Water charges revisited?

CeilingFly · 02-07-2018 02:51PM

Hitman3000 wrote: »

50% of processed water leaking into the ground before the tap.

Current figure is circa 45% and the current infrastructure programme will bring that down to well under 40% within 2 years.

But massive money is needed to redo the archaic pipework

Generally around the world, unaccounted water represents 20-25% of treated water. Even in california who claim to have the most efficient water system in the world, unaccounted water is over 15%. So the real leakage/unaccounted target should be in the region of 20/25% - after that its uneconomical.

Hence, the current hosepipe ban that is in place to ensure supply of water even if we have another 6 weeks of dry weather is the right thing to do.

The Bishop Basher · 02-07-2018 03:06PM

blanch152 wrote: »

But that doesn't mean that a particular protest isn't stupid, misguided, ignorant, dangerously populist, crazy or wrong. And the Irish Water protests were all of those.

In your opinion..

The protesters, myself included, felt differently.

You only seem to like democracy when people agree with you which isn't how it works.

We won. The refunds are being processed. Water charges are off the table.

Move on..

FreudianSlippers · 02-07-2018 03:25PM

Rennaws wrote: »

In your opinion..

The protesters, myself included, felt differently.

You only seem to like democracy when people agree with you which isn't how it works.

We won. The refunds are being processed. Water charges are off the table.

Move on..

Water charges very much aren't off the table; they're back in January 2019 for any domestic user that uses over 213,000 litres per annum.

Water protesters didn't "win" anything - they assisted in ensuring that the Irish people will be unable to access a steady supply of a commodity. Funny enough, the protesters claimed that free water is a human right (which it isn't) and this "win" of yours could potentially impact negatively on the actual human rights regarding access to safe water.

Congratulations?

thomas 123 · 02-07-2018 03:57PM

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

Water charges very much aren't off the table; they're back in January 2019 for any domestic user that uses over 213,000 litres per annum.

Water protesters didn't "win" anything - they assisted in ensuring that the Irish people will be unable to access a steady supply of a commodity. Funny enough, the protesters claimed that free water is a human right (which it isn't) and this "win" of yours could potentially impact negatively on the actual human rights regarding access to safe water.

Congratulations?

How did we manage to provide clean water up until now?

Will you be happy when the government takes all our money or just 90% ?

FreudianSlippers · 02-07-2018 04:10PM

thomas 123 wrote: »

How did we manage to provide clean water up until now?

We don't. There's literally no water right now.

Will you be happy when the government takes all our money or just 90% ?

I'll be happy when government taxation policy is burnt to the ground and re-built in a fair and equitable manner to everyone and not just the lowest earners in society.

I'll be happy when we stop wasting tax money on utilities, such as water, and we have a well-run, regulated and subsidized semi-state water utility.

bladespin · 02-07-2018 04:15PM

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

I'll be happy when we stop wasting tax money on utilities, such as water, and we have a well-run, regulated and subsidized semi-state water utility.

That could never happen here, they like their quangos and cronies too much, knew the old IW was doomed as soon as they started appointing, no thought at all just jobs for the boys and wages to beat the bank, wasted opportunity, VBTW it wasn't just the low incomes that protested, plenty of the middle guys did to.

Slightly alarmist, there is water now, Ireland didn't suddenly turn into sub Saharan Africa just because of a bit of sun, it'd take longer than a couple of weeks.

McMurphy · 02-07-2018 04:20PM

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

We don't. There's literally no water right now.

Ah come on, there is too.

There's a hose pipe ban in place in Dublin to try and conserve the water, but stating there literally isn't water at all is a bit of a stretch.

Hitman3000 · 02-07-2018 04:23PM

FreudianSlippers wrote:

There's literally no water right now.

Are people just going to make nonsense claims now and expect to be taken serious?

thomas 123 · 02-07-2018 04:24PM

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

We don't. There's literally no water right now.

I'll be happy when government taxation policy is burnt to the ground and re-built in a fair and equitable manner to everyone and not just the lowest earners in society.

I'll be happy when we stop wasting tax money on utilities, such as water, and we have a well-run, regulated and subsidized semi-state water utility.

Like said above - we cant do that in this country.

It would be great for 5-10 years then it will be sold to the likes of Nestle.

thomas 123 · 02-07-2018 04:25PM

Sorry forgot to Add the few years of scandals tribunals and golden handshakes.

02-07-2018 04:25PM

thomas 123 wrote: »

How did we manage to provide clean water up until now?

Will you be happy when the government takes all our money or just 90% ?

Are you suggesting that the government are just pocketing our money? How very dare they.

02-07-2018 04:25PM

Hitman3000 wrote: »

Are people just going to make nonsense claims now and expect to be taken serious?

Post of the day!

FreudianSlippers · 02-07-2018 04:26PM

Johnny Dogs wrote: »

Ah come on, there is too.

There's a hose pipe ban in place in Dublin to try and conserve the water, but stating there literally isn't water at all is a bit of a stretch.

Hose pipe ban just for the craic? No, because we're seriously and dangerously short on water supplies. What do you suggest the rationale is for the hose pipe ban and general national request to conserve water?

thomas 123 · 02-07-2018 04:27PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Are you suggesting that the government are just pocketing our money? How very dare they.

Good one - 10/10 contribution to the debate.

You should stay in the background and keep thanking comments.

And yes they pocket and misuse quite a lot of our money eg: Nama, Anglo Irish, Noreen O'Sullivans Pension.

thomas 123 · 02-07-2018 04:30PM

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

Hose pipe ban just for the craic? No, because we're seriously and dangerously short on water supplies. What do you suggest the rationale is for the hose pipe ban and general national request to conserve water?

To Irish waters credit its a little bit of thinking ahead in case of the worst.

Heres RTE's List of whats banned:(Lucky you can still drink it)
https://www.rte.ie/news/newslens/2018/0702/975722-hosepipe-ban-water-restrictions/

McMurphy · 02-07-2018 04:32PM

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

Hose pipe ban just for the craic? No, because we're seriously and dangerously short on water supplies. What do you suggest the rationale is for the hose pipe ban and general national request to conserve water?

Let me remind you that you proclaimed there was literally No water right now.

Stop trying to shift the goalposts.

bladespin · 02-07-2018 04:34PM

thomas 123 wrote: »

To Irish waters credit its a little bit of thinking ahead in case of the worst.

Heres RTE's List of whats banned:(Lucky you can still drink it)
https://www.rte.ie/news/newslens/2018/0702/975722-hosepipe-ban-water-restrictions/

Is it just Dublin???

FreudianSlippers · 02-07-2018 04:39PM

Johnny Dogs wrote: »

Let me remind you that you proclaimed there was literally No water right now.

Stop trying to shift the goalposts.

There is literally not enough water to adequately supply the country. That is a fact.

Hitman3000 · 02-07-2018 04:40PM

Deleted User wrote:

Post of the day!

Not me MA that claimed there is 'literally no water' . I think FS deserves that distinction for his hyperbolic post.

FreudianSlippers · 02-07-2018 04:43PM

bladespin wrote: »

Is it just Dublin???

Greater Dublin Region at present, although I heard somewhere it may be extended nationwide - I'll see if I can dig out where I saw that.

EDIT: It was on Morning Ireland this morning - found a link here: https://www.rte.ie/news/2018/0702/974655-water/

ancapailldorcha · 02-07-2018 05:35PM

thomas 123 wrote: »

Good one - 10/10 contribution to the debate.

You should stay in the background and keep thanking comments.

And yes they pocket and misuse quite a lot of our money eg: Nama, Anglo Irish, Noreen O'Sullivans Pension.

Enough of the snide digs, please.

thomas 123 · 02-07-2018 05:48PM

Noted.

The Bishop Basher · 02-07-2018 06:03PM

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

Water charges very much aren't off the table; they're back in January 2019 for any domestic user that uses over 213,000 litres per annum.

Really

Good luck with that..

I can hear the banners and megaphones being dusted off up and down the country as we speak..

I can't be metered anyway and I intend on dying here so I won't be paying on the treble but I'll get out and march in support of everyone else again if I have to..

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

Water protesters didn't "win" anything - they assisted in ensuring that the Irish people will be unable to access a steady supply of a commodity. Funny enough, the protesters claimed that free water is a human right (which it isn't) and this "win" of yours could potentially impact negatively on the actual human rights regarding access to safe water.

So you're sticking to the same line as last time ? Fair enough..

It's amazing that my tap still works at all but work it does.. We even have a major infrastructural project under way at the moment so i look forward to an uninterrupted supply of fresh water for many years to come.

All paid for by me and you.. The tax payer..

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

Congratulations?

Nearly but not quite. Irish Water still exist. That said, I think we're stuck with them for now and i suppose we can try and get our moneys worth by letting them handle a few projects..

But congratulations on the fact that I achieved what I set out to achieve which was not having to pay yet another tax ?

Yes for sure. I'll take the congrats. Thank you

The Bishop Basher · 02-07-2018 06:05PM

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

Greater Dublin Region at present, although I heard somewhere it may be extended nationwide - I'll see if I can dig out where I saw that.

EDIT: It was on Morning Ireland this morning - found a link here: https://www.rte.ie/news/2018/0702/974655-water/

Water shortages happen in many countries during the Summer months including countries that have a charge.

This is a complete red herring..

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2018/jan/05/south-east-england-at-risk-of-water-shortages-this-summer-officials-warn

phater phagan · 02-07-2018 06:12PM

My water is off in Kerry. Irish Water website really doesn't give any indication when it will be back on.
I was one of those who paid the water charges - but for a country of just 4.5 million people our public services are as inadequate as if there were 64.5 million in our small country. HSE, Water, etc. costing us first world expenditure for third world services. Very frustrating.

fxotoole · 02-07-2018 06:19PM

thomas 123 wrote: »

Good one - 10/10 contribution to the debate.

You should stay in the background and keep thanking comments.

And yes they pocket and misuse quite a lot of our money eg: Nama, Anglo Irish, Noreen O'Sullivans Pension.

All of which has nothing to do with water charges. Nice whatabouttery. Go you.

fxotoole · 02-07-2018 06:23PM

Rennaws wrote: »

Water shortages happen in many countries during the Summer months including countries that have a charge.

This is a complete red herring..

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2018/jan/05/south-east-england-at-risk-of-water-shortages-this-summer-officials-warn

Do those countries have adequate funding to provide water to the whole country during droughts?

Coz · 02-07-2018 06:27PM

FreudianSlippers wrote:

There is literally not enough water to adequately supply the country. That is a fact.

There is. The issue is that for every 1 litre of water used IW has to process 2 litres due to leakage.

This is because of poor investment over the years and our 3 contributions to Water Services being frittered away and not spent where they should be.

marno21 · 02-07-2018 06:37PM

phater phagan wrote: »

My water is off in Kerry. Irish Water website really doesn't give any indication when it will be back on.
I was one of those who paid the water charges - but for a country of just 4.5 million people our public services are as inadequate as if there were 64.5 million in our small country. HSE, Water, etc. costing us first world expenditure for third world services. Very frustrating.

And with that constant objections to efficiencies and reform by self serving unions screaming "privatisation". The issue isn't funding, it's the obscenely inefficient way in which money is wasted in this country.

It would be much more beneficial if this year's Budget sought to cut the cost of living for people rather than throwing fivers at this person and the other. The mind boggles

marno21 · 02-07-2018 06:39PM

Coz wrote: »

There is. The issue is that for every 1 litre of water used IW has to process 2 litres due to leakage.

This is because of poor investment over the years and our 3 contributions to Water Services being frittered away and not spent where they should be.

Exactly this. This was discussed on Today FM this evening and the one point that was made clear to listeners by one guest is that there's little benefit in piping water up from the Shannon only to lose half of it to leaks. Using meters to detect customer leaks and improving larger network leaks should be done asap instead of a massive project that will ultimately only give half benefits.

Water charges revisited?

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