Succession [HBO] *Spoilers*

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120517473#Comment_120517473

I said "decent" in the context of the previous two episodes which were tremendous throughout. This episode I felt had some ups and downs. Yes, everything with Roman & Kendall was terrific (Roman in particular but I'm enjoying Kendall really starting to come into his own as well), and Mathison battling with and likely manipulating all the Roys was all great. I just felt there were elements of the episode, particularly with the other people in Mathisons's cohort who we'll likely never see again, and some of the Roy's cohort discussing the kill list where Guy A and Guy B who I don't think we've ever seen before were going to lose their jobs we didn't know they had took the episode down a few notches.

magic_murph

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120510828#Comment_120510828

So Logan was bucking at the age of 10. The dirty old dog

The White Wolf

Roman's breakdown aside that whole episode was quite comical. Shiv quietly clicking what Kendall and Roman were up to, and thinking she was knowingly assisting Mathison, when really he's playing them all to get what he wants. He's more Logan than any of them.

tesla_newbie

That was my favourite episode this season, mattson is a great character

Sudden Valley

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120518022#Comment_120518022

is Mathison not bidding too much for the business- is that risky if they accept- ala Musk with Twitter?

Cartman78

Karl and Frank putting on the compression socks before take off was priceless 😂

billyhead

What was Mathison up to when he asked for a picture of Kendell and Roman. Is he planning to publish it?

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120518911#Comment_120518911

I think it was more just he wanted to see the looks on their faces after he made them an offer they can't really refuse. It's an offer they didn't think he'd go to, one that the board would likely outvoted them if they refuse it, and one they're likely going to be forced to sell to him.

They disrespected him, so now he's beaten them. He wanted to see the look on their faces when they were contemplating that he beat them.

Jump_In_Jack

Matsson is the most intriguing character now. It seems he will be the successor, and the Roys will end up each going their own way. Shiv seems to have realised that she can't trust the other two, and the two boys would be better off starting out on a new venture.

Something tells me there will be a sting in the tail with the deal, perhaps as I think Kendall mentioned, the value of the deal is wrapped up in the shares, so if the shares drop he might buy them all out later on.

The Black Oil

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120516901#Comment_120516901

There was some discussion of this in the comments on the AV Club's review re both alcohol and coke. Seems like she may have been giving the impression she was indulging, but not actually doing so, though it may have been ambiguous too.

EltonJohn69

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120518943#Comment_120518943

Beating them would be them selling and at a low price…. I feel like both parties won/lost/compromised

elefant

In a slightly illogical way, I thought that Roman letting loose at Matsson, when he couldn't control his emotions any longer, was the most impressive any of the Roy siblings were at any stage of this episode. Their entire entourage was pathetic in the way they let Matsson and his group walk all over them. They were constantly fretting about what Logan would do, but I'm certain he wouldn't have let outsiders completely rip the piss out of his family and company in front of him during negotiations. Roman at least showed some gumption.

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120519288#Comment_120519288

Mathison doesn't care about the money. Maybe it's part of a bigger play where when the deal is nearing agreement he pulls something to lower the price and still forces them to complete the deal, but Roman royally f*cked Mathison off. I think Mathison would happily pay over the odds just to take the company away from them at this point. He still beats them because Roman & Kendall have shown they want to keep ATN because it's their father's legacy and they want it to be their future. The money means little to Mathison, he'll likely recoup it anyway.

murpho999

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120517857#Comment_120517857

Well I would disagree entirely and say that I found it tremendous throughout.

There was a lot going on in this episode with people all working their different agendas.

Apart from Roman and Kendall, the plays by Matsson were great stuff.

Also enjoyed Tom raising his profile with Matsson and calling in Greg as back up.

Just because you feel you may never see a character again does not mean they're a waste of time. I think the show is actually very tight and there's stuff going on all the time with subtleties like Karl and Frank putting on flight socks.

For me not a second of screen time is wasted and this episode is right up there with the best.

It appears its being critically acclaimed too.

tesla_newbie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120518858#Comment_120518858

Both heading for the scrap yard and not a bother on them

EltonJohn69

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120519320#Comment_120519320

They certainly looked beaten/broken….

Sudden Valley

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120519273#Comment_120519273

Ah I see now that Shiv refused the alcohol and coke with Mathison. Cant believe he willingly gave dirt on himself to her for free, what an idiot. By presumably offloading the company and the toxic news network and keeping Tom safe, she seemed to have come out ahead of Kendal and Roman.

I think the show has given up on giving any sort of coherent storyline to Greg.

AllForIt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120518510#Comment_120518510

Yeah we saw the real Matsson in that episode, he's scary. Superb episode.

castletownman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120517468#Comment_120517468

'THAT SLALOM MOTHERF*CKER'

De Bhál

loved that. Almost like an episode of The Office with the level of cringe comedy.

Wife couldn't watch last night so I get to watch it twice.

castletownman

One of the best juxtapositions I have ever seen was Conor worrying about the image of Logan being tarnished by wearing a kilt in the coffin, and him potentially losing it in the embalming room, and Roman ACTUALLY losing it when Logan's image WAS tarnished by Matsson.

The White Wolf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120519288#Comment_120519288

If there was any truth to what he told Shiv about his personal life, then it wouldn't surprise me if he'd overpay just to get his rocks off at Roman and Kendall.

But as others have said I've no doubt Mattson has only began shafting them.

EltonJohn69

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120520129#Comment_120520129

He did appear to be a formidable foe… and the Roy’s are wounded

Full_Circle_81

Skarsgård and Culkin were bloody brilliant in that episode. Things were so tense on the top of the mountain at the end, I half expected the brothers to murder Matsson and throw his body off the edge!

Shiv still confuses me though, never quite able to follow her motivations......

The White Wolf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120520439#Comment_120520439

I don't think she's too complex. She's most comfortable when kicking the hornet's nest (the family/family buisness) from the outside. Anytime she's inside it she just gets pissed off and goes back to kicking it again.

I think that's the point for all of them, they're all better off away from the business.

Galwayguy35

Matsson will give Shiv a tipping i think.

nc6000

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120519772#Comment_120519772

You mean you watched it yesterday without her? 😀

Officer999

Maybe I’m confused about this but why would Matsson give them the ‘kill list’ before he has actually purchased the company?

The likes of Frank etc are on the board. Surely Frank can try and resist the offer to save himself?

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120521794#Comment_120521794

Matsson just for kicks probably!

But Frank doesn't want to be saved... he wants the golden handshake to sign off on I think. Same for Karl.

In comparison, Hugo wants to stick around, as he thinks he has earning years left in him \ handshake not as golden perhaps.

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120521794#Comment_120521794

The older ones like Frank, Karl and Gerri all own shares in the company. If Matsson buys they get a huge payout. It's pretty much their retirement plan (though seems like Gerri would still like to work a bit longer and would work for Matsson, but she'd still get her payout too).

It's why they were so reluctant to let Kendall and Roman take over negotiations, they don't want the deal to fall through. If Matsson didn't buy and they just decided to sell their shares and retire, they wouldn't get as much money.

People like Hugo and Karolina, I don't know if they have shares and they're not on the board, so being on the kill list for them is the same as just being made redundant.

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120521841#Comment_120521841

It'd still be unusual to provide a kill list before a takeover \ merger is done?

I don't think that's information that needs to be \ is typically disclosed to the board of the target company.

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120521856#Comment_120521856

Probably. A lot of the business stuff in the show goes over my head. But I also saw it as a bit of strategy from Matsson. In terms of Frank, Karl and Gerri, there was no real for them to go to Norway. But they're board members with a vote, and Matsson's kill list has essentially given them all what they wanted. Frank and Karl get their big payouts, Gerri gets hers too but also gets to stay on and work which seems like what she wanted. Possibly the same with Tom too, can't remember if he's on the board with a vote or not or if he owns his own shares, but it works out well for him too.

The kill list could be as much appeasing the important people, while also showing that they will be getting rid of some like Hugo and the two other guys who were there so it looks like a real kill list, with the whole reason for bringing them all to Norway to sound them out and figure out what was best, who wanted out etc.

tesla_newbie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120520439#Comment_120520439

Matson is as big as both of them put together

tesla_newbie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120520518#Comment_120520518

She’s you’re typical rich liberal hypocrite, she preaches morality about the editorial position of ATN etc but act’s exactly the same as the rest of her family

tesla_newbie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120520642#Comment_120520642

If he hasn’t already

billyhead

Is Matson meant to be richer then the Roys? I think I read somewhere that Logan's combined wealth was 17 billion. Isn't Logan based on Rupert Murdoch?

one armed dwarf

Matson just owns an overvalued product, I think. He wouldn't want to waste too much time getting Wayster and its more tangible IP and assets.

AlmightyCushion

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120523453#Comment_120523453

Yeah, Logan is based on Murdoch. Mattson is probably just a generic Web 2.0 founder/CEO douche. I don't know if he is based on any one in particular. It isn't Mattson buying Waystar, it is the company he founded, GoJo, that is buying it. He might not have the net worth to do it himself but GoJo does. Like a lot of founders, most of his net worth is probably tied up in GoJo. He might only own a relatively small percentage of it (for example Zuckerberg only owns about 10-20% of Meta I think) so GoJo would be in a much better position to buy a company like Waystar even if Mattson wasn't worth a lot more than Logan.

Penn

Yeah I think going by Matsson and Logan's conversations last season, it's less about which company is worth more but rather which direction each company was going in. Waystar's stock was falling/stagnating, whereas GoJo is hugely on the rise. That's why Logan started off wanting to buy GoJo, but in the end GoJo became the bigger fish and offered to buy Waystar.

castletownman

What sort of company/service is GoJo meant to be?

I am not ashamed to admit that all the business and tech speak goes completely over my head (and often find it hard to keep up with some of the dialogue as a result- just isn't my thing). I'm only in it for the low-brow bitchiness!

one armed dwarf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120524068#Comment_120524068

Honestly, for the most part Succession is the kind of series where the nitty gritty details of the business are secondary to the low brow bitchiness, at times anyway

I think all we know about GoJo is they are a tech startup with a streaming platform which has good technology behind it, better than the shite Waystar has. Also they have some gaming companies, or something? All that really matters I think is GoJo is a new media/technology company, riding the upward trend (at least, in the Succession verse) of the tech bubble.

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120524068#Comment_120524068

I think it's predominantly streaming, including sports, news, tech etc. I think Logan wanted to buy it because it'd help modernise Waystar.

But yeah, all the business talk is white noise to me most of the time. In an earlier season there was a lot of talk over a possible 'bear hug' that went on for several episodes. Still not sure what it meant.

Officer999

It still baffles me that Peep Show and Succession are written by the same guy.

yabadabado

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120524170#Comment_120524170

That was the case,Logan wanted it because it had a modern streaming service and Waystar was lagging way behind.Wanted to use Gojo to modernise Waystar.

El Gato De Negocios

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120524170#Comment_120524170

A bear hug is essentially an offer to buy a company for way over the market value and that is essentially too good to refuse / a forced sale.

Hodors Appletart

GoJo is a netflix stand-in I think

AllForIt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120524068#Comment_120524068

All you need to know is that GoJo is internet tech like twitter facebook, whereas Waystar Royco is more 'legacy' media like TV channels and newspapers.

duffysfarm

Whats going to happen in the final few episodes? I cant for one second see it been as easy as seliing the shares/company for the agreed price and everyone been happy

Sudden Valley

Tom and shiv were hilarious in the latest episode. I hope they get back together for real rather than just flings. The swedes plan mimics elon musks takeover of twitter, overbidding then trying to get out of agreed price. Roman and kendalls behaviour seems odd for two people also trying to get out of the deal.

shrewdness

Roman and Kendall look like they're going off the deep end - even though Kendall seemed to pull it off in the end, I don't think it'll last long.

Karl has really come into his own this season imo and I loved his talking to Kendall before the presentation. It's like he's all out of f*cks to give at this stage.