John Connors is a bit of a wanker

aroundthehouse

yourdeadwright wrote: »

I pulled a friend up one day for being " racist " towards Travellers due to some of his comments,
He replied to me, would you have a problem living next-door to a African, Pakistan, Afgan or Aisan family , I said "No of course not "
He then said would you live next-door to a traveller , and I have to say I probably wouldn't by choice, ,
I reckon they are the most persecuted people in Ireland by other Irish  , Its not right at all but at the same time how do we solve it, Its very sad in this day and age a group of people are hated or possible feared like they are it's just not right ,
But at the same time i'd be a person who wouldn't want to live beside them , so I don't know really,

the travellers persecuted??? what about all the poor auld people that they rob and harrass in their own homes? are they not persecuted? what about the business people trying to make a living who are constantly robbed blind by travellers, are they not persecuted? what about the people who save hard to build a home only to have everything pulled out of it by travellers? are they not persecuted? what about the poor people who have to reside beside their caravans putting up with all sorts of abuse? are they not persecuted? what about people who attend cemetary sunday who have to put up with travellers brawling in the cemetary, are they not persecuted?
when travellers stop hiding behind this ethnic minority bull**** and start abiding by the laws of the land, then just maybe people might think more of them

sbsquarepants

DChancer wrote: »

It is and always has been a derogatory term, but sure you knew that already.

Like most words it's meaning is in it's intent.

I've personally used it and have never used it as a derogatory term. It's short for Pakistani - that's it when I use it, just like Brit is short for British.
Where's the problem?

punisher5112

yourdeadwright wrote: »

I pulled a friend up one day for being " racist " towards Travellers due to some of his comments,
He replied to me, would you have a problem living next-door to a African, Pakistan, Afgan or Aisan family , I said "No of course not "
He then said would you live next-door to a traveller , and I have to say I probably wouldn't by choice, ,
I reckon they are the most persecuted people in Ireland by other Irish  , Its not right at all but at the same time how do we solve it, Its very sad in this day and age a group of people are hated or possible feared like they are it's just not right ,
But at the same time i'd be a person who wouldn't want to live beside them , so I don't know really,

What are you on about...


Sure there are many of all the above including Irish people you wouldn't want living next door.

You can't be racist against your own.

If the travellers actually conducted themselves in any better form then they do then that would be a change.

Berserker

SureYWouldntYa wrote: »

He calls Gardai scum because of the actions of a few guards

What actions? I find it very hard to see fault in what the guards did.

Loves_lorries wrote: »

Under a socialist state, the likes of travellers would see the biggest culture shock, I've polish friends who have told me how Poland used to have a very big gypsy population, the communist government post 1945 didn't kill them or anything but they were forced to abandon their life of nomadic freedom and assimilate into the new single ideology which prevailed, travellers are the biggest capitalists-individualist of all in many ways, they have no interest in the national interest, a common purpose etc. Only under a free market system could their current existence be maintained.

Irish people have a unique view of Socialism. It's viewed as some sort of utopia where everyone is equal and free. If you look at what happened in Eastern Europe, you will see the dark reality of what's behind it. It'd be the end of plenty of minority groups here, not just the travellers. Capitalism is their greatest ally, in reality, as you said.

Deebles McBeebles

sbsquarepants wrote: »

Like most words it's meaning is in it's intent.

I've personally used it and have never used it as a derogatory term. It's short for Pakistani - that's it when I use it, just like Brit is short for British.
Where's the problem?

Fly over to Birmingham and start shouting it, you'll soon see.

Edgware

RocketRaccoon wrote: »

Went to school with a few who I would still chat to if I saw them around town. They've never been anything but nice and polite to me.

Do you get out much?

Edgware

Lollipops23 wrote: »

I was in school with a girl who was 1st gen settled Traveller.

She was lovely, sweet and very bright. She did quite well in school, but was absent a lot.

I sat next to her in 5th Year Biology and she had a keen interest. Then one day she stopped coming to school, about midway through the year.

Found out a few months later she'd been pulled out to get married. Next time I saw her, a year later, she was 8 months pregnant.

What a waste of potential. There was time enough for marriage and babies, why did she need to sacrifice her education, something she clearly valued?

I can never get passed the Traveller treatment of women. If they even attempted to treat them equally I'd take their opinions on other matters of discrimination a bit more seriously.

It's their culture
It's racist to criticise it

Loves_lorries

yourdeadwright wrote: »

I pulled a friend up one day for being " racist " towards Travellers due to some of his comments,
He replied to me, would you have a problem living next-door to a African, Pakistan, Afgan or Aisan family , I said "No of course not "
He then said would you live next-door to a traveller , and I have to say I probably wouldn't by choice, ,
I reckon they are the most persecuted people in Ireland by other Irish  , Its not right at all but at the same time how do we solve it, Its very sad in this day and age a group of people are hated or possible feared like they are it's just not right ,
But at the same time i'd be a person who wouldn't want to live beside them , so I don't know really,

Stop pandering to them, people like you are useful idiots to travellers.

If someone " called me out" on something I said about travellers, I'd write them off as a complete virtue signalling poser.

Red_Wake

Berserker wrote: »

SureYWouldntYa wrote: »

He calls Gardai scum because of the actions of a few guards

What actions? I find it very hard to see fault in what the guards did.

Loves_lorries wrote: »

Under a socialist state, the likes of travellers would see the biggest culture shock, I've polish friends who have told me how Poland used to have a very big gypsy population, the communist government post 1945 didn't kill them or anything but they were forced to abandon their life of nomadic freedom and assimilate into the new single ideology which prevailed, travellers are the biggest capitalists-individualist of all in many ways, they have no interest in the national interest, a common purpose etc. Only under a free market system could their current existence be maintained.

Irish people have a unique view of Socialism. It's viewed as some sort of utopia where everyone is equal and free. If you look at what happened in Eastern Europe, you will see the dark reality of what's behind it. It'd be the end of plenty of minority groups here, not just the travellers. Capitalism is their greatest ally, in reality, as you said.

The horror.

Loves_lorries

Berserker wrote: »

What actions? I find it very hard to see fault in what the guards did.



Irish people have a unique view of Socialism. It's viewed as some sort of utopia where everyone is equal and free. If you look at what happened in Eastern Europe, you will see the dark reality of what's behind it. It'd be the end of plenty of minority groups here, not just the travellers. Capitalism is their greatest ally, in reality, as you said.

Absolutely, the kind of socialism Connors looks for does not tolerate wild abandon, travellers would be forced to assimilate and work, travellers hate rules, under hardcore socialism, the government is on your back all the time enforcing rules.the police are everywhere.

yourdeadwright

Loves_lorries wrote: »

yourdeadwright wrote: »

I pulled a friend up one day for being " racist " towards Travellers due to some of his comments,
He replied to me, would you have a problem living next-door to a African, Pakistan, Afgan or Aisan family , I said "No of course not "
He then said would you live next-door to a traveller , and I have to say I probably wouldn't by choice, ,
I reckon they are the most persecuted people in Ireland by other Irish  , Its not right at all but at the same time how do we solve it, Its very sad in this day and age a group of people are hated or possible feared like they are it's just not right ,
But at the same time i'd be a person who wouldn't want to live beside them , so I don't know really,

Stop pandering to them, people like you are useful idiots to travellers.

If someone " called me out" on something I said about travellers, I'd write them off as a complete virtue signalling poser.

So its ok to call John an idiot for making a sweeping statement about the Garda being scum but then do the same when talking about travellers and branding them all the same ?
Yes I called someone out for making a statement on a local traveller that was simply not true of that one particular guy ,

Omackeral

yourdeadwright wrote: »

So its ok to call John an idiot

Yes.

Loves_lorries

yourdeadwright wrote: »

So its ok to call John an idiot for making a sweeping statement about the Garda being scum but then do the same when talking about travellers and branding them all the same ?
Yes I called someone out for making a statement on a local traveller that was simply not true of that one particular guy ,

You said you pulled him up on making comments about travellers (plural)

Now your saying it was about a specific individual?

No problem with the latter, if the individual is decent, doesn't matter if he's a traveller, many on the left will however excuse bad behaviour by individuals if they happen to be members of a minority when they would never let a regular person off.

sbsquarepants

Deebles McBeebles wrote: »

Fly over to Birmingham and start shouting it, you'll soon see.

Start shouting anything at anyone and they're likely to have an issue with it.

As far as I'm concerned it is perfectly acceptable to describe someone by using their nationality, especially if it's the most obvious differentiator.

Mickeroo

sbsquarepants wrote: »

Like most words it's meaning is in it's intent.

I've personally used it and have never used it as a derogatory term. It's short for Pakistani - that's it when I use it, just like Brit is short for British.
Where's the problem?

Convincing yourself a word isn't derogatory is not the same as a word not being derogatory.

Gimme A Pound

sbsquarepants wrote: »

Start shouting anything at anyone and they're likely to have an issue with it.

As far as I'm concerned it is perfectly acceptable to describe someone by using their nationality, especially if it's the most obvious differentiator.

So long as they're actually from Pakistan!

sbsquarepants

Mickeroo wrote: »

Convincing yourself a word isn't derogatory is not the same as a word not being derogatory.

I'm not an idiot - I know full well it's used as in insult by some people.
I'm just saying it's possible for it to have a less sinister use - it is a shortened version of Pakistani, similar to Brit or Aussie.

In the southern USA for example the word boy is seen as an insult, not so much in Cork.

Meanings are in the intent as much as in the word itself. Anyway - this is all very much off topic.

The Bishop Basher

So can we get back to calling John connors a wanker :-)

He was booked to turn up for a local showing of Cardboard Gangsters near me here..

It sold a few tickets but he never showed..

No apology no nothing..

And he ****es on about not getting an agent ?

RabbleRouser2k

Lollipops23 wrote: »

I was in school with a girl who was 1st gen settled Traveller.

She was lovely, sweet and very bright. She did quite well in school, but was absent a lot.

I sat next to her in 5th Year Biology and she had a keen interest. Then one day she stopped coming to school, about midway through the year.

Found out a few months later she'd been pulled out to get married. Next time I saw her, a year later, she was 8 months pregnant.

What a waste of potential. There was time enough for marriage and babies, why did she need to sacrifice her education, something she clearly valued?

I can never get passed the Traveller treatment of women. If they even attempted to treat them equally I'd take their opinions on other matters of discrimination a bit more seriously.

I hope there's a change, tbh. I think there definitely is, but its slow. More girls are doing the Leaving Cert for one thing. Wonder if we'll see more lads doing the same?

Unfortunately, it's girls who suffer the most in the traveller community. Similar to other cultures, the guys can be 'players' while the girls have to remain 'pure'.

I remember going to school with a number of travellers. One family moved in close to where I grew up. Genuinely nice people, my father used to give em a lift to school, and one of them he drove to her communion.
They worked around the area, didn't do any damage and genuinely thought they'd assimilate into the area. (I think they moved to a halting site/ settled down).

On the other hand, there were others who were just....yeah. Didn't cause violence, but were kind of a nuisance.

Edgware wrote: »

It's their culture
It's racist to criticise it

Ah, no. We criticise many outdated elements of many cultures-circumcision, in Jewish and Muslim culture, for one. Traveller culture is an outdated practise at the best of times, and utterly neanderthal at the worst.

When it genuinely oppresses one gender over the other-it should be called out.

Edgware

RabbleRouser2k wrote: »

I hope there's a change, tbh. I think there definitely is, but its slow. More girls are doing the Leaving Cert for one thing. Wonder if we'll see more lads doing the same?

Unfortunately, it's girls who suffer the most in the traveller community. Similar to other cultures, the guys can be 'players' while the girls have to remain 'pure'.

I remember going to school with a number of travellers. One family moved in close to where I grew up. Genuinely nice people, my father used to give em a lift to school, and one of them he drove to her communion.
They worked around the area, didn't do any damage and genuinely thought they'd assimilate into the area. (I think they moved to a halting site/ settled down).

On the other hand, there were others who were just....yeah. Didn't cause violence, but were kind of a nuisance.



Ah, no. We criticise many outdated elements of many cultures-circumcision, in Jewish and Muslim culture, for one. Traveller culture is an outdated practise at the best of times, and utterly neanderthal at the worst.

When it genuinely oppresses one gender over the other-it should be called out.

Criticise the Muslims for wearing their scarfs etc but you see plenty Muslim women in Ireland Britain etc at the top of professions like law, medicine, finance etc. But don't dare criticise the Travellers for their treatment of women. young marriage, early school leaving. Our wonderful liberals are too right on to tell the truth on those issues. It is easier tobull****e about traveller culture and let them leech off the taxpayer

FTA69

sbsquarepants wrote: »

It's just short for Pakistani, it's no more derogatory than Brit or Aussie.

Yeah and ‘n*gger’ is just a colloquialism derived from the word negro, no problem there. Jeez why are people so sensitive?

Out of curiosity have you ever referred in person to a Pakistani as a Paki or asked them how they feel about the word? You know full well the significance of the word, you just take some sort of pleasure in throwing it about because you think it makes you sound like some edgelord.

Hector Savage

sbsquarepants wrote: »

I'm not an idiot - I know full well it's used as in insult by some people.
I'm just saying it's possible for it to have a less sinister use - it is a shortened version of Pakistani, similar to Brit or Aussie.

In the southern USA for example the word boy is seen as an insult, not so much in Cork.

Meanings are in the intent as much as in the word itself. Anyway - this is all very much off topic.

Exactly, even the biggest leftie luvvie hippie retards in Spain use "Paki" all the time ...having said that I wouldn't use it myself, where I grew up it was derog.
But I get the point, it is an abbreviation - the comparison with n*gger though is disingenous.
Totally different word.

STB.

sbsquarepants wrote: »

Start shouting anything at anyone and they're likely to have an issue with it.

As far as I'm concerned it is perfectly acceptable to describe someone by using their nationality, especially if it's the most obvious differentiator.

Intent doesn't come in to it. Use of the word is recognised as a racial slur.

The use of the word Paki originated in the 60s in Britain when they were experiencing mass immigration. Its hardly used anywhere else. By nationality they are referred to as Pakistanis.

Brits is recognised as a word to describe people from Britain and used by the Brits themselves. Just because you saw Brits Out on walls over the last 30 years doesn't mean that the word is derogatory.

Given the thread title, you may already know this but the word "knacker" isn't exclusive in slang in its use against some people from the travelling community as it has a wider meaning in society as it can describe gougers from every walk of life.

FTA69

Paki is also a catch all slur for all South Asians, it isn’t a cute abbreviation for Pakistani nationals.

Poor_old_gill

Rennaws wrote: »

So can we get back to calling John connors a wanker :-)

He was booked to turn up for a local showing of Cardboard Gangsters near me here..

It sold a few tickets but he never showed..

No apology no nothing..

And he ****es on about not getting an agent ?

Where was that supposed to be on?

Homer

FTA69 wrote: »

Paki is also a catch all slur for all South Asians, it isn’t a cute abbreviation for Pakistani nationals.

Better not call someone from Scotland a Scot? or from Britain a Brit? Or Australia an Aussie? :pac:

aroundthehouse

Can we not just focus on Johnny Connors being a bit of a wanker lads?

mattser

aroundthehouse wrote: »

Can we not just focus on Johnny Connors being a bit of a wanker lads?

Well the LLS audience didn't seem to think so.

sbsquarepants

FTA69 wrote: »

Yeah and ‘n*gger’ is just a colloquialism derived from the word negro, no problem there. Jeez why are people so sensitive?

Out of curiosity have you ever referred in person to a Pakistani as a Paki or asked them how they feel about the word? You know full well the significance of the word, you just take some sort of pleasure in throwing it about because you think it makes you sound like some edgelord.

Edgelord :D

It is absolutely nothing like the word nígger, nothing at all.

I don't personally know too many Pakistanis to be honest with you!
A girl I had a brief fling with years ago and a family who rent an apartment off me is the sum total of my Pakistani aquaintances!
I wouldn't call or address anybody as "Paki" - how could that be anything but derogatory? But I would have zero problem with describing them as one - it is after all what they are!

STB. wrote: »

Intent doesn't come in to it. Use of the word is recognised as a racial slur. .

Of course intent comes in to it, don't be ridiculous!
Yes it can be used as a racial slur, but it can also be used differently.

STB. wrote: »

The use of the word Paki originated in the 60s in Britain when they were experiencing mass immigration. Its hardly used anywhere else. By nationality they are referred to as Pakistanis..

Or Pakis for short!

STB. wrote: »

Brits is recognised as a word to describe people from Britain and used by the Brits themselves. Just because you saw Brits Out on walls over the last 30 years doesn't mean that the word is derogatory.

You don't think the word Brit can be used derogatorily?
It comes down to our old friend intent again!

"Jaysus, I wouldn't go to magaluf, it's full of brits" - doesn't sound like a compliment to me!

STB. wrote: »

Given the thread title, you may already know this but the word "knacker" isn't exclusive in slang in its use against some people from the travelling community as it has a wider meaning in society as it can describe gougers from every walk of life.

So let me get this straight, you're saying that intent can change the meaning of the word?

AndyBoBandy

mattser wrote: »

Well the LLS audience didn't seem to think so.

That’s because they are usually asleep, and then 2-3 guys run around in front of them waving their arms and telling them to clap