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Tomas O Se says Leinster Football is a Joke

  • 08-05-2018 6:04pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 1,072 ✭✭✭ Sonny678


    I cannot really disagree with this comment. This is the most uncompetitive leinster championship in 130 years. Meath are having their worst decade since 1920s. Kildare are also having one of their worst decades ( along with the 1980s) since 1920s. Offaly are having their worst decade since 1950s , since before they emerged on the football scene. Laois are having their worst decade since 1970s. While louth are going up and down divisions 4 3 2 yearly. Wicklow are stuck in division 4 after a good decade in the 00s. While Wexford are back in div 4 after having their best decade since the 40s in the 00s.

    Only Dublin with their greatest team ever, Carlow having their best period in 30 years, Westmeath are having solid period with their first ever consecutive leinster finals appearances in a row and Longford are also making solid progess.

    But overall this decade is an all time low for leinster football. Dublin havent had to face strong division 1 opposition ( a team in division 1 year after year) since early 00s. Compared to early 90s when you had 4 top division 1 teams in the proviences all wining leinster titles and playing in national finals . Compared to every decade or era when you had at least two top division 1 teams in leinster winning leinster titles and winning or at least reaching an All Ireland final. Its 17 years since a leinster team other then Dublin reached a All Ireland final. That has never happened before. So Tomas is right there.

    But the issue I have is Tomas seems to have forgot or ignored that you could also say Munster football has been in the same situation for generations as leinster is currently. Kerry have dominated Munster football pretty much for 100 years the same way Dublin r dominating leinster football at the moment. He says leinster teams are beating before they ever enter the field v Dublin. You could say the same thing about Kerry in Munster for 100 years. There is an aura surrounding kerry down South where the rest in Munster for generations dont believe they can beat the kingdom.

    Yes Tipp and Clare are making good progress recently . But will they beat kerry in a Munster final in the next 4 or 5 years. Theres no gurantee they will. Tipp havent won a Munster title in 80 years, Clare have won 1 Munster title in 90 years and limerick havent won a Munster title in 120 years. Waterford havent won a Munster title in 120 years also their only Munster title. That doesnt make for a very competitive Munster championship since 1900. The Munster championship has been won by Kerry or Cork every year since 1923 with the exception of victories by Tipperary in 1935 and Clare in 1992. Watterford havent beaten Kerry in Munster championship in 60 years. Tipperary havent beaten Kerry in the Munster championship in 91 years. And Limerick havent beaten Kerry in the Munster championship in 120 years. Clare have beaten Kerry once in the Munster championship in 80 years.

    Look at the below stats, look at Kerrys sucess rate in Munster

    1920s: 6 for Kerry (1923-24-25-26-27-29)
    1930s: 9 for Kerry (1930-31-32-33-34-36-37-38-39)
    1940s: 7 for Kerry (1940-41-42-44-46-47-48)
    1950s: 7 for Kerry (1950-51-53-54-55-58-59)
    1960s: 8 for Kerry (1960-61-62-63-64-65-68-69)
    1970s: 7 for Kerry (1970-72-75-76-77-78-79)
    1980s: 6 for Kerry (1980-81-82-84-85-86)
    1990s: 5 for Cork (1990-93-94-95-99)
    2000s: 6 for Kerry (2000-01-03-04-05-07)
    2010s: 7 for Kerry (2010-11-13-14-15-16-17)

    Then you take Cork. Cork and Kerry is the biggest myth of a rivalry in GAA. Most rivalries both teams have periods of domination or sucess over the other. Kilkenny and Tipp have great battles where supremacy swings from one to another. Mayo and Galway is very 50 50 rivalry if u take out Galways All Ireland wins. Mayo are sucessful for years then Galway are sucessful. The same with Meath and Dublin. For 80 years Meath went toe to toe with Dublin until this decade. For years Dublin teams couldnt beat Meath teams year after year ( Late 40s , late 50s, 60s, late 80s, late 90s) and for years Meath couldnt beat Dublin teams ( Late 50s, Late 70s, Early 80s, mid 90s , 00s ). Meath won 7 All Irelands to Dublins 9 in that 80 year period. With Meath having the same sucess rate as Dublin in 40s 50s 60s ( 1 All Ireland win each in each decade) and Dublin being more sucessful in 70s ( 3 All Irelands) and Meath more sucessful in 80s and 90s (Meath 4 All Irelands to Dublins 2). A very equal rivalry until this decade.

    But with the exception of the late 80s and early 90s Cork have been second best to kerry since Independence. Kerry were the dominate force in Munster football in the 1920s, 30s,40s,50s,60s, 70s, early 1980s and 00s and this decade. There is the odd Cork year of sucess in between eg 1973 but overall you take out late 80s and early 90s , and pretty much for 90% of the last 100 years kerry have been top dog in Munster. Kerry always play up how how Cork good are. And they need a Cork Munster final to prepare them for the championship outside Munster.

    There is no love lost between kerry and Cork and a Munster final with Cork and Kerry in killarney or Pairc ui Chaoimh is always a grand occasion. But usually always kerry win. look at how Cork couldnt beat kerry in Croke Park in 00s. Cork is a masive football county. Has more football clubs then kerry. Yet for many Cork GAA people hurling is number 1. Been defeated kerry yearly probaly meant Cork hurling is held in higher esteem down south. Cork for all their resources should be on double the All Irelands at least and double the Munster titles. But kerry have had them in metal vice grip for generations. And at the moment Cork are at their lowest since 1950s. That was the last time they were in divsion 2 and been beating by Tipp in the championship.

    So when Tomas O Se says Leinster foot all is a joke he is right. But if he puts the same criteria to Munster football, that teams in Munster are beaten before they ever enter the field v kerry. Is Munster football a bigger joke for a longer period. Are am I been harsh on Tomas and Munster. ( Who happens to be one of my favorite players the since 2000).

    Also there also being periods when Connacht and Ulster were one sided and had lean years. From 1900 to 1960 with the odd Antrim victory , Cavan dominated Ulster . Winning 20 or so Ulster tiltles out of maybe 21. Cavan had the same aura , Dublin have at the moment were teams were beaten before they entered the field for half century v Cavan teams in Ulster.

    Down changed that in the 60s. While in the 70s and 80s Ulster football was very uncompetitive when teams came out of the province. It must be said there was conflict , a war basically in the north so that made it almost impossible for Ulster teams to prepare properly. Since 1990s the best teams, best players, best tactics, best managers have come from Ulster and it has became the strongest provience. With Down Donegal Derry Tyrone and Armgh all winning Sam. However with 4 All Ireland wins in the 90s and 4 more in the 00s. Ulster has only won 1 All Ireland in this decade so far. So has the provience of Ulster somewhat declined in this decade so far.

    In Connacht the 1970s 80s and early 90s, Connacht championship was seen as weak also. However particularly Mayo have risen Connacht football promience in the game in the last 20 years. And Connacht teams at the moment have 3 top division 1 teams with Mayo Galway and Roscommon. But the fact is in the last 50 years Connacht teams have only won 2 All Irelands to Ulsters 10 All Ireland titles and Munsters 21 All Ireland titles and leinsters 17 All Ireland titles in the same time period.

    All the proviences have had very bad periods and lean years. leinster is just having its least competitive currently. But even though there is a less sense of togetherness in leinster then Connacht or Ulster in the GAA. This decade will show that Ulster have won 1 All Ireland, Munster have won 1 All Ireland and leinster have won 5 All Irelands so far.


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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭ LeinsterDub


    Is there a question in this post? What are we meant to be discussing?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,072 ✭✭✭ Sonny678


    Is there a question in this post? What are we meant to be discussing?

    People are saying Leinster football is a joke uncompetitive at the moment, but other proviences particulalry Munster have been more uncompetitive for longer. Discuss whatever you want. Thats the point Im making.


  • Registered Users Posts: 665 ✭✭✭ idnkph


    It is a joke at the moment but it comes down to money invested in the county teams at the end of the day. Dublin are investing 12-13 million quid a year more than most other counties country wide. Until there are major changes in croker and the way things are done with investment then it'll continue this way. Dublin will dominate in the all Ireland as always. It's getting boring now and a huge reason people are losing interest in the great game.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭ LeinsterDub


    Sonny678 wrote: »
    People are saying Leinster football is a joke uncompetitive at the moment, but other proviences particulalry Munster have been more uncompetitive for longer. Discuss whatever you want. Thats the point Im making.

    Generally when you start a thread you wish to start a discussion not just post a wall of text.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭ LeinsterDub


    idnkph wrote: »
    Dublin are investing 12-13 million quid a year more than most other counties country wide.

    Citation needed! I'm going to need to see a reference for those numbers.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 7,665 ✭✭✭ Fann Linn


    Twas grand when Dublin were winning nowt between '95 and 2011.
    It's a problem now for some unknown reason.


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,298 ✭✭✭✭ Fr Tod Umptious


    idnkph wrote: »
    It is a joke at the moment but it comes down to money invested in the county teams at the end of the day. Dublin are investing 12-13 million quid a year more than most other counties country wide. Until there are major changes in croker and the way things are done with investment then it'll continue this way. Dublin will dominate in the all Ireland as always. It's getting boring now and a huge reason people are losing interest in the great game.


    But how come, this decade, counties with small dispersed populations like Mayo and to a lesser extend Donegal, have been able to go
    toe to toe with Dublin, while the likes of Meath and Kildare suck ?


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,478 ✭✭✭ Lu Tze


    Sonny678 wrote: »
    People are saying Leinster football is a joke uncompetitive at the moment, but other proviences particulalry Munster have been more uncompetitive for longer. Discuss whatever you want. Thats the point Im making.

    You are very much cherry picking your stats. Cork have won the all Ireland in the last decade which none of other teams in Leinster outside Dublin have done, and the stats are skewed as there are twice as many countries in Leinster than in Munster.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,569 ✭✭✭✭ ProudDUB


    Grumble...grumble...resources...grumble....population....grumble...rural depopulation...grumble...resources...AIG...grumble....grumble...

    There.

    Everyone happy now?

    Close the thread.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,072 ✭✭✭ Sonny678


    But how come, this decade, counties with small dispersed populations like Mayo and to a lesser extend Donegal, have been able to go
    toe to toe with Dublin, while the likes of Meath and Kildare suck ?

    There are unique factors to Donegal and Mayo. Its something you hear directed at counties like Meath and kildare, but Mayo have a special unique feature thats driving them to all these finals that no other county in Ireland has .The 3 reasons why Mayo have suceeded are below.


    Regard Donegal , they had the most charismatic, innovative, brillant manager of this era. Like Loughane in 95 or Griffin in 96 or Heffernan in 74, Donegal is another example of one individual capturing a counties attention and county players fans all united under 1 charismatic brillant manager. Donegal had the best manager of his generation.

    Mayo have a couple of reasons , one is particularly unique to Mayo.
    1 Mayo have spent longer in division 1 then any other county in Ireland. Mayo have been in division 1 since 1996 , 1997.

    2 Mayo seem to produce , have a conveyor belt of inter county managers similar to kerry and Dublin. Some of them are not great, but they do produce alot of inter county managers. For example in the last 20 years Mayo managers at inter county level eg John Maughan, John O Mahoney, James Horan, Stephen Rochford, Kevin McStay, Peter Forde, Pat Holmes, Noel Connelly.

    In comparsion Galway have produced very few inter county managers of any decent standard. Who is the greatest Galway football manager ? Kevin Walsh, Liam Sammon, they have never had one. Look at us in Meath we dont produce many inter county managers. Outiside O Brien O Dowd and McEntee, name a Meath man who has managed an inter county team in this decade. I think Offaly had a Meath man a couple of years ago . And in the 00s Coyle managed Monaghan and Hayes Carlow. Meath Galway and Cork dont produce as many inter county managers as say Kerry Dublin Mayo or even kildare. Carew, Glen Ryan and luke Dempsey all kildare men have managed inter county teams in this decade outside kildare. Mayo always seem to have a good quality manager in charge eg O'Mahoney in 89, Maughan in 96 97, Horan in 2012 , 2013 and Rochford in 2016, 2017.

    3 And the third reason and the major factor in driving Mayo to all these finals.

    Mayo have produced quality footballers and top class managers for the last 15 years. But whats driving Mayo to 4 All Ireland finals in 6 years, which has never happened before ( A county losing 4 finals in 6 years). To keep coming back is remarkable and you have to admire their bravery. But its become so important to Mayo people to win Sam. Its like the county, the players, the fans are on a crusade to win Sam. In that so many times you hear Mayo fans ' before I die I want to see Mayo win Sam'. It means so much to Mayo people. Winning Sam would mean more to them then any other county. Its become a counties dream, almost obession to end the famine and break the curse. Thats what driving these brave Mayo footballers.


    I think if Mayo had won in 2012 or 13 they wouldnt have reached the last 2 finals. I know its hard to prove. But Mayo quest for Sam is being driven by the passion and hunger of a county desire to win an All Ireland that has become so important to every man woman and child in Mayo. Very admirable passion. No other county in Ireland has this sort of unique experience that Mayo have of losing 9 finals in 25 years , that is unprecedented, and leading to Mayo teams drive to end the famine of 70 plus years and break the curse.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 11,197 ✭✭✭✭ rossie1977


    Clearly Dublin are far ahead of everyone else but Kildare are building a nice team and should be competitive in a few years, meath are decent and would probably give any team outside Dublin/Kerry or Tyrone a game in the qualifiers.

    There are simple solutions to making the Leinster more interesting. One is obviously that no match outside the final should be in croke park and even the Leinster final should probably be rotated between croke park, Thurles, pairc ui chaoimh, clones and/or castlebar every 4 years.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,072 ✭✭✭ Sonny678


    Lu Tze wrote: »
    You are very much cherry picking your stats. Cork have won the all Ireland in the last decade which none of other teams in Leinster outside Dublin have done, and the stats are skewed as there are twice as many countries in Leinster than in Munster.

    Facts, these are facts, I am not skewing any facts, below is a summary of Munster counties sucess rate outside the big Two and kerrys titles per decade.That is not skewing anything. Below are facts.

    1 Tipp havent won a Munster title in 80 years
    2 Clare have won 1 Munster title in 90 years
    3 limerick havent won a Munster title in 120 years
    4 Waterford havent won a Munster title in 120 years also their only Munster title.
    5 The Munster championship has been won by Kerry or Cork every year since 1923 with the exception of victories by Tipperary in 1935 and Clare in 1992.
    6 Watterford havent beaten Kerry in Munster championship in 60 years.
    7 Tipperary havent beaten Kerry in the Munster championship in 91 years. 8 Limerick havent beaten Kerry in the Munster championship in 120 years. 9 Clare have beaten Kerry once in the Munster championship in 80 years.

    10
    1920s: 6 for Kerry (1923-24-25-26-27-29)
    1930s: 9 for Kerry (1930-31-32-33-34-36-37-38-39)
    1940s: 7 for Kerry (1940-41-42-44-46-47-48)
    1950s: 7 for Kerry (1950-51-53-54-55-58-59)
    1960s: 8 for Kerry (1960-61-62-63-64-65-68-69)
    1970s: 7 for Kerry (1970-72-75-76-77-78-79)
    1980s: 6 for Kerry (1980-81-82-84-85-86)
    1990s: 5 for Cork (1990-93-94-95-99)
    2000s: 6 for Kerry (2000-01-03-04-05-07)
    2010s: 7 for Kerry (2010-11-13-14-15-16-17)


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,665 ✭✭✭ Fann Linn


    rossie1977 wrote: »
    Clearly Dublin are far ahead of everyone else but Kildare are building a nice team and should be competitive in a few years, meath are decent and would probably give any team outside Dublin/Kerry or Tyrone a game in the qualifiers.

    There are simple solutions to making the Leinster more interesting. One is obviously that no match outside the final should be in croke park and even the Leinster final should probably be rotated between croke park, Thurles, pairc ui chaoimh, clones and/or castlebar every 4 years.

    The Leinster final should be played in Tipp, Cork Mayo or Ulster?
    Mad Ted.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,072 ✭✭✭ Sonny678


    rossie1977 wrote: »
    Clearly Dublin are far ahead of everyone else but Kildare are building a nice team and should be competitive in a few years, meath are decent and would probably give any team outside Dublin/Kerry or Tyrone a game in the qualifiers.
    .

    This has been a dreadful decade for Meath and kildare.

    In this decade kildare have reached only 1 leinster final. They have had 3 relegations in 5 years. They currently have lost 10 games in a row. They have lost their last 6 games in Croke Park in the last 3 years. They havent won a match in Croke Park in the championship in 5 years. They have only won in Croke Park 3 times in the championship in this decade. They have lost their last 35 of their last 40 matchs in Croke Park. They havent won a leinster senior semi final in Croke Park in 9 years since 2009.

    11 And they have had some of the worst defeats in their history in the last decade, record defeats to Dublin and Kerry. Two defeats v Dublin recently are their two worst defeats in the leinster championship in 100 years for kildare football. kildares 19 point defeat to Dublin in 2015 is kildares worst defeat to Dublin since 1897 ( Dublin 5 -18 Kildare 0-14) . The 7 goal hammering v Kerry in 2015 is the worst defeat for kildare in the championship outside leinster in 100 years ( Kerry 7 -16 Kildare 0-10). Other bad defeats (Cork 2-19 0-12 in 2012).
    ( In terms of the leinster senior championship, the stats show kildare are not the second most sucessful team in the leinster championship in this decade which most people would probaly believe. They are the fourth. Dublin r number 1 of course with 7 senior titles, Meath r second with 4 leinster final appearances and 1 title, Westmeath have 2 leinster final appearances and kildare have 1 leinster final appearances along with Louth who also have 1.)

    It is also Meaths worst decade since the 1920s, if Meath dont reach an All Ireland in the next 2 years it will be first decade since 1920s that has happened. Meaths lose to Dublin in 2014 is Meath worst lose to Dublin since the 1920s. There was bad loses in 95 ( but Meath were ahead with ten mins to go), early 60s and 1955 ( but that Meath team was overhil in 55 after winning the final with the oldest team ever in 54) . 2014 was first time in hundred years a Meath v Dublin match was over by half time. Meath have also spent 12 years outside division 1 . And had their first loses in the championship ever to Tyrone Armagh and famously to Westmeath in 2015.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭ LeinsterDub


    rossie1977 wrote: »
    Leinster final should probably be rotated between croke park, Thurles, pairc ui chaoimh, clones and/or castlebar every 4 years.

    And Wembley, Stade De France and Mars since we are talking pure gash.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,072 ✭✭✭ Sonny678


    And Wembley, Stade De France and Mars since we are talking pure gash.

    Why is it when you mention the uncompetiveness of leinster which is a genuinie and real concern the Dubs get all touchy and take it as some sort of go at the Dubs. I can give you 20 reasons why Meath have declined and none of them have anything to Dublin. Meath and kildares decline have nothing to do with Dublin.

    I remeber in the 80s and 90s when the Dubs werent so touchy and u could have a discussion and the crack about anything with them. Now if you Dont say brillant things about their team and if u bring up all the other problems in football, the Dubs get very touchy. We r entitled to ask questions. The same way the Dubs were asking questions between 1996 to 2010 when they couldnt get to a final. Just because everything is rosey in the Dublin garden we dont all have to say its greats for us all in leinster. This is the worst decade least competitive leinster championship in 130 years . That is a fact. There should not be any issue about talking about the crisis in leinster football.

    Dublin are the one of the greatest teams ever. But other counties in leisnter and throughout the country eg Down Armagh Galway Derry Cork are having their worst decade in generations. There shouldnt be an issue or problem about talking about this.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,665 ✭✭✭ Fann Linn


    Sonny678 wrote: »
    Why is it when you mention the uncompetiveness of leinster which is a genuinie and real concern the Dubs get all touchy and take it as some sort of go at the Dubs. I can give you 20 reasons why Meath have declined and none of them have anything to Dublin. Meath and kildares decline have nothing to do with Dublin.

    I remeber in the 80s and 90s when the Dubs werent so touchy and u could have a discussion and the crack about anything with them. Now if you Dont say brillant things about their team and if u bring up all the other problems in football, the Dubs get very touchy. We r entitled to ask questions. The same way the Dubs were asking questions between 1996 to 2010 when they couldnt get to a final. Just because everything is rosey in the Dublin garden we dont all have to say its greats for us all in leinster. This is the worst decade least competitive leinster championship in 130 years . That is a fact. There should not be any issue about talking about the crisis in leinster football.

    Dublin are the one of the greatest teams ever. But other counties in leisnter and throughout the country eg Down Armagh Galway Derry Cork are having their worst decade in generations. There shouldnt be an issue or problem about talking about this.


    Nothing touchy about pointing out ludicrous suggestions ie playing the Leinster final in Ulster, Munster and Connacht.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,005 ✭✭✭ EICVD


    idnkph wrote: »
    It is a joke at the moment but it comes down to money invested in the county teams at the end of the day. Dublin are investing 12-13 million quid a year more than most other counties country wide. Until there are major changes in croker and the way things are done with investment then it'll continue this way. Dublin will dominate in the all Ireland as always. It's getting boring now and a huge reason people are losing interest in the great game.

    It’s not getting boring at all, I’m even pissed off im not in the country for our hammering of Wicklow or Offaly


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,197 ✭✭✭✭ rossie1977


    Fann Linn wrote: »
    Nothing touchy about pointing out ludicrous suggestions ie playing the Leinster final in Ulster, Munster and Connacht.

    Ulster final was played in Leinster (croke park) for a number of years so why is it so ludicrous exactly.

    It would ensure a neutral venue and 38k in Thurles creates a better atmosphere than in croke park


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,010 ✭✭✭ theoneeyedman


    Let's forget about Dublin for a minute, and focus on Leinster.

    The other Leinster counties are very poor, and have been for probably 10 years. Kildare, Meath have population, economy, and location and are not producing good teams. For instance, 3 Connacht teams in Division 1 next year, none from the rest of Leinster. In fact if you want to find a Leinster team look in Division 3 or 4. Laois played Division 4 this year, a county with a big population. None of the other Leinster teams would win Connacht, Ulster, or Munster. Counties like Offaly, Laois, Meath, Westmeath, in the doldrums.
    I don't care how strong Dublin are, these counties should be very competitive in the league and the qualifiers.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,534 ✭✭✭ howiya


    rossie1977 wrote: »
    It would ensure a neutral venue and 38k in Thurles creates a better atmosphere than in croke park

    Should the Munster final be played at a neutral venue?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,072 ✭✭✭ Sonny678


    rossie1977 wrote:
    Ulster final was played in Leinster (croke park) for a number of years so why is it so ludicrous exactly.

    rossie1977 wrote:
    It would ensure a neutral venue and 38k in Thurles creates a better atmosphere than in croke park


    I think you have a fair point about taking Dubs out of Croker. But a leinster final in Thurles. I dont know if that is a runner. As a Meath man I want to play Dublin in Croker not Navan or Tullamore. But there should be a 30000 stadium in leinster. A stadium built in Tullamore or Athlone which could take in Munster hurling Connacht footbal games and big qualifier matchs . A leinster final in 35000 stadium in Athlone or Tullamore would be ideal. But aint going to happen.

    What I would do. And you have to make sure ur not penalising Dublin eitheir. But all leinster q final and semi finals outside Croker should be considered. And Dublin should play all their league matchs in Parnell Park. Whoever decided that Dublin should play league matchs in Croker again it was a great idea for Dublin. Dublin moved back to Croker in the league in early part of this decade. And from that moment Dublin have been almost unbeaten in Croker. Playing all league matchs at home in Croker is a help to Dubs. You have to be careful not penalise them. But for me playing league matchs in Parnell Park is a runner. But I doubt the Dubs will go back. Again it must be said Dublin have a golden generation of players great managers and serious volunteer work being done at ground level across the capital are reasons they have suceeded . But moving them from Croker for league games I think that makes sense . Its a serious advantage having basically all championship matchs in Croker and all home league matchs in Croker.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,072 ✭✭✭ Sonny678


    Let's forget about Dublin for a minute, and focus on Leinster.

    The other Leinster counties are very poor, and have been for probably 10 years. Kildare, Meath have population, economy, and location and are not producing good teams. For instance, 3 Connacht teams in Division 1 next year, none from the rest of Leinster. In fact if you want to find a Leinster team look in Division 3 or 4. Laois played Division 4 this year, a county with a big population. None of the other Leinster teams would win Connacht, Ulster, or Munster. Counties like Offaly, Laois, Meath, Westmeath, in the doldrums. I don't care how strong Dublin are, these counties should be very competitive in the league and the qualifiers.


    Lets focus on other strong football counties plummeting recently
    1 This is Downs worst decade since 1950s
    2 This is Derrys worst decade since 1960s eg Div 4 currently
    3 This Armghs worst decade since 60s eg 3 out of 4 years in div 3
    4 This is Corks worst period since 1950s. In div 2 beating by Tipp uncompetitive v kerry.
    5 This is Galways worst decade in 100 years so far. Galway havent won a match in championship in Croker in 17 years. This would be the first Galways first decade they have not reached an All Ireland since independence if they dont in next 2 years. Galway havent reached a semi final in 17 years.
    6 This is Offalys worst decade since 50s. Offaly have reached a leinster final in every decade since the 50s. This will be the first one they havent if they dont this or next year.
    7 This is laois worst decade since 70s eg Div 4 this spring
    8 This is Meath worst and one of kildares worst decades since 1920s.

    Thats allot of counties which 20 or 15 years ago were winning provicial titles and even All Irelands. Alot of counties are bottoming out together.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,832 ✭✭✭ Poor_old_gill


    Meath and Kildare have fallen off a ridiculous amount- they have really gone to sh*t.

    I know Dublin have an awful lot in their favour and thats fine but jeez its embarrassing how crap Meath have become and how crap Kilare became (although they have improved).

    Meath lost to Cork and Tipp this year and would def lose to Kerry so they would prob be number 4 in Munster- theres a need to address the over funding that Dublin have had but some counties in Leinster need to look closer to home as well.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,968 ✭✭✭ Tombo2001


    Really disappointing the way this thread has gone, op has tried to set up an honest debate about the dismal state of Leinster football outside the capital.... that comment about ‘talking pure gash’ a great exam0le of the really offensive type of comment that is standard fare in internet discussions, but wouldn’t ever be said to someone’s face. The OP was just fine for anyone with any reasonable attention span, very worthwhile discussion.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,072 ✭✭✭ Sonny678


    Meath and Kildare have fallen off a ridiculous amount- they have really gone to sh*t.

    I know Dublin have an awful lot in their favour and thats fine but jeez its embarrassing how crap Meath have become and how crap Kilare became (although they have improved).

    Meath lost to Cork and Tipp this year and would def lose to Kerry so they would prob be number 4 in Munster- theres a need to address the over funding that Dublin have had but some counties in Leinster need to look closer to home as well.

    What about Laois Offaly Derry Wexford Down Armagh Cork and Galway ( I know Galway had a good league but the next two championships will tell us where Galway are, but up to this years championship this has been Galways worst decade in generations).
    Down lost 15 games in a row recently, next year Down r in Div 3. Offaly are permanently in div 3 or 4. Laois are in div 4 this spring, Derry are in div 4 next year. And so are Wexford. Armagh have spent 3 years in div 3 recently. That hasnt happened to Armagh since the the 60s. Armagh won Ulster titles in 70s 80s 90s and 00s. This will be first decade in half century they havent won a provincial title if they dont this year or next year. Cork are also at an all time low. Its extraordinary how many counties who were so sucessful so recently have reached all time lows together.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 26,661 ✭✭✭✭ OldMrBrennan83


    This post has been deleted.


  • Registered Users Posts: 23,458 ✭✭✭✭ lawred2


    Sonny678 wrote: »
    Is there a question in this post? What are we meant to be discussing?

    People are saying Leinster football is a joke uncompetitive at the moment, but other proviences particulalry Munster have been more uncompetitive for longer. Discuss whatever you want. Thats the point Im making.

    Could have been made in about one line really...

    First thing that popped into my head when I saw the thread title anyway.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,072 ✭✭✭ Sonny678


    The other Leinster counties are very poor, and have been for probably 10 years. Kildare, Meath have population, economy, and location and are not producing good teams. For instance, 3 Connacht teams in Division 1 next year, none from the rest of Leinster. In fact if you want to find a Leinster team look in Division 3 or 4. Laois played Division 4 this year, a county with a big population. None of the other Leinster teams would win Connacht, Ulster, or Munster. Counties like Offaly, Laois, Meath, Westmeath, in the doldrums. I don't care how strong Dublin are, these counties should be very competitive in the league and the qualifiers.

    Population and resources doesnt gurantee sucess. One example, Wicklow.

    Wicklow has the population resources economy a d location . Wicklow have a very strong club scene. Yet with all these advantages they are in bottom 2 or 3 counties out of 32 in the whole country. Only themselves and Fermanagh have never won a provincial title. And they only won their first match in Croker in the championship a couple of years ago eg mid 00s. So Wicklow shows pop resources dont gurantee sucess.

    Take limerick a sportsmad county. Great strong GAA tradition and scene. Big population and resources yet in hurling Limerick have only won 1 senior hurling title in 90 years. And in football limerick havent beaten kerry in the championship or won a Munster senior football title in 120 years.

    Take Antrim. Now I know half the population is not going to play. But when you see Monaghan doing so well. Antrim with pop location and resources should be doing better. Yet Antrim havent won a Ulster football title in over 75 years.

    Take Kildare. Kildare have always had location pop resources yet they have only played in 1 senior All Ireland final in 90 years. Have never won a minor All Ireland title or a national league division 1 title and only won 1 provicial leinster title in 42 years between 1935 to 1997.
    Resources or Population dont gurantee sucess. Its much more complicated.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 26,661 ✭✭✭✭ OldMrBrennan83


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