Peat bedding for cattle

Teddy 1234

It’s looking like straw will be scarce and expensive this coming year, do anyone use peat bedding for cattle?? What ar the advantages/disadvantages of it? And what does it cost, and can it be spread on the land like FYM.

Thanks

Never wrestle with pigs

Was thinking the same and it's something that might be easier sorted during the summer. Not to hijack your post but how does it compare with saw dust or wood chip for bedding and calving on cost etc.

Justjens

Miscanthus is another option, has great soakage by all accounts. Good bit of it around me, although it's all been harvested at this stage, the majority of it baled and sent to England to burn in a power station.

Managed to source some cut with a precision chop so will be trying a bit next winter.

Water John

I think the Boardsie, with the best knowledge on peat bedding is, Reggie.
I think you change it every 6 weeks. you might have to go back 1/2 months, on this thread, pics and all.
https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057765784&page=591

Located
https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057765784&page=400

Reggie.

Water John wrote: »

I think the Boardsie, with the best knowledge on peat bedding is, Reggie.
I think you change it every 6 weeks. you might have to go back 1/2 months, on this thread, pics and all.
https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057765784&page=591

Located
https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057765784&page=400

Yeah I used it this year and won't be going back to straw for bedding. Put approx 3 m3 in a 15ft x 20ft bay to house 6 weanlings, at approx 250kg. Get 8 to 10 weeks before cleaning out. Goes out like FYM in the spreader. Used roughly 8m3 this year at a cost of €70.

charolais0153

I used woodchip this year. Cost about €12 per calf for 4 months.will be using it again. Havent tried it in calving pens tho

Hard Knocks

charolais0153 wrote: »

I used woodchip this year. Cost about €12 per calf for 4 months.will be using it again. Havent tried it in calving pens tho

Is it hard keep clean?
Can it be spread or what do you do with it afterwards

Who2

Hard Knocks wrote: »

Is it hard keep clean?
Can it be spread or what do you do with it afterwards

It needs to be stock piled for two years to help it break down. Out in a side slinger no hassle. Definitely don’t let it near your tanks. I learnt the hard way.

Hagimalone

Reggie. wrote:

Yeah I used it this year and won't be going back to straw for bedding. Put approx 3 m3 in a 15ft x 20ft bay to house 6 weanlings, at approx 250kg. Get 8 to 10 weeks before cleaning out. Goes out like FYM in the spreader. Used roughly 8m3 this year at a cost of €70.

That's seems very cheap in comparison to what's for sale on done deal, seen €300 for large redrock trailer, would it be 4m3 approx?

Reggie.

Hagimalone wrote: »

That's seems very cheap in comparison to what's for sale on done deal, seen €300 for large redrock trailer, would it be 4m3 approx?

Large redrock trailer holds roughly 26m3

amacca

Would the peat acidify the land its spread on? + maybe eat away at the dung spreader?

Hagimalone

Don't no what I was thinking about.

Reggie.

amacca wrote: »

Would the peat acidify the land its spread on? + maybe eat away at the dung spreader?

Can't be any worse on the spreader than FYM

Burning Tires

Was onto a staw merchant in England on Tuesday. Hes exporting straw to Ireland by the boat load next harvest. He has to fill 2 boats himself.
He made 22,000 bales of 8x4x3 and 8x4x4 last year and reckons he'll nearly have 30,000 this year.

charolais0153

Burning Tires wrote: »

Was onto a staw merchant in England on Tuesday. Hes exporting straw to Ireland by the boat load next harvest. He has to fill 2 boats himself.
He made 22,000 bales of 8x4x3 and 8x4x4 last year and reckons he'll nearly have 30,000 this year.

How much does that cost

Burning Tires

charolais0153 wrote: »

How much does that cost

I've no idea, but I'll be finding out in the coming week. I was just amazed at the number the man was quoting

Say my name

amacca wrote: »

Would the peat acidify the land its spread on? + maybe eat away at the dung spreader?

Google says peat moss is pH 4.4
Cattle dung pH 8.

I guess the only true test would be to test yourself with a hand held meter.

Water John

Gardeners should be able to give an opinion on peat, as they have, long used it.
This is also a mix with the cattle waste. Might be gardeners gold.
We'll have to fund Reggie, to do a trial.

Say my name

Water John wrote: »

Gardeners should be able to give an opinion on peat, as they have, long used it.
This is also a mix with the cattle waste. Might be gardeners gold.
We'll have to fund Reggie, to do a trial.

Put a hydrangea cutting into a pot of peat and see what colour the bloom comes.
If it's acidic it'll be blue.
If it's alkaline it'll be red/pink.

I have no idea of the answer to that test but that's a way to test soil pH.
(If you have nothing better to do for a few years while you wait on the result).

Water John

If the mix was left covered and composted, the worms might get to work, over time.

Say my name

Water John wrote: »

If the mix was left covered and composted, the worms might get to work, over time.

Google "Korean natural farming" for the craic.

orm0nd

amacca wrote: »

Would the peat acidify the land its spread on? + maybe eat away at the dung spreader?

plays havoc with ph apparently

Say my name

orm0nd wrote: »

plays havoc with ph apparently

It's the low pH (and no air) in peat that allows it to perfectly preserve "bog butter" and "bog bodies".
It's the same principal in silage making.

Just thinking as I'm typing about a thread I made about "silage char" about some ones in limerick putting charcoal into silage bales. No wonder there was no mention anymore of that practice. I mean silage needs a low pH and they were putting charcoal that probably had a pH of 9 into the bales. The bales must have turned out as dung when they went to open them.

Hagimalone

Has anyone ever used a combination of straw and peat? Reasons being I've straw but I'm not ready to get the peat just yet. So was thinking of starting off with straw & in 3 weeks or so get a load of peat. Also I've no dung stead, so what ever is in the shed stays in the shed.

Reggie.

Hagimalone wrote: »

Has anyone ever used a combination of straw and peat? Reasons being I've straw but I'm not ready to get the peat just yet. So was thinking of starting off with straw & in 3 weeks or so get a load of peat. Also I've no dung stead, so what ever is in the shed stays in the shed.

No go the other way round. Peat first them straw. Cattle will mix the straw through the peat for you and you'll get the extra soakage from the straw. If you go straw first you wont be able to root up the peat after a few weeks.

Can you not just pile the FYM in the field it's going to be spread on

newholland mad

Reggie. wrote: »

No go the other way round. Peat first them straw. Cattle will mix the straw through the peat for you and you'll get the extra soakage from the straw. If you go straw first you wont be able to root up the peat after a few weeks.

Can you not just pile the FYM in the field it's going to be spread on

Fym can't be stored on land until after the closed period afaik

Gudstock

Has anyone with bog tried to make their own peat bedding? I know you wouldnt be able to get the same moisture content and grading as the pros, just wondering if there was any diy way to make some? Have access to digger and tractor with duals.

EvanFahy

Have a read of this

https://www.motherearthnews.com/homesteading-and-livestock/pitchfork-pulpit-composting-livestock-manure-zm0z17fmzbre

Markcheese

Gudstock wrote: »

Has anyone with bog tried to make their own peat bedding? I know you wouldnt be able to get the same moisture content and grading as the pros, just wondering if there was any diy way to make some? Have access to digger and tractor with duals.

For the messing and hardship would it be worth it ?
It's dried milled peat that's being used for bedding , isn't it ?
Maybe if you had a really large concrete yard that you could chop it onto and spread it to dry ...

Reggie.

Markcheese wrote: »

For the messing and hardship would it be worth it ?
It's dried milled peat that's being used for bedding , isn't it ?
Maybe if you had a really large concrete yard that you could chop it onto and spread it to dry ...

Yeah its turned a few times on the bog before its piled up

wrangler

Reggie. wrote: »

Yeah its turned a few times on the bog before its piled up

I see our mutual friend drawing it with the big forage wagon

Reggie.

wrangler wrote: »

I see our mutual friend drawing it with the big forage wagon

He isnt

wrangler

Reggie. wrote: »

He isnt

He is, I saw it myself and thought he couldn't be , but he's drawing four loads a day past a friends house from derrinboy, near Kilcormac, two in the wagon and two in a trailer. So it's confirmed

Reggie.

wrangler wrote: »

He is, I saw it myself and thought he couldn't be , but he's drawing four loads a day past a friends house from derrinboy, near Kilcormac, two in the wagon and two in a trailer. So it's confirmed

He will wreck the wagon. The other man in kells that does it, his wagons are in rough shape from hauling it

wrangler

Reggie. wrote: »

He will wreck the wagon. The other man in kells that does it, his wagons are in rough shape from hauling it

I wouldn't think the tyres are good road tyres either, they look low pressure... maybe they're alright

Reggie.

wrangler wrote: »

I wouldn't think the tyres are good road tyres either, they look low pressure... maybe they're alright

Sure they would be the best in the country

K.G.

If this straw thing get going and with slurry spreading becoming as hard to do as making hay,is peat for bedding relatively carbon neutral when its not being burned.

Reggie.

K.G. wrote: »

If this straw thing get going and with slurry spreading becoming as hard to do as making hay,is peat for bedding relatively carbon neutral when its not being burned.

They say it is but its nearly impossible to get pest now as BNM has shut down

K.G.

Reggie. wrote: »

They say it is but its nearly impossible to get pest now as BNM has shut down

You were shifting some of it were you?.surely the gear and the know how is there still but maybe authorisation and access to bogs is the problem. Maybe the economics dont stack up either.seemed to work well for some lads and would think it would be a great addition to alot of farms soils

_Brian

It’s the extraction of the peat that’s as damaging as using it.

Bogs drained release their stored carbon making them nett emitters instead of consumers of carbon.

So you can’t just look at the peat in a trailer as a product and say it’s neutral to bed with it and spread it. The damage is being done to get it into the trailer.

Peat isn’t and can’t be a sustainable product for anything except left in place in a bog.

Reggie.

K.G. wrote: »

You were shifting some of it were you?.surely the gear and the know how is there still but maybe authorisation and access to bogs is the problem. Maybe the economics dont stack up either.seemed to work well for some lads and would think it would be a great addition to alot of farms soils

Well atm the talk is that all the equipment is being shipped to Norway to harvest the peat there and ship it back to dundalk. I seen the carriages getting loaded onto trucks myself. Pure madness imo.

At lot of peat here was shipped to uk every year. Not sure of the volumes but it's a safe bet it was nearly more than the domestic market was using.

A local firm here had 8 drivers and trucks on full time hauling container loads to the docks daily

Reggie.

_Brian wrote: »

It’s the extraction of the peat that’s as damaging as using it.

Bogs drained release their stored carbon making them nett emitters instead of consumers of carbon.

So you can’t just look at the peat in a trailer as a product and say it’s neutral to bed with it and spread it. The damage is being done to get it into the trailer.

Peat isn’t and can’t be a sustainable product for anything except left in place in a bog.

Not looking for a argument brian but tbh the green agenda is getting out of control.

Ireland as a whole contributes something like .1% of total global carbon. Now where in the name of god is stopping the peat going to save the planet. Sure if we were going to make a difference why harvest it elsewhere and ship it back to ireland. I bet I run of them large container ships used more fuel than BNM over many months.

I'd be all for cutting it back to domestic use only and no exports if it makes the greens feel better. The loss of jobs in the Midlands is going to be quite substantial. In the 1000s. That's a bigger disaster to the rural ireland.

The last few decades has seen the beet industry, many army and garda bks close in rural ireland and now the peat. It's like a non stop assault on the countryside. You would think with the way the covid is that the government would try to keep irish companies going and have ourselves self sufficient but no once again as a country we will be at the mercy of fluctuating markets as we are an island.

This isn't more for my great love of peat. Just the mind boggling stupidity and short sightedness of our political crowd who once again show that nothing matters outside the pale

wrangler

Reggie. wrote: »

Not looking for a argument brian but tbh the green agenda is getting out of control.

Ireland as a whole contributes something like .1% of total global carbon. Now where in the name of god is stopping the peat going to save the planet. Sure if we were going to make a difference why harvest it elsewhere and ship it back to ireland. I bet I run of them large container ships used more fuel than BNM over many months.

I'd be all for cutting it back to domestic use only and no exports if it makes the greens feel better. The loss of jobs in the Midlands is going to be quite substantial. In the 1000s. That's a bigger disaster to the rural ireland.

The last few decades has seen the beet industry, many army and garda bks close in rural ireland and now the peat. It's like a non stop assault on the countryside. You would think with the way the covid is that the government would try to keep irish companies going and have ourselves self sufficient but no once again as a country we will be at the mercy of fluctuating markets as we are an island.

This isn't more for my great love of peat. Just the mind boggling stupidity and short sightedness of our political crowd who once again show that nothing matters outside the pale

Agreed, This is public service pulling the ladder up again, they're sitting there insulated from the real world and f..k everyone else. Public service workers not taking their turns for vaccinations, jumping the queue, is the lowest of teh low and no more than I'd expect.
STOPPING THE PEAT WORKERS HERE AND LETTING IT GO ON IN OTHER COUNTRIES IS THE PITS

endainoz

Reggie. wrote: »

Not looking for a argument brian but tbh the green agenda is getting out of control.

Ireland as a whole contributes something like .1% of total global carbon. Now where in the name of god is stopping the peat going to save the planet. Sure if we were going to make a difference why harvest it elsewhere and ship it back to ireland. I bet I run of them large container ships used more fuel than BNM over many months.

I'd be all for cutting it back to domestic use only and no exports if it makes the greens feel better. The loss of jobs in the Midlands is going to be quite substantial. In the 1000s. That's a bigger disaster to the rural ireland.

The last few decades has seen the beet industry, many army and garda bks close in rural ireland and now the peat. It's like a non stop assault on the countryside. You would think with the way the covid is that the government would try to keep irish companies going and have ourselves self sufficient but no once again as a country we will be at the mercy of fluctuating markets as we are an island.

This isn't more for my great love of peat. Just the mind boggling stupidity and short sightedness of our political crowd who once again show that nothing matters outside the pale

Not looking for an argument either Reggie but as Brian said its the extraction that causes the massive damage. We can't use the attitude that were such a small country that it wouldn't make any difference when it suits us either.

As I had said before I did use peat for bedding in my first year of organic conversion (as it was allowed for that single year due to a sever straw shortage). It's by far the best thing you can put under animals in a bedded area. Once it's laid in thick enough, (About a foot deep). Theres a lot of dust in the beginning and if your water troughs are lowish to the ground like mine, there is a chance of your water getting nearly black from all the peat. But once you empty the water a few times and let the peat settle the cattle really take to it.

I don't know of any other bedding you could leave under animals without having to change it for such a long time. No cases of scour in calves or any pathogens that you'd normally find in straw. Animals were very clean with it too.

With all that being said, I was only allowed to use it for one season and have been using straw with all it's added hardships since. I could understand why I wasn't allowed to use it seen as I would be putting it out on the ground again as fym. But once I realized the massive carbon sinks our bogs are, it made sense.

I do fear for the rural job market for sure, particularly an area like the midlands that relies on it so much. Bord na Mona seem to have a plan to make loads of other jobs in green energy, I suppose we'll have to wait and see if they do or not.

jaymla627

Reggie. wrote: »

Not looking for a argument brian but tbh the green agenda is getting out of control.

Ireland as a whole contributes something like .1% of total global carbon. Now where in the name of god is stopping the peat going to save the planet. Sure if we were going to make a difference why harvest it elsewhere and ship it back to ireland. I bet I run of them large container ships used more fuel than BNM over many months.

I'd be all for cutting it back to domestic use only and no exports if it makes the greens feel better. The loss of jobs in the Midlands is going to be quite substantial. In the 1000s. That's a bigger disaster to the rural ireland.

The last few decades has seen the beet industry, many army and garda bks close in rural ireland and now the peat. It's like a non stop assault on the countryside. You would think with the way the covid is that the government would try to keep irish companies going and have ourselves self sufficient but no once again as a country we will be at the mercy of fluctuating markets as we are an island.

This isn't more for my great love of peat. Just the mind boggling stupidity and short sightedness of our political crowd who once again show that nothing matters outside the pale

If their was actual policies to mitigate the job losses with direct replacements in whatever green bulls**t jobs they deem planet saving enough then fair enough, bit their isn't any coherent policy our anything in the pipeline that will replace the jobs been lost, then you have the uproar over locals objecting to green energy be it windmills/ad plants etc that then usually don't go ahead what's the end game in all of this god knows but destroying irelands only remaining primary industries on the hope the Intel/apple tax take will be a never ending source of revenue is a fool's errand

_Brian

Continuing to extract the peat is destroying bogs that should be storing carbon, a haven for biodiversity and essential areas to mitigate flooding.

It’s not a sustainable practice it’s a destructive one that will in time have to stop anyway when the peat is exhausted. Then you have neither a big or cheap bedding, just nothing.

I’ve said before I’d allow turf cutting on private bogs to continue, but with no mechanised equipment, spades and barrows just like the old days that people say they are entitled to continue.


I completely agree an opposing viewpoint doesn’t have to be an argument.

Reggie.

endainoz wrote: »

Not looking for an argument either Reggie but as Brian said its the extraction that causes the massive damage. We can't use the attitude that were such a small country that it wouldn't make any difference when it suits us either.

If thats the case what's the argument for hauling from 1000s of miles away as opposed to just down the road. I think the green agenda is used just to justify stupid decisions.

The peat will still be extracted just from a different location. So wheres the difference then as the world as a whole? The carbon situation worldwide will be worse off due to it having to be shipped across the sea so in essence this isn't saving anything like carbon or the planet its just making the carbon situation worse.

Someone somewhere is benefiting from this plan and it's being wrapped up in the "saving the planet" wrapping paper

Reggie.

_Brian wrote: »

Continuing to extract the peat is destroying bogs that should be storing carbon, a haven for biodiversity and essential areas to mitigate flooding.

It’s not a sustainable practice it’s a destructive one that will in time have to stop anyway when the peat is exhausted. Then you have neither a big or cheap bedding, just nothing.

I’ve said before I’d allow turf cutting on private bogs to continue, but with no mechanised equipment, spades and barrows just like the old days that people say they are entitled to continue.


I completely agree an opposing viewpoint doesn’t have to be an argument.

But explain then why stop harvesting here only to start somewhere else.

endainoz

Reggie. wrote: »

If thats the case what's the argument for hauling from 1000s of miles away as opposed to just down the road. I think the green agenda is used just to justify stupid decisions.

The peat will still be extracted just from a different location. So wheres the difference then as the world as a whole? The carbon situation worldwide will be worse off due to it having to be shipped across the sea so in essence this isn't saving anything like carbon or the planet its just making the carbon situation worse.

Someone somewhere is benefiting from this plan and it's being wrapped up in the "saving the planet" wrapping paper

Do you think we're going to importing our own peat on as large a scale as we're currently using it? I can see horticulture growers importing it alright, but nobody like BNM will be doing it to make briquettes.

Reggie.

endainoz wrote: »

Do you think we're going to importing our own peat on as large a scale as we're currently using it? I can see horticulture growers importing it alright, but nobody like BNM will be doing it to make briquettes.

Germany is and thier briquettes are being imported to fill the gap at present.

Also most was exported like I said so itll just be exported to england from Norway as opposed to us. Like I said before it should have been banned from export then at least local businesses would have an advantage.

The extra cost will just have a negative impact on the farming/ mushroom/ horticultural industry as a whole. Jobs will be threated and the public will have to swallow extra cost for goods as a result

endainoz

Reggie. wrote: »

Germany is and thier briquettes are being imported to fill the gap at present.

Also most was exported like I said so itll just be exported to england from Norway as opposed to us. Like I said before it should have been banned from export then at least local businesses would have an advantage.

The extra cost will just have a negative impact on the farming/ mushroom/ horticultural industry as a whole. Jobs will be threated and the public will have to swallow extra cost for goods as a result

Ah jaysus, I hadn't heard of the German stuff coming in. An EU wide ban of it will have to happen so. There is fair shortsightedness for horticulture for sure, but it will drive other methods of creating compost. There's is definitely a chance for people to start producing products like bio char mixed with animal dung on a larger scale to sell back to producers here.

I'm still hoping to use biochar and a base layer for my bedding for the next housing season and top it off with straw. As far as I know, nobody else is doing that currently.