Waterford GAA thread - mod warning post #1 and #51

Junior Hurler

Gunners’ victory margins 11, 19, 12, 18, 17

Mastermcgrath

Billy Ocean wrote: »

Seen a comment elsewhere that ballygunners pick would be bigger than the rest of east Waterford clubs combined, would that be an exaggeration?

Just a bit.

The bottom line is they are doing the work at underage level and utilising the resources they have. Tramore have ‘a big pick‘ but no one says they have an unfair advantage.

The one thing that feeds into Bgunners advantage is the parish rule or lack thereof, in Waterford. I don’t specifically know if many players affiliated with the club are not from the area, but there’s nothing to stop parents from other areas if the city and county sending their little Johnny out to Ballygunner cos its fashionable and they beleive they have the best chance at being the next Paul Flynn or paudie Mahony or whoever else

PTH2009

Mastermcgrath wrote: »

Just a bit.

The bottom line is they are doing the work at underage level and utilising the resources they have. Tramore have ‘a big pick‘ but no one says they have an unfair advantage.

The one thing that feeds into Bgunners advantage is the parish rule or lack thereof, in Waterford. I don’t specifically know if many players affiliated with the club are not from the area, but there’s nothing to stop parents from other areas if the city and county sending their little Johnny out to Ballygunner cos its fashionable and they beleive they have the best chance at being the next Paul Flynn or paudie Mahony or whoever else

nothing stopping Aussie Gleeson transferring clubs and he might actually win a county senior medal with BGl. Obv not happening

seananigans

PTH2009 wrote: »

nothing stopping Aussie Gleeson transferring clubs and he might actually win a county senior medal with BGl. Obv not happening

would be the making of him, BG manager talking about how they built a system to get the best out of dessie, and how its a near county setup in terms of professionalism would have him put in place.

they could also afford to drop him as much as they want ,something mt sion and waterford dont have

Mastermcgrath

seananigans wrote: »

would be the making of him, BG manager talking about how they built a system to get the best out of dessie, and how its a near county setup in terms of professionalism would have him put in place.

they could also afford to drop him as much as they want ,something mt sion and waterford dont have

Can we stop the conversation there

JesusRef

Borrisileigh and Ballyhale are tiny places with a pick smaller than alot of clubs in Waterford.

They both have beaten Ballygunner recently

It's time for Waterford clubs to quit the pity and excuses

thesultan

Maybe that could could be that while Ballygunner have Avery good team they have no superstar on their team like a Reid or Horgan.

Cornerstoner

thesultan wrote: »

Maybe that could could be that while Ballygunner have Avery good team they have no superstar on their team like a Reid or Horgan.

My own personal opinion is that BG struggle at the latter end of the Club Championships as a result of having no ball winners in there forward line. There forwards are all of a similar style: skilful, fast and good movement. Add in the fact that these games are generally played in winter conditions where winning primary possession is more effective than short stick passing that can break down. The Borris game from last year is a prime example

Jjjjjjjjbarry

Lot of talk of Ballygunner's pool of players and little about how there were 4 brothers + cousins on the team. Their senior team is probably made up of fewer families than most other teams in the country.

mountgomery burns

Jjjjjjjjbarry wrote: »

Lot of talk of Ballygunner's pool of players and little about how there were 4 brothers + cousins on the team. Their senior team is probably made up of fewer families than most other teams in the country.

Fair enough about the Mahonys, Sullivans, O'Keeffes etc but don't agree with the second statement. It's feature of most rural club teams. Might be a bit unique in the City but certainly not unique in Waterford let alone Ireland.

Waternut

thesultan wrote: »

Maybe that could could be that while Ballygunner have Avery good team they have no superstar on their team like a Reid or Horgan.

A lot of sensible comments here on Ballygunner. Yes, they have been regularly beaten by smaller rural clubs in the Munster and All Ireland club championship and it really begs the question as to the standard of the Waterford championship.
It's up to other Waterford clubs to reach the Ballygunner standard but it seems the likes of De La Salle and Mount Sion have seriously regressed in recent years and are probably not investing as much time in their underage structures.
As mentioned, the likes of Tramore, De La Salle and Dungarvan have similar numbers / catchment to Ballygunner, so I don't buy the argument that it's a numbers game. It is down to the time and effort put in underage. Someone mentioned recently that Ballygunner ran away with the U14 A championship. De La Salle were only playing in division 2 or 3 and both Dungarvan and Tramore were also down in division 2 or 3. Dungarvan and Tramore have regularly been playing Division 2 and 3 in all age groups

thesultan

Ballygunner remind me of Dublin.. Both have massive populations and once they had their structures in place they destroyed all round them. Population and money combined to beat all round them. Ballygunner I think the only club that don't sell the Deise draw. They don't have to. Every other club its their lifeline.

Mount Sion in their pomp in the 90s were the kingpins of the county. They were winning countless titles but they never had fellas all of a one age playing at one age..

PTH2009

thesultan wrote: »

Ballygunner remind me of Dublin.. Both have massive populations and once they had their structures in place they destroyed all round them. Population and money combined to beat all round them. Ballygunner I think the only club that don't sell the Deise draw. They don't have to. Every other club its their lifeline.

Mount Sion in their pomp in the 90s were the kingpins of the county. They were winning countless titles but they never had fellas all of a one age playing at one age..

The Mount Sion team of the late 90s/early 00s vs this current crop in Ballygunner would of been some game

Be interesting what Cahill and his management team decide before the IC return on the 14th Sep

Motivator

Back at the turn of the decade, De La Salle looked like they could do what Ballygunner are doing now. De La Salle won an u21 title around 2008 and that panel of players, I think, had never been beaten at any age group all the way up. They had some excellent hurlers mixed with some good hurlers who looked like they would develop into a serious senior team over time but it never really happened. Moran is the only one still playing senior hurling.

Ballygunner are just an awesome team and the club itself is a monster. Whatever about their skill levels, the senior team’s attitude and application is second to none. I don’t know if I’ve ever seen a fitter club team. Their forward line might be small but they’re powerful. Are they probably one player short of an all Ireland winning team? Yes. They need an out and out full forward. They need a big and strong focal point for their attack. If not to start then to bring on if their plan A doesn’t work. They panicked a small bit against Boris last year and against Ballyhale the year before. There’s nothing wrong with route 1 hurling and I think the addition of a big ball winning full forward to do nothing but sit on the edge of the square would make them an even better team and could be the difference in the All Ireland series.

tommylad1212

Waternut wrote: »

A lot of sensible comments here on Ballygunner. Yes, they have been regularly beaten by smaller rural clubs in the Munster and All Ireland club championship and it really begs the question as to the standard of the Waterford championship.
It's up to other Waterford clubs to reach the Ballygunner standard but it seems the likes of De La Salle and Mount Sion have seriously regressed in recent years and are probably not investing as much time in their underage structures.
As mentioned, the likes of Tramore, De La Salle and Dungarvan have similar numbers / catchment to Ballygunner, so I don't buy the argument that it's a numbers game. It is down to the time and effort put in underage. Someone mentioned recently that Ballygunner ran away with the U14 A championship. De La Salle were only playing in division 2 or 3 and both Dungarvan and Tramore were also down in division 2 or 3. Dungarvan and Tramore have regularly been playing Division 2 and 3 in all age groups

Dungarvan haven't large pick, all the new houses are been build in abbyside, brickeys seem to be getting numbers from dungarvan for some reason

conor05

Motivator wrote: »

Back at the turn of the decade, De La Salle looked like they could do what Ballygunner are doing now. De La Salle won an u21 title around 2008 and that panel of players, I think, had never been beaten at any age group all the way up. They had some excellent hurlers mixed with some good hurlers who looked like they would develop into a serious senior team over time but it never really happened. Moran is the only one still playing senior hurling.

Ballygunner are just an awesome team and the club itself is a monster. Whatever about their skill levels, the senior team’s attitude and application is second to none. I don’t know if I’ve ever seen a fitter club team. Their forward line might be small but they’re powerful. Are they probably one player short of an all Ireland winning team? Yes. They need an out and out full forward. They need a big and strong focal point for their attack. If not to start then to bring on if their plan A doesn’t work. They panicked a small bit against Boris last year and against Ballyhale the year before. There’s nothing wrong with route 1 hurling and I think the addition of a big ball winning full forward to do nothing but sit on the edge of the square would make them an even better team and could be the difference in the All Ireland series.

Ballygunner do not produce the same quality of hurler that Ballyhale produce, it’s that simple.
Ballyhale have TJ, Ritchie & Eoin Reid, Darren & Adrian Mullen, Joey Holden, Colin Fennelly, Eoin Cody. Name me 8 hurlers on the Ballygunner panel as good as them 8?

I can even think of 3 or 4 other senior teams in Kilkenny that would beat this current Ballygunner team. The standard isn’t that strong in Waterford.

TheScoringGoal

conor05 wrote: »

Ballygunner do not produce the same quality of hurler that Ballyhale produce, it’s that simple.
Ballyhale have TJ, Ritchie & Eoin Reid, Darren & Adrian Mullen, Joey Holden, Colin Fennelly, Eoin Cody. Name me 8 hurlers on the Ballygunner panel as good as them 8?

I can even think of 3 or 4 other senior teams in Kilkenny that would beat this current Ballygunner team. The standard isn’t that strong in Waterford.

There are Ballygunner players better than players you have named. Both Mahoneys ahead of Ritchie and Eoin Reid. I'd argue Coughlan ahead of Holden. Ballygunner don't have a TJ or similar elite standard player though yet. They have hopes for at least one coming through.

thesultan

PTH2009 wrote: »

The Mount Sion team of the late 90s/early 00s vs this current crop in Ballygunner would of been some game

Be interesting what Cahill and his management team decide before the IC return on the 14th Sep

Mount Sion had six players on the 02 Waterford team. Ballygunner never had that talent.

thesultan

TheScoringGoal wrote: »

There are Ballygunner players better than players you have named. Both Mahoneys ahead of Ritchie and Eoin Reid. I'd argue Coughlan ahead of Holden. Ballygunner don't have a TJ or similar elite standard player though yet. They have hopes for at least one coming through.

Coughlan is a stopper and a very good one at that but holden has more hurling. Saw him recently against Glen rovers and he gave an exhibition of defending.

mountgomery burns

conor05 wrote: »

Ballygunner do not produce the same quality of hurler that Ballyhale produce, it’s that simple.
Ballyhale have TJ, Ritchie & Eoin Reid, Darren & Adrian Mullen, Joey Holden, Colin Fennelly, Eoin Cody. Name me 8 hurlers on the Ballygunner panel as good as them 8?

I can even think of 3 or 4 other senior teams in Kilkenny that would beat this current Ballygunner team. The standard isn’t that strong in Waterford.

You're right about the standard in Waterford however I'm skeptical about your other point. No Kilkenny team has won Leinster outside of Ballyhale aside from O Loughlins in the last 10 years, and they were hammered by Clarinbridge in the All Ireland that year.

BGs record in Munster could be better but in the last two they beat a Na Piarsaigh side well in the final who had just been in two of the last 3 all Ireland's, and last year they hammered Sixmilebridge and Patrickswell before they just fell short in conditions that really didn't suit against Borrisileigh.

Don't bother naming players, watch them play.

Cake Man

TheScoringGoal wrote: »

They have hopes for at least one coming through.

Just curious to know who this is? Am always interested to hear of lads with potential coming through to keep an eye on their progress over the years.
Pity there isn’t a Munster/AI club championship, it would have been very interesting to see how far BG would have gone.

seananigans

Cake Man wrote: »

Just curious to know who this is? Am always interested to hear of lads with potential coming through to keep an eye on their progress over the years.
Pity there isn’t a Munster/AI club championship, it would have been very interesting to see how far BG would have gone.

Dessie Hutchinson ,Mikey Mahony, and Billy O'Keefe all come to mind im sure theres more but those are the ones at senior level that are obvious.

Jjjjjjjjbarry

Any updates on who'll be on the Waterford senior panel yet?
Can't wait to see the panel so we can start arguing over starting 15's and who'll be on frees and where Aussie will play

upthedeise16

Cake Man wrote: »

Just curious to know who this is? Am always interested to hear of lads with potential coming through to keep an eye on their progress over the years.
Pity there isn’t a Munster/AI club championship, it would have been very interesting to see how far BG would have gone.

Young Fitzgerald who was outstanding in the minor final

tommylad1212

Jjjjjjjjbarry wrote: »

Any updates on who'll be on the Waterford senior panel yet?
Can't wait to see the panel so we can start arguing over starting 15's and who'll be on frees and where Aussie will play

.


The same panel they had for the lge, might me one or two in and out,

PTH2009

tommylad1212 wrote: »

.


The same panel they had for the lge, might me one or two in and out,

Cahill gave a good interview on TG4 and siad management are considering all options

Looking forward to the championship even though we wont be going to games but suppose it will be on TV and we can all argue here play by play

Ian OB

Jjjjjjjjbarry wrote: »

Any updates on who'll be on the Waterford senior panel yet?
Can't wait to see the panel so we can start arguing over starting 15's and who'll be on frees and where Aussie will play

It won't matter where Aussie is played. By half-time we'll be saying he should be in one of two other positions instead!!

: )

thesultan

PTH2009 wrote: »

Cahill gave a good interview on TG4 and siad management are considering all options

Looking forward to the championship even though we wont be going to games but suppose it will be on TV and we can all argue here play by play

He also said he'd judge players on how they did against Ballygunner..

Parishman

That was a mad comment from Liam Cahill to make as half the senior clubs did not play Ballygunner this year.

Can see very few coming into panel but on a brighter note many of the county panel did play well in fairness. For me the most impressive was Callum Lyons overall, Conor Prunty's display against Lismore and Dessie Hutchinson. someone who I think might be worth a call is Martin O' Neill of Mt Sion even if only for his free taking always good to have a back up. There are a few others who are in the Under 20 ranks, but it is probably a year too soon, Kevin Mahoney & Rory Furlong to name a few. On the championship as a whole Ballygunners' defence is their rock and I was very impressed with them as a unit. Well marshaled by Philip and Socky they suffocated teams and was a great platform for the forwards to score at will.

greenspurs

mountgomery burns wrote: »

You're right about the standard in Waterford however I'm skeptical about your other point. No Kilkenny team has won Leinster outside of Ballyhale aside from O Loughlins in the last 10 years, and they were hammered by Clarinbridge in the All Ireland that year.

BGs record in Munster could be better but in the last two they beat a Na Piarsaigh side well in the final who had just been in two of the last 3 all Ireland's, and last year they hammered Sixmilebridge and Patrickswell before they just fell short in conditions that really didn't suit against Borrisileigh.

Don't bother naming players, watch them play.

He didn't say anything about Leinster-
He said there 3-4 KK teams that would beat Ballygunner… and its true.

And how often have Ballyhale beaten Ballygunner?