouble, or 'catching out' the Gardai there. Thing is, they're well known. I could give you the names of them from the area I worked, but the Official Secrets Act and Garda Code prevent me from doing so (and that little law, what was it... Data protection, that's it).

Like every Garda bashing thread, this is only going to end up in circles. I've said my bit, I'm not repeating it. People have agendas, people have opinions and they won't charge, regardless, so no point in trying too hard.

The reason there isn't enough money for the Gardai is because of the huge investment in social welfare by the Government. Ireland is among the highest levels of direct transfers in welfare payments in the world.

Fann Linn

blanch152 wrote: »

The reason there isn't enough money for the Gardai is because of the huge investment in social welfare by the Government. Ireland is among the highest levels of direct transfers in welfare payments in the world.

Plus one of the highest paid Police forces. Not so long ago they got an €87,000,000 payrise.

HeidiHeidi

end of the road wrote: »

the gardai's identity isn't the issue, i have already said they were identifiable. it's the shadowy masked men which is the focus of my concern. also, given the gardai weren't wearing their helmets as required as part of their balaclava, then it obviously wasn't necessary, otherwise they would have worn the helmet as required. the comments from the garda commissioner today seem to suggest the same thing. having it go to a court order is nothing to do with being soft, it's just the way it's done and i'd suggest it's a good thing.

end of the road wrote: »

the equipment is for protection from people throwing dangerous things at their faces. it's not to protect their identity. if the commissioner says they weren't supposed to wear the equipment in that situation, or if they needed to wear it, wear the full equipment, then that is the rule and it is non-negotiable. they weren't wearing the helmet as required, therefore clearly there was no danger from people throwing potentially firey things at their faces, therefore they should not have been covering their faces.
the water protests are irrelevant, whether the commissioner was around or not for those protests is irrelevant. he is the boss.

Are you even reading the posts you're replying to?

ohnonotgmail

Fann Linn wrote: »

Plus one of the highest paid Police forces. Not so long ago they got an €87,000,000 payrise.

each? blimey.

Fann Linn

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

each? blimey.

'they'.