strength level

seefin

Female here in 40s. Went to exrx.com website for strength standards and according to them I'm advanced level with my bench press and deadlift. I wouldn't have thought that as only been lifting a few years and did most progress in the first 8 months and just maintaining since. Are these guidelines reliable?

GiftofGab

I've never used that site. I tend to use: https://symmetricstrength.com

Which is quite popular in the community and very well regarded.

seefin

Thanks a million for that

Alf Veedersane

Tells me my bench is shít.

It's legit.

Yeah I'm intermediate on s&dl and a noob at bench on that

whippet

never saw something like that before .. apparently my squat is elite and my deadlift is exceptional !! .. less said about the bench the better.

It also says:

Exceptional: Lifters in this category have typically taken a consistent, structured approach to diet and strength training for the majority of their adult life and are competitive at the regional level. For many lifters, this level is near the maximum genetic potential without the use of performance-enhancing drugs. Strength score 100

Elite: Lifters in this category are competitive at the national level. Those at this level have typically spent a lifetime of rigorous and structured training and dieting. Strength score 112.5.

I've been lifting just over 2 years and I can say that I have not spent my life looking after myself !!

There must be a squad of super elite benchers out there skewing all our stats haha

whippet

bluewolf wrote: »

There must be a squad of super elite benchers out there skewing all our stats haha

I’ll second that

caviardreams

Intermediate at BP, DL & Squat though unsurprisingly my squat is the worst of the lot

Did not do OHP as thought I might break the calculator by putting in a minus figure for my 1RM :rolleyes:

Dtp1979

whippet wrote: »

I've been lifting just over 2 years!

Seriously green with envy. Not fair

GiftofGab

whippet wrote: »

never saw something like that before .. apparently my squat is elite and my deadlift is exceptional !! .. less said about the bench the better.

It also says:


I've been lifting just over 2 years and I can say that I have not spent my life looking after myself !!

Any chance of a video of these lifts??

whippet

GiftofGab wrote: »

Any chance of a video of these lifts??

I don’t do vids on boards !!

My comment was a bit tounge in cheek ... according to that website my lifts are elite but I wouldn’t classify them as anything like that.

COH

whippet wrote: »

I don’t do vids on boards !!

Well then they never happened - even if I was standing beside you when they did.

#science

whippet

COH wrote: »

Well then they never happened - even if I was standing beside you when they did.

#science

Your lifts would show as world class !!! Even though I was watching 67kg lifters open with 170 bench’s last night at the US open !

Transform

GiftofGab wrote: »

I've never used that site. I tend to use: https://symmetricstrength.com

Which is quite popular in the community and very well regarded.

combine with some conditioning and mobility standards also.

theres a point where strong is strong enough

Blacktie.

Transform wrote: »

theres a point where strong is strong enough

Finding that point is the hard part.

Mellor

Transform wrote: »

combine with some conditioning and mobility standards also.

theres a point where strong is strong enough

Agree about strong being strong enough. But will probably vary individual to i dividual.
With myself for example. I do only two sessions if strength work a week. Really simply routine. If I did 4 days of a powerlifting routine, I would no doubt be stronger, but it would be detrimental to my training overall.

Mobile is hugely important. However I also feel that it's hard to account for people who might be hypermobile to the point of being an issue (weakness, injury prone, instability). Are there tests you could do on that end?

Transform

Mellor wrote: »

Agree about strong being strong enough. But will probably vary individual to i dividual.
With myself for example. I do only two sessions if strength work a week. Really simply routine. If I did 4 days of a powerlifting routine, I would no doubt be stronger, but it would be detrimental to my training overall.

Mobile is hugely important. However I also feel that it's hard to account for people who might be hypermobile to the point of being an issue (weakness, injury prone, instability). Are there tests you could do on that end?

how would it vary from individual to individual as that statement only applies to people with 1-2 yrs of training behind them?

tests for hyper-mobility - pick any stretch and if it looks crasy good and they have elbows that look overextended when holding a weight overhead or a push up position then yup more stability required - i see this very very rarely

DylanJM

whippet wrote: »

Even though I was watching 67kg lifters open with 170 bench’s last night at the US open !

Isn’t that US Open meet untested though? I don’t think these standards apply to those lifters.

Powerhouse

COH wrote: »

Well then they never happened - even if I was standing beside you when they did.

Are you saying you’d refuse to believe your own eyes?

Alf Veedersane

Powerhouse wrote: »

Are you saying you’d refuse to believe your own eyes?

whippet

DylanJM wrote: »

Isn’t that US Open meet untested though? I don’t think these standards apply to those lifters.

Untested alright ... I would train with a good few ‘untested’ lifters and would be a fairly moderate lifter in comparison... so would always feel fairly humble. When you have lasts pulling and squatting 300+ most sessions you kinda get immune to it.

I have nothing against lads using PEDs .. they are just not for me - unless they compete In tested comps !

DylanJM

whippet wrote: »

Untested alright ... I would train with a good few ‘untested’ lifters and would be a fairly moderate lifter in comparison... so would always feel fairly humble. When you have lasts pulling and squatting 300+ most sessions you kinda get immune to it.

I have nothing against lads using PEDs .. they are just not for me - unless they compete In tested comps !

I have nothing against it either tbh. It's a massive part of sports in general and especially strength sports.

I was just making the point that these standards go out the window once you start including enhanced lifters. It blurs the lines. For example, say someone reached their maximum natural potential with a 200kg squat but then went on to do 250kg+ using PEDs would they be classed as advanced or elite? (I'm just picking random numbers here to illustrate the point not necessarily what constitutes advanced and elite standards).

whippet

100% agree with you ... but I still think those standards are way off. If my squat is elite why don’t I win comps !!

As for peds .. I know quite a few lads who are shovelling them in to themselves and with stupid training are still weak

GiftofGab

whippet wrote: »

100% agree with you ... but I still think those standards are way off. If my squat is elite why don’t I win comps !!

As for peds .. I know quite a few lads who are shovelling them in to themselves and with stupid training are still weak

If you're classified as elite, as you say you are, you would smash anyone in a competition in Ireland.
Its similar to saying I'm out of shape and only started running less than 2 years ago but still doing a sub 10 second 100m sprint.

whippet

GiftofGab wrote: »

If you're classified as elite, as you say you are, you would smash anyone in a competition in Ireland.
Its similar to saying I'm out of shape and only started running less than 2 years ago but still doing a sub 10 second 100m sprint.

Only one of my lifts is classified as elite ... in my last comp two lifters squatted more than me

Alf Veedersane

GiftofGab wrote: »

If you're classified as elite, as you say you are, you would smash anyone in a competition in Ireland.
Its similar to saying I'm out of shape and only started running less than 2 years ago but still doing a sub 10 second 100m sprint.

To be fair, he's pretty much scoffed at the classification of his lifts on the website.

He hasn't made any effort to say his lifts are.particularly impressive and has pretty much always said they're not even impressive in his own gym.

GiftofGab

GiftofGab wrote: »

If you're classified as elite, as you say you are, you would smash anyone in a competition in Ireland.
Its similar to saying I'm out of shape and only started running less than 2 years ago but still doing a sub 10 second 100m sprint.

In fairness i don't think it's whippet saying he is elite i think it is an app/website saying he is and him going 'lolno'

Mellor

GiftofGab wrote: »

If you're classified as elite, as you say you are, you would smash anyone in a competition in Ireland.
Its similar to saying I'm out of shape and only started running less than 2 years ago but still doing a sub 10 second 100m sprint.

I think you are underestimating how many lifters around the country would hit the elite mark. The top lifters would be in the world class category.
Where as a sub 10 100m is pretty much out of reach for guys who aren't African descent. I think there's only been one or two that have broken 10-secs.

GiftofGab

Is there anywhere where I can find the Irish powerlifting records for each weight class??

Alf Veedersane

GiftofGab wrote: »

Is there anywhere where I can find the Irish powerlifting records for each weight class??

For which federation?

whippet

IrishPF Records and Standards
www.irishpowerliftingfederation.com/national-records-standards/

IPO / AIPO records
ipopowerlifting.ie/website/site/index.php/records/
IPO is untested and the AIPO section is drug tested.
AIPO has only been running just over a year so for some of the records there may have only been one athlete to compete in a Weightclass / Age group so will have the record by default.

Irish Drug Free Powerlifting Association (IDPFA)
http://www.idfpa.net/national-records

Irish Drug Free Powerlifting Federation (IDPFF) or I can't believe it's not the IDPFA
www.idfpf.com/records

I can't seem to find records for the GPC (Global Power Lifting Congress) - however; in many circles these records are not given much credence. There was only 20 odd lifters at their national championships in March.

There is a new federation set up (a fall out of the drama with the GPC earlier this year) - its the Southern Powerlifting Federation (an affiliate of the SPF from the US) .. they haven't had a competition yet - however it will be mainly old GPC lifters who move across.

whippet

for those not too familiar there are also different lifting categories

RAW
This is bare knee and no wrist wraps - belt allowed

Classic RAW
Knee sleeves and wrist wraps allowed.
AIPO / IPO / GPC / SPF allow knee wraps

Equipped Single Ply
Single Ply Squat Suit - Bench Shirt - Deadlift Suit


Equipped Multi Ply
Multi Ply Squat Suit - Bench Shirt - Deadlift Suit

Also the AIPO/IPO/GPC/SPF use a monolift instead of a walk out squat rack for national championship and speciality bars.
Squatbar - 25KG and 32mm in thickness (it think); Deadlift bar - 7ft

GiftofGab

So the IDPFA record for 75kg Squat is 195kg...with some lads only squatting 141 kg?? Is that right?

A 195kg squat @ 75kg would only place you in the Exceptional category.

Alf Veedersane

GiftofGab wrote: »

So the IDPFA record for 75kg Squat is 195kg...with some lads only squatting 141 kg?? Is that right?

That 195 was by Adam Keane who then went on to squat 255ish.

The 141kg in the 75s there was in the M5 (Masters category....by someone aged 60-64.

Mellor

GiftofGab wrote: »

So the IDPFA record for 75kg Squat is 195kg...with some lads only squatting 141 kg?? Is that right?

A 195kg squat @ 75kg would only place you in the Exceptional category.

The lad only squatting 141kg is in the 60+ age group. So a bit harsh to be knocking him like that.
Also, some of those organisation are new, so the record books aren't fleshed out.
If you look at the IPO records. The 75kg squat record is 250kg raw (world class on the website above) and 320kg equipped (multi).

whippet

GiftofGab wrote: »

So the IDPFA record for 75kg Squat is 195kg...with some lads only squatting 141 kg?? Is that right?

A 195kg squat @ 75kg would only place you in the Exceptional category.

most of the better IDPFA lifters have moved on to the IPF and AIPO in recent years.

GiftofGab

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

That 195 was by Adam Keane who then went on to squat 255ish.

The 141kg in the 75s there was in the M5 (Masters category....by someone aged 60-64.

Cheers...That's incredible at 60 years old.

whippet

GiftofGab wrote: »

Cheers...That's incredible at 60 years old.

some masters lifters are very impressive .. there is one lad in the AIPO (tested) .. ex IDPFA who is in the Masters 3 (50-54 year old) with a 700 total.

Records have to be taken with a pinch of salt. There are so many weight / age / classes that means that only some are competitive.

The IPF have a minimum standard for records .. in otherwords; even if you are the only one in the category and no previous record stands you must hit a certain standard before the lift is classified as a record.

Mellor

Transform wrote: »

how would it vary from individual to individual as that statement only applies to people with 1-2 yrs of training behind them?

It varies very easily imo.
You said there's a point where strong is strong enough. That "point" is largely dependent on a persons reason for training. For example a rugby player has a higher strength goal than a tennis player.
I wouldn't have thought that was in anyway controversial

whippet

Mellor wrote: »

It varies very easily imo.
You said there's a point where strong is strong enough. That "point" is largely dependent on a persons reason for training. For example a rugby player has a higher strength goal than a tennis player.
I wouldn't have thought that was in anyway controversial

plus if you are specifically strength training for strength based sports .. enough is never enough and you will always look to gain that extra bit. - hence why many lifters will go down the PED route as they feel they have hit their body's limit naturally and want to chase bigger numbers.

Although there is a worrying trend of young fellas (and ladies) who start out on PEDs as their local Gym Pharmacist tells them its the best thing to be doing

Transform

Mellor wrote: »

It varies very easily imo.
You said there's a point where strong is strong enough. That "point" is largely dependent on a persons reason for training. For example a rugby player has a higher strength goal than a tennis player.
I wouldn't have thought that was in anyway controversial

not saying its controversial at all just discussion

the relative strength of any athlete is dependent on whether strength is a limiting factor - in my experience it rarely is, typically in elite its lifestyle factors

geotrig

whippet wrote: »

Although there is a worrying trend of young fellas (and ladies) who start out on PEDs as their local Gym Pharmacist tells them its the best thing to be doing

What types of "peds" are they taking these days ? would some of the supps they take fall into this or a bit more hardcore per se , Im just curious as i dont know anyone that takes stuff other than protein shakes

Transform

whippet wrote: »

plus if you are specifically strength training for strength based sports .. enough is never enough and you will always look to gain that extra bit. - hence why many lifters will go down the PED route as they feel they have hit their body's limit naturally and want to chase bigger numbers.

Although there is a worrying trend of young fellas (and ladies) who start out on PEDs as their local Gym Pharmacist tells them its the best thing to be doing

most elite will use PEDs for enhanced recovery rates and most are just maintaining strength or gaining a very small amount of strength

You think Messi, Federer etc need to get stronger?

I do understand that this is a continuum

im not referring to lifters as thats highly specific - more general sports

Read Game Changer by fergus connolly

Yes steroid use in gyms is rife

whippet

geotrig wrote: »

What types of "peds" are they taking these days ? would some of the supps they take fall into this or a bit more hardcore per se , Im just curious as i dont know anyone that takes stuff other than protein shakes

the list is almost endless of what is being used .. from steroids, growth, insulin etc ... and its far more common than you would think.

Protein shakes are just another form of food

whippet

Transform wrote: »

You think Messi, Federer etc need to get stronger?

I do .. but to a point; with other sports there is a finer balance at elite level between strength - mobility - weight - speed etc .. while a big centre half will have a better use for strength than a lighting quick winger

geotrig

whippet wrote: »

the list is almost endless of what is being used .. from steroids, growth, insulin etc ... and its far more common than you would think.

Protein shakes are just another form of food

ta
yeah , I was just wondering what was being used outside of the age old roids and if like other countries we are seeing increases in insulin ,growth hormone etcs being used , i believe it probably is more widely used than I think i just havent seen it and glad to not be offered all that crapola. I understand protein is just food,so maybe i am seeing it being used in conjunction with it that .
I was just trying to get some perspective as to what is considered a ped's to gym goers as some supplements to me fit under these headings, while not flagged as banned substances offically ,although i've done little reading on them to be fair.

Mellor

Transform wrote: »

the relative strength of any athlete is dependent on whether strength is a limiting factor - in my experience it rarely is, typically in elite its lifestyle factors

"The" limiting factor suggests there's only one. Which is not really the case. And while strength may rarely be the most significant issue, I guess it's almost always a factor to some degree.
I can't think of a physical sport or activity where being magically stronger (without any trace off obviousky) is not an immediate benefit. Hence the widespread abuse and subsequent banning of PEDs.

For me it's not a question of whether strength is a benefit/limiting factor. It's about the effort vrs payback. As you get stronger, each 10% gain is harder earned. There comes a point when the hours needed to add that 10% are better spent on other training imo.

You think Messi, Federer etc need to get stronger

Need to get stronger? No, of course not. They are plenty strong, compete in highly skilled sports, where conditioning is a huge factor. That training time is better spent elsewhere. That is exactly the situation above.

But if they could get instantly stronger without sacrifice. Would they be better, yeah of course they would.

Powerhouse

whippet wrote: »

Protein shakes are just another form of food

Yeah, but in spirit they are closer to PEDs as people use them for a shortcut to achieve a benefit they would presumably struggle to achieve otherwise.

Blacktie.

Powerhouse wrote: »

Yeah, but in spirit they are closer to PEDs as people use them for a shortcut to achieve a benefit they would presumably struggle to achieve otherwise.

In this respect you can consider anything that is attempting to benefit yourself as a PED.

whippet

Powerhouse wrote: »

Yeah, but in spirit they are closer to PEDs as people use them for a shortcut to achieve a benefit they would presumably struggle to achieve otherwise.

The D in PED is for Drug .. protein isn’t a drug and it does not enhance performance whatsoever. It is a concentrated food group.

Growth hormones and steroids are actual performance enhancing substances